Warning! I've just been screwed by Jas Jenners & Austin International

[Forest]

Thinking of moving to Australia? Thinking of taking your bike with you? Be very careful.

I've just been screwed over by Jas Jenner and Austin International. Hopefully you'll learn from my mistake and avoid these clowns before they get a chance to screw you as well.

I live in the Melbourne CBD and decided that I'd bring one of my Ducatis over to Australia. Jas Jenners was recommended so I gave them a call. They are an agent for Austin International and here is the shipping quote they gave me (a total of $755 NZD door-to-depot plus Australian clearances):



Many thanks for your call and below subsequent email. We'd be glad to assist with the shipping of this, your first, Ducati 'back home' to Melbourne...! We can confirm our shipping price at NZ$605.00 inclusive from door-Haldanes to arrival Melbourne container CFS unpack depot. Australian arrival charges (THC, Delivery Order, Customs & AQIS clearances etc) would be additional along with any relevant local and import taxes. The insurance premium - via Vero Insurance Ltd - would be NZ$150.00 based on below advised value. This premium charge can be added to shipping cost and paid on arrival in Australia.


Sounds quite reasonable doesn't it? I certainly thought so.

So how much do you think they invoiced me for the freight and clearances?

$1,000?
$1,500?
$2,000?

If you chose any of these, you would be be wrong! The final invoice was for $2,018.25 AUD, which is $2,245.33 NZD at today's FX rates.

So there's no confusion, this figure does not include the Australian GST that was levied on import - it is purely the freight service and entry charges.

So how does $750 NZD plus customs clearances end up as $2,245.33 NZD?

According to my Australia customs broker, they've done it by padding both the freight/cartage rates and the freight service charges on their invoices.

What a fucking joke! These clowns will never get another cent of business from me - and I would strongly caution any other biker against using them for vehicle transport.


.

[Maha]

I know the feeling, get told a ''payable' figure from a company and then get landed with alot extra, end of the day, it has to be paid, but man does it suck arse!!!

[Scouse]

Tell it to Fair Go, oh your in aussie now, oh well their version is prolly called "fair go mate".

[Forest]

As I'm sure you can tell, I am severely pissed off.

I run a trading company that regularly ships equipment between Australia and New Zealand. Therefore I am well aware that I can ship an entire 20-foot container (33 cubic metres) from Auckland to Melbourne for the same bloody price that they have charged to ship a 230kg crate (1.95 cubic metres).

It really shits me that companies can treat their customers like this.

This is un-fucking-believable.

[SPman]

Let the Manager know that you are extremely unhappy and, being in the business (sort of), you will be putting the word out to warn potential customers off their firm!
You'll quickly know then, if they give a fuck!

[Forest]

Let the Manager know that you are extremely unhappy and, being in the business (sort of), you will be putting the word out to warn potential customers off their firm!
You'll quickly know then, if they give a fuck!

I entirely agree! I approached both companies with before I started this thread.

The General Manager for Jas Jenners replied:


Please review comments below from our associates Austins. Frankly, they make sense and I can say after many years working with them, Austins are DEFINITELY not known to charge extravagantly or unnecessarily

The sales manager at Austin International replied:


In looking at the charges we have billed out there is not much of a mark up at all.

...

And as Mike said of course another freight company would say it's a rip off when they didn't handle the shipment.

...

As I always say it's never cheap importing anything into another country.

Translation = Neither of these companies gives a shit.

[CookMySock]

hold on, if you have a quote, then the quote is the price? Isn't that the law?

[Forest]

hold on, if you have a quote, then the quote is the price? Isn't that the law?

Unfortunately no. Freight quotes are often variable in their nature (since customs clearances and port service charges differ depending on the destination). Hence the following escape clause in their quote:


We can confirm our shipping price at NZ$605.00 inclusive from door-Haldanes to arrival Melbourne container CFS unpack depot. Australian arrival charges (THC, Delivery Order, Customs & AQIS clearances etc) would be additional along with any relevant local and import taxes.

