Accident cause - discussion

[FJRider]

Talking about stock truck effluent and diesel on corners some mad drifters have been carving up the Catlins. I was coming home from Scumdog's hoose today and every right hander had a scattering of gravel pushed out from the oncoming lane. Some hoon going from Papatowai to Owaka must have been cutting every corner and spreading death traps on the road.

According to Katman I'm so inexperienced and fast that I should have died about 20 times....I wonder what went wrong?

:Pokey: :rofl:

Truck and trailer units can do that. Blind corners they can't take wide. Because they can't see whats coming.

[FJRider]

See? Katman would simply look at the crash scene and say "Let him die" and wouldn't even warn oncoming traffic that there was an accident ahead. Good onya bro' that will reduce the number of fuckwits on the road and make you happy! :rofl:

Go ---sell ya bike----you know you want to......:rofl::Pokey:

Perhaps if we see a wire wheeled katana in the ditch...we may be tempted to keep on going, and leave him have his own adventure...

[McDuck]

Perhaps if we see a wire wheeled katana in the ditch...we may be tempted to keep on going, and leave him have his own adventure...

Having ridden that road....




and survived.......





that road (when i rode it and in the mindspace i rode it)) that road is not a race track. Infact there was no real way you could safly go 'fast' on that road. Have fun yes, briskly yes, fast no.

[FJRider]

Anybody remember the Hiscock brothers who raced for Wellington Suzuki (I think), They used it for "practice" (mid/early 80's)

[Katman]

Those of you who like to rub each others backs and go "there, there" when someone has an accident through over exuberanance and out-riding their ability are perpetuating the belief that it's quite okay to reward irresponsible behaviour with sympathy.

I don't do sympathy unless it's warranted.

[FJRider]

I don't do sympathy unless it's warranted.

who cares ... have a nice day...

[MSTRS]

Well, here we all are again.
Isn't it nice to know that, in this ever-changing world, there is one thing we can rely on to be a constant? Well, two actually.
Physics can be a bitch, and KM will always be there to tell us it's always our fault.

[Donor]

Physics can be a bitch, and KM will always be there to tell us it's always our fault.

I'm no Katman fan.

But pray tell, whose fault WAS this accident then?

I'm starting to think Katman is on to something here...

...clearly I need another beer...

[justsomeguy]

Those of you who like to rub each others backs and go "there, there" when someone has an accident through over exuberanance and out-riding their ability are perpetuating the belief that it's quite okay to reward irresponsible behaviour with sympathy.

I don't do sympathy unless it's warranted.

Course you don't, you just like to increase your post count, type crap that doesn't say anything and be negative. Must be sad to be so miserable all the time.

Having ridden the Taka's I feel sorry for the poor fella, they are a lovely road, just soo dangerous with the wind and crap on the road.

[Mom]

Course you don't, you just like to increase your post count, type crap that doesn't say anything and be negative. Must be sad to be so miserable all the time.

Having ridden the Taka's I feel sorry for the poor fella, they are a lovely road, just soo dangerous with the wind and crap on the road.

Come on <_< you are missing the message here, weather conditions, particularly wind shear and road surface have nothing at all to do with coming off, it is all attitude :rolleyes: Gospel according to Katman.

[dipshit]

experienced does not mean blameless. experienced riders are aware of road conditions. if they miss things they could have seen... whose fault is it.

Exactly. This thread is another perfect example of Katman's tag line.

[dipshit]

weather conditions, particularly wind shear and road surface have nothing at all to do with coming off, it is all attitude :rolleyes: Gospel according to Katman.

Well your attitude you take towards these variables and unknowns that could be just around the next corner does actually matter a lot.

[Owl]

I don't do sympathy unless it's warranted.

It's a pity the same can't be said about sarcasm, eh Katman:msn-wink:

[yungatart]

Well your attitude you take towards these variables and unknowns that could be just around the next corner does actually matter a lot.

No kidding!
And you think (like Katman) that most of us don't know that already....pillars of enlightenment, you two are....one could even go so far as to say you are clones...:yes:

[MSTRS]

Physics can be a bitch, and KM will always be there to tell us it's always our fault.
Perhaps I should have said that danger exists all round us...

