Why You Should Never Talk to the Police

[jrandom]

This (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4097602514885833865) is an engaging and fascinating video presentation by Professor James Duane of the Regent University School of Law, explaining why -- in a criminal matter -- you should never, ever, ever talk to the police or any other government agent. It doesn't matter if you're guilty or innocent, if you have an alibi or not -- it isn't possible for anything you to say to help you, and it's very possible that innocuous things you say will hurt you.

Definitely worth half an hour of your time.

And this (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6014022229458915912&q=&hl=en) is a video of Virginia Beach Police Department Officer George Bruch, who basically says that Duane is right.

...

Shamelessly pasted from Bruce Schneier's blog (http://schneier.com/blog/).

I don't have a set of headphones to listen to the audio, here, but if Mr Schneier says it's good shit, I trust his judgement. (I'm not sure how much of it is specific to the American legal system, though.)

The title of the post matches the impressions I've formed over the years in dealing with the New Zealand Police. Not to belittle them; most of them are just doing their best at a difficult job, but the simple fact is that unless one actually finds it necessary to lay a complaint, it is never to one's own advantage to communicate with them in any way beyond what's legally required.

Two experiences of mine this year so far in regards to having an unfounded complaint laid against me and being called as a witness at a criminal trial (entirely separate matters) very much confirmed this.

Thoughts, folks? I look forward to comments from anyone who can watch and listen to the videos before I get home to watch them myself tonight.

[Patch]

The only thing you should be saying to plod is "this is my lawyer"


Perhaps when you're a little older there sonny, you may learn a few more of these useful lessons life has to offer.


80% of communication is the art of listening - which you seem . . .

[jrandom]

Perhaps when you're a little older there sonny, you may learn a few more of these useful lessons life has to offer.

I think the point of this thread is that I have learned, and am sharing, this particular lesson.

:blink:

[Gubb]

The guy talks reeeeeeeeeeealy fast.

Do we have an equivalent of "Pleading the Fifth", or is it just not saying anything until your lawyer arrives?

[jrandom]

Do we have an equivalent of "Pleading the Fifth"

Surely we have a law that states that nobody can be forced to incriminate themselves.

Dunno where it is, though.

[scumdog]

Sooooo... if you're a cop you follow this advice how???:crazy:

[jrandom]

Sooooo... if you're a cop you follow this advice how???:crazy:

Don't ever talk to the PCA?

:laugh:

[MSTRS]

Do we have an equivalent of "Pleading the Fifth", ...

Essentially, yes. You are obliged to give them your name (and DOB?), otherwise it is as the 'miranda' goes "You are not obliged to say anything...."
Remember, in the eyes of the law, you are innocent until proved otherwise. If you are accused by the cops, the onus is on them to prove you guilty and anything you say beyond your name may help them in their pursuit.

The 5th Amendment reads...
No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.
We have elements of all of that in our laws too. Except in the 'double jeopardy' thing?

[boomer]

The only thing you should be saying to plod is "this is my lawyer"


Perhaps when you're a little older there sonny, you may learn a few more of these useful lessons life has to offer.


Growing up with a father who was CID it was always drummed into me.. say NOTHING to the rozzas; under 18.. ring dad.. over 18.. ring the lawyer. No ifs buts or anthings.


80% of communication is the art of listening - which you seem . . .


hhahahah life is so good with a few individuals on Ignore.

[jrandom]

hhahahah life is so good with a few individuals on Ignore.

I'm glad you took my advice bro. Life's also good with a minimum of folk who can't resist taking digs whenever one posts anything.

:hug:

[Fatjim]

The important point is that you don't LISTEN to the cops.

[boomer]

The important point is that you don't LISTEN to the cops.

Just like JRandom..??!!! Sounds like a smart move to me...!!! Everyone should put the idjiot(s) on ignore (him and his alter ego Number one)... then KB would almost be about bikes again!!!

[Boob Johnson]

The guy talks reeeeeeeeeeealy fast.

Do we have an equivalent of "Pleading the Fifth", or is it just not saying anything until your lawyer arrives?
Nope, we don't have a fifth, just as you said, "im saying nothing, I want my lawyer"

[Gubb]

Got through the first part.

Good listen, the guy is a good speaker. Just about to listen to the Cops part now.

[Boob Johnson]

Got through the first part.

