Honda V4 2010

[R-Soul]

Well I reckon it looks great - it has the "iron man" superhero look like the CBR. *drool*

It will be interesting to see how it stacks up compared to other sports tourers/sportsbikes.

[nudemetalz]

Still don't like the exhaust, despite this comment:
"I found that it really does sound great, especially at the upper end of the rev range when the engine is at full song."

Is there anywhere where we can hear the VFR1200 at top revs?

[vifferman]

Is there anywhere where we can hear the VFR1200 at top revs?
There was a sound clip available before the official release, but it was just a repeated loop of someone giving the bike a bit of a rev.
I'll see what I can dig up...

[vifferman]

Here's what I dug up (http://www.motorcyclenews.com/MCN/News/newsresults/videos/2009/October/oct2909-video-honda-vfr1200f-in-action/?&R=EPI-119607). Frankly I'm disappointed - it sounds like a boxer twin. :blink:

[nudemetalz]

Thanks, Vifferman.
Rather uninspiring sound, that's for sure.

[vifferman]

Thanks, Vifferman.
Rather uninspiring sound, that's for sure.
It took some digging.
As for the sound - at least the reviews of the bike aren't so uninspiring. Apparently the new DSG gearbox is fantastic, either in 'S' mode or manual (although one tester said after a while he decided he couldn't do a better job than the bike's 'brain', so gave up using manual, and just concentrated on riding. He said it was great: all the changes were at the right time (up or down) and gearchanges (manual or automatic) on the DSG-equipped bike didn't unsettle it at all. Just give it the throttle and let it sort out the gear.
One thing some testers commented on was the DCBS brakes weren't the new e-DCBS+ABS, as Honda decided it would add too much weight and cost to an already weighty/costly bike, so they used a variant of the VFR800's system. Apparently although they're good, they're not up to the standard of the new ones fitted to the CBRs.

[nudemetalz]

Cheers for the info.
The only V-four I've owned (apart from an RZ500) was a VF500 back in '89.
Now they had a lovely exhaust note (great machine too). Why couldn't Honda give the '1200 a nice flat 360degree type note?

[vifferman]

Cheers for the info.
The only V-four I've owned (apart from an RZ500) was a VF500 back in '89.
Now they had a lovely exhaust note (great machine too). Why couldn't Honda give the '1200 a nice flat 360degree type note?
I think the exhaust has a lot to do with it - the headers are unequal lengths, and there's a servo valve in the muffler. But one of the biggest things is that it's a 72-degree V4, with a 28-degree crankpin offset. That's going to change the way it sounds.
I had a VF500 too - with a custom collector and two s/steel megaphones. Sounded very nice. Also had a VFR750 and VTR1000 before the VFR800.

[RavenR44]

I think the exhaust has a lot to do with it - the headers are unequal lengths, and there's a servo valve in the muffler. But one of the biggest things is that it's a 72-degree V4, with a 28-degree crankpin offset.

Lordy, I wish I knew what that means. But failing that, I'm certain you're onto something. I'd forgotten how sweet are the bass notes of the 800 viffer and how much it sounds like two twins in perfect harmony.

Aaaaahhhhh... :devil2:

Just a wee quiz; is feathering the viffer 800 clutch the accepted workaround for the on/off snatch-osity in first cog? (And sorry 'bout the hijack but I don't think my question deserves a separate thread.) And what makes that 'donk' noise at the beginning of a throttle blip? Don't remember that from the 750 - something unique to the test bike maybe? Or an injector/cat thing? Enquiring minds and such...

Ta, VM. And cheers.

Andy.

PS: Didja get to the Ulysses meet, me having already hijacked thread and all? :shit:

[motorbyclist]

Just a wee quiz; is feathering the viffer 800 clutch the accepted workaround for the on/off snatch-osity in first cog? (And sorry 'bout the hijack but I don't think my question deserves a separate thread.) And what makes that 'donk' noise at the beginning of a throttle blip? Don't remember that from the 750 - something unique to the test bike maybe? Or an injector/cat thing? Enquiring minds and such...


clutch is the accepted workaround for ALL bikes/car/trucks ;)

at what revs? Which model? the vtec version makes varying noises but perhaps what you're hearing is knocking. Perhaps you should find a honda mechanic...

[vifferman]

Just a wee quiz; is feathering the viffer 800 clutch the accepted workaround for the on/off snatch-osity in first cog?
As a temporary fix, yes. It also helps if you remove all free play from the throttle cables.
The snatchiness is caused by the EFI switching between 'closed loop' mode and mapped mode; there's a momentary hesitation when you throttle off for a slow-speed corner (f'rinstance) then open the throttle again.

A better long-term solution is to disable the oxygen sensors by fitting 330ohm resistors across the heating element wires to the sensors (to keep the ECU happy), then the ECU 'thinks' the fueling doesn't need to be adjusted, and doesn't activate 'closed loop' mode, which is very lean. This also eliminates the lean surge you get at small throttle openings / constant throttle.
However, doing this makes the fuelling a little rich at low revs / small throttle openings. This doesn't hurt, just makes the performance very slightly soggy. This is easy to fix by fitting a Power Commander and loading a good map.