I'm no Katman fan.

But pray tell, whose fault WAS this accident then?

I'm starting to think Katman is on to something here...



...and physics will claim the unwary.
I'm making no guesses as to this thread's subject. Unlike some. Yet again.

[Katman]

Having ridden the Taka's I feel sorry for the poor fella, they are a lovely road, just soo dangerous with the wind and crap on the road.

It's got nothing to do with the wind and the crap on the road.

It's everything to do with the attitude people take their bikes to that road with.

[MSTRS]

It's got nothing to do with the wind and the crap on the road.

It's everything to do with the attitude people take their bikes to that road with.

Ridden that road a LOT, have you?

[dipshit]

No kidding!
And you think (like Katman) that most of us don't know that already...


Judging from the typical attitude in these forums - no.

Being the fastest, having the most tortured looking tyres, scraping away your hero blobs, getting your knee down, pulling the longest wheelie... etc will guarantee you to be a "hero" around here. And when it does go wrong - it was never their brilliant selves that caused the accident. Oh no... "It was a freak accident!"... "There was a shiny spot on the road!"... "It was the fucking cage's fault!"

Yet the guy that figures out that the road is not a race track and conditions and the road surface can change from one week to the next... and rides accordingly at 7/10's because his attitude towards his riding is that getting to their destination without binning has a higher priority over having fun, just won't have the same street cred it seems.

There is something fundamentally fucked up with the attitude in which many approach motorcycling.

[MSTRS]

Judging from the typical attitude in these forums - no.

Being the fastest, having the most tortured looking tyres, scraping away your hero blobs, getting your knee down, pulling the longest wheelie... etc will guarantee you to be a "hero" around here. And when it does go wrong - it was never their brilliant selves that caused the accident. Oh no... "It was a freak accident!"... "There was a shiny spot on the road!"... "It was the fucking cage's fault!"

Yet the guy that figures out that the road is not a race track and conditions and the road surface can change from one week to the next... and rides accordingly at 7/10's because his attitude towards his riding is that getting to their destination without binning has a higher priority over having fun just won't have the same street cred it seems.

There is something fundamentally fucked up with the attitude in which many approach motorcycling.
I'd agree with a lot of the above, esp. if 'many' read 'some'

[Katman]

Ridden that road a LOT, have you?

I've ridden in conditions that would have you hiding in your bed for the day.

[MSTRS]

I've ridden in conditions that would have you hiding in your bed for the day.

R-i-ght...
You are wrong. Again.
O MasterOfTheSweepingStatement - I asked you a direct question, and in best Winnie fashion you have ducked for cover. I take it that you know of the 'Takas by reading on here - that's bound to mean you know everything there is to know about this stretch of road. Not.

[Mom]

Well your attitude you take towards these variables and unknowns that could be just around the next corner does actually matter a lot.

No shit dipshit. You know me and the way I ride I take it. I obviously need to be reminded of these things for my own good. Thank you for pointing out the bleeding obvious. You and Katman annoy the crap out of me sometimes.


Come on <_< you are missing the message here, weather conditions, particularly wind shear and road surface have nothing at all to do with coming off, it is all attitude :rolleyes: Gospel according to Katman.


It's got nothing to do with the wind and the crap on the road.

It's everything to do with the attitude people take their bikes to that road with.


You did not need to say a thing mate, I already spouted your mantra in an earlier post, why dont you go and have a nice pre-dinner drink or 10.

[SixPackBack]

Course you don't, you just like to increase your post count, type crap that doesn't say anything and be negative. Must be sad to be so miserable all the time.

Having ridden the Taka's I feel sorry for the poor fella, they are a lovely road, just soo dangerous with the wind and crap on the road.

Put him on ignore Ujwal, your viewing pleasure will improve measurably:msn-wink:

[MSTRS]

Put him on ignore Ujwal, your viewing pleasure will improve measurably:msn-wink:

Perhaps. I think the analogy of a boil on the bum is apt...even when you can't see it, you know it's there and it still irritates the fuck out of you.