Good listen, the guy is a good speaker. Just about to listen to the Cops part now.
Did I miss anything? As JR rightly said, you don't say a word to the 5-0 if they are accusing you of a crime, not new news, new to some, sure. But what else is there in that 30mins useful other than that?

[Mr Merde]

A very interesting watch.

Based heavily on the 5ht ammendmant but relevant to all of us except those who live in the UK where your silence has been fixed to weigh againgst you.

[scumdog]

A very interesting watch.

Based heavily on the 5ht ammendmant but relevant to all of us except those who live in the UK where your silence has been fixed to weigh againgst you.


Yep - should be the same here.

You just roll your eyes when the shithead who says they don't know anything/couldn't explain why they had done a particular act etc etc suddenly turns up at court with (to him) a perfectly plausible explanation for his acts that he now suddenly remembers.

I guess sitting around with a few bush-lawyer mates toking up and boozing clarifies the memory....

[Patch]

I guess sitting around with a few bush-lawyer mates toking up and boozing clarifies the memory....
can you recommend a couple suppliers of the good shit there ole fulla??

[MSTRS]

Come on, Tom, we all know it's just a game. Try not to be a sore loser...the jails are full of them.

[jrandom]

You just roll your eyes when the shithead who says they don't know anything/couldn't explain why they had done a particular act etc etc suddenly turns up at court with (to him) a perfectly plausible explanation for his acts that he now suddenly remembers.

I would have thought there'd be a fairly material difference between that, and simply and politely saying "I'm really not prepared to make any comment at this stage. I'd like to discuss this situation with my lawyer."

Shitheads are shitheads. Nobody's arguing that they shouldn't be locked up. This thread's for the benefit of well-intentioned folk who find themselves in entirely unjust hot water.

[scumdog]

Shitheads are shitheads. Nobody's arguing that they shouldn't be locked up. This thread's for the benefit of well-intentioned folk who find themselves in entirely unjust hot water.


Oh but they're ALL well-intentioned folk who find themselves in entirely unjust hot water.:whistle:

It's true - they told me so...;)

[Gubb]

Nothing really stood out about the cops speech, just a few interview techniques to be cautious of, other than that, any non-brain dead idiot should know what's going on anyway.

[jrandom]

Oh but they're ALL well-intentioned folk who find themselves in entirely unjust hot water.:whistle:

It's true - they told me so...;)

See, here's the issue right here - you're a good cunt, but even you have formed the tendency to paint every 'client' with the same brush.

[GaZBur]

So let me get this right. If a police officer asks me something - I say nothing? Even if I am innocent? So what happens next - instead of clearing things up there and then - perhaps he will politely ask me to accompany him to the station (or even arrest me) - at which time i have to say nothing again until I can get a lawyer at some horrendous fee to say my client is innocent and has nothing to say???

Can't I judge if the officer is going to listen to truth and make a judgement on that? I think the problem most people have with talking to the law is that people who are lied to constantly tend to get finely tuned bullshit metres and will detect your crap.
My advise is either talk or don't its up to you but whatever you do don't talk crap - they will know and eventually you will contradict other crap you have said.

[scumdog]

See, here's the issue right here - you're a good cunt, but even you have formed the tendency to paint every 'client' with the same brush.

Hey, I pretty soon figure out the difference between the two catagories you are talking about.

Unfortunately the shit-head clients see themselves in the same catagory as those that ARE innocent...and it's always somebody elses fault that the cops think they DID do it.

[Patch]

Nothing really stood out about the cops speech, just a few interview techniques to be cautious of, other than that, any non-brain dead idiot should know what's going on anyway.
clearly the thread starter appears to be a little confused

[jrandom]

clearly the thread starter appears to be a little confused

I did mention that I didn't have the ability to watch the videos here at work and would like some feedback as to their value from them as could, y'know.

I'm starting to think that you don't like me, Mr Patch.

:weep:

[MSTRS]

So let me get this right. If a police officer asks me something - I say nothing? Even if I am innocent? So what happens next - instead of clearing things up there and then - perhaps he will politely ask me to accompany him to the station (or even arrest me) - at which time i have to say nothing again until I can get a lawyer at some horrendous fee to say my client is innocent and has nothing to say???

