broken hilux(what to do?)

[750Y]

dilemma... 92 hilux d/cab ute, 2.4 diesel('2L' motor with 220+kms).
heard a dodgy tapping sound which turned to a clacking sound, which turned into a knocking sound(sounded like maybe the valve was hitting the piston on no.4). did some ringing round only to find prices for 2nd replacement engines ranging from $2250+gst(older engine like what just went) - $4000+gst(00-02 3litre engine). I could swap them over myself no problem. I havent had an expert check the engine over but it sounds ugly & i can't be stuffed tearing it down just to confirm what i already can hear.
dunno if i should get another engine or flick it & get a newer ute.
I can get another just like it for $4500ono which has 300ks & a year older but it sounds like a backward step to me. A decent replacement will cost around $12-$14k.
what to do?
any mechanics/car experts here have an opinion?
also anyone have an opinion on 4x4 diesel utes like Mazda Bounty,Nissan Navarra etc?

[XTC]

It's not that hard to pull the head and have a look. Fixing yours will be a bettter option than replacing the ute with one that's done 300kms providing the body is worth it?

[XTC]

Could always do this??
www.4wd.net.nz/suprasurf.htm

[750Y]

It's not that hard to pull the head and have a look. Fixing yours will be a bettter option than replacing the ute with one that's done 300kms providing the body is worth it?

I had heard of these engines costing $4k plus for a recon.???

[ktulu]

I have driven a 99 ford courier 2.5 turbo diesel a fair bit and its awesome, fully drives like a petrol car, plenty of go and smooth on the open road, the guy who owned it used to do a fair bit of hunting aswell and we took it out in the mud and stuff and all over paddocks and it went well, remote hub locking aswell so it was handing when you were in the shit, didn't have to get out. I understand the bountys are pretty much the same ute.

[MSTRS]

The Bounty & Ford are same ute. Watch the heads after 100,000. They have a tendency to warp etc

[Motu]

First the possible good news - we had a Hi Ace with a 2L come in Xmas Eve with a bad knock,sounded just like a big end or piston...but I suspected a sticky injector.After a compression test we cracked each injector and found the noise was in No1 cyl - so swapped 1 & 2 injectors,and the noise went away! Injector reco and all is well.You could get it down to me,but my mech has called in sick and I'm stuck with my usless apprentice,I'm gonna have a shit of a day...

Is it a turbo? The 2L turbo Surf was prone to dropping exhaust seats,kinda wrecks the motor if it goes on too long.The last one we did,which goes back to about 99 - we put a 3L non turbo into (2.8 litre) The engine was fully reconed and it was a fairly simple conversion - but I still charged 24hrs labour and dropped some time on it too.Costs about the same to recon a motor as they want for a good 2nd hand job,and yeah,about 4 grand for a motor,so 5 to 6 all up,not good eh?

[750Y]

First the possible good news - we had a Hi Ace with a 2L come in Xmas Eve with a bad knock,sounded just like a big end or piston...but I suspected a sticky injector.After a compression test we cracked each injector and found the noise was in No1 cyl - so swapped 1 & 2 injectors,and the noise went away! Injector reco and all is well.You could get it down to me,but my mech has called in sick and I'm stuck with my usless apprentice,I'm gonna have a shit of a day...

Is it a turbo? The 2L turbo Surf was prone to dropping exhaust seats,kinda wrecks the motor if it goes on too long.The last one we did,which goes back to about 99 - we put a 3L non turbo into (2.8 litre) The engine was fully reconed and it was a fairly simple conversion - but I still charged 24hrs labour and dropped some time on it too.Costs about the same to recon a motor as they want for a good 2nd hand job,and yeah,about 4 grand for a motor,so 5 to 6 all up,not good eh?

Thanks for that Motu, when You say 'cracked each injector' do you mean you pulled it out? could you see the damage? did you replace them with good ones before the noise went away? do you think i could swap the suspect cylinder injector & see if the nopise moves? it is a non turbo 2.4. it will start but runs very rough & noisy..

[Motu]

Just slacken off the 17mm pipe union on top of the injector,that will cut the fuel to that cyl - doesn't prove it's the injector,just isolates the noise to that cyl.If the injector is sticking taking it out and putting it in again will often be enough to free it,just change cyls in case it doesn't - if the noise changes cyl it will be the injector,if the noise stays in the same cyl,well something more expensive is involved.Carefull of course when you pull them out,don't damage the pintle - the face of the injector should be smooth and flat with a small pintle pocking out,badly undercut nozzle means it's seen some kms and it will need new nozzles.Keep an eye on all those little washers too - a small wavy one under the nozzle,a big copper one under the gland nut.

