Let's have a good bitch about incompetent 4x4 owners

[Coldkiwi]

This was partially inspired by the thread on the concerns over poor riding gear (good topic kiwistorm!) and partially inspired by a conversation I had with a mate about stupid looking SUV's (sports utility vehicles) but more correctly known as UAV's (Urban Assualt Vehicles) given the way they are generally driven in metropolitan areas.

The reply I received from him following a tirade about Suzuki X90 UAV's (look 'em up on the web if you don't know what they are.. they're UGLY) and another particularly stupid looking peach UAV on Shortland St in Auckland was this....

*****************I think that there should be some kinda regulations on buying those things.

"So, sir, why would you like this mid range, 2nd hand, rugged as completely unpretentious SUV?"

"Well, I own a 25foot boat that I have to tow, I have a family of 6, and I live on a farm...."

"Congratulations... you're the new owner"

 

*next customer*

 

"And you Miss... why are you after a brand new not dirty and completely w*nk SUV

with more functions that you can ever hope to know how to work, and, I notice,

is an automatic which apperently does 0 - 100 in a reasonable 12.4 secs... but

has the torque of the average BMX powered by an 11 year old?"

"Well, my husband is really rich, I live in Remuera, and that b*tch from across

the street just got one, but it only cost $130,000, whcih is why I need this

$145,000 edition one... and in red to match my nails...."

"Uh, would you mind steeping a few paces to the left....... that's it.... one more..... thanks"

*pulls lever, Mr Burns style - trapdoor opens*

"AHHHHhhhhhhhhh......"

"Excellent"

  :niceone:

[georgedubyabush]

My last car got taken out when one pulled out of a driveway across my path on turntable hill just north of Moerewa. Unavoidably hit his right rear wheel area. My impact speed probably about 80, as he lumbered across the road. My car was shortened pretty much up to the A pillar and ended up facing the opposite direction in the opposite lane. His beheamoth spun across the road into the ditch.

Fricken hurt. Seatbelt stretched enough for my chest to thump on the wheel, and my head to crack the windscreen. Couldnt move my neck so nice little ambo ride and xrays etc. Turned out to only be severe whiplash which was lucky I guess. Neck in a brace for 2 weeks.

Turns out guy was a 14yr old high school dropout, his parents let him drive to work. I'd Never had insurance, so after 6 months of crap, youth aid, family conferences and generally wasting my time, he starts his 20 dollar a week reparations.

Lessons learned? Dunno, insurance wouldve saved a crap load of hassles. My bike would've made the desperate swerve to the left... maybe. An 87 Toyota Levin holds together quite well considering.

[Kwaka-Kid]

fucking hate them! my mother wanted one last year when she decided she needed a new car, made her buy a brand new corolla instead, a)more her size/driving capabilities, and b) one less on the road to show my middle fingure to :).

well i had a funny thing today, wanker in a big toyota MPV, like a Previa i think, msuta been brand spanking new, some random no.1 haircut... anyways traffic was stopped @ a stop sign, i went down left of about 5 cars.. he was infront, i was just inside on left, then as there was a gap i shot ahead of him as i knew his auto wouldnt accel as fast as me, and actually didnt think hed take the gap, he did but anyway.. he tailgated me HARDOUT! in the friggin pouring rain, i couldnt bare to take my eyes off the mirrors as i was just waiting for the *bang* as he hit my rear of my nice VFR :( but luckily not.. yet he kept *almost* trying to overtake me, like riding up the right hand side of me ffs, and @ a small roundabout way out west here when i turned left i slowed right down to like 5kmph as i watched to the right incase any cars were coming.. he even had the nerve to friggin jamm on his horn! fucking wanker, i mean, okay i was a little bit slow but at least i didnt come to a stop, and like im not the best rider in the world and take hard raining wet as conditions on new bike on slow speed left handers carefully!...  just yet another general wanker out there.. but sorry no kool ending.. he followed me so clsoe so long but then coming down atkinson road rather fast i seemed to loose him by my right hand turn... unfortunate in a way.. was thinking if he had the nerve to follow me allllll the way home... woulda been fun to see what he wanted to make of it :cool:

  but then again, im only a pip.. oh but wait, the Dry rider gear i must admit does make me feel big and special :P

anyways i say ban the friggin things from central!...

