Mladin DQ'd from VIR!

[Maido]

Holy crap! This is a pretty big thing as far as AMA goes.
Hayes from Honda had the same thing earlier in the season.

http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2008/Aug/080821atf.htm

Good to see that technical inspections actually get results. The funny thing is Mladin would have probably got the same wining results on a regulation crankshaft.
I wonder when MNZ will start doing full on technical inspections in the major classes at nationals, apart from checking easy stuff, as everyone knows it is way to hard to pull a crank out during nationals lol:beer:

[Cajun]

yeah i read that earlyer, though it was very interesting cause you would think spies bike be runnign same crank, so why isn't his bike looked at also now. since he is now the winner of both races.

[johan]

What made them suspect the crankcase in the first place? There are many parts to inspect on an engine, is the crankcase most likely to be tempered with?

[Maido]

You red wrong johan, it was crankshaft, not crankcase.

I would imagine that even though spies, mladin and hayden are on the same team, they will each have separate engine builders, incase things like this happen.
when hayes was disqualified, he had been using the same spec crank as the previous year with the same modifications, the ama had employed an independant inspector who interpreted the rules differently to the prior inspector and that is how that one came about, i would imaging that this is along the same lines. mladin and his team would not (and could not afford) to cheat on purpose.

[johan]

You red wrong johan, it was crankshaft, not crankcase.
snip

Oups, yes, wrong indeed :)

[slowpoke]

I would imagine that even though spies, mladin and hayden are on the same team, they will each have separate engine builders, incase things like this happen.


Hmmm, can't see 'em having separate engine builders, separate engine maps maybe to suit their individual styles, but I reckon the team would use a common engine builder.

Whatever, it's taken the sting out of what was shaping up to be an interesting end of season. Just like Rossi and Stoner, Mladin and Spies are head and shoulders above the rest. Great racing.

[slowpoke]

It's interesting that Spies and Hayden's bikes, from the same team, have NOT had their crank's checked.....

From www.superbikeplanet.com:

"Sources tell us that Mladin's bike was the only one to be torn down to the crankshaft. The top end of Spies and Tom Haydens' bikes were checked and some parts taken back to Ohio, but thus far they have not met with any issues."

[oyster]

Mladin and Spies are very independent within the team, including right back to technical matters with their respective bikes.

[BarryG]

Further to this, Mladin's times from Friday qualifying this last weekend at Road Atlanta were disallowed, same crank problem, apparently. They put in a completely standard one from their stock, had it OK'd by AMA, then he went out and just got pipped by Ben for pole.
I was at the race, and it is absolutely astounding how much more commitment both of them look to have in comparison to the others. Not that any of them are slouches, don't get me wrong, but the way the Suzukis slammmed into the esses and down the hill was most impressive.
It's so obvious that they're the class of the field, have been for the last few years, built to the same rules but the GSXR seems to have an edge, and it's not the crank! Notwithstanding, they won't win their appeal, and Ben is, in a bit of a letdown, champ for the third year in a row.
In a perfect world, Yoshimura would tell DMG/AMA to get stuffed, and pick up and move lock, stock and barrel to Europe and run Mladin and Spies in WSB, and I reckon they'd be just as competitive as anyone else right off the bat.
I'm glad I got to see them again this year - it'll be a while before this shit sorts itself out over here, I reckon.
Cheers
Barry

[slowpoke]

In a perfect world, Yoshimura would tell DMG/AMA to get stuffed, and pick up and move lock, stock and barrel to Europe and run Mladin and Spies in WSB, and I reckon they'd be just as competitive as anyone else right off the bat.


Haha, that would be brilliant, smoke everyone (again) and just walk off! Everyone was saying how the Zookies were the dominant bike yada yada and then Tommy Hayden climbed on and conspicuously didn't set the world on fire. Mladin and Spies are definitely the class of the field regardless of what they are riding, it's a shame they haven't stepped on to the world stage.

Back to the current controversy, it's starting to smell decidedly dodgy. Why would you check the bottom end of one bike say it's DQ'd, and then award the win to another bike from the same team and not check the same components?

I had high hopes for the new promoter but those hopes are falling faster than the current economic sentiment.

[BarryG]

http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2008/Aug/080831h.htm

This is the AMA/DMG explanation, FWIW. They haven't, in the past, been interested in giving out details ofa technical teardown and why the components were out of spec (see-Josh Hayes, Erion Honda, Daytona 200), so this is quite interesting just from a 'stop the rumours' point.

Cheers
Barry

[Shaun]

So Yoshimura had a STOCK STANDARD NOT STAMPED OR ballanced crank sent to them, to choose the very best one from the production RUN:niceone:


WIPPY SHIT, it would only really give the more confidence in the reliabillity of the motor, NOT POWER!

RE checking NZSuperbikes

When has it ever been done

And I have heard 2 of them in the last 2 years using some kind of a quick shifter system!!!