Fingers crossed eh?!

[750Y]

mate i won't get my hopes up, but i'll reip ionto it as soon as i get home, i'd be a very happy chappy if it were the case. I really appreciate the help, now haven't you got an apprentice to go an yell at or something? 8-)

[bondagebunny]

one less cage on the road

[sAsLEX]

Could always do this??
www.4wd.net.nz/suprasurf.htm

mate is just finishing putting a soarer V8 into his 4x4 hilux, sounds pretty good, he has an old 2.4 motor he needs to sell will find out about condition price etc

[Motu]

Sure,a petrol engine makes more horsepower - up top,but if you are doing any off road or hauling you don't want HP that comes with revs...that means wheelspin.Stay with the diesel.

Did you see Clarkson try to destroy a Hi Lux on Top Gear last year? He couldn't kill it because it was a diesel - put them under salt water,set them on fire,what ever you like,you can't treat a petrol engine like that...no way if it's got a computer.

[What?]

I agree with Motu - could well be an injector. 220Km is barely run in for a 2.4 Toyota (as long as it has been serviced...)

[750Y]

well last night i cracked the injectors & tested for the knock. #4 then 3 then 2 then had trouble cracking #1. the whole injector body turned with it maybe a quarter turn & it was then that i noticed the little metal pipe which runs between injector body 1 & 2 was broken. Now i'm not sure whether i did it or it was like that but anyway now i have a compound problem, alas i'll continue... i thought ok & got a big crescent on the body and managed to crack it, so i pulled out the injector body(kinda looked like a spark plug shape). i'm not sure if i took the whole thing out as the body that came out only had a spring inside with a little nipple cap kinda thing. anyway i started the engine again to test & i think the knocking noise has gone(although it was running that rough that it was kinda hard to tell). it was puffing a smokey mist, with it out, & barely able to keep running. now i must replace the broken piping to test properly but it seems that all the injector bodies are interconnected with this piping. how do i fix this problem now?

Oh & thanks for the helpful advice bondagebunny, but i have kids to pick up after school & daycare, so i need a cage as much as i loathe them...

oh & What?, the engine has had a good service history, I am the 3rd owner & know the previous owner also...

[What?]

oh & What?, the engine has had a good service history, I am the 3rd owner & know the previous owner also...
Cool - that engine should have another 600K left in it at least.

[Motu]

Oh dear - the pipe you broke connecting injectors is the fuel return,can be repaired or get another from a wrecker (Manurewa Comercial) But sounds like you pulled the injector apart...not a good look,the biggest hex is a gland nut that holds the injector in,the smaller one dismantles the injector.With a bit of ignorant luck you may get it all back together and running so long as you haven't lost anything and get it all back in the correct order.I don't touch injectors,that's a specialist job that goes to High Speed Diesel in Nielson St Onehunga.

Apart from having a cam belt (dumb idea on a motor with zero valve to piston clearance that's supposed to run forever) these are a tough motor - they can crack heads if overheated,but the rest will go on and on and on...

[750Y]

ok, i have the top part of the injector in a plastic bag. it consists of 3 parts, a body, a spring & a cap. I am confident of getting it back in correctly without a problem but agree the fuel return is a major piss off. Sounds like a visit to manurewa commercial is on the cards followed possibly by a trip to high speed diesel. thanks again for your help

[750Y]

OK, went to Manurewa Commercial spares to pick up a replacement fuel return $73.
Will dismantle the tops of the injectors CAREFULLY and replace the fuel return line across all four & I will swap injectors 1 & 2 & then test. If the problem persists I will lift the head and have a nosey. I figure even if the engine is stuffed it hasn't cost me much to confirm it(less than the price of a tow truck to a mechanic shop). my fingers are crossed. c'mon baby!!!!

[750Y]

Anyone out there know if a toyota surf (SSR) 3L(2.8litre) diesel turbo efi engine can go into a standard 92 2L hilux? I know the block is identical but what about the turbo & efi. I found an engine with lowish kms for a reasonable price but it has the turbo & manifold & the efi on it still.
I'm thinking I can rip the turbo & manifold & associated plumbing off no worries but the efi bothers me because it will be computer controlled & may not talk to my own cdi. I guess i could just sit them side by side and swap all the ancillary parts over but it'd seem a waste to lose the newer injectors...