[007XX]

hold on, if you have a quote, then the quote is the price? Isn't that the law?

Nope...I'm pretty sure a quote is not binding as such. They will certainly have disclaimers up the wazoo to back their new price up too.

Is there an equivalent of the Consummer's Affairs in Oz? If so, I'd give them a call.

[CookMySock]

Unfortunately no. Freight quotes are often variable in their nature (since customs clearances and port service charges differ depending on the destination). Hence the following escape clause in their quote:Thats fair enough, but I think it has to be in the ballpark.. just what I think.

I suppose they won't release the freight if you don't pay for it? What if you tell them to forget it and send it back?

DB

[Forest]

I suppose they won't release the freight if you don't pay for it? What if you tell them to forget it and send it back?

DB

The crate is sitting in my garage (it arrived yesterday morning).

Unfortunately I cannot avoid the charges. Before the freight landed in Australia I had to provide Austins with a letter of authority that explicitly authorised any applicable fees and charges.

[raftn]

Thats fair enough, but I think it has to be in the ballpark.. just what I think.

I suppose they won't release the freight if you don't pay for it? What if you tell them to forget it and send it back?

DB

I would say the poor bloke will never see the bike again...........probably get pushed overboard!

[Forest]

I would say the poor bloke will never see the bike again...........probably get pushed overboard!

Abandoned freight is generally seized and sent to an auction house for disposal.

After the freight and penalty fees have been deducted from the sale proceeds, they remit the balance to the shipper (or they send an invoice if the sale proceeds are too low to cover the fees and penalties).

[007XX]

Unfortunately I cannot avoid the charges. Before the freight landed in Australia I had to provide Austins with a letter of authority that explicitly authorised any applicable fees and charges.

Oh shit...then yeah you're stuffed! Really sorry for you.

But thanks for the heads up on these morons.

[Ocean1]

Very similar story to a friend of mine, shipped a KT250 to Perth about 6 months ago.

Quote was about $600, Landed cost was over $2k.

He's still smoking.

[Big Dave]

T in aussie now, oh well their version is prolly called "fair go mate".


'For F*ck's Sake'

[RantyDave]

Hang on. Your tax invoice shows exactly what's going on - you've paid $1330.73 GST on the Duc as it's come in. 10% GST on a bike that has it's invoice price listed as NZ$15k. Seems about right to me. Add on the quoted AU$600; AU$139 origin charges (customs here, no doubt); AU$231 port charges (customs there, see the *other* invoice); plus shipping it to your house for AU$200 is about AU$2,500. Hmmmm.

It's the GST that's the killer.

Dave

[Forest]

'For F*ck's Sake'

Now that's a great name for a TV show!

[jtzzr]

Now that's a great name for a TV show!

At least you still have a sense of humour, but it still sucks.

[Headbanger]

Hang on. Your tax invoice shows exactly what's going on - you've paid $1330.73 GST on the Duc as it's come in. 10% GST on a bike that has it's invoice price listed as NZ$15k. Seems about right to me. Add on the quoted AU$600; AU$139 origin charges (customs here, no doubt); AU$231 port charges (customs there, see the *other* invoice); plus shipping it to your house for AU$200 is about AU$2,500. Hmmmm.

It's the GST that's the killer.

Dave

GST on the transaction sure, There should be no GST charge on the value of the bike.

Anyhow, We sent my sisters ATV to her new place in Perth and it cost what we were quoted, $1290. But then we did use a large NZ freight company. Funny enough they had the most expensive quote but we chose to ignore claims of $600 from companies we had never heard of. And I and my sister arranged,filled out and submitted the importation cert.

[Forest]

Hang on. Your tax invoice shows exactly what's going on - you've paid $1330.73 GST on the Duc as it's come in. 10% GST on a bike that has it's invoice price listed as NZ$15k. Seems about right to me. Add on the quoted AU$600; AU$139 origin charges (customs here, no doubt); AU$231 port charges (customs there, see the *other* invoice); plus shipping it to your house for AU$200 is about AU$2,500. Hmmmm.