(This might all sound rather technical, but the answers are all there in VFRD, or I can PM you with more info).

(And sorry 'bout the hijack but I don't think my question deserves a separate thread.) And what makes that 'donk' noise at the beginning of a throttle blip?
It's probably the flapper valve in the airbox opening. This will also produce a funny noise like gravel rattling around somewhere in the top left of the engine's innards, if you sit at standstill with the bike in gear and the clutch in, and let the clutch in/out a few mm (not enough to make the bike move, but just enough to operate the little microswitch in the clutch lever mount).

[RavenR44]

As a temporary fix, yes. It also helps if you remove all free play from the throttle cables.
The snatchiness is caused by the EFI switching between 'closed loop' mode and mapped mode; there's a momentary hesitation when you throttle off for a slow-speed corner (f'rinstance) then open the throttle again.

A better long-term solution is to disable the oxygen sensors by fitting 330ohm resistors across the heating element wires to the sensors (to keep the ECU happy), then the ECU 'thinks' the fueling doesn't need to be adjusted, and doesn't activate 'closed loop' mode, which is very lean. This also eliminates the lean surge you get at small throttle openings / constant throttle.
However, doing this makes the fuelling a little rich at low revs / small throttle openings. This doesn't hurt, just makes the performance very slightly soggy. This is easy to fix by fitting a Power Commander and loading a good map.

(This might all sound rather technical, but the answers are all there in VFRD, or I can PM you with more info).

It's probably the flapper valve in the airbox opening. This will also produce a funny noise like gravel rattling around somewhere in the top left of the engine's innards, if you sit at standstill with the bike in gear and the clutch in, and let the clutch in/out a few mm (not enough to make the bike move, but just enough to operate the little microswitch in the clutch lever mount).

Hey VM,

Thanks for the response. The issues were minor, and on the dealer's demo bike. I'm still planning on a new viffer so it'll be interesting to see the comparison.

Enjoyed the test. The 800 feels a little heavier than I remember the 750. But that might be bad memory, the fact that I was riding all the time back then, or just my imagination. :)

There was something about the demo bike that I noticed - it tipped into left-handers more easily than right-handers. Could have been the tires I guess but my gut says alignment.

The bottom end is heaps stronger than the CBR600 (not surprisingly) and I found the viffer easy to ride. The midrange and top end are plenty strong enough for me so after two days fannying about the place on it, I felt quite at home.

Got a Striple in mind for an extended test next weekend, weather permitting, so it'll be an interesting comparison.

Cheers,
Andy.

[vifferman]

Enjoyed the test. The 800 feels a little heavier than I remember the 750. But that might be bad memory, the fact that I was riding all the time back then, or just my imagination.
What model 750 were you riding? Here's a table with some data (sorry, it doesn't include the latest VFR800 but I can dig that out if you want.)

[RavenR44]

What model 750 were you riding? Here's a table with some data (sorry, it doesn't include the latest VFR800 but I can dig that out if you want.)

Don't honestly remember but it was a decade ago, so most likely the last of the 750 line. It was carburettored, if that helps. And red. And there was sod-all mileage on it - but I can't be more specific than that.

I was reluctant to give it back though, having had the use of it for 3 months! :)

I have a current brochure so I'll look up the 800 numbers from that. But thanks for the offer anyway. And thanks also for the table. Quite interesting.

Cheers,
Andy.

[Bodhi]

Hey VM,

Thanks for the response. The issues were minor, and on the dealer's demo bike. I'm still planning on a new viffer so it'll be interesting to see the comparison.

Enjoyed the test. The 800 feels a little heavier than I remember the 750. But that might be bad memory, the fact that I was riding all the time back then, or just my imagination. :)

There was something about the demo bike that I noticed - it tipped into left-handers more easily than right-handers. Could have been the tires I guess but my gut says alignment.

The bottom end is heaps stronger than the CBR600 (not surprisingly) and I found the viffer easy to ride. The midrange and top end are plenty strong enough for me so after two days fannying about the place on it, I felt quite at home.

Got a Striple in mind for an extended test next weekend, weather permitting, so it'll be an interesting comparison.

Cheers,
Andy.

I have an 06 VFR800 and use it for commuting. The o2 eliminator and Power Commander option works very well with the closed loop open loop thing which I found mildly irritating when riding through rush hour. It also runs a lot smoother at 100km. I also noticed that it initially felt slightly harder to tip in on right turns but think it maybe something to do with the throttle bar angle because I don't really notice it any more. It is fairly road camber sensitive though so It could be that too. Super stable bike I really like mine

[motorbyclist]

the right-turning thing might be due to a bit of flex in the single sided swingarm, now that I think about it....

[Swoop]

An interesting review, after a more serious period of time with the bike.
http://ashonbikes.com/content/honda-vfr1200f