Can't I judge if the officer is going to listen to truth and make a judgement on that? I think the problem most people have with talking to the law is that people who are lied to constantly tend to get finely tuned bullshit metres and will detect your crap.
My advise is either talk or don't its up to you but whatever you do don't talk crap - they will know and eventually you will contradict other crap you have said.
All sounds fine and logical. Generally speaking, probably a good way to respond, and how most of us would. Hindsight will tell you whether this was right or wrong, after any particular incident. But if it was wrong, then it's too late and even your lawyer will have trouble putting out the fire it created.

[Fatjim]

hey, i pretty soon figure out the difference between the two catagories you are talking about.

Unfortunately the shit-head clients see themselves in the same catagory as those that are innocent...and it's always somebody elses fault that the cops think they did do it.

but nobody's innocent!!!!!!!

[Skunk]

I was caught on the spot by ten cops (five cars) with a van load of timber. They were responding to a breaking and entering call.
Had I said nothing I think I would have been pretty quick to the station. As it was we all had a good laugh and went on our way.

Attitude is everything.

[jrandom]

Hey, I pretty soon figure out the difference between the two catagories you are talking about.

Y'reckon?

That's what I'm talking about - you think you can tell the difference.

:no:

Now, maybe you're not so bad at it, maybe you are, I dunno, but generally, that particular arrogance on the part of your average police officer tends to spill over to situations where the guilt or innocence of the party really is questionable.

Some judges are soft and have their heads in the clouds (recent case of the drunk driver escaping jail being a good example) but, on the whole, thank goodness for the courts and for the judgement of men who have a bit more day-to-day detachment than your average copper, I say.

[HenryDorsetCase]

I guess sitting around with a few bush-lawyer mates toking up and boozing clarifies the memory....

Well, yeah.

Just because I am pedantic, there are circumstances here where you are required to answer in spite of the fact that may compromise your right to silence: from memory its SFO investigations, tax department (of course) and Customs.

Interestingly the most "powerful" govt department by far (in terms of potential "interference" in your life and uh, livelihood is the Customs, followed by the IRD, Pleece a distant third.

In the Uk the warning is something like "if you say something now which differs from something you subsequently say in court then that may be used in evidence agin ya" something like that.

But the best advice is always "say nothing: get lawyered up"

Of course those of us like Ronnie Biggs who lead innocent blameless lives have nothing to worry about...................

[HenryDorsetCase]

Some judges are soft and have their heads in the clouds (recent case of the drunk driver escaping jail being a good example) but, on the whole, thank goodness for the courts and for the judgement of men who have a bit more day-to-day detachment than your average copper, I say.

that statement does a huge disservice to the Pleece and the courts.

[scumdog]

but, on the whole, thank goodness for the courts and for the judgement of men who have a bit more day-to-day detachment than your average copper, I say.

Yeah, the lack of regular contact with court attendees sure must help them sift out the shit eh....

BTW: Silence to the cops - who suffers?

Not the cops that's for sure.

The suffferers are the victims, - of assault, of theft, of sexual abuse, of domestic violence ad nausuem....

[jrandom]

that statement does a huge disservice to the Pleece and the courts.

How so?

I'm not criticising the Pleece, as such. Losing detachment is an unavoidable hazard of the job, and it's not as though we could make do without them, is it?

It's just an unavoidable truth that if they're asking you questions about something, they'll never have your best interests at heart. S'way it works innit.

[CookMySock]

I would have thought there'd be a fairly material difference between that, and simply and politely saying "I'm really not prepared to make any comment at this stage. I'd like to discuss this situation with my lawyer."Nah thats just <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doublespeak">doublespeak</a> for the same thing.


Shitheads are shitheads. Nobody's arguing that they shouldn't be locked up. This thread's for the benefit of well-intentioned folk who find themselves in entirely unjust hot water.We (inadvertantly?) excuse ourselves from their company based on our own judgement though.. not to be done lightly, or at least with some rationale based in logic.

My line of thinking is - I'm going to go do what I want. Its a process of discovery to see what I can get away with. If I interfere with your rights in this process you should not think it was intentional, and you should immeditely inform me of my ignorance - loudly if you feel it necessary - I expect it. Certainly in your process of discovering the same, I would expect to be heard also. THIS is where the legal process is welcome - resolving what is actually do-able or not, and this is where it should be honored IMO. If you fuck up and maim someone then you dun rong, and the reverse applies also and then we get due diligence from the law. Obviously, thinking people will not go this far and enjoy themselves at their OWN risk, not others.


DB

[jrandom]

The suffferers are the victims, - of assault, of theft, of sexual abuse, of domestic violence ad nausuem....

