Car vs. Motorbike

[Sycophant]

I haven't seen any news stories about it yet but there was what looked like a very very nasty accident on the K Road/Symonds St intersection - I walked past about 30 minutes ago and just about tossed my cookies in the street. It was a horrible mess there were things in the road which should not be there.

By the time I passed there were no ambos left on scene so I assume all parties had been transported already but there was a heavy police presence and Symonds St was closed from the intersection to Wakefield St, the Grafton bridge also. As of about 3 miinutes ago, the Grafton Bridge was still closed, so I assume they are still investigating.

I was going to snap some pictures with my phone, but I was a little too disturbed by the scene. The bike was a red commuter-style bike. It looked pretty small. That's all I can tell you.

I hope the rider was okay, but I am not confident. And I hope everyone on here is okay. Be safe. Drivers are crazy.

Edit:
Also, from what I saw it looked like two, possibly three cars were involved. One had hit the toilets on the bridge side there, both airbags deployed and a big crack in the windscreen on the passengers side.

I think there was a van involved too, and I maybe another car, I saw a bumper that didn't seem to belong to the first car.

[bugjuice]

ouch. Lets hope it's not a fatality

[Ninja51]

Ive been in this glorious country of yours a year now... to me, its fabulous and the friendship and camaradery i see (especially on here) knocks spots off the UK. But reading the title thread here and having had to have my wits about me on New Zealand roads on more than one occassion only serves to confirm one thing to me. Kiwi cagers are dreadful drivers! Am I right or am I wrong? As for letting a kid into a low slung, low profiled, magged, fat exhausted, tinted windowed cage with a picnic table on the back at 15! Gawd 'elp us!

Remember guys! Keep death off the roads...ride on the pavement!

[onearmedbandit]

Not trying to hijack the thread, but on the way home tonight from work as I approached an intersection controlled by lights in the inner city a painted up mk1 escort with 2 guys and a girl flew through the right only metres in front of my car. Put the shits right up me, you know the whole 'whoa how close was that', the driver realised what he'd done but didn't slow or react in any way, he would've been doing at least 65-70km/h. Almost enough to give up riding in town with fuckwits like that, he's the sort of driver who needs to be banished from our roads.

[Zapf]

Ive been in this glorious country of yours a year now... to me, its fabulous and the friendship and camaradery i see (especially on here) knocks spots off the UK. But reading the title thread here and having had to have my wits about me on New Zealand roads on more than one occassion only serves to confirm one thing to me. Kiwi cagers are dreadful drivers! Am I right or am I wrong? As for letting a kid into a low slung, low profiled, magged, fat exhausted, tinted windowed cage with a picnic table on the back at 15! Gawd 'elp us!

Remember guys! Keep death off the roads...ride on the pavement!

well, it is really hard to group kiwi drivers into one singular group, as most people who live in NZ comes from different backgrounds and different part of the world.

And it doesn't help with the state of the NZ drivers education system.

Some people just really don't know the finer rules / or methods of driving..

I for one am "Asian". and if it was not for one of my mates who is involved in motorsports and has raced in the targa for the past few years, I wouldn't have had been so passionate about motoring and perhaps not be driving as well as I am and taking care on the road. And also the family up bringing of what is acceptable has a lot do with it as well...

anyway that is my "bit"

OH AND THOSE RED LIGHT RUNNERS!

[Sycophant]

I am actually selling my bike in the near future (for financial and practical reasons mainly) - but things like this make the decision easier. I would only use it for commuting around the city - given the way many people drive in the city (taxis and couriers are especially dodgy) it can be pretty dangerous for bikers around the city streets. I know of at least four serious car vs motorcycle accidents on Symonds St in the last 18 months or so. And don't even get me started on the joys of riding on Ponsonby Road.

I'll buy another bike in a few years when I have a little more money, and free time, and I can take nice long leisurly rides in the great outdoors without having to worry about what any of the 9 cars immediately surrounding me are about to do for no apparant reason.

[crashe]

Fark I hope the rider is ok.

Ummm not wanting to hi-jack the thread....
But I too had a close call today on the nor-western motorway heading city bound.

I was in the middle lane.... very little traffic... and this big silver BMW came up on my right hand side and then cruised at my pace .... cool no problems... nothing ahead of us...
But then I spotted out the corner of my eye that the car was getting closer to me.... so I'm thinking shit.. I hit the horn... and the car is still coming closer... I kept my finger on the horn the whole time, but its like they were deaf, so I ended up being pushed in the far left lane.... thank goodness there wasn't nothing in that lane... but the truck in the far left lane wasnt that far behind me.