It's the GST that's the killer.

Dave

That's not quite right.

There are two separate invoices. The first invoice covers freight and GST on entry, the second invoice covers quarantine and shipping across Melbourne to my flat.

First invoice = $1,019.38 of freight and freight services + $1,330.71 in Australian GST = $2,350.09 AUD in total

Second invoice = $999.44 of freight services

Total of two invoices = $2,350.09 + $999.44 = $3,349.53 AUD

In other words, I have to pay Austin International the grand total of $3,349.53 AUD in fees for this import.

---------------------------------------------------------

The problem is not the $1,330.71 of Australian GST that was levied on the import. I was expecting that and budgeted for it.

What I was not expecting was the $3,349.53 - $1,330.71 = $2,018 AUD in freight and freight service charges.

:mad: :mad: :mad:

[Forest]

Have just submitted a complaint through the Fair Go website.

Will let you know if anything comes back.

[pete376403]

Try one (or more) of the consumer organisations listed here
http://www.austlii.edu.au/catalog/38.html

[CookMySock]

best of luck with that. keep us informed.

Steve

[Mully]

mate, I work in freight and have dealt with phil a bit. I'll have a closer look tomorrow cos I'm on my iPod at the moment and it's a bit of a bastard to do much on.

[Motoworld Powersports]

We use that crowd quite a bit with our imports and have never had any query with them. I would highly reccommend them.

[southernmike]

You could have bought a row of first class seats on a plane for that money!

I have a mate about to bring a bike out from Oz so I'll let him know who not to use.

[jrandom]

Sounds quite reasonable doesn't it? I certainly thought so.

Did you make any enquiries whatsoever as to the actual amounts involved in "Australian arrival charges (THC, Delivery Order, Customs & AQIS clearances etc) would be additional along with any relevant local and import taxes"?

Perhaps these people are used to dealing with customers who are aware of those other costs (which are not charged by the shipping company) and don't need the probable amounts spelled out to them.

If you did nothing in advance to find out what all the extra costs they forewarned you of would be likely to come to, I don't think you have much of a case against the shipping company.

[Forest]

Did you make any enquiries whatsoever as to the actual amounts involved in "Australian arrival charges (THC, Delivery Order, Customs & AQIS clearances etc) would be additional along with any relevant local and import taxes"?

Perhaps these people are used to dealing with customers who are aware of those other costs (which are not charged by the shipping company) and don't need the probable amounts spelled out to them.

If you did nothing in advance to find out what all the extra costs they forewarned you of would be likely to come to, I don't think you have much of a case against the shipping company.

I own and run a company that regularly ships computer equipment between New Zealand and Australia. Therefore I am well aware of the freight and clearance rates for both countries.

To put the price they have charged in comparison - I can ship an entire 20 foot container (FCL) between Auckland and Melbourne for the same price that they've charged me to ship a single motorbike. Even consol airfreight shipping wold have been significantly cheaper.

This is why I've posted copies of the invoices earlier in this thread. A line-by-line analysis of the charges on theis invoices shows where they've padded out the charges. For example:

1. They charged $279.50 AUD per cube for LCL seafreight. The actual LCL rate is around $100 NZD per cube.

2. They charged $97.50 AUD per cube for Melbourne cartage. The actual rate is around $65-70 AUD per cube.

3. They charged $240 AUD for quarantine attendance. This is not a government charge - this is simply the cost for their staff member to be present for the AQIS inspection.

4. Port service charge of $231.25 AUD plus GST. This is excessive - the freight was containerised and devanned outside of the port.

5. Cartage to store of $65 AUD. A mystery charge - is their bond store and general store at different sites?

[Scouse]

'For F*ck's Sake'Aww fair go mate

[jrandom]

I own and run a company that regularly ships computer equipment between New Zealand and Australia. Therefore I am well aware of the freight and clearance rates for both countries.