Poor, poor victims.

Sorry, man, I knew a 'victim' of 'domestic violence and sexual abuse'.

I was her so-called 'abuser'.

It opened my eyes to the bullshit which can be fed to the cops, and the way they happily lap it up.

:no:

[jrandom]

Nah thats just <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doublespeak">doublespeak</a> for the same thing.

Well, if you distil it down, of course. But I'm saying that it's possible to make no comment without coming across as a shithead.

[scumdog]

Poor, poor victims.

Sorry, man, I knew a 'victim' of 'domestic violence and sexual abuse'.

I was her so-called 'abuser'.

It opened my eyes to the bullshit which can be fed to the cops, and the way they happily lap it up.

:no:

So staying silent WOULD have helped you eh??

[jrandom]

So staying silent helped you eh??

Nope. Opening my mouth and trying to be helpful, on the mistaken assumption that an unfounded accusation would be treated as it deserved to be, caused tremendous difficulties for me.

My life would have been far, far easier if I had stayed silent.

Edit: I see you got the same idea vis-a-vis editing your post.

[kiwifruit]

Love is in the air, in every sight and every sound

[scumdog]

Nope. Opening my mouth and trying to be helpful, on the mistaken assumption that an unfounded accusation would be treated as it deserved to be, caused tremendous difficulties for me.

My life would have been far, far easier if I had stayed silent.

Edit: I see you got the same idea vis-a-vis editing your post.


You are 'collateral damage'

Kinda a result of the focus on victims, the majority who ARE victims - however a few psuedo-victims slip through, possibly as in your case?

EDIT: And your silence in this case would very likely not have affected the outcome, it may have made it worse...

These psuedo-victims often make it harder for the REAL ones and waste a shitload of Police time and resources.

(of course an astute judge would have picked that in your case??)

[Fatjim]

Love is in the air, in every sight and every sound
And I don't why I'm feeling foolish...

[jrandom]

You are 'collateral damage'

Now I know how all those bombed-out Afghani wedding parties feel.


These psuedo-victims often make it harder for the REAL ones and waste a shitload of Police time and resources.

I bet. Of course, they're a good argument for Police taking a non-judgemental approach to the gathering of evidence and carefully weighing up of the worth of prosecutions rather than charging into court with unfounded allegations, aren't they?


(of course an astute judge would have picked that in your case??)

I never had any doubt of that.

Fortunately, I managed to reason the 'victim' into not proceeding with the complaint (in spite of pressure from the Police to do so).

I sweated a fair bit of blood in the process, though, and she still likes to threaten me with the idea of re-laying the complaint when she's in a difficult mood.

:crazy:

[Fatjim]

You need a tape recorder.

[jrandom]

EDIT: And your silence in this case would very likely not have affected the outcome, it may have made it worse...

Dunno about that.

Y'see, based on subsequent conversations with the 'victim', apparently I came across to the investigating sergeant as the genuine deal, a fair dinkum rapist and woman-beater.

Something to do with 'arrogance'.

:laugh:

(Yes, I know. You're all very surprised at that, aren't you.)

Perhaps he's never pondered the thought of how facing a false accusation and being dragged hither and yon about town to face large bullying men asking inane questions might cause your average slightly-less-than-humble law-abiding citizen to react.

[scumdog]

I bet. Of course, they're a good argument for Police taking a non-judgemental approach to the gathering of evidence and carefully weighing up of the worth of prosecutions rather than charging into court with unfounded allegations, aren't they?

Cases such as yours tend to be 'he-said,she-said' affairs.
Hard to get to the facts so get as many as can, if sufficient to present to Court then that's where it goes.

The judge judges it - police present the case and facts as they have on the case.

[Gubb]

So let me get this right. If a police officer asks me something - I say nothing? Even if I am innocent? So what happens next - instead of clearing things up there and then - perhaps he will politely ask me to accompany him to the station (or even arrest me) - at which time i have to say nothing again until I can get a lawyer at some horrendous fee to say my client is innocent and has nothing to say???

Can't I judge if the officer is going to listen to truth and make a judgement on that? I think the problem most people have with talking to the law is that people who are lied to constantly tend to get finely tuned bullshit metres and will detect your crap.
My advise is either talk or don't its up to you but whatever you do don't talk crap - they will know and eventually you will contradict other crap you have said.

Watch the first part of the video. They cover this exact thing in depth.