I gave the driver the "International finger" and raised my fist...
no reaction... so I went back in front of the car but another car got in between me and the Silver BMW.... I was still furious, so I moved into the far right lane and slowed down... and as the silver BMW finally came up beside me I yelled all the abuse under the sun to the driver... the driver eventually raised a hand to say sorry... I then pointed to my eyes to say to her "Try using them, thats what they are for"....
:angry2: :angry2: :angry2:

Now if I knew how you dudes do it I really felt like kicking in her door and knocking of the wing mirrors...

So why did the driver need to come into my lane when there was nothing ahead of them. They even stayed in the middle lane after I pulled off the motorway... and they DIDN'T indicate either.

They had to have seen me as they came up from behind me in the other lane and cruised beside me at the speed limit for a short time.... so how the FARK could they not have seen me.

[Zapf]

Crashe, quote "driver education" end quote.

Just imagen how horrerified german drivers must be 1st time on our roads...

[Gixxer 4 ever]

I was going to snap some pictures with my phone, .

Good choice. We do not need to see it.


I hope the rider was okay, but I am not confident. And I hope everyone on here is okay. Be safe. Drivers are crazy.

Even with all this posted here and on other web pages I still want to ride and if it is tomorrow my number is up so be it but I would be an even bigger pain to live with if I could not go out and give it a thrash from time to time. Maybe we need to look at ourselves. We thrash the bikes on the road and have a ball, but, it appears to me we are the hypocrites because we do the same things the cage drivers do and we bag them no end but are we any better?
Hope the rider and drivers are ok but what will be will be.
Keep riding, it fills the need to be free and happy. I am as upset about this as everyone else ( probable a bit more than some at this time ) but I see a constant thread bagging cages. Like the speeding thing. We need to look at our own attitude to road use before we judge others. Take care out there

[Gixxer 4 ever]

I was still furious, so I moved into the far right lane and slowed down... and as the silver BMW finally came up beside me I yelled all the abuse under the sun to the driver... the driver eventually raised a hand to say sorry... I then pointed to my eyes to say to her "Try using them, thats what they are for"....
:angry2: :angry2: :angry2:

.

Seeing as I am having a rant on here myself lets try a little tolerance. When I visit Auckland ( once every few years ) I love the motorway and love to head out in to the traffic. I do not know the local codes of conduct and if I read a map that tells me to be in the middle lane that's where I go as soon as it is practical to do so. I tend to stay there till I see the off ramp or I get lost. And believe me lost for me is lost. I do keep up with the traffic and I do use the indicators but I know I get it wrong from time to time. As you all do. Try looking at the others point of view. You do not know what or where they are coming from and if they give a wave to apologise just wave back. The point is made. Defuse the situation and you just might make the difference for that person for the rest of there lives. Soft and fuzzy.....maybe but life is fragile and short so why waist it on abuse when people get it wrong.

[Atomic]

Soft and fuzzy.....maybe but life is fragile and short so why waist it on abuse when people get it wrong.

Yeah, no one lost an eye, limb or there life in this situation so its easy to say "why waist it on abuse when people get it wrong" but what about "WHAT IF"!? What if there had been a vehicle in the left hand lane when this BMW decided to take Crashe's road space? Crashe looses his life because this guy "got it wrong"! For all we know, this guy makes a habit of owning the road and maybe...just maybe he needs to know that he needs to wake up. Sure its possible that it was a one time mistake but not likely considering it took so long for Crashe to get his attention.

[Biff]

Here's hoping everyone involved is ok.
Photo's - no thank you.

[Sycophant]

I found a brief mention of it on the Xtra site:
http://xtramsn.co.nz/news/0,,11964-4090835,00.html


08/02/2005
NewstalkZB
Traffic in central Auckland came to a standstill during the evening rush hour after an accident near the top of Symonds Street.

A motorcycle and a car collided at the intersection with Karangahape Road just before four o'clock.

The rider is in hospital with critical injuries.

Police blocked off all but one lane on Symonds Street between Wakefield Street and Grafton Road.

This affected traffic throughout the rest of the CBD, with Queen Street gridlocked, and long delays expected.

[bear]

Just read similar item on the nzherald site, hope the rider is okay.

[Krayy]

The Herald's got this one.... http://www.nzherald.co.nz/index.cfm?c_id=1&ObjectID=10010131
Key piece of info is:

"Inspector Darroch Todd of the police northern communications centre said the motorbike and a car, going south through the intersection from Karangahape Rd, collided with a second car coming along Symonds St. "

This to me sounds like cager # 2 ran a red while going up or down Symonds and collected both the poor bastards. What do you reckon the chances are he'll get done for any serious charge in the biker doesn't pull through? Damn sentencing laws in the country are piss weak.