[Katman]

No shit dipshit. You know me and the way I ride I take it. I obviously need to be reminded of these things for my own good. Thank you for pointing out the bleeding obvious. You and Katman annoy the crap out of me sometimes.


Fuck you make me laugh, the way you take everything so personally.

Here's an idea - if you're that confident that your attitude towards motorcycling is beyond reproach then there's a good chance that the comments that dipshit and I (and others) make on here are not actually directed at you.

[sinned]

Nice to read the professional advice from those who spent a great day behind a keyboard instead of on a bike. I had a great ride today - and it was over the Takas :bleh:

[dipshit]

No shit dipshit. You know me and the way I ride I take it. I obviously need to be reminded of these things for my own good. Thank you for pointing out the bleeding obvious. You and Katman annoy the crap out of me sometimes.

Don't flatter yourself. This discussion isn't just for your benefit.

[Ocean1]

Yet the guy that figures out that the road is not a race track and conditions and the road surface can change from one week to the next... and rides accordingly at 7/10's ...

... might take a little longer to die.

Dude I know, (actually know), the details of only half a dozen non-minor incidences on that hill. I promise you that 5 of those were riding at well less than 70%.

That road, more than almost any other I know is quite capable of hurting you at fookin' near walking speed. Two of the above lost the front wheel while following a queue of cars, so hardly fast, one of them on a diesel patch and the other one on an oil spill.

Yes, a lot of people, (me included) are occasionally intemperate, even reckless up there. But that's in no way a required factor for losing it in that particular place.

Your safety theories are as flawed as your prose is obnoxious. Fuck off.

[Fatjim]

Judging from the typical attitude in these forums - no.

Being the fastest, having the most tortured looking tyres, scraping away your hero blobs, getting your knee down, pulling the longest wheelie... etc will guarantee you to be a "hero" around here. And when it does go wrong - it was never their brilliant selves that caused the accident. Oh no... "It was a freak accident!"... "There was a shiny spot on the road!"... "It was the fucking cage's fault!"

Yet the guy that figures out that the road is not a race track and conditions and the road surface can change from one week to the next... and rides accordingly at 7/10's because his attitude towards his riding is that getting to their destination without binning has a higher priority over having fun, just won't have the same street cred it seems.

There is something fundamentally fucked up with the attitude in which many approach motorcycling.

fucking SV1000 rider. you guys wouldn't know what 7/10's is your so farking slow.

[justsomeguy]

fucking SV1000 rider. you guys wouldn't know what 7/10's is your so farking slow.

:Oi:.... he may be an idiot - but there is no reason to insult the bike.

It's not what you ride - but how......... :Playnice:

[justsomeguy]

Perhaps. I think the analogy of a boil on the bum is apt...even when you can't see it, you know it's there and it still irritates the fuck out of you.

Give that man some bling.

[Katman]

Surely a few "best wishes" and a "poor bugger" are appropriate

Why? So you can feel better about going out next weekend and doing it all over again?

[Headbanger]

I liked it better when katmans dribble went straight into pd.....

[Mom]

Don't flatter yourself. This discussion isn't just for your benefit.

I would have quoted katman too, but he has finally decided that I am not worth it. :msn-wink:

If you can get past the fact that you are so right and the rest of us dissenters are wrong for a moment, you would see the point I am trying to make here. You quote a message of mine, you refer in your reply to "your" and "you", it is addressed to me. Katman finds this sort of thing amusing but trust me I find it even more funny.

You lump all riders in the same broad, sweeping generalisations. It offends some, and most certainly turns anyone that may benefit from your wise words completely off your message.

Please can you, in your opinion of course, define me, the rider you are referring to when you post. Lets see just how close to the mark you are...:devil2:

[Mom]

This thread was started about someone that had a nasty off on the Taka's, there is only Greyham, Guitana and myself who know who he is, and a resonable idea of what happened. Surely a few "best wishes" and a "poor bugger" are appropriate not a full on - lets guess about everything we know nothing about and while we are at it lets swing our handbags! grow up for fucks sake. The guy is a live and very lucky end of story, move on.