OK, fairy muff. Go fuck the bastards up!

[Conquiztador]

Wanted to have a look at the invoices, but tells me they are not available. Anyhow, the Oz GST you paid on the bike price, when/if you take it back to NZ you will get that back from the Oz government. And as you already have a GST invoice from getting her in NZ, as long as you did not get the GST refunded when you took her out from NZ, you will not have to pay that again.

Said that, I find it strange that you did not get a price on all the other costs before taking her over, as you clearly know what you are doing re freight.

Hope you get some response/clarity in this as getting ripped off sucks!

[Forest]

Wanted to have a look at the invoices, but tells me they are not available. Anyhow, the Oz GST you paid on the bike price, when/if you take it back to NZ you will get that back from the Oz government. And as you already have a GST invoice from getting her in NZ, as long as you did not get the GST refunded when you took her out from NZ, you will not have to pay that again.

Not sure why the invoices aren't downloading. They're both in PDF format so you'll need a PDF viewer to open them.

The GST isn't an issue at all. I factored that into my calculations and have no problem paying for it. What I take issue with is the $2018 AUD they charged for freight and freight related services to ship a single motorcycle.


Said that, I find it strange that you did not get a price on all the other costs before taking her over, as you clearly know what you are doing re freight.

I generally trust the companies I deal with to do the right thing.

But I'm not stupid. I trust and verify.


Hope you get some response/clarity in this as getting ripped off sucks!

I hope so too! However I'm not holding my breath as both companies deny any wrongdoing or overcharging.

So I've filed a detailed shipping report with horizonsunlimited.com and will start a related thread on the advrider.com forums. Name and shame!

[Bike-aholic]

I Know how you feel man, i got a DVD collection sent out from the UK, the postal system was going to charge 90 pounds (ouch), but the guy sent it through a sea freight co and cost 40 pounds (great). When it arrived in NZ i had to pay an additional $250 for port charges (minimum 1 tone charge the thing weighed 5kg) and paperwork. If i didn't do the customs/ maf clearance it would have cost me another $200 plus $50 to get it posted from the airport to paptoetoe, wish the F**K it was sent by normal post, hard lesson learned not to get anything sent via seafreight:argh:

[imdying]

Take them to court... they'll have to fuck around with representation most likely... you probably won't see your 2 grand, but after they've paid their bills, neither will they.

[Titanium]

Snip >>> as long as you did not get the GST refunded when you took her out from NZ, you will not have to pay that again.



I would be interested in how you may obtain a GST credit on a botormike you purchased in New Zealand (Paid GST on) and then took it out of the country.

I took a bike to Oz in February last year. At that time there was no provision to claim the GST back of the tax man. Has this changed?

I did have to pay GST and duty in Oz, this was based on an excluding GST quote I obtained in NZ dollars prior to leaving NZ. This NZ value was converted to AUD by Oz customs at their conversion factor and that was the 10% duty and 10 % GST that was payable, also payable on the freight charges.

Other charges were around $400 all up, for AQUIS fees and brokerage fees. Go the bike the second day from the shippers and rode it to the shop for roadworthy!

Then there is the stamp duty you pay when it is first registered in VIC 7.5% of the value of the bike!

Anyways .... not a cheap exercise.

[Slyer]

Sounds like I'll be recommending selling and buying a new one from now on.
That's way expensive, it'd have to be under a grand before I'd consider it.

[marty]

I own and run a company that regularly ships computer equipment between New Zealand and Australia. Therefore I am well aware of the freight and clearance rates for both countries.

To put the price they have charged in comparison - I can ship an entire 20 foot container (FCL) between Auckland and Melbourne for the same price that they've charged me to ship a single motorbike. Even consol airfreight shipping wold have been significantly cheaper.