[750Y]

ACTUALLY FORGET ABOUT IT, THIS IS A BIKE SITE AFTER ALL & PLUS I JUST FOUND HILUX HEAVEN ON THE WEB...

[Motu]

Heh,heh...welcome to my world,how'd you like to do this sort of crap for a living eh?

[pete376403]

Just slacken off the 17mm pipe union on top of the injector,that will cut the fuel to that cyl - doesn't prove it's the injector,just isolates the noise to that cyl.

The diesel equivalent of pulling a spark plug lead.

If anyone here services Caterpillar diesels I still have the precombustion chamber removal tools I bought while doing my apprenticeship. Ask and they're yours.

[750Y]

Heh,heh...welcome to my world,how'd you like to do this sort of crap for a living eh?

i enjoy working on cars etc. as i have done a few conversions in the past but all petrol, this is my first diesel experience and i'm starting from ground zero & not very familiar with these jappas either.
if i did this for a living at least i'd have the damn tools!
YOU try doing a conversion armed with fencing pliers & a hammer 8-(
at least there's no shortage of number 8 at my place lol
dam kiwi diy-ers are a menace i tell ya,

[Motu]

I have to justify my time spent on the job,very hard in this day of consumer rights,fair trading act etc.Back in the old days we charged for every minute the mechanic spent on a vehicle,even going to pick up parts.These days customers scream and moan....the exhaust manifold nuts are siezed,the studs strip,we pull the manifold,drill and eaziout studs,fit new studs and replace manifold.....now days the customer sees that as my problem,not theirs...we broke the studs,not him,it's our problem.Grrrrr.

If you've done a conversion you'll know dropping the motor in the hole is 1/4 of the job,the little things take up all the time.If the 3L pump is fly by wire I'd put on a standard pump...more money,more time.Should be easy to run the computer though,all inputs come on the motor (TPS,CKS,MAP,CTS) all you need is the loom and a power supply.

[750Y]

If you've done a conversion you'll know dropping the motor in the hole is 1/4 of the job,the little things take up all the time..
Definitely!
i just found a drive in/out service $2k with 6mth guarantee. i know it's the lazy man's solution but it's cheap 8-) unless i can get a really good engine for a good price that's a straightforward swap i'm probably best going that way & flicking the whole shebang once up & running. still looking at all options tho.

[750Y]

DAM that place was so dodgy... when i wrote down the engine number to check on the year etc the looks i got was not good. i popped the cap it looked ok inside but a quick sniff revealed the engine had being doing a kettle impersonation recently(shiny head gasket on a filthy engine hmm). good new is... someone i know has a new engine for his & will give his high mile good runner to me for 'cheap as chips'. woohoo!!

[750Y]

WTF!?!? now i found out the 'good runner' has nearly 400kms & uses 2litres oil to every 3 tanks! i am going nuts! now i found another engine for $2k out of a smashed vehicle but gotta wait to inspect it when it arrives from Hamilton. it sounds like a goody. i am driving a toyota(i think) at the moment, yeck! i'm tempted to push the ute down the hill into the pond & start again with a newer beast. what a headache...

[Blakamin]

would you like a box of matches???? (and a litre of petrol coz diesel is hard to set fire to)

[750Y]

would you like a box of matches???? (and a litre of petrol coz diesel is hard to set fire to)

lol, thanks for your kind offer Blakamin, it's tempting, trust me...

[Blakamin]

I feel for ya... used to have to source engines for my nephews cage coz he'd kill one a month....
never again!

Good luck!!!

[750Y]

OK, ...i'm picking up a replacement engine today so there goes the weekend!
hope to have it up & running by monday, fingers crossed all goes to plan.

[Motu]

Swap the injectors of the replacement engine with the ones of the engine still in the truck - it could save you a few hours of filthy work....

[750Y]

hmmm, i don't understand, why shouldn't i just put the replacement engine in, injectors & all? The dude told me the engine i'm getting was recond 'top to bottom' a couple years back('insert tui label here').
being out of a van, i will probably need to swap the oil pans & i'll be throwing a new timing belt into it & changing filters & fluids at the same time, while its out. also i intend to get loose with the degreaser & clean the engine/bay.
the hardest part is the power steering hydraulic connector which is a 17 & it doesn't want to budge. apart from that only the engine mounts/exhaust flange need undoing & out she comes...(almost sounds too easy huh)

[Motu]

I retract my previous statement.