Good call, my apologies mate. Will see about getting this off topic stuff moved to another thread. Your mate seems to have been one lucky man, I am pleased you still have him around. I guess my contribution on this thread was in defense of him in a strange way...best wishes heading out to him and his family and friends :o

[dipshit]

You lump all riders in the same broad, sweeping generalisations. It offends some, and most certainly turns anyone that may benefit from your wise words completely off your message.

:crybaby:



Come on <_< you are missing the message here, weather conditions, particularly wind shear and road surface have nothing at all to do with coming off, it is all attitude :rolleyes: Gospel according to Katman.


So why are you disagreeing with this then? Do you, or do you not think the attitude people approach riding with plays a very big important part?

[Katman]

You lump all riders in the same broad, sweeping generalisations.

In future, when I use the words "you" or "your" I'll follow it with "(except Mom)".

Happy?

[FJRider]

In future, when I use the words "you" or "your" I'll follow it with "(except Mom)".

Happy?

Words of one syllable ... or less ...... explains a lot...

[Grub]

Surely a few "best wishes" and a "poor bugger" are appropriate not a full on - lets guess about everything we know nothing about and while we are at it lets swing our handbags! grow up for fucks sake. .

Yeah, sorry about Katman ... he sits with his hand on his dick just waiting for the 'binned' threads. It's instantly predictable and really quite boring.

Best you do what the rest of us do, put him on ignore. All the best to your mate.

[ajturbo]

well.. i had a great ride to palmy and back over the hill today....
some tosser on a SV1000 over took me...(HE is a tosser, because i couldn't/didn't keep up..Yer i suck lol)

[CookMySock]

I don't do sympathy unless it's warranted.You are very good at deciding whether something is warranted or not. In fact, your decision seems to be final. Does it not occur to you that others have opinions as well, and that they just consider them to be opinions rather than fact ?

DB

[Ixion]

This thread seems more than somewhat disconnected.

Very seldom is a crash due solely to just one cause. Though there may be a predominate cause.

Defensive and prudent riding will certainly not guarantee a crash free existence. Sometimes the Biker Gods (bastards that they are) just decide to piss on some poor soul.

But riding is a matter of probabilities. A cautious attititude is no guarantee of crash-virginity. The wisest most experienced most prudent most cautious most Nannaish rider may crash. Either because he made a mistake (as we all do sometimes) at the wrong time and place. Or because the Biker Gods pissed on him. But a cautious and wary attitude will certainly help push the odd in the right (ie non crash) direction. The probabilities are better

And, while there are many things that can cause a crash, most of them we can do little about. We can't change the laws of physics (well, not without a virgin mouse anyway, and the way those little floozies carry on there's no odds on that); we can't easily change the road surface; we can't change the weather. But we can change our attitudes. It costs nothing, and requires no specialised equipment . So it's the easiest place to start, isn't it?

[Mom]

well.. i had a great ride to palmy and back over the hill today....
some tosser on a SV1000 over took me...(HE is a tosser, because i couldn't/didn't keep up..Yer i suck lol)

We went to Puhoi for lunch with Busa Pete and his lovely lady, first fine weekend day we have had in months! We raced them home and won!

The fact we live 10 mins away and they live 20mins is irrelevant OK!

[avgas]

I ride to slow to crash.........ever since my accident.......

but according to the internet some people pay to get hurt - so i guess i can't judge.

[MIZXR]

I'm curious, how do you know your limits if you never push yourself and if you don't your limit how do you tell your riding at 7/10?

How do you learn to control yourself and your panic if never put in a situation that requires it until it's too late? - skid control course put you well outside personal limits so are they a Bad thing?

How do you know how had you can brake or lean if you never try, and as a result can't avoid the "unavoidable" accident.

Crashing can have a major bonus of teaching you that hitting the ground can be the less painfull of the options as opposed to driving into the drunk that pulled out from the side street.

[Ixion]

Because riding at 7/10, the remaining 3/10 is what you use when the drunk pulls out in front of you. Or when the corner keeps tightening, and tightening, and oh, fuck it CAN"T tighten any more f'gawds sake, but it is.

So sometimes you do end up at 10/10- (or even 10.5 /10 , which is when you really sweat). But riding at 10/10 , when that drunk pulls out you have nothing left.

Not to mention that a shit load of riders ride at 11/10 a lot of the time. Y' can usually identify them, there's some strange law of physics that causes a ripple in the time space continuum around them, the result of which is the apparently magical appearance of gravel and diesel at frequent intervals.

Old saying goes : Crash on gravel once, shame on council; crash on gravel twice , shame on rider; crash on gravel thrice, shame, he was a nice block.

[MSTRS]

I see that post 21 remains unanswered. No more than I expected.
And Ixion has put the 7/10 thing well. We all know the 'when the conditions change...' thing from LTNZ - none of us ignore the need to take more care (than we already are) when conditions alter for the worse. The lottery that is riding will sometimes throw us a curveball, where the nice safe 7/10 becomes 11/10 in the blink of an eye. *Somebody* never allows that is a fact of riding.
None of us knows what happened for this thread's subject rider, nor are most of us speculating, but the assumptions of fact from several posters are insulting to say the least.

[yungatart]

....You lump all riders in the same broad, sweeping generalisations. It offends some, and most certainly turns anyone that may benefit from your wise words completely off your message.

Please can you, in your opinion of course, define me, the rider you are referring to when you post. Lets see just how close to the mark you are...:devil2:

I also take offence at being labelled by one (two) who don't know me, have never seen me ride and know f a about me.
I have said it before and I will say it again, ALL THE FOLK I RIDE WITH RIDE SENSIBLY AND RESPONSIBLY, otherwise I elect to not ride with them!


I ride to slow to crash.........ever since my accident........

Yeah me too...until someone described my riding as being so slow I was in danger of falling off due to lack of momentum....

[Katman]

From now on it'll be "(except Mom and yungatart)", okay?

[MSTRS]

Yeah me too...until someone described my riding as being so slow I was in danger of falling off due to lack of momentum....

But the trainer wheels fixed that, eh?:blink:

[Fatjim]

I also take offence at being labelled by one (two) who don't know me, have never seen me ride and know f a about me.
I have said it before and I will say it again, ALL THE FOLK I RIDE WITH RIDE SENSIBLY AND RESPONSIBLY, otherwise I elect to not ride with them!


You should see your husband when you're not around.:innocent:

[yungatart]

Nice!!! This from the man who plays fast and loose with cucumbers!

[jrandom]

I've ridden in conditions that would have you hiding in your bed for the day.


R-i-ght...
You are wrong. Again.

:shutup:

Wrong, eh.

You're entirely sure about that?

:laugh:

[NC]

Yeah, sorry about Katman ... he sits with his hand on his dick just waiting for the 'binned' threads. It's instantly predictable and really quite boring.

Best you do what the rest of us do, put him on ignore. All the best to your mate.

It's Scatman, really he should just stick to playing, eating and fucking in shit.

[yungatart]

It's Scatman, really he should just stick to playing, eating and fucking in shit.

Wot! No drinking! He's so much fun when he's been drinking.....

[NC]

:shutup:

Wrong, eh.

You're entirely sure about that?

:laugh:

I heard that katman once road his bigwheel down the street when there was fresh rain on the road

[NC]

Wot! No drinking! He's so much fun when he's been drinking.....

:sweatdrop

Good call, can't forget about the wee/poos

[Kiwifire72]

I suppose I should read the whole thread to see what you all tlking about lol

[98tls]

:Oi:.... he may be an idiot - but there is no reason to insult the bike.

It's not what you ride - but how......... :Playnice: :killingme:killingme:killingme you may want to go back and have another look at his post,in particular the top right hand corner.:confused:

[MSTRS]

I suppose I should read the whole thread to see what you all tlking about lol

Nope. But any post of Katman's will give the 'secret' away...

[NC]

:killingme:killingme:killingme you may want to go back and have another look at his post,in particular the top right hand corner.:confused:

I noticed that too, but I was just hoping for his sake that he was being REALLY sarcastic :)