[nodrog]

i find it ironic that the title of this thread is "Why You Should Never Talk to the Police"

[jrandom]

Hard to get to the facts so get as many as can, if sufficient to present to Court then that's where it goes.

The judge judges it - police present the case and facts as they have on the case.

Mmyes.

Of course, once the charges against the man are dismissed, no charges are ever laid against the woman for wasting police and court time, are they?

Are they?

It'd be lovely if they were, but I somehow doubt it.

[boomer]

So staying silent WOULD have helped you eh??
The fooka has never been silent in his life...
Bloody wifebeaters!

[Skyryder]

If you say nothing, nothing can be used against you.

The bit about the Police allowing to lie at an interview caught my attention.


Page 32 TRIAL BY TRICKERY. The Tormenting of Guy Wallace.

Shamefull.



Skyryder

[MSTRS]

Mmyes.

Of course, once the charges against the man are dismissed, no charges are ever laid against the woman for wasting police and court time, are they?

Are they?

It'd be lovely if they were, but I somehow doubt it.

They are in false rape claims.

[jrandom]

The fooka has never been silent in his life...
Bloody wifebeaters!

Shut up and cook me my eggs, bitch.

[scumdog]

Mmyes.

Of course, once the charges against the man are dismissed, no charges are ever laid against the woman for wasting police and court time, are they?

Are they?

It'd be lovely if they were, but I somehow doubt it.

You're right - they are rarely charged.

But they are now 'on record' - makes them less likely to be believed next time.

'boy that cried wolf' kinda thing.

[Gubb]

i find it ironic that the title of this thread is "Why You Should Never Talk to the Police"

You must spread some Reputation yadda yadda yadda.....

:rockon:

[jrandom]

But they are now 'on record' - makes them less likely to be believed next time.

Mmm.

Still works as a wonderful way for a woman to make a man's life hell for a while for free, doesn't it?

[scumdog]

Mmm.

Still works as a wonderful way for a woman to make a man's life hell for a while for free, doesn't it?

She woul be part of my past-life pretty damn quick if it were me sunshine.

I'd drop her like a hot turd.

Kids or no kids.

[jrandom]

She woul be part of my past-life pretty damn quick if it were me sunshine.

I'd drop her like a hot turd.

Oh, that's been well and truly done, believe me.


Kids or no kids.

Fortunately I've managed to keep a good handle on regular contact with them.

[Ixion]

Mmm.

Still works as a wonderful way for a woman to make a man's life hell for a while for free, doesn't it?

Not to mention the cases where the accused man ISN'T able to prove that the allegation is a malicious fabrication. Not always that easy to do, regardless of the theory a man accused by a woman is guilty until proven innocent.

So, one wonders how many of the rapists in rpison were 'fitted up'.

[Ixion]

You're right - they are rarely charged.

But they are now 'on record' - makes them less likely to be believed next time.

'boy that cried wolf' kinda thing.

But , so also is a (presumably) completely innocent Mr Random. WHo, thereby, is also less likely to be believed in any future dealings with the police.

[Fatjim]

Mate, when a cop accuses you of raping a chick tell him he's more your type and ask him out.

You'll be surprised how many take you up on the offer.

[Boob Johnson]

Oh but they're ALL well-intentioned folk who find themselves in entirely unjust hot water.:whistle:

It's true - they told me so...;)
Yeah cause the 5-0 NEVER EVER made a mistake before aye, come on Scummy, we know you are a good bastard but don't loose site of reality here. People are people, irrelevant of the position they hold.



i find it ironic that the title of this thread is "Why You Should Never Talk to the Police"
LMFAO!!! :niceone:


Well deserved bling my friend.


Now back to that song............

"Love is in the air" :whistle:

[Indoo]

thank goodness for the courts and for the judgement of men who have a bit more day-to-day detachment than your average copper, I say.

The only detached people in the court room are the security guards who doze off during proceedings, everyone else, especially in Auckland is very much playing the 'game'.

Go spend a day in the drink drive court and watch all the ridiculous excuses and absurd defenses and you will see what I mean.


So, one wonders how many of the rapists in rpison were 'fitted up'.

I think something like only 5 percent of all rape complaints end in conviction or something along those lines, so false or malicious complaints would seem to get weeded out along the way.

Its a hard situation as often with rapes there are no independent witnesses or compelling forensic evidence, it will all come down to the credibility of the victims, the same goes with historic cases of sex abuse as well which don't have any other evidence aside from someones testimony. That of course leads to a situation whereby innocent people can be convicted if the victim is compelling enough, its a catch 22 given what the alternative is.