[MacD]

There's some more detail in the Herald (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/index.cfm?c_id=1&ObjectID=10010131).


Inspector Darroch Todd of the police northern communications centre said the motorbike and a car, going south through the intersection from Karangahape Rd, collided with a second car coming along Symonds St.

I commute through this area and decided a long time ago that it wasn't worth filtering up to the front of the lights as there are too many red-light runners through these intersections. Even if I'm at the front of the queue I wait until I'm sure nobody is coming through the intersection, particularly buses which seem to be as bad at it as cars!

Hope the rider recovers, I know a few people that ride through there but none have a small red bike.

As for Crashe's experience, if I can't speed up to avoid paralleling a car, I tend to drop back. Being beside a car on the left seems to be a significant blind-spot for most drivers. Glad you made it past OK!

(Heh, Krayy beat me to the draw by 1 minute! Damned slow typing! )

[Sycophant]

The Herald's got this one.... http://www.nzherald.co.nz/index.cfm?c_id=1&ObjectID=10010131
Key piece of info is:

"Inspector Darroch Todd of the police northern communications centre said the motorbike and a car, going south through the intersection from Karangahape Rd, collided with a second car coming along Symonds St. "

This to me sounds like cager # 2 ran a red while going up or down Symonds and collected both the poor bastards. What do you reckon the chances are he'll get done for any serious charge in the biker doesn't pull through? Damn sentencing laws in the country are piss weak.

I walked through the intersection on the way to work this morning. Judging by the painted marks on the road, that looks pretty accurate... Although I can't quite imagine how it happened. When I went past all the wreckage was very much on the north side of the intersection.

I assume the northbound car just collected both the car and bike and shunted them through the intersection. There are some fairly hefty gouges in the road, and very strong tyre marks.

I've had some close calls on that intersection myself, with redlight runners and also people who decide they don't want to do where their lane is supposed to go.

Edit:
If anyone is concerned about who the biker was, there is a very clear photo of the bike on A2 of today's NZ Herald, with the number plate clearly visible.

[Atomic]

Tell me it wasnt a Red Honda GN250 with white wheels!?
I havent got the herald.

[Krayy]

Tell me it wasnt a Red Honda GN250 with white wheels!?
I havent got the herald.
It looks like a Suzi GN125 or 250 from the back with the plate 23WGS. Looks like its brand new with no scuffing on rear and chrome all polished with no visible dirt. Even the pipe doesnt have any carbon build up.

[Atomic]

Whoops I meant Suzuki GN/Honda CB! Whats a Honda GN!?!?!?!
But after looking at bike pics iv realized my mate has a Honda CB250 so thats a relief.

Still unfortuante and I hope the rider recovers ok.

[mini_hooks_]

thats a bit on the ruff side!!!!! :shit:
three cars onto one bike, thats crazy.....
some people just dont know how to drive!!!!! :angry2: :brick: :brick:

[Krayy]

It looks like a Suzi GN125 or 250 from the back with the plate 23WGS. Looks like its brand new with no scuffing on rear and chrome all polished with no visible dirt. Even the pipe doesnt have any carbon build up.
That plate would put the purchase time at around late November last year I think as I got 23WLF at that time too, so the rider might have been very new to the bike too. What a darn Xmas present eh?

[Rainbow Wizard]

decided a long time ago that it wasn't worth filtering up to the front of the lights as there are too many red-light runners through these intersections.

Thanks for this comment, hadn't considered it being risky beforehand. Might save me in the future.
Cheers :niceone:

[jrandom]

It looks like a Suzi GN125 or 250 from the back with the plate 23WGS.

Aw, damn, I hate this. Yes, it was a new GN250, and the rider had a rather unusual surname... a quick Google reveals that he was only one degree of separation removed from me via the NZ ADSL mailing list. Never actually corresponded with him, but it's a small world, innit.

My thoughts go out to his wife. Hope he's OK.

[Slim]

From Crime Scene in the Herald today:

Police want to hear from anyone who witnessed an accident on the corner of Karangahape Road and Symonds Street about 3:30pm on Tuesday of last week. Motorcyclist Mark Tan-Wanklyn (unfortunate name!!!), 41, has since died of his injuries at the crash. The cars involved were a Toyota Camry and Ford XR6. Information to Constable Graham Morton on (09) 359-3114.