FACT

The NZ SB rules are bullshit really

Unless you are fully supported, YOU CANNOT AFFORD TO BUILD A COMPETITIVE ONE

[scrivy]

The NZ SB rules are bullshit really

Unless you are fully supported, YOU CANNOT AFFORD TO BUILD A COMPETITIVE ONE

Get into Sidecars I say!!!

[Shaun]

Get into Sidecars I say!!!


Is that your way of offering me your one, for the rounds you are not doing????

[scrivy]

Is that your way of offering me your one, for the rounds you are not doing????

Mate, you know I'd love to......... but I don't think you'd be able to reach the handle bars on full lock.......:niceone::rolleyes:

[slowpoke]

The NZ SB rules are bullshit really

Unless you are fully supported, YOU CANNOT AFFORD TO BUILD A COMPETITIVE ONE

I dunno mate. I was reading an article on Jamie Stauffer the three time Aus Superbike Champion. He can't get a decent ride in WSBK despite posting times competitive with riders on several hundred thousand dollar Factory SBK machines on his mere $50,000 low spec Aussie superbike. It's all relative.

The Aussie superbikes are low tech compared to WSBK, NZ superbikes are low tech compared to Aussie Superbikes. Our factory Superbikes make about the same horsepower as a Superstock AMA bike, with AMA Superbikes a step up again. As it stands how can a local rider even to jump onto a significantly higher spec overseas machine and hope to do well?

Your last statement is true....but you could say that about any motorsport. Who could afford to race even a Formula Ford without sponsorship, let alone a V8 Supercar or Production Sedan? I reckon the problem is more one of exposure, to give sponsors an incentive to invest rather than keep dropping the standard of machines we are competing with and distancing ourselves even further from the rest of the racing world.

The low numbers of Superbikes are more due to the extra racing a middleweight gets with cross entering, than the outright cost of a Superbike. Why would you spend a similar amount of money to do half as much racing? Solving this issue issue is the key to getting more bums on Superbike seats.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Need to change our Superbike class back to senior proddie. They need to build a fully competitive Superbike that they present to the winner each year with a plane ticket to Aus. The numbers will swell, the cost would be well down, and the step up to a superbike season in Australia just rewards.

How's that sound?

[slowpoke]

Need to change our Superbike class back to senior proddie. They need to build a fully competitive Superbike that they present to the winner each year with a plane ticket to Aus. The numbers will swell, the cost would be well down, and the step up to a superbike season in Australia just rewards.

How's that sound?

Sounds pretty good to me, if I was a young bloke with a modicum of talent (neither which are true) I'd be all over it like white on rice.

But, my only concern would be that if we dumb down our premier class the rider would take time to adjust to a full monty superbike, have one mediocre season in Oz and not go on to bigger and better things.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Sounds pretty good to me, if I was a young bloke with a modicum of talent (neither which are true) I'd be all over it like white on rice.

But, my only concern would be that if we dumb down our premier class the rider would take time to adjust to a full monty superbike, have one mediocre season in Oz and not go on to bigger and better things.

I hear ya. But I think if you can master a stock GSXR1000 etc better than anyone else in NZ (Stroud etc), you'll make the next step ok.

Good riders can (and do) make the jump from a 600 to a 1000, don't think the jump from a big proddie bike (good as they are now stock) to a superbike would be too much of a problem for the top rider. Besides...to do it right they can let them ride it here until the send them over!

[Shaun]

Need to change our Superbike class back to senior proddie. They need to build a fully competitive Superbike that they present to the winner each year with a plane ticket to Aus. The numbers will swell, the cost would be well down, and the step up to a superbike season in Australia just rewards.

How's that sound?



Way to Obvious

Way to easy

Way to practicall

[Crasherfromwayback]

Way to Obvious

Way to easy

Way to practicall

I spose that's why it's never gonna happen!

But the money to build such a bike/prize I'm sure is the major hurdle. But I guess it depends just how much MNZ would like to see good lil old NZ produce another wold class rider!!!

When I was young (ish) and racing 250's...I would've sold my left nut to have a chance at such a thing.

Maybe with all of the industry aboard (Dolds, Darbi, Eurobike etc) it could happen.

MNZ...are you reading this??

[Shaun]

I spose that's why it's never gonna happen!

But the money to build such a bike/prize I'm sure is the major hurdle. But I guess it depends just how much MNZ would like to see good lil old NZ produce another wold class rider!!!

When I was young (ish) and racing 250's...I would've sold my left nut to have a chance at such a thing.

Maybe with all of the industry aboard (Dolds, Darbi, Eurobike etc) it could happen.

MNZ...are you reading this??



It only takes the commitment mate! YOU KNOW THAT

You have a very very good idea here, SO WHY NOT RUN WITH IT YOURSELF?

You are in a position to co-ordinate all the sponsors required to achieve such a programme!!!!!