[Katman]

Why do knobs feel the need to say "bling sent"?

Does it give them delusions of philanthropy?

[chrisso]

When im being quizzed by the Ecilops i tell em '' I have the right to remain silent''--- ''youre trying to take my rights of me by questioning me & expecting answers.''Just give the P****s your name, DOB & add:innocent:ress.
I read some where that about 90% of ppl convict themselves by NOT shutting up.

[jrandom]

Does it give them delusions of philanthropy?

And I always thought bling was redeemable for CHEEZBURGERS.

:weep:

[MSTRS]

And I always thought bling was redeemable for CHEEZBURGERS.



Well, cheese does come from (some) knobs....

[Mikkel]

Very interesting videos. Good find!

[Boob Johnson]

Well, cheese does come from (some) knobs....
Baa ha ha ha...

Bling sent :laugh:

[Badjelly]

Why do knobs feel the need to say "bling sent"

Bling sent :laugh:

[Boob Johnson]

Bling sent :laugh:
lol I did exactly the same thing. He sure ain't the fastest boat on the harbour is he :laugh:

[crazefox]

:Police::Police::Police::Police: yeah FTP

[MSTRS]

Baa ha ha ha...

Bling sent :laugh:


Bling sent :laugh:

To whom? :rofl:

[Swoop]

So let me get this right. If a police officer asks me something - I say nothing?
To a point.

A very good (ecilop) mate told me "If a cop says ""you have the right to remain..."" SAY ABSOLUTELY NOTHING!!!"

Certainly, be civil and explain your actions [if needed] up to that point. HOWEVER, once the statement is made - SHUT THE FUCK UP and get a good lawyer. Period.

[Boob Johnson]

To whom? :rofl:
to EVERYONE!!! :love:


Im in a great mood, the stupid tart that was trying to blackmail us (through the employment tribunal) out of a large sum of money got her ass handed to her today.........baaa ha ha ha. Aside from not having a case she was unaware we knew how badly she ripped off her last boss, so the name was dropped into a meeting & she backed off real quick......he he.


JUSTICE FOR ALL!!! :Punk:


ps: so yeah on topic........talking to the 5-0 is good :laugh:

[The Stranger]

Dunno about that.

Y'see, based on subsequent conversations with the 'victim', apparently I came across to the investigating sergeant as the genuine deal, a fair dinkum rapist and woman-beater.

Something to do with 'arrogance'.

:laugh:

(Yes, I know. You're all very surprised at that, aren't you.)



So you find his conclusion surprising?
Why put up the deception if you don't like the consequences?

[doc]

People you don't need to download a video to know how to talk to the Police.:Police: Everyone knows how the "Kahui's" did it and everyone had an opinion then. :jerry:

[tri boy]

I approached and spoke to a female constable once.
Twas at a toy run she was on duty at.
I said, "excuse me, would it be possible to use your pen, i have just met an old friend (ex girlfriend0, and I would like to write her number down before i forget it".
Seemed like a reasonable request, sunny relaxed day etc, no stress.
F**king mole looked at me like I just shat on her bonnet.
I was told, (the portable communications enscriber) was not for general use.
Since then, I'll be polite, but look at them like they just stepped out of shit street central.

[sidecar bob]

Here's a much shorter & very concise video clip on how to deal with the Police.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uj0mtxXEGE8

[scumdog]

Seemed like a reasonable request, sunny relaxed day etc, no stress.
F**king mole looked at me like I just shat on her bonnet.
I was told, (the portable communications enscriber) was not for general use.
Since then, I'll be polite, but look at them like they just stepped out of shit street central.


Probably the 50th time she had heard that this year.

A lot of ding-bats see a police pen as some form of trophy and will go to all ends to get one - even if they are just a blue Bic.

[jrandom]

A lot of ding-bats see a police pen as some form of trophy and will go to all ends to get one...

OK, now, that takes the prize as the weirdest thing I've heard all day.

[scumdog]

OK, now, that takes the prize as the weirdest thing I've heard all day.

There's way more real weird people out there apart from yourself jr..

[smoky]

I got ripped off once, went the police for help and got told it was a ‘civil matter’, but really they just couldn’t be bothered helping.
A week later they were knocking on my door, along with every other door in the street, investigating some crime – I wouldn’t talk to them, told them it was a ‘police matter’ and nothing to do with a civilian like me.