This is why I've posted copies of the invoices earlier in this thread. A line-by-line analysis of the charges on theis invoices shows where they've padded out the charges. For example:

1. They charged $279.50 AUD per cube for LCL seafreight. The actual LCL rate is around $100 NZD per cube.

2. They charged $97.50 AUD per cube for Melbourne cartage. The actual rate is around $65-70 AUD per cube.

3. They charged $240 AUD for quarantine attendance. This is not a government charge - this is simply the cost for their staff member to be present for the AQIS inspection.

4. Port service charge of $231.25 AUD plus GST. This is excessive - the freight was containerised and devanned outside of the port.

5. Cartage to store of $65 AUD. A mystery charge - is their bond store and general store at different sites?

all well and good, but if you do so much auck-melb container work, why not drop the bike in one of those? paying an appropriate fee of course. why pay someone else to do the work for you, when you could have done it yourself? reality is tough mate - you should have asked some more questions i reckon.

[Forest]

I would be interested in how you may obtain a GST credit on a botormike you purchased in New Zealand (Paid GST on) and then took it out of the country.

I took a bike to Oz in February last year. At that time there was no provision to claim the GST back of the tax man. Has this changed?

You can claim back the New Zealand GST when you export a bike but it requires some work, and it requires you to be GST registered (or trading through a GST registered company or partnership).

I bought this bike with the intention of taking it to Australia. So I had my company purchase it using company funds. Then my company sold it to me in Australia.

This allowed my company to claim back the New Zealand GST when the bike was purchased. The bike was exported from New Zealand on a zero-rated export invoice. This results in a net GST credit on the transaction.



I did have to pay GST and duty in Oz, this was based on an excluding GST quote I obtained in NZ dollars prior to leaving NZ. This NZ value was converted to AUD by Oz customs at their conversion factor and that was the 10% duty and 10 % GST that was payable, also payable on the freight charges.


The rules might have changed but there is currently no import duty on motorbike imports into Australia. The only tax on motorcycle imports is Australian GST.

Cars are different. They currently attract a 10% duty and a Luxury Car Tax if the invoice price is above a certain threshold.



Other charges were around $400 all up, for AQUIS fees and brokerage fees. Go the bike the second day from the shippers and rode it to the shop for roadworthy!

Then there is the stamp duty you pay when it is first registered in VIC 7.5% of the value of the bike!

Anyways .... not a cheap exercise.

Definitely not a cheap exercise!

[Forest]

all well and good, but if you do so much auck-melb container work, why not drop the bike in one of those? paying an appropriate fee of course. why pay someone else to do the work for you, when you could have done it yourself? reality is tough mate - you should have asked some more questions i reckon.

It would have been considerably cheaper for me to airfreight the bike.

We currently pay about $1.50 per kg for trans-Tasman consolidated airfreight. The bike was 1.95 cubes (or 323 volumetric kg). So airfreighting the bike would only have cost me $484 NZD plus clearances.

Reality is tough. I made the mistake of trusting these guys and they took advantage. Rather than simply whinge about it, I've created this thread to illustrate what has happened and hopefully to help other bikers avoid similar problems.

[chucky19]

In the last issue of Australian Road Rider (which I don't have in front of me) they shipped a couple of bikes to NZ and back and it cost them just over $1400 Australian.

They list the company that did the shipping in the article (but I can't remember it). Seems a lot more reasonable.

[2 wheel madness]

Put it back on the shipping company.

A quote is a legal binding document that with out unforeseen circumstances or variations must be honored. The issue you seam to have is the extra tag-ons.

If they have quoted you $605 + additional costs and you think the additional costs are to much (and it sounds like you know what you are talking about) you have the right to ask them to prove these additional costs before you accept them.

Bet you would love to tell them where to stick it aye, i know i would (that is if they didnt have my bike).

[The Joka]

Well I think that you are both at fault here..

Firstly you can ask for a refund on some!

Check this out...

"NZ$605.00 inclusive from door-Haldanes to arrival Melbourne container CFS unpack depot."

So that charge would be the invoice 00005831

Freight AUD$599.62 is all they can charge you.

Origin charges AUD$138.75 this should definitely be credited - This is the origin (as in Auckland) charges and the quote stipulates that they will only charge nz$605 to Melbourne CFS (container freight station or unpack depo).

So the actual charge based on exchange rate .76 (havent checked actual exchange rate) nz$971.54 credit due
nz$366.54

Port Charges AUD$231.25
Security handling charge AUD$2.61
Govt charges AUD$64.00 (dodgy charge ask for break down)

you need to confirm where these port charges are incurred Aussie or NZ if NZ same deal you need a credit.

If Aussie you should have confirmed the Aussie charges.

The other invoice 00005831A sorry mate but cough up you should have checked the Australian landed costs or asked for a DDU quote.

I work in the industry and would be happy to help you out with this PM me.

For all future people check out the inco terms link below and ask for a DDP or DDU quote, this will mean that they have to quote everything excluding GST and DUTY.

http://www.i-b-t.net/incoterms.html

[toycollector10]

The cost for me to ship a large bike out of Miami to Christchurch was approximately $3200 NZD.

You've been rolled over I'm afraid.

Can I put in a plug for Mainfreight? They were very professional, even obtained a quick refund for a charge claimed for "reasigning ownership" at the USA end, which never took place.

[Mully]

I would be interested in how you may obtain a GST credit on a botormike you purchased in New Zealand (Paid GST on) and then took it out of the country.

I took a bike to Oz in February last year. At that time there was no provision to claim the GST back of the tax man. Has this changed?


Forest's information was correct for a company (and the way he did it makes him smart like a fox, genius) but is not applicable for private individuals. There is currently no provision (and none on the horizon) for travellers to claim GST back upon leaving the country. My understanding is that there is that provision in AU.

If you are going to move a bike (or anything expensive) back and forward, do it on a Carnet.



We currently pay about $1.50 per kg for trans-Tasman consolidated airfreight. The bike was 1.95 cubes (or 323 volumetric kg). So airfreighting the bike would only have cost me $484 NZD plus clearances.


Do you pay $1.50 per KG for hazardous cargo? Cos the airline will spank you on a bike for DG surcharges.

I guess the lesson for those kiddies playing at home is:

Get a formal written quote. Or several from different forwarders.
Prepay as much as you can in NZ.
Only pay AQIS and GST in AU.
Ensure they are aware that you want a Door to Door price, excluding AQIS and GST from the NZ guys, and that they are aware that you will not be paying any charges for which you have not been quoted.

[Forest]

There is currently no provision (and none on the horizon) for travellers to claim GST back upon leaving the country. My understanding is that there is that provision in AU.

There is some provision in Australia for private GST refunds on export. They call it the Tourist Refund Scheme. However there some major limitations:

1. The goods have to be taken out of Australia within 30 days of purchase. I've been caught by this - they go by the date on the invoice/receipt and won't refund if the purchase is over 30 days old.

2. The goods have to be presented to TRS staff for inspection at the airport. This effectively limits the scheme to hand-luggage and clothing. So you can't get a refund for anything heavy or anything which is banned from airline carry-on luggage.

3. There has to be a minimum of $300 on each of your invoices. You can't combine invoices to go over the $300 threshold.



If you are going to move a bike (or anything expensive) back and forward, do it on a Carnet.

That's that's definitely the way to go if you're going to return your bike to NZ.



Do you pay $1.50 per KG for hazardous cargo? Cos the airline will spank you on a bike for DG surcharges.

That is true. The airlines will also require the fuel tank to be fully drained and the batteries disconnected. You're also supposed to drain the engine oil (but I suspect you could get away without doing this).



I guess the lesson for those kiddies playing at home is:

Get a formal written quote. Or several from different forwarders.
Prepay as much as you can in NZ.
Only pay AQIS and GST in AU.
Ensure they are aware that you want a Door to Door price, excluding AQIS and GST from the NZ guys, and that they are aware that you will not be paying any charges for which you have not been quoted.

That's excellent advice. Don't rely on trust or you'll end up in a similar situation to me!