RUN WITH IT MAN< MAKE IT HAPPEN

[pritch]

The proposal may seem radical but a long time ago we used to send a promising driver to Europe and from that we wound up with three Kiwi bums on Formula 1 seats. This idea is much more modest than that.

God knows we need to do something, Moto GP and WSBKs are awash with Australians and it's not like they are genetically superior to Kiwis. (I'm prepared to concede though that they are likely to be better prepared mentally due to their Institute of sport...)

It'll be an uphill push, and all sorts of politics come into play, but if the desire is there it can be done. Neither Stoner nor Dixon had an easy ride/drive to where they are.

[Crasherfromwayback]

It all comes down to what MNZ hope to achieve. It's my belief they're there to foster talent, yet (no offence to those of you out there doing the bizz) on the road race side of things...we're not seen in any of the major catagories internationally, and realistically haven't been since Aaron Slight. That's a failure in anyones book surely.

If you know how many top moto-x riders we spit out...there's no reason we can't do the same on the tar. Apart from money. To get a competitive moto-x bike and run it is cheap, not so in a premier road race class here.

That's why I think MNZ shold go back to the senior proddie thing (we had quite a few international stars back then funnily enough), to cut costs.

Tim Gibbes was also on the right track years ago when he tried to get an SV 650 class off the ground.

I know how much effort Suzuki NZ puts into road racing here...maybe they (SNZ & MNZ) need to organize a GS500 race class here, with the winner getting a GSXR 1000 to race in the senior proddie class for the next year.

A race ready GS 500 could be as little as 7k with a lil help from SNZ..less than a moto-x bike. Numbers will swell in that class with the carrot of a GSXR1000.

Numbers = chances of finding NZ's latest 'weapon'.

[k14]

I know how much effort Suzuki NZ puts into road racing here...maybe they (SNZ & MNZ) need to organize a GS500 race class here, with the winner getting a GSXR 1000 to race in the senior proddie class for the next year.

A race ready GS 500 could be as little as 7k with a lil help from SNZ..less than a moto-x bike. Numbers will swell in that class with the carrot of a GSXR1000.

Numbers = chances of finding NZ's latest 'weapon'.
Yeah that is a great idea. From the reports the FZ6 Yamaha cup class in auzzie is going great. I think its about 10k (and you can get finance) for a full race ready bike with ohlins suspension, pipe, rearsets etc. If I lived over there that would be my choice of class. Probably cost similar amounts to running my 125 over here and everyone is on the same bike.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Yeah that is a great idea. From the reports the FZ6 Yamaha cup class in auzzie is going great. I think its about 10k (and you can get finance) for a full race ready bike with ohlins suspension, pipe, rearsets etc. If I lived over there that would be my choice of class. Probably cost similar amounts to running my 125 over here and everyone is on the same bike.

Yeah and in the UK they had a Honda GB 500 cup or something I think?

Did Toseland come from those ranks?

When I was racing 883 Harleys I used to sing the praises of the class every prize giving.

A: Because the class was dwindling.
(This may or may have not been due to the fact that as the prize money was so good it attracted a lot of NZ's best racers. Brett Richmond, Bruce Ainstey, Robert Holden, Simon Turner, Ant Young, Andrew Rangi etc).

B: Because even with those guys in there you could win great prize money.
The 883's were cheap as chips to run, and I often won more money for a top three (or five) finish there than the guy winning the superbike class at the time won.

C: Because no matter how naff you think an 883 Harley (or a Suzuki GS500) is, if you've got 20,30...or better still 40 loonies with a point to prove...it's huge fun and a great way to see who really is good.

[slowpoke]

I think the comparison to MX probably isn't quite fair. In NZ it's a simple matter to buy a chook chaser and charge around our relatively unpopulated countryside with MX tracks, temporary or otherwise springing up all over the joint and never far from any location.

On the flip side our road race tracks are declining in standard, street circuits are slowly but surely dying off, and the remaining options are often days away. In this era of "I want it now" a dirt bike is a far more attractive option than road racing. Contrast the many more opportunities to go MX/enduro racing on a weekend with road racing and it's a no brainer. Yes, and then there's the cost.

I've said it before but we encourage people to stay in the middleweight ranks with our cross entering system. By stepping up to a Superbike a rider gets only half the already limited racing opportunites and therby also halves the exposure time for sponsors. We need to be doing all we can to get promising young riders onto the bigger bikes as early as possible. Riders should be competing to get into the premier class and they should be rewarded for getting there, even if it's just with longer races. As it stands most 600 pilots would have mixed feelings about a Superbike ride with the reduction in track time.

My concern also remains that by introducing a lower spec of top level bikes that we make the jump to a decent ride overseas too great.

That said, a feeder class is a great idea, but isn't it already in place with Pro-Twins?

Sorry if this comes across negative, I like your thinking.