[scumdog]

I got ripped off once, went the police for help and got told it was a ‘civil matter’, but really they just couldn’t be bothered helping.
A week later they were knocking on my door, along with every other door in the street, investigating some crime – I wouldn’t talk to them, told them it was a ‘police matter’ and nothing to do with a civilian like me.

They would't give a fat rats arse but hey, if it helped you feel good (and got your 'ripped-off' money back) it's all good eh? <_<.

[jrandom]

I got ripped off once, went the police for help and got told it was a ‘civil matter’, but really they just couldn’t be bothered helping.

I found myself in the same situation several years ago, now that you bring it to mind.

Hey, scumdog/Patrick/Indoo et al, genuine question: how do yous fullas draw the line between a civil matter of 'ripping off', to be ignored, and a criminal matter of theft, to be followed up?

Edit: And, smoky, did you end up taking it to the Disputes Tribunal, etc, or could you not be arsed?

[scumdog]

I found myself in the same situation several years ago, now that you bring it to mind.

Hey, scumdog/Patrick/Indoo et al, genuine question: how do yous fullas draw the line between a civil matter of 'ripping off', to be ignored, and a criminal matter of theft, to be followed up?

Edit: And, smoky, did you end up taking it to the Disputes Tribunal, etc, or could you not be arsed?

No hard and fast rule but normally from experience and knowing if the other party has an 'out' as far as criminality goes.

Most people that rip off, owe money etc are pretty crafty or have crafty mates who tell them what to say so the matter is civil instead criminal.

So then it's a long drawn out saga to get money out of them.

Sometimes we'll point out to the person complaining (depending on the amount owing) that if we COULD get the matter to court they would be waiting even longer to get the money - after all if the guy 'owes' a few hundred dollars (and gets fined $300+$130 costs which would be better off going to the complainant) he is certainly going to drip-feed any reparation ordered. (if they ever pay it)

[alanzs]

I always smile when speaking to the police. Never had any hassles with them, so I never have had to talk to them. Maybe its the smile? Sames goes for customs, immigration, etc. Smile, say nothing other than exactly what is asked and move along. :2thumbsup

[smoky]

Edit: And, smoky, did you end up taking it to the Disputes Tribunal, etc, or could you not be arsed?

I rounded up a couple of hard arse mates, tracked the dickhead down who ripped me off (that's a whole different story involving blocking a car yard entrance and making a violent scene inside the showroom) then we used threats and intimidation to get justice - it worked



instead of clearing things up there and then......
Can't I judge if the officer is going to listen to truth and make a judgement on that? I think the problem most people have with talking to the law is that people who are lied to constantly tend to get finely tuned bullshit metres and will detect your crap.
My advise is either talk or don't its up to you but whatever you do don't talk crap - they will know and eventually you will contradict other crap you have said.
It sounds good - to fair minded people but I do find the police that I know personally, and work closely with thru my work, can be a bit desensitised to some peoples reality, and their constant exposure to the negative aspects of society renders them fairly cynical. For that reason I would hesitate to rely on a cops intuition or judgement - and I like cops


There are two very clear factions with in the Police themselves – the ones that are hard line and cynical, and those who think they can still make a difference and turn people around.

Oh but they're ALL well-intentioned folk who find themselves in entirely unjust hot water.:whistle:

I guess you're the hard line and cynical type

[scumdog]

I

There are two very clear factions with in the Police themselves – the ones that are hard line and cynical, and those who think they can still make a difference and turn people around.

I guess you're the hard line and cynical type

You public made me like this - well done!!!:crazy:

[smoky]

You public made me like this - well done!!!:crazy:


You guys got my dander up - so I handed out a shitload of tickets today.
Told em KB made me do it.

Man, did I feel GOOD!!
:crybaby:
Yep - good ol subjective fair police work at it’s best.

I bet you’re one of those cops who aren’t actual Police – just traffic cops dressed up
I think Police honestly forget who they work for .. who pays them… it’s the public
A lot of Police forget they're actually Public Servants – bound by the Public Service Code of Conduct – commissioned to be ‘imbued with the spirit of service to the community’.

[terbang]

Well, cheese does come from (some) knobs....
That really depends on whether you have a police helmet or grease gun..!

[spudchucka]

Mmyes.