[bluninja]

I dunno, a 4x4 looks nicer than a hiace van, and I can pull 3 bikes, 2 riders other than me, and all the gear......and it's got a big rear mounted tyre to put some advertising on. That's my excuse, feeble as it is.

I personally prefer a 'normal' car to the 4x4 as they handle and stop better...and my kids don't chuck up in the back on long journeys.

Still as with any vehicle with 2 or 4 wheels, it's the pilot that is the saint or sinner.

TTFN

[Big Dog]

Well, I hate the fucking things if you want a ute get a ute, if you want to go off road get a off roader but don't kid yourself that any car can do both safely.:angry2:

But i have too laugh a couple of penis envy types have had the nerve to follow me after cutting me off.

Funnily enough if standing up after getting off the bike does not get them skidmarks on the the road taking my helmet puts some in their undies:niceone:

[Kwaka-Kid]

haha hsot bigdog! :p you see for apip like me the tactic is to NOT have to reveal whats beneath all that protective bulk-up gear :o

hehe

[mangell6]

Travelling along the m'way in Wgtn some of the SUV and 4X4 drivers like sitting right on your tail. I always leave a bigger and bigger gap in front of me when they do this. They seem to think that they can out brake a bike. :argh:

<Generalisation>
SUV and 4X4s are killers in an accident check out the statistics. People have this belief that they are just like a car.
</Generalisation>

Mike

[georgedubyabush]

Originally posted by mangell6


<GENERALISATION>
SUV and 4X4s are killers in an accident check out the statistics. People have this belief that they are just like a car.
</GENERALISATION>

Mike

Or, better than a car. But then if we took the design/purpose thing too seriously, then most of us would be on scooters wouldnt we?

[Big Dog]

Originally posted by georgedubyabush
Or, better than a car. But then if we took the design/purpose thing too seriously, then most of us would be on scooters wouldnt we?

hahahah 1000 cc ducati scooters in wsb lol:niceone:

[PZR]

I get sick and tired of people whinging about 4WD vehicles. There have always been wankers that drive bigger machinery than others and use them to intimidate. If you ride a bike everyone is bigger and a potential threat. If you drive a Mini a Commodore is a bigger threat. If you drive a 4WD then a truck is a bigger threat etc. Most people on the road drive responsibly but we all make errors and sometimes those errors will result in an incident. And sometimes that incident will result in damage and or injury. Thats life.
We have 4 vehicles at present. One bike, two cars and a 4WD. The 4wd is a seven seater which no other vehicle can provide so we can use it to transport a lot of children around (not all ours) I have had 4 wheelers for years as I did off roading in a purpose built truck for 15 years so I like having a 4WD. If some one has a problem with that then tough shit, get a life. We drive it like a large vehicle not a sports car. If we hit something smaller then we may come out better off. If we hit something larger then we may not. Same chance everyone takes. Even truck drivers hit bigger things and die. Yes I know people do not know how to drive their 4WD effectivly but then plenty do not know how to drive their cars either. Some people cannot ride a bike real well, but bikes are a hell of a lot less forgiving than cars so most either learn quickly, die or move away from bikes.
It seems to me that if you are receiving a lot of aggression from other road users then you need to look at how aggressive your road user style is. We get back what we give out to the world. Be considerate to others and you will receive consideration back. Be an aggressive dickhead to others and you will meet lots of agressive dickheads. And before you all rave at me yes I know that does not work everytime but it does work as a general rule of thumb.
The old adage applies, "treat others as you would like to be treated yourself"
Try it, you might learn something about yourself and life

[Big Dog]

If you read between the lines you will see that it is not the 4x4 that we are bitching about it but those irresponsible owners who own them as a power trip and use the additional size as a reason to assume they own the road.

Personally I would never own a specillist vehicle like a 4x4 unless I intended for it to go off road..... But then I wouldn't use a bulldozer to go and get the milk either, nor a grader to take the kids to school ( yes I know I might if it were snowing but thats not my point ).


If you feel offended perhaps you need to look at your own concience?

[wkid_one]

Interestingly enuf - 4WD's are not as safe as one would think for those that own them ( and before any one bags me - I too have owned them for years having had a ex-wife in to equestrian!!).

The inherent lack of safety is due to two primary reasons:

1.&nbsp; Higher centre of gravity - this is the primary cause for rollover - in both cornering and in case of accidents - potentially injuring the occupants.&nbsp; Also, the higher centre of gravity decreases the effectiveness of the braking system of the vehicle - by allowing the weight of the vehicle to travel over the axles and effectively promoting the vehicle to slide/skid when braking hard.

2.&nbsp; Ladder Chassis - this doesn't allow for the normal crumple zones that passenger vehicles allow.&nbsp; The ladder chassis is designed from the vehicles non-road background - allowing a more rigid platform for suspension and towing etc.&nbsp; IN the event of a crash - a vehicle with a ladder chassis is more likely to transfer the forces of a crash to the occupants of the vehicle - meaning those supposed 'safe baby carriers' are in fact more likely to kill your child through impact forces than a standard car.

There are other hazards on the road tho - as a 4WD driver - nothing pisses me off more than seeing people tow with inappropriate cars.&nbsp; Eg towing a horse float with a family car.....ridiculous.&nbsp; Yes it may have the power to tow - but not the design/suspension/chassis/weight and quite often the correct certified tow bar.

Modern 4WD manufacturers are going a long way to improving there safety&nbsp;- air bag compatible safety bars, monocoque chassis, crumple zones, lower centre of gravity etc.

I think much of the concern over 4wd's is in the eyes of the person following.....in all honesty - we are probably cut off etc just as many times by cars etc than as by 4WD's (if not more)&nbsp;- we just remember them coz they are bigger than the average vehicle.

I find that couriers and taxi drivers are more a concern than 4wd's??&nbsp; Shit, with all the power a bike has a 4wd should only be a problem to a bike if it is a Cayenne/Tourag/X5.

I think the trick is to not put yourself in a situation where other drivers become a problem.....remember your lane is 10 feet wide - that is about 3-4 bikes (or only one car) - plenty of room for a car and bike if need be - hardly a risk.

&nbsp;

[Firefight]

Wkid one makes an excellent point, for a long time some people have laboured under the misunderstanding that 4X4 are safer , in fact in many cases involving HSCI, the extraction process (that is the use of "Jaws of life"and other hydraulic rescue gear) becomes a long drawn out process, this means that the injured patient may not be transported to a medical/trauma center within the "golden hour".And of course if the accident occurs in a rural area the delay is longer.

[Dave]

Theres always exceptions, but given a straight comparison i would rather be in my 4X4 than in a toyota corolla if someone crashed into me.

[marty]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by mangell6
[B]Travelling along the m'way in Wgtn some of the SUV and 4X4 drivers like sitting right on your tail. I always leave a bigger and bigger gap in front of me when they do this. They seem to think that they can out brake a bike. :argh:



aren't you on a FZ1???? even my slow old RS250 can peel out a landcruiser......

[marty]

i've always been a UAV owner - had a bighorn, then a prado, then a L300 4x4 van (that was pretty cool actually). traded the van though for a commodore wagon (for the missus you understand). it is bigger and meaner than all the 4x4's i've had, takes up more road, and weighs 2 tonne. it's quicker in the corners too :)

the only problems i really have with UAV drivers is: 1. their use of 'fog' lights which aren't permanently dipped and 2. their inability to see behind their rear wheel and reluctance to move over when a bike comes up behind them.

[Coldkiwi]

i'd just like to point out again (as big dog has) that my problem is with people that own them that shouldn't (likewise, I have a problem with people that own bikes that probably shouldn't given the way the ride them.. and&nbsp;NO I'm not making snide remarks about anyone here).

if you have&nbsp;to tow something big,&nbsp; for goodness sake, use a large car or 4x4 thats up to the task. its dangerous to do otherwise. if you want to go off road, then get a 4x4 vehicle up to the task. but if you want to drive around, cut people off and generally be a dirty great hazard, either sod off or get&nbsp;a bicycle so you hurt less people when you screw it up.

and if you want to drive fast and be safe, get a vehicle designed to do that. from the number of rolled 4x4's I've seen, many drivers haven't figured that one out.

[Gixxer]

there r&nbsp;4X4 drivers out there, like all other road users, who know how to use there&nbsp;vehical and who a responcible etc, then you drive in ACK CBD, on the auckland motorway or on the shore and you r brought back to reality that alot of them are dickheads in big vehicals, who have never driven out of auckland let alone off road, these dickheads are the ones I have a beef with, yeah yeah, most of us here cut in and out of traffic, we speed, and all that fun stuff, but i still think alot of 4X4 drivers&nbsp; shoud not be on the road at all. I try not to let them tailgate me, so i just open it up, after awhile they realise they can not keep up and F-off, but when one of them tailgates me in a 50 i will always slow to 40, and if he wants to have ago at the lights bring it on. (unless it's big dog)

[Big Dog]

Originally posted by Gixxer
and if he wants to have ago at the lights bring it on. (unless it's big dog)

LOL (Scooby doo styles)
:o

Funny a dude did that too me in my old gold falcon. so I slowed to 20 kmph. when I stopped at the lights he came storming up "look here bitch!" (I had long hair at the time) So I politely wound down my window before facing him. He still wanted a go so I got out of the car. followed by a loud bowel motion from a quickly whitening moron so i got back in and rolled on at 20 km again. This time he did not tailgate.:done:

[bikerboy]

Ever one has attacked the drivers but while I think there is a link I just don't think these things belong on CITY street/roads.

It comes down to design. The bumpers are higher than cars, making simple touches into broken lights or scratched bonnets as the two don't mate up as cars do. The doors are too high so you get dented window sills; not the rub strips as designed with cars.

They're too wide for narrow streets ; you see them with scratched wheel bulges from side swipping cars, can't manuever in the space a car can; so you have to wait for them to do the twelve point turn. Car parks are narrow enough and then one of these road hippos parks next to you so you can't even get the doors open let alone in your car.

All these things are inherent design faults as urban transport. They use three times as much gas, polute three times as much. There weight causes more road damage. Very few have the same space as a station wagon yet are bigger. They are OFF road vehicles and that's where they should STAY, OFF ROAD.:done:

[wkid_one]

Originally posted by marty
the only problems i really have with UAV drivers is: 1. their use of 'fog' lights which aren't permanently dipped and 2. their inability to see behind their rear wheel and reluctance to move over when a bike comes up behind them.

My understanding of Fog Lights is the following...

1.&nbsp; They need to be linked to the Park Lights so can only be on when the lights are on.

2. Fog Lights by definition are PERMANENTLY DIPPED as anyone who drives in fog knows - high beam blinds you in fog as you can't see more than 2m ahead of you - fog lights are actually super low beam to illuminate the road directly in front of the car

3. HIgh Beam SPOTLIGHTS should only be linked to the High beam of the cars headlights

4. You can only have 4 headlights on at any one time???

Motu may correct me on this

PS - don't use a car if you are towing something big (boat/horse float).&nbsp; Seldom is the tow point connected directly to a strong enuf chassis, seldom is the tow bar rated to tow the weight, seldom is the car heavy enuf (casual ratio of 1.5 times the weight being towed - take a horse float with two horses at about 2tonne&nbsp;- that is a fucken heavy car!! - could use a Trimuph Rocket III tho), seldom is the suspension kitted out to stop both a car and dead weight - even allowing for active brakes

I still think everyone is slightly exagerating here - I think incidents with 4WD's are remembered more often than those with cars coz:

- Their size

- The fact you can't see around them

[wkid_one]

I must diagree BB - many of the SUV's are now very road orientated - and we should learn to live with them.&nbsp;

I disagree with the Jap Import SUV's on the market - spilling diesel, suffocating bikers.....but modern SUV's are fine.&nbsp; The X5 will scare most bike riders, as will the Cayenne &amp; Tourag.

If I was to buy a vehicle - I would buy one, why??


- I have a dog
- I have shit loads of stuff in my boot (golf clubs, sports gear, change of clothes)
- I like to have the choice to go where I want (and yes I do drive off LTSA roads)
- I like the option to tow (bike trailer) safely.
- They are more comfortable for my size
- I am no hurry when I drive, so speed isn't an issue


&nbsp;

&nbsp;

&nbsp;

&nbsp;

[Coldkiwi]

wkid, I think its just that you've forgotten the delights of driving in auckland :)

I reckon my mate (see the first post on this thread) has the right idea. Make the buyer prove they either own a heavy trailer, need to carry lots of kids/crap around on a regular basis or actively go off roading on a regular basis. Otherwise, tell them to buy a freakin car that suits them and their lack of abilities. and why not the same with bikes? if you can't control a harley or goldwing or R1 or Zx12 safely (i'm not saying you HAVE to. .. you just need to be able to) then you shouldn't be able to endanger the lives of others by riding one.

Who cares if that means some unskilled bugger can't get his uncoordinated hands on&nbsp;the GSXR 1000 he wants because of&nbsp;his ego problem? at least he'll have to get something a bit more forgiving that won't get him into as much trouble.

(hows that for opening a can of worms!! :cool: )

[Coldkiwi]

hehe, oh yeah, X5's can scare you all right! Put a remuera housewife behind one of those and I'm a off running!!!

[wkid_one]

FUCK

I wouldn't have been able to get the R1 then

&nbsp;

[bikerboy]

Sorry wikd,
There is a vehicle that satisfies all your requirements except the ego, and it is more economical, environmentally friendlier, has more room, and is safer.


It's called a station wagon, and for those mild off road adventures they come in 4wheel drive versions that will go 85% of the places those road hippos go.
:beer:

[MikeL]

Recent Auckland trend: tiny Asian women at the wheel of big SUVs.
Be afraid. Be very afraid.
:(

[Motu]

wkid - near as dammit - I don't have my VIRM in front of me...but I should,I'm doing an update course tomorrow night - any questions from the floor? I'm going to be asking a few about the new M/C rules that came in this month....no one has been moaning about failing a wof on panniers yet,so I'll keep my mouth shut here.

I think fogs can go at will - hence those wankers in the Subbies and the like,fogs are always dipped and have no penetration (was there penetration officer?) driving lights on high beam only.Ultimatly you can have 8 :eek: lights on at once - thats 4 headlamps,2 driving and 2 fog...enough to satisfy any SUV pilot.

What I hate about these things is on the open road you get 3 or 4 in a line,you can't see past them...then when they come to passing lanes one of the silly pricks in his diesel Teranno pulls out to pass the diesel Pajero pulling a 22ft tinny with 3 150 horse Mercs on the back,then amid clouds of black smoke only just gets past at the end of the passing lanes - 15 cars and 6 motorcycles never got a chance...these pricks shouldn't be alowd on our roads.:angry2:

[MikeL]

Originally posted by Motu
then when they come to passing lanes one of the silly pricks in his diesel Teranno pulls out to pass the diesel Pajero pulling a 22ft tinny with 3 150 horse Mercs on the back,then amid clouds of black smoke only just gets past at the end of the passing lanes -

Exactly.

And by the way, when are we going to address the very real problem of diesel exhausts? Does anyone else apart from me finish a commute feeling slightly nauseated from all the diesel smoke? Not to mention the worry about longer term health consequences. If the cops wanted to make a real contribution to people's safety and well-being in the broadest sense, they'd be better off handing out hefty fines to all the drivers of filthy diesel trucks, buses, SUVs and so on instead of narrowly targetting safe drivers/riders doing 5 or 10 k over the arbitrary speed limit. Efforts to date to reduce diesel pollution have been laughable. Dob in a dirty diesel? What does the driver get? A polite letter advising him to have his engine tuned??!!
:argh: Sorry :Offtopic: rant!

[Redstar]

good thread my second car is a nissan Safari and thats about as ugly as they get. but like motorbikes there are the self ritious army of politically correct fagots who would compatmentalise all into one catagory.
I have three boys all into sport. I do 30,000klms in the 4X4 to such extream places as Palmerston north and Wanganui and Whangarei and apart from a Bongo van I need this monster! we go to the snow and we go on the beach we have fun and we drive with consideration and care for all.
the current anti SUV thing eminates from some Aussie wanker Keating and it's populus crap.
If e buy into this rubbish we we all be driving Mopeds and Puntos
Bollocks!

[Kwaka-Kid]

firstly: nope, never noticed feeling odd when behind desiels or anything like that etc.. its fine by me, blow all the smoke you like, its just somthing desiels generally do :).&nbsp; and damn those SUV's, all i can say is that.&nbsp; just friggin damn them!

but i spose there are the good drivers etc..

hey anyways :Offtopic:

&nbsp;just with dad today welded a towbar onto the front big homemade bullbars of the Hiace.. so now we can tow stuff, and push stuff! one on each end! hah! its grea,t SOO much easier to just maneuver around side of narrow driveway/house etc and dump dirt/concrete/all the odd things hoarders get for cheap/free.&nbsp; and no it wont b used like that on the road! haha, drag on road, then get home, and to get around side push from front.. what&nbsp; a neat idea...

jsut thought id share it - anybody heard of that before? its a detachable one too with a locking bolt so i can still get the WOF just a bit of 2inchby2inch box steel hidden welded on inside edge of big bullbars :) -kiwi inginuety.

[wkid_one]

I am sorry BB - but a station wagon falls woefully short in a couple of areas as I said above...I drive one every day...


Towing ability - shite, it is just a car engine, car chassis and car suspension - sorry I would always prefer to tow in safety
Comfort/headroom - shite....I have enuf trouble with my company station wagon on this factor, having to find the one place the seat provides me with some small amount of comfort and vision.
No seperate rear compartment - as the 'boot' makes up part of the inside of the car - putting smelly/dirty/shitty things in there (ie Petrol for long trips) becomes slightly annyoing - give me a ute with a canopy any day.


All valid reasons to purchase a SUV........don't generalise all SUV drivers in to one pool.

&nbsp;

[Dave]

then when they come to passing lanes one of the silly pricks in his diesel Teranno pulls out to pass the diesel Pajero pulling a 22ft tinny with 3 150 horse Mercs on the back,then amid clouds of black smoke only just gets past at the end of the passing lanes -

Sorry-that was probably me in my terrano-but that stupid fukker in the pajero was holding me up, and if you need to wait for passing lanes on your bike, then get a bike with some balls!

[georgedubyabush]

Originally posted by Dave
Sorry-that was probably me in my terrano-but that stupid fukker in the pajero was holding me up, and if you need to wait for passing lanes on your bike, then get a bike with some balls!

I'll admit to going three wide once or twice. Probably begging for someone to *555 me.

[Big Dog]

I agree with wkid1 there is some genuine 4x4 drivers.

Perhaps someone in the know can explain why it is that you need a class 2 license to drive a 1.5 ton truck but not to drive a 2 ton 4x4? Is this why so many independant contractors drive overloaded 4x4's instead of getting the truck they need?

Perhaps there should be a license requirement to drive a 4x4 over 1.5 ton just as you don't need a truck licence to trucks under 1.5 ton?

PS my tons may be tonnes I am not too sure and always mix them up:o

4x4's can be driven well and safely but some jaffa's do 20,000 kms (or less)at less than 60 km then this same jaffa takes their UAV out on the open road often for the first time. Then finds out that the car that was so perfect for the commute from Remma's to Epsom pitches quite badly on the open road. and don't know what to do about it.

I'm sure we have all had a discrete laugh at the expense of these people on 20/20 that buy $120k plus uavs because they feel safer taking their kids to kindy, and then want to cry when having been told the danger they are exposing their kids to say "yeah but I feel safer".


Oh and I have seen a bighorn do a stoppie looked funny to me but probably not to amusing to the passengers or the owner.:niceone: :p

[marty]

the secret to not getting *555'd? (apart from riding past at 200km/h) - don't get a personalised plate.

i dunno about the wagon thing though - i've got a certed tow pak on mine (cost $100's though) and adjustable rear shocks. i'd take the wagon over the sedan all day - put stuff (surfboards kayaks MTB's etc) on the roof-rails fitted and comfortably fits 5 adults. it's not a daewoo or hyundai though. even the camry wagons are small in comparison.

guess what - it's got permanently dipped hard wired driving lights too........

a class 2 licence is now only needed for over 4500kg (that's inclusive of towing - 2200kg UAV plus 2200kg fishing boat - you're still under!) and you can drive a f-off big 6 berth camper on a car licence, but you can't ride a 100cc scooter. it's bullshit really.

[Big Dog]

I don't know what state but a freind in the 90's had to get a truck license in order to drive a 2500 kg camper over 20 ft ( so any thing bigger than a maui). but wasn't too hard to get (international car license plus a driving test in the vehicle desired for a temporary limited). Apparently americans though have to get a ht.

[Motu]

So,the SUV owners are getting in a huff :D hey,it's not about the vehicles,it's about the drivers.I have a diesel van - it's gutless as,but I know my place....I want to get past that Pajero pulling the boat,but I hang back and give the more powerful vehicles a go first - if they don't...then I have a shot at it.It's just being considerate of other road users - something these 4x4 drivers are severely lacking in.

[Coldkiwi]

but Wkid, you said it yourself... get a UTE! double cab utes are the sensible alternative in so many situations for towing and carrying stuff on the road and still have a reasonable dirt track capability without being over qualified and under stable.

hmm.. how many Ford Explorer owners thought they were buying a nice safe tank before they found out they roll quicker than a skyhawk?

&nbsp;

&nbsp;

[wkid_one]

I am looking at a&nbsp;Nissan Navara 4WD at the moment, coz of the three tonne tow rating.......as for wagons towing - depends entirely what you are towing....anything over 1.5 tonnes - and a car won't foot it in an emergency situation - not enuf weight regardless of whether the trailer is braked (different if hydraulic - but most are passive ram brakes if braked at all).

Also - towing with front wheel drive wagons/cars is useless - your drive wheels should be at the rear nearest the tow point again for safety reasons.

NZ is presently in the process of revewing its towing laws due to the inappropriate vehicles (and drivers) presently towing on the road.

One thing I do hate, and agree with Motu about, is drivers WHO KNOW THEY ARE slow - not giving faster traffic a thought and allowing them to pass safely!

[wkid_one]

On the same topic - check this out
<H2>Call for emissions to be tested as part of WOF </H2>06 September 2003
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<B>Just 10 per cent of cars in the Auckland region are responsible for over half the carbon monoxide pumped into the atmosphere from the region's fleet, according to a new study released yesterday.</B>




The Auckland Regional Council, which commissioned the study by the National Institute of Water and Atmospheric Research, says the study shows emissions testing should become part of warrant of fitness checks.

Over 40,000 vehicles were tested in a month-long study measuring pollutants from the tailpipes of vehicles at 16 sites throughout the Auckland region.

It is estimated that vehicle particle emissions cause 250 premature deaths every year in the Auckland region, and air pollution levels regularly exceed World Health Organisation standards for carbon monoxide and nitrogen dioxide.

ARC air quality manager Kevin Mahon said the results highlighted the need for New Zealanders to tune their vehicles regularly. Well-cared-for cars came out in the top 20 per cent regardless of how old they were.

Imported vehicles, which make up half the Auckland fleet, had lower emissions on average than New Zealand-new vehicles.

ABOUT FECKEN TIME

[marty]

Originally posted by Big Dog
I don't know what state but a freind in the 90's had to get a truck license in order to drive a 2500 kg camper over 20 ft ( so any thing bigger than a maui). .

when the new land transport act came out in 1998 they upped the weight limits for a class 1 (car) to 4500kg combined. any driver with a licence issued in a country as a signatory to the geneva convention can drive here for a year without any special test. after that they can apply to go straight onto their full NZ licence

[Coldkiwi]

BTW... I reckon the best way to not get hauled up following a *555 call (I must be a menace on the roads if I've thought about it) is to get a highly unmemorable personalised plate... something like 6S3E4 .... try recalling that while you fumble for the phone! :) adjacent&nbsp;letters and numbers can be recalled by thinking of them as abbreviations.. but if you mix'em right its harder to recall! (ie SE 634 is easy!)

&nbsp;

[Redstar]

did you Know this the average SUV weighs in at 2 tonnes I know mines that plus now add a boat trailer and a haynes hunter and thats another 3 tonne yah we have 4.7 tonne oh dear we need a class 2 licence otherwise all insurance bets are off!

thats a bummer!

I still say that the movement against SUV it similar to the assalt on bikers politically correct tossers who like to spoil your fun.

[Kwaka-Kid]

heard of a guy once with a numberplate that was readable upside down or somthing, cant fully remember the story, but along same idea in a way, saving money.. he could park anywhere and get parking tickets for a number plate, which was really his turned upside down or somthing a rather, have to ask the old man about that one again.

anyways i really hope you dont get *555 calls rich! :) ride sensible and ride safe. :o

[Sharkey]

Speaking of number plates, I heard about this one.

TI VUM

Imagine that in your rear view mirror :D

Also, this bit of SUV/UAV culture jamming is quite fun

www.changingtheclimate.com

[Big Dog]

Originally posted by Sharkey
Speaking of number plates, I heard about this one.

TI VUM

Imagine that in your rear view mirror :D

Also, this bit of SUV/UAV culture jamming is quite fun

www.changingtheclimate.com

A freind had TI 3VOM:niceone:

[Coldkiwi]

Originally posted by Kwaka-Kid

anyways i really hope you dont get *555 calls rich! :) ride sensible and ride safe. :o

well, I don't actually GET the calls.. but I'd be surprised if some disgruntled cipple in a cage doesn't make them most mornings I cruise on past on my merry way to work while they're stuck in gridlock. I realise now (having spoken to them) that there are short sighted people out there who JUST DON'T LIKE BIKES for no good reason but are adamant that bikes shoudn't lane split simply because its unfair that cars can't too.

rooted logic I know. I consider it&nbsp;one of the few perks in an otherwise poor method of transport.

downsides: I can get wet, cold, I'm much more vulnerable to injury, I can't listen to music and I have to breath every bastards fumes.

upsides: I can make the most of the gaps left by drivers (I use the term loosly), I love being outside, i like the feeling of freedom and being master of my own travel rather than a passenger stuck in a queue.

you take the good with the bad.

&nbsp;

(Hows that for :Offtopic: )

[Lou Girardin]

It's funny how intimidatory these tosser's in 4wd's are when mobile.
But when they have to stop at the lights and you get off your bike and walk over to them, those door locks are hit real quick.

[SPman]

Speaking from first hand knowledge ? :D

[Lou Girardin]

Yeah, sometimes I'm too stroppy for my own good.
Lou

[Lou Girardin]

P S it hasn't hapened often and the anger management course seems to be working:angry2:

[avgas]

I believe i have heard enough 4wd owners comments to say they suffer big fish syndrome.
There is allways a bigger fish, how do you not get eaten by that big fish is you make yourself as big as them.
By one person owning a 4wd, all those that fear crashing into it have to have a 4wd.
Am i getting somewhere......huh...huh





:eyepoke: sorry they let me out too early

[marty]

omg for a minute there i thought wkid was back

[Posh Tourer :P]

Hey avgas - could you please stop thread dredging..... There's enough new posts on here as it is :gob:

[DEATH_INC.]

I missed this one
I have my UAV for revenge on all those cage driving wankers who have no respect for me and my bike.......funny how no-one cuts you off or pulls out in front of you when you're bigger than them and have a bullbar.