[jrandom]

Mark Tan-Wanklyn (unfortunate name!!!)

Told yez so...


...has since died of his injuries at the crash.

Another one bites the dust. Requiem aeternam.

[Hitcher]

There's usually something pretentiously dodgy about people with hyphenated surnames...

[jrandom]

There's usually something pretentiously dodgy about people with hyphenated surnames...

Unfortunately, this one didn't have quite *enough* dodge.

[Hitcher]

Unfortunately, this one didn't have quite *enough* dodge.
Obviously a case of hyphen-induced indecision.

[avgas]

Some people just really don't know the finer rules / or methods of driving..

Have to agree here, why do all instructors teach that you should hit the brakes in any situation.
I actually took my G/F to an empty car park, taught her to 'race' her car round the car park. This taught her good skills like : cornering, swerving, decelleration, driving in tight spaces and 'look where you want to go'.
The lessons she got from AA were bullshit, they just jumped in the car with her and said "Lets drive around the block a few times".
It scares me to know that 1/2 the drivers out there, in an emergency sit. are gonna slam on the brakes/horn - rather than avoid the situation.

Oh yeh as for the comment about not riding after seeing the drivers, thats to someone who was late to the office in the morning i have a pin in the leg. I dont like taking any risks round town anymore.......anyone can kill you - not just the boy racers.

[EZAS]

If som1 wanted to learn how to drive they shouldnt be taught when there 16-18. As this is the time your brain starts to shrink (honestly it does start at this age). If children are taught to drive, and are shown horrific "scar'd for life" shots of what happens if your careless, im sure the country would be better off having 8 year olds at intersections than either, illiterate taxi drivers that couldnt read the part stating "RED = STOP", or old men, who sit at give way signs after you've shaken the fist and held the horn down for 2 mins.

As for symonds/nelson, Another shocker is Upper Queen Street and Newton Road .. I work on this corner and have seen motorcyclist killed already. We usually get ATLEAST one major accident a week, but atleast 1 or 2 minor dings a day. Its only the danger that makes it so fun :doctor:

[Motu]

Come down to my roundabout at Carr rd - we can have 4 prangs before morning break,there's a big pile of glass and plastic out there right now.Only seen one bike prang there,and that was just a Harley on a diesel spill so it doesn't count.

[Krayy]

It still makes me wonder about the relative noob status of the bike and whether he had started riding only a few months back. Now at 41 you would think he would be a reasonably cautious (unlike yours truly, but I have a few years left - well, less than 5 anyway - to get there) and have a modicum of road sense.

That being said, I remember when I got the VTR after a long hiatus (15 odd years) and I did experience a little tunnel vision while I was relearning and getting used to the controls and find the limits of the gears.

Now, however, I'm used to the bike, so all of the changing gears, signalling etc is all automatic which allows me to be more actively visual and take in more of my surroundings while looking for danger areas. I was very reticent to do any kind of filtering during that transition phase, and even now I only do it at low speeds when there is a decent sized gap and the traffic is (almost) stationary - Northwestern Motorway anyone?

If and when I get a new bike, I think it'll be a case of finding a quiet area and just going through gears, learn their limits and get to a point where riding is automatic before filtering on it.

P.S. With such an oddball name it took about 30 seconds to find out his wife's name, email and phone (theres only 1 entry in the Whitepages too). Does the KB community have anyone who makes contact with crash victims to show our support at all? (and no, I'm not volunteering if there isn't)

[jrandom]

I was very reticent to do any kind of filtering during that transition phase, and even now I only do it at low speeds when there is a decent sized gap and the traffic is (almost) stationary - Northwestern Motorway anyone?

That would have been you I said hello to at the Nelson St turnoff a few mornings back, then. Thought you were probably a KBer but couldn't remember who had a yellow VTR. You're filtering OK. You'll probably end up going a bit faster than you do now, but then again, why bother... you'll just get to work earlier...


Does the KB community have anyone who makes contact with crash victims to show our support at all?

Nup. If we wanted to do that, we'd have to get crash victim details from the cops, and they wouldn't give us those details unless the people involved in each instance were happy to, and the whole thing would be a non-starter unless we were a proper legal entity of some sort with qualified counsellors, etc... fuggeddabootit.

[Krayy]

That would have been you I said hello to at the Nelson St turnoff a few mornings back, then. Thought you were probably a KBer but couldn't remember who had a yellow VTR. You're filtering OK. You'll probably end up going a bit faster than you do now, but then again, why bother... you'll just get to work earlier...
I was thinking the same thing. Damn lights change too quick to have a good conversation though.