Of course, once the charges against the man are dismissed, no charges are ever laid against the woman for wasting police and court time, are they?

Are they?

It'd be lovely if they were, but I somehow doubt it.

They are, frequently, when it can be proved that the complaint was false.

[spudchucka]

I approached and spoke to a female constable once.
Twas at a toy run she was on duty at.
I said, "excuse me, would it be possible to use your pen, i have just met an old friend (ex girlfriend0, and I would like to write her number down before i forget it".
Seemed like a reasonable request, sunny relaxed day etc, no stress.
F**king mole looked at me like I just shat on her bonnet.
I was told, (the portable communications enscriber) was not for general use.
Since then, I'll be polite, but look at them like they just stepped out of shit street central.

Lousy bloody tax payers don't cough up enough coin to allow you more than one pen a month so have some sympathy for the up tight cranky old sow.

[Grahameeboy]

Just read opener....geeze, this is a sad sad world....when I have been stopped I always natter...still got the ticket but hey ho......had a few laughs as well...some people just read too much stuff I reckon

[jrandom]

when I have been stopped I always natter...

Don't be silly, Graham; this isn't about traffic stops.

[Grahameeboy]

Don't be silly, Graham; this isn't about traffic stops.

I would still natter............it's good to talk..don't ya know

[scumdog]

:crybaby:
Yep - good ol subjective fair police work at it’s best.

I bet you’re one of those cops who aren’t actual Police – just traffic cops dressed up
I think Police honestly forget who they work for .. who pays them… it’s the public
A lot of Police forget they're actually Public Servants – bound by the Public Service Code of Conduct – commissioned to be ‘imbued with the spirit of service to the community’.

But..but.. the public pay us and they WANT to see some effort for their tax dollars - and how better to show that than dishing out tickets???

[marty]

I always smile when speaking to the police. Never had any hassles with them, so I never have had to talk to them.. :2thumbsup


so you speak to them, but have never had to talk to them?

how does that work?

[davereid]

so you speak to them, but have never had to talk to them?

how does that work?

... like the man in the video said, even if you have done nothing wrong, and you only try to say the truth, you may be caught out in a lie...

QED.

[Littleman]

I approached and spoke to a female constable once.
Twas at a toy run she was on duty at.
I said, "excuse me, would it be possible to use your pen, i have just met an old friend (ex girlfriend0, and I would like to write her number down before i forget it".
Seemed like a reasonable request, sunny relaxed day etc, no stress.
F**king mole looked at me like I just shat on her bonnet.
I was told, (the portable communications enscriber) was not for general use.
Since then, I'll be polite, but look at them like they just stepped out of shit street central.

Had a guy push past me once. Nearly knocked me over.

He happened to be a white male.

Now I hate all white males.

[The Stranger]

Had a guy push past me once. Nearly knocked me over.

He happened to be a white male.

Now I hate all white males.

And here I thought that you love me Greg.

[Patch]

i find it ironic that the title of this thread is "Why You Should Never Talk to the Police"
He seems to be a very confused person - must be part woman, always changes the rules to suit his black self.


Like a mountain stream - always running


Judging by his actions of late, wouldn't surprise me if there was some truth to 'the complaint'. They certainly got one thing right tho - one arrogant son of a bitch.

[peasea]

Had a guy push past me once. Nearly knocked me over.

He happened to be a white male.

Now I hate all white males.

Sounds fair.
We had an Asian guy back his van into our V8, now I hate all vans.

[jrandom]

Like a mountain stream...

Awww! That's actually quite a sweet simile. Nicest thing I've been called all week.


Judging by his actions of late, wouldn't surprise me if there was some truth to 'the complaint'.

You'd make an excellent copper. Got a good nose for scoundrels.

:yes:


They certainly got one thing right tho - one arrogant son of a bitch.

Too right. I'll be sweating guilty bucketloads if arrogance ever becomes a criminal offense.

[Ixion]

The cat ate the chicken I bought for my dinner. Does that mean I have to buy a Honda?

(NB. This is incredibly clever and subtle. Only three of you will understand it. The rest can just stand back and applaud in awed reverence that which is deep beyond their thought)

[turtleman]

The cat ate the chicken I bought for my dinner. Does that mean I have to buy a Honda?

(NB. This is incredibly clever and subtle. Only three of you will understand it. The rest can just stand back and applaud in awed reverence that which is deep beyond their thought)

Yes. Yes, it does. :Pokey: