New boy racer legislation

[Tony]

Ok I know this is not a bike debate but it does incorrectly concern us.

John Key and the national party are proposing draconian new laws to deal with boy racers.

"Mr Key, Police Minister Judith Collins and Transport Minister Steven Joyce talked with officials last night about how quickly changes could be made.

Ms Collins is to see Police Commissioner Howard Broad today.

Options included a cease and desist order, like that used in Scotland. It would require a new offence of vehicle disorder -- using a vehicle in a way that alarmed or distressed the public -- to be established."

ref: http://nz.news.yahoo.com/a/-/top-stories/5294512 (http://nz.news.yahoo.com/a/-/top-stories/5294512)

This law is of real concern as it leaves too much discretion in the hands of individual police officers. It is the middle part of wedge...we have already seen the thin end of the wedge.

Also the rule worries me as it is more about politicing than it is about road safety. Draconian knee jerk laws like this criminalises people and causes us all more issues down stream.

Here's an alternative suggestion for legislation.

Introduce a Learner restriction similar to that for motorcycle learners.

"1. Learner drivers are not permitted to drive a non turbovehicle greater than 1350cc (Alternatively limit cars by a power to weight ratio as per the new motorcycle learner restrictions) until they reach the age of 20. No engine modifications (including engine electronics, induction and exhauxst systems) are permitted, but owners may modify the personalise the vehicle in any other way that is compliant with Warrant Of Fitness regulations.

2.Vehicles of drivers caught breaking this rule will be sold to defray fines, court costs, victim compensation and any damages to third party property. [This rule has been amended from previous suggestion of crushing cars due to popular consensus ...and because my self esteem can't withstand losing votes to Judith Collins!]

Exemptions:
Learner drivers may drive a vehicle that exceeds this CC restriction if they are accompanied by either the owner of the car or a family member who must be over the age of 20.

Learner drivers may apply for an exemption to this rule for the purpose of driving speciality vehicles as part of their employment, etc that will not be unreasonably withheld.

Learner drivers who are existing owners of vehicles that are not compliant with these conditions may continue driving them while they remain the owners of them."

[madbikeboy]

Bullshit.

If 300 bikers mobbed and shot at a police officer, we'd deserve to get this legislation on us.

The boy racer problem is way out of control - most Fridays and Saturdays the boy racers use my road as a fucking race track - I've lost count of the amount of times they've crashed on my corner. Most of the time they're drunk. I've stopped bothering to go help, if they bleed to death, it's their problem.

This doesn't affect us, or concern us.

[mrchips]

Saw this on the news & thought..... oh not again, they're not going to target bloody exhaust noise again shurely.

Shame it took harassing a member of our finest law enforcement constabulary to get the ball rolling, at least they're taking it seriously this time.

[Tank]

Saw this on the news & thought..... oh not again, they're not going to target bloody exhaust noise again shurely.

Shame it took harassing a member of our finest law enforcement constabulary to get the ball rolling, at least they're taking it seriously this time.

Its a lot more than just loud exhaust.

[nodrog]

why the fuck do they need to make another bullshit law to deal with these fuckwits? what is wrong with using the dangerous driving, speeding, drunk driving, assualt, etc laws that already exist.

there is going to be so many variations of basically the same type of law soon, that the coppers are going to have to have fuckin lawyers degrees to work out which one to apply.

they need to simplify the existing laws and apply them properly instead of inventing new ones.

soon it will be illegal to listen to anything other than classic hits on your car stereo because it might frighten the blue rinse brigade.

[Road Guardian]

Bullshit.

If 300 bikers mobbed and shot at a police officer, we'd deserve to get this legislation on us.

The boy racer problem is way out of control - most Fridays and Saturdays the boy racers use my road as a fucking race track - I've lost count of the amount of times they've crashed on my corner. Most of the time they're drunk. I've stopped bothering to go help, if they bleed to death, it's their problem.

This doesn't affect us, or concern us.

I totally agree with that MBB.

Tony
Putting any restriction on any learner in a car IS NOT GOING TO FIX ANYTHING, the issue is the access these (and I mean the "hardcore boy racers") boy racers have too cars.

You can take away their licenses, and they will continue to drive their vehicles. The issue is their behavior is getting out of control, taking their car will fix that.

Any boy racer legislation should not affect the majority of bike riders, how many bikers do you see driving up and down Manchester Street on a Friday night. And if any of us (bikers) who are acting like a boy racer should have their bike/license taken anyway.

I support the change that is required, as I HAVE TO PICK THE B******* UP when they crash because of their own stupidity and excess testosterone.

And nodrog, yes i agree with you a bit there, the laws should be simplified and made more more effective.

Yea yea, another rant I know, sad :( :argue:

[Disco Dan]

As Judith Collins said herself on the news - cars should be crushed.

That would really start sending the message to these very immature youths.

They show no respect for the law or anyone else.

I would love for them to stream the crushing of their tin can cars on website.

[MSTRS]

why the fuck do they need to make another bullshit law to deal with these fuckwits? what is wrong with using the dangerous driving, speeding, drunk driving, assualt, etc laws that already exist.

there is going to be so many variations of basically the same type of law soon, that the coppers are going to have to have fuckin lawyers degrees to work out which one to apply.

they need to simplify the existing laws and apply them properly instead of inventing new ones.


That covers it nicely. New laws are not required.
eg Right now there is a law pertaining to illegal gatherings and/or gathering for the purposes of committing a criminal act. Use that one.

[Dargor]

They dont need more laws they need police to go to where they hang out and wait with ticket book ready. loss of traction - ticket, drink driving - ticket, speeding - ticket.

However i agree engine size limit would be good, but restrict by licence not age.

[meteor]

That covers it nicely. New laws are not required.
eg Right now there is a law pertaining to illegal gatherings and/or gathering for the purposes of committing a criminal act. Use that one.

Exactly, but when the case inevitably gets to court we need the justice sector to step up. All to frequently the laws are made an ass of because the courts are not sending the message. Reap what we sow! Look at how the cops are getting assaulted, if the courts banged the crims up for doing it then they would stop. It's a justice issue not a police one.

[Mikkel]

I don't understand why people think that a ccm limitation as part of the graded licensing system is going to change anything. The problem here is not that they are speeding, it's all the other shit that goes on.

If they can't pay their fines, expropriate and sell their cars. If they use mob tactics to ambush cops - round them up and lock them down. If some of them have to go to hospital before the rest of them understands that society at large isn't going to put up with that kind of shit, then so be it.

As far as vehicles are concerned compulsory 3rd party insurance is going to hit them where it hurts. Provided that they are made to follow the rules, which the nanny state hasn't been able to achieve yet.

[JMemonic]

How about this for an idea Police not attending situations like this, where they know from past experience the potential to explode into a near riot, with only one officer.

They don't have the resources thanks to successive attacks by governments and bureaucrats into basic issues like staffing, also what has not help is the softly softly approach to restorative justice, there is little disincentive for behaviour like this, jails are full fines are unpaid, there are stories often about community service not being done and ankle bracelets being left at home.

What is needed is a total overhaul of our justice system, slowly and thoughtfully from the ground up, we need incentives for people with life experience to enter enforcement, a restorative system that actually has some form of punishment to it, and when restitution is ordered 10 cents per week is not acceptable, punishment needs to be that punishment.

[idb]

young people frighten me

[oldrider]

To make a law like this work they will have to crush their cars with them still inside them!

I could vote for something like that. :niceone: John.

[moT]

Great all the boy racers are gunna start driving 13b rotarys

[The Stranger]

why the fuck do they need to make another bullshit law to deal with these fuckwits? what is wrong with using the dangerous driving, speeding, drunk driving, assualt, etc laws that already exist.

there is going to be so many variations of basically the same type of law soon, that the coppers are going to have to have fuckin lawyers degrees to work out which one to apply.

they need to simplify the existing laws and apply them properly instead of inventing new ones.

soon it will be illegal to listen to anything other than classic hits on your car stereo because it might frighten the blue rinse brigade.

Nah, you're wrong!
With this new law he could have quickly grabbed a pen and instantly issued 300 cease and desist orders. That would have fixed those boy racers good and proper!

[The Stranger]

Bullshit.

If 300 bikers mobbed and shot at a police officer, we'd deserve to get this legislation on us.

The boy racer problem is way out of control - most Fridays and Saturdays the boy racers use my road as a fucking race track - I've lost count of the amount of times they've crashed on my corner. Most of the time they're drunk. I've stopped bothering to go help, if they bleed to death, it's their problem.

This doesn't affect us, or concern us.


"Prime Minister John Key says law changes to crack down on boy racers would be implemented quickly, possibly within six months."

Southern Area Commander Inspector Malcolm Johnston said... "This is not boy racer activity. This is thuggery."

[nodrog]

... "This is not boy racer activity. This is thuggery."

great! now they are going to pass laws making thuggery illegal as well i suppose?

[Skyryder]

The fact that individuals can hide behind a large gathering and commit offences not only against the police as happened her in Chch this weekend but the public at large also does need some kind of drastic response. This sort of behavour simply can not be allowed to continue. It's a problem of identifying the indavidual that hides behind the crowd and not one so much of driving laws etc. This to me seems to be the issue. While I am not entirely in agreement with this proposed legislation the police do need some, and I say this with some hesitation, powers of mass arrest if only for processing reasons for future enquiries where incedents of a simular nature occured here in Christchurch. I would be extreemly concerned if this carried on with a prosecution simply on the basis of being in the vicinity where an incident ocurred.

My main concern is that legislation is not discriminatory and while I can see no other groups at present that pose the sort of problems that the so called boy racers do I can not help but wonder who this would be turned on once the boy racer problem is resolved. I would be a bit more enthusiastic about this if the proposed legislation had a built in expirary date so that if these laws needed to be extended this could be debated in a more enlightened environment than at present.

My own gut feeling on this is that there needs to be some kind of legislation where the courts have imposed some penalty by way of loss of licence and the car impounded etc there needs to be some measures taken for the prevention of purchasing a new vehicle. Shut down the credit supply by making it an offence to give credit for the purchase of a vehicle for say five years coupled with an extended period of loss of licence for an equivalent time for weekends (when most of these problem occure) and you will solve this problem over night. No chick who is interested in boy racers is going to get involved with the ‘passanger’ so you have reduced his sex life and by extending a weekend ban for a long time you will remove the individual from the boy racer crowd.

There you are Jude C. go for it.

Skyryder

[Skyryder]

As Judith Collins said herself on the news - cars should be crushed.

That would really start sending the message to these very immature youths.

They show no respect for the law or anyone else.

I would love for them to stream the crushing of their tin can cars on website.

I think they should be required to press the button too and the Judge order all their mates along to watch.

Skyryder

[Skyryder]

Nah, you're wrong!
With this new law he could have quickly grabbed a pen and instantly issued 300 cease and desist orders. That would have fixed those boy racers good and proper!

Someone needs to design a taser shot gun. They could all drown in their own vomit:soon:

Skyryder

[ckai]

So these guys in Chch were allegedly doing burnouts? Obviously someone saw them for this to be reported. If this is the case then by someone seeing them, their cars can be confiscated. It's happened before - a rather high profile case with expensive car involved. I don't get it?

If the cop got hemmed in and had to bugger off, then he can grab some mates later and start grabbing cars. Of course this would depend on accurate decriptions of car for witnesses.

So the high profile case didn't actually do what the judge entended it to do? I bet some people are pissed off about that ;)

[howdamnhard]

As Judith Collins said herself on the news - cars should be crushed.

That would really start sending the message to these very immature youths.

They show no respect for the law or anyone else.

I would love for them to stream the crushing of their tin can cars on website.

What he said,crush their cars.

[Max Preload]

Bullshit.

If 300 bikers mobbed and shot at a police officer, we'd deserve to get this legislation on us.

But that's not the only way it will be able to be used - it will be used when you have a personality conflict with a cop who has pulled you over and he can't get you for anything else. Police already have sufficient powers to deal with rioters, disorder and arguably far too many to deal with vehicles like "It sounds too loud to me - here's your sticker!" and "You took off too fast and it looked like you were racing that other vehicle, so I'm taking your vehicle for 28-days".

The fact of the matter is that as much of a pain these Christchurch clowns are, I strongly object to legislation that is purely subjective in nature because history has shown that it will be misused.

[DarkLord]

Also agree with the crushing of the cars.

Correct me if I am wrong, but once the cars have been impounded, are they not just sold off again? so therefore what is to stop another boy racer shelling out his student loan or whatever on another racers car that was impounded? The car is off the road for a while, sure, but then it just ends up back on it again.

If the cars are destroyed, there is no chance of anyone else getting their hands on a previously impounded car so you would hope that this would start to drastically lessen the amount of boy racer cars on the road.

[The Pastor]

good lord burnouts! the horrors!

[idb]

Typical though, nothing is done until a poor policeman is a little bit frightened!!!
What about all of the innocent citizens of that have been terrorised over the years and everyone has sat on their hands...bloody hypocrites!!!
Cops are pricks!!!

We need a new super hero that will protect us...someone with a past full of demons and who suffers flashbacks at inconvenient moments of danger but can no longer sit idly by and watch the criminal underworld force the good citizens to live in fear in their own homes.

He must have a cool rubber suit as well.

[woza]

Boy racers have been around for decades, you will never stop young males modifying cars and doing burn outs.

However attacking a police officer is stupid and deserves some harse penalties.

[Max Preload]

Correct me if I am wrong, but once the cars have been impounded, are they not just sold off again?

Incorrect. Only the Court can confiscate and sell a vehicle. Vehicles impounded under the existing 'Boy Racer' legislation are returned after 28-days and payment of the towage & storage charges.

[nodrog]

We need a new super hero that will protect us...someone with a past full of demons and who suffers flashbacks at inconvenient moments of danger but can no longer sit idly by and watch the criminal underworld force the good citizens to live in fear in their own homes.

He must have a cool rubber suit as well.

i vote for Orgazmo (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/0/0a/Orgazmo_film.jpg)

[madbikeboy]

good lord burnouts! the horrors!

No, not burnouts. The cop was shot at. If that had happened in LA, then there would have been a very different end result for the 300 naughty children.

[Marmoot]

Bullshit.

If 300 bikers mobbed and shot at a police officer, we'd deserve to get this legislation on us.

The boy racer problem is way out of control - most Fridays and Saturdays the boy racers use my road as a fucking race track - I've lost count of the amount of times they've crashed on my corner. Most of the time they're drunk. I've stopped bothering to go help, if they bleed to death, it's their problem.

This doesn't affect us, or concern us.

I'd assume you've been burrying your head in the sand so deep it actually popped into a chinese arse at the other side of the earth...

One only needs to remember the chaos when they brought out the exhaust law a few years back. It concerned both some bikers as well as soccer mums in Subarus. Did it stop the boyracer problems? Apparently not.

[Mikkel]

Well, let's just all hope they come up with a final solution to the boy racer problem sometime soon then.

[DarkLord]

Incorrect. Only the Court can confiscate and sell a vehicle. Vehicles impounded under the existing 'Boy Racer' legislation are returned after 28-days and payment of the towage & storage charges.

So the original owner ends up getting it back??

If that's the case, that stupid law isn't going to solve anything. They know they can go and do what they want, if worst comes to the worst they will lose their license (will still drive anyway) and will lose their car but only for a month.

I vote again for car crushing. I already voted before but I want to again.

[Marmoot]

Well, let's just all hope they come up with a final solution to the boy racer problem sometime soon then.

I hope we're not thinking of the same thing

Final Solution (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Final_Solution)

[Ixion]

Police want a cease and desist order, like that used in Scotland. It would require a new offence of vehicle disorder – using a vehicle in a way that alarmed or distressed the public – to be established.

...

Other changes police wanted included; licence suspension for failure to pay fines; increased demerit point penalties for speeding, and serious penalties for failure to stop for police.



Firstly, what do speeding and failure to stop have to do with it. My understanding is that they are already pretty much stopped. Are they saying that the 300 boi-racers were speeding and failed to stop? 300 boi racers congregated at 100kph+ would be quite a sight.

Secondly, they want an offence of 'alarming or distressing the public'. That is wide open to abuse. And could have major impact on motorcycles, since Mabel gets alarmed and distressed every time someone overtakes her.I can see that being used against lanesplitters for example.

There's not even a 'reasonable person' clause. The person who claims to be alarmed or distressed could be mentally unstable. or just have a major obsession against motorbikes. Should my bike be confiscated because some neurotic froot-loop old woman , who's already half demented goes off her tree ?

The original (present) boy racer laws have been so widely abused by the police that any extension of them should be viewed with the greatest concern. They certainly won't be used only against boi-racers.

[R6_kid]

Bullshit.

If 300 bikers mobbed and shot at a police officer, we'd deserve to get this legislation on us.

The boy racer problem is way out of control - most Fridays and Saturdays the boy racers use my road as a fucking race track - I've lost count of the amount of times they've crashed on my corner. Most of the time they're drunk. I've stopped bothering to go help, if they bleed to death, it's their problem.

This doesn't affect us, or concern us.


Tell me how what they are doing on your road at night is different to groups of bikes riding over Coromandel without concern for the speed limit.

I'm sure that being passed by a bike doing 170kmh+ would put the shits up most Sunday drivers.

The thing that worries me is the "using a vehicle in a way that alarmed or distressed the public" - some people are so insecure on the road that they cant use merging lanes properly. Simply having a loud exhaust makes them cringe and lower their speed by another 20kmh in moving traffic.

I know of a well respected person on this site who was charged with dangerous driving after he 'ran another vehicle of the road'. The complaint wasnt from the person that pulled off the road voluntarily, it was from a person 100m back who thought they saw the vehicle swerve to avoid the vehicle passing them.

And anyway for what it's worth, 'witnesses' are over-rated. Unless you have photo/video footage your memory can be somewhat unreliable.

[Max Preload]

So the original owner ends up getting it back??

Yes. Unless it is in the meantime confiscated by the Courts for unpaid fines etc.


If that's the case, that stupid law isn't going to solve anything.

No shit... :sherlock:

At the end of the day this is not a legislation issue - there are plenty of existing laws that allow the Police to deal with the vehicle issues. But this issue is not one of cars or boy racers but one of simple lawlessness. Personally, I don't want to be put in the situation of being able to be threatened with prosecution under some knee-jerk reactionary subjective law because I refuse to be bullied (i.e. simply don't pass the attitude test if stopped). There's already far too many of those bullshit laws now.

[The Stranger]

We need a new super hero that will protect us...someone with a past full of demons and who suffers flashbacks at inconvenient moments of danger but can no longer sit idly by and watch the criminal underworld force the good citizens to live in fear in their own homes.

He must have a cool rubber suit as well.

After all it's been 22 years since Chernobyl, where's our super heros?

[ManDownUnder]

Best thing the boy racers could do it turn on those bringing their name into disrepute - assuming there are those that obey the law (forgive me - but all I have is the press BS to go on).

Like with bikes - if someone pulled a gun on the police and had a go... I'd be the first to name them. That's stupidity that will reflect badly on anyone not speaking out against it.

As for law changes afoot as the result? No surprise at all.... ab-so-lute-ly none. Someone escalated the issue - consider it escalated. I'm right with the cops on this one.

[DarkLord]

I really believe that the core of the issue lies simply within the heart and mind of each individual. That is the only way anything is going to get resolved. We can all point fingers as much as we like, but for every finger we point at others there are three pointing back at us. This goes for EVERYONE. No one is exempt from this.

Personally, I would like to see boy racer cars crushed if deserved. However I somehow doubt that would change anything. For the root of the problem is within the individual, not within the vehicle that they own. We can take the vehicle away from them but their attitude that causes them to act irresponsibly will remain, and will either manifest through them finding another vehicle and doing the same thing, or through something worse.

I feel that the NZ justice system, although well-meaning, is too soft at times and is fully reliant on those who are in the wrong realising that they have been "naughty" and are grateful for the lenient, educational "punishment" received, and therefore know not to do it again. Boi-racers know that they will just get their car back, and once they do they can go and do it again. If there was a real risk involved, of them losing their car permanently, then they may stop racing. However as I have said that attitude will just come out elsewhere and will be just as unpleasant.

They also know that they can protest about the treatment they received for doing something wrong and there is a good chance their voice will be heard. At the same time, of course, if harsher laws based on "attitude" are put into place, it places too much judgment into the hands of the individual, who might just be having a bad day or really hates bikes or something, and therefore because of their "attitude", some poor bastard loses something they didn't deserve to lose. Fairness? I think not.

As I have said, I honestly think the only way that situations like this are going to change is if people stop taking the easy way out and take the necessary way, regardless of who they are or what position they are in. Before we go off judging others and ranting and raving about whoever it may be, we need to take a hard look in the mirror first. For through each individual doing that, change for the better will come.

I don't know exactly how this could happen to be honest, plus I am overtired and hungry, but those are my thoughts.

Peace and well being to you all.

[Morcs]

Promote the Gingas to no.1 and no.2 in the 'force.

Thatll sort these vermin boy racers out.

[SPman]

They don't need any more laws - proper application of the laws they already have should be more than enough, if the police are diong their jobs properly...
The original (present) boy racer laws have been so widely abused by the police that any extension of them should be viewed with the greatest concern. They certainly won't be used only against boi-racers. <!-- / message --> <!-- sig --> ___________ - increasing the size of the wedge.......scare the populace - more laws - less "freedoms" for members of the general populace!

I also can't help noticing how anyone allegedly doing anything that upsets a section of the community, police, authorities, or indeed, the news media, more and more, is being demonised......"scumbags", "vermin", "lowlifes", etc etc etc.

Just look through the above posts........

Not an indicator of a healthy society from any angle..........

[pritch]

This doesn't affect us, or concern us.

I hope you're right, but I fear you are wrong.

New legislation once passed, tends to be used in ummm creative(?) ways. Some of the people who draft our laws seem to be less than spectacularly talented and the problem is exacerbated if the legislation, as in this case, is deemed urgent.

There is considerable potential for the proposed law changes (which a Police spokesman says are not necessary) to effect us as well.

[Tony]

Great all the boy racers are gunna start driving 13b rotarys


Easy to solve this. Use the same 1.7 multiplication factor that is used for racing rotarys. Oh and add one more clause no rotarys.

[Tony]

Boy racers have been around for decades, you will never stop young males modifying cars and doing burn outs.


I belive that if the "Tony" rule says you can only have a 1350cc car and it's not allowed any engine modifications then that gives you the opportunity to seize the car and destroy it.

[twotyred]

simply a chance to grab even more power through public fear.
The po-lice have more than enough laws to use for lawbreakers,the whole idea of labelling a "group" with a gang-like name is to induce fear,it's a problem-reaction-solution situation.

welcome to the next step in the ever increasing police state

[Tony]

Also agree with the crushing of the cars.

Correct me if I am wrong, but once the cars have been impounded, are they not just sold off again? so therefore what is to stop another boy racer shelling out his student loan or whatever on another racers car that was impounded? The car is off the road for a while, sure, but then it just ends up back on it again.


Under the "Tony" rule No. 1 they won't be able to purchase it.

Under the proposed "Tony" rule No.2 it's very hard to do drive crushed cars.

[Tony]

Boy racers have been around for decades, you will never stop young males modifying cars and doing burn outs.

Guys I am dead serious about the 'Tony' rules. (see original post in this thread for "Tony" laws.)

Under rule No.1 they won't be able to own modified cars and who wants to do and isn't going to be nearly so much fun doing burnouts in unmodified cars under 1350cc!

My idea is not to try and police and then punish boy racers after the fact but to get rid of them all together.

Remove the incentive by limiting them to communter cars.

And lets not create laws that are open to abuse and individual discretion. Let's have clear cut laws.

Please people let's have no more disagreement on my proposed law changes.

[Skyryder]

Typical though, nothing is done until a poor policeman is a little bit frightened!!!
What about all of the innocent citizens of that have been terrorised over the years and everyone has sat on their hands...bloody hypocrites!!!
Cops are pricks!!!

We need a new super hero that will protect us...someone with a past full of demons and who suffers flashbacks at inconvenient moments of danger but can no longer sit idly by and watch the criminal underworld force the good citizens to live in fear in their own homes.

He must have a cool rubber suit as well.

Condom Man. Security is his password.:wari:

Skyryder

[mikeey01]

Learner drivers have a CC restriction

Tony I think u hit the nail on the head, every motorcyclist has to go through this, what and why is it so different with cars?

[The Stranger]

Please people let's have no more disagreement on my proposed law changes.

Yeah, come on guys, this is serious. We know the police monitor this site and are looking for our agreement prior to enacting the Tony laws.

[gixxer-king]

Tony I think u hit the nail on the head, every motorcyclist has to go through this, what and why is it so different with cars?

um yea, and look at how sensible that is! A 250 2 smoker can take down most 400's and some 600's and its the same with cars. sorry to smack you with this one but most of the cars i see "acting up" are glanzas (1.2 or 1.3l) charades (660cc) those poo mitsi mx's (1.3 1.5 and 1.8l) a few lancer hatches 1.25l) and the other problem with that is the smaller the engine the lighter the car (just as with bikes 250cc no longer means gutless due to having next to no mass) so i think cc is a bullshit rule. as is no turbos ( i was declined insurance many years back for a mu A FURKING MU because oh wait it had a turbo charger.
What we need is a TOTAL lock down on:
cut springs as a number 1. i personally would buy the crusher to get these shit heaps off the road.
Next is loud mufflers. There is no need to hear your accord valve bouncing at 2am!
next are stupid wheel fitments. if fitting 22's to your mini is cool then as my friend morty would say "you need a fucking slap" (said in an indian accent)
next angled number plates (this originated in the USA as a form of Gays and Lesbians to find one another as of course it is frowned upon over there) so god knows why its meant to be "cool" over in NZ (either someone got the message wrong or we have a ton of out of closet 15-21yo males here)
crack down on these and the culture will die out very fast indeed.

[JMemonic]

Whilst the idea of a law that restricts learners to harsher restrictions is one possible solution to the problem and folks are saying support this its a great idea etc I will play devils advocate for a minute.

There are already plenty of laws on the books to use against these offenders, none of which are being headed, or for that matter used to the fullest in regard to the penalty's available under these laws.

We want less restrictions on the motorcycle laws, removal of the 70kph limit, increasing the max cc rating, it a little umm hypocritical to then turn around and demand that restrictions are placed on cars.

The larger portion of the voting public will be opposed to this as currently they only have to have one car that the kids can use when needed, what about those on learners in rural areas that may drive the 4 wheel drive or farm truck.

New laws are not what is needed, any new legislation will be a knee jerk reaction designed to satisfy the public but have no real consequence.

[McDuck]

Tony I think u hit the nail on the head, every motorcyclist has to go through this, what and why is it so different with cars?

I got my licence in a 1300, got my full in it at 16 and a half.


I think the majority of boy racers are over 16 and a half.

[JMemonic]

good lord burnouts! the horrors!

As usual you display a total ignorance of the situation and take the slightest of notice of the larger issue.

Perhaps you feel it is ok to have you life ruined by lack of sleep, for both you and your family, your property trashed with people urinating on you garden, to find excrement on your lawns, and should you have the audacity to complain or attempt to suggest that perhaps consideration towards sleep and your sanity would be nice you are subjected to stand over tactics with threats of personal harm to yourself and your family including children not limited to but including fire-bombing you home, physical harm, even in one case that I know of gang rape.

I gather from you horror at Police attending burnouts on public streets you approve of the attack.

You may go ahead and red rep me again but I care not, you sir are a loser of exemplary character.

[mark247]

Police rules as they are for burnouts etc are harsh enough as it is, IF they use them. I did a 3 second hollywood in my car a while back and had it impounded for 28days and nearly lost my licence for 6 months ( lawyers are awesome ), let alone the impoundment fee etc.

If the police want to fuck someone over ( and rightly so in those chch muppets cases ) they can quite easily, there is no reason why a boyracer in chch couldnt get sustained loss of traction, speeding, dangerous driving etc etc and lose there car and licence for a good while. If you get done for 2 charges of sustained loss of traction in the same 4 years ( i think its that, might even be 7 ) the courts have the right to sell your car.

On the other hand, attacking a single cop is absolutely rediculous, when the tazers come out I'm sure that will sort them out a bit. But when it's 300 on 1, what can they do? Changing the laws is going to do nothing, what they need is more cops, and some guns.

[Molly]

Tonight's news shows some complete cock of a boy racer pouring diesel on the road. This s**t just ****s me off. I hope the police get the legislation they need.

In my experience the NZ police are pretty fair (though I appreciate your experience may differ). The cop that followed-up / liaised after my accident was bloody good and the two that chatted to me at a local cafe recently actually warned me about a nearby anti-speeding focus. If you're out there just taking the piss you deserve all you get.

[mark247]

Tonight's news shows some complete cock of a boy racer pouring diesel on the road. This s**t just ****s me off. I hope the police get the legislation they need.

In my experience the NZ police are pretty fair (though I appreciate your experience may differ). The cop that followed-up / liaised after my accident was bloody good and the two that chatted to me at a local cafe recently actually warned me about a nearby anti-speeding focus. If you're out there just taking the piss you deserve all you get.

You get what you deserve i agree. And if i remember correctly the punishment for pouring diesel on a public road can be pretty big.

[The Pastor]

As usual you display a total ignorance of the situation and take the slightest of notice of the larger issue.

Perhaps you feel it is ok to have you life ruined by lack of sleep, for both you and your family, your property trashed with people urinating on you garden, to find excrement on your lawns, and should you have the audacity to complain or attempt to suggest that perhaps consideration towards sleep and your sanity would be nice you are subjected to stand over tactics with threats of personal harm to yourself and your family including children not limited to but including fire-bombing you home, physical harm, even in one case that I know of gang rape.

I gather from you horror at Police attending burnouts on public streets you approve of the attack.

You may go ahead and red rep me again but I care not, you sir are a loser of exemplary character.
man why you always harshing on my buzz man

[Tony]

um yea, and look at how sensible that is! A 250 2 smoker can take down most 400's and some 600's and its the same with cars. sorry to smack you with this one but most of the cars i see "acting up" are glanzas (1.2 or 1.3l) charades (660cc) those poo mitsi mx's (1.3 1.5 and 1.8l) a few lancer hatches 1.25l) and the other problem with that is the smaller the engine the lighter the car (just as with bikes 250cc no longer means gutless due to having next to no mass) so i think cc is a bullshit rule. as is no turbos.

Sorry to burst your bubble but a non modified non turbo car less than 1350 cc can't take down much. But far more importantly doesn't motivate anyone to try.

We have lots of rules the cops can use after the offence.

What the intent of the 'Tony' rules is to stop the offences occuring in the first place!

If your young and want excitement behind the wheel then get a race license and race cars or karts - it's way more fun on a track.

[Pedrostt500]

Well there has always been boy racers of one sort or another down the years, nothing new here, now we have the news media stirring the pot, the old standard of if it bleeds it leads, shocking old grannies at how naughty those bad boy racers are, sells news papers and telivision advertising.
Ok so what needs to happen to those boy racer MUPPETS, who belive that they are above the law, or just dont give a fuck about the law or any one else. the police have more than enough laws that they can use, where the house of cards falls apart is in the justic system, our Judges are limp wristed, they allow tens of thousands of dollars to be racked up in fines, then wipe the fines with a short stint of community service. jail is only handed down as an extreme measure, often watered down to home detention.

Ok think a strike three first time up on a, Drink Driving, Dangerous Driving, using a Motor Vechicle for an unlawfull act, should recive a minimum of a 12 month and one day lose of licence, they have to go through the full licence resit all over again and pay any fines and full payments for damages to any victims.
strike two is the same as strike one.
strike three is lose of licence for life and a life time ban on owning any vechicles.

Am I a Bastard or what?.

[Tony]

We want less restrictions on the motorcycle laws, removal of the 70kph limit, increasing the max cc rating, it a little umm hypocritical to then turn around and demand that restrictions are placed on cars.

The reason to remove the 70km restriction is that it is dangerous. The increased CC rating rule is a power to weight rating. the bikes that are over 250cc that comply with this are slower than most of the 2-stroke 250 cc bikes that are currently legal for learners. The proposed changes to the GDLS for learners make it safer for learners.


The larger portion of the voting public will be opposed to this as currently they only have to have one car that the kids can use when needed, what about those on learners in rural areas that may drive the 4 wheel drive or farm truck.

The 'Tony laws' accomodate the 4 wheel drive or farm truck. (see original thread posting). They also accomodate junior driving dad's car with dad in the passenger seat. If dad has a GSX 750 we don't expect junior to ride it on his restricted - so what's the difference. When Dad has a Audi turbo and junior wants to drive it by himself? I would think Dads will be pleased to be able to say "Son the law doesn't allow you to drive my it".

[JMemonic]

The reason to remove the 70km restriction is that it is dangerous. The increased CC rating rule is a power to weight rating. the bikes that are over 250cc that comply with this are slower than most of the 2-stroke 250 cc bikes that are currently legal for learners. The proposed changes to the GDLS for learners make it safer for learners.

I heartily agree with the proposed changes to GLDS and I understand the reasons for them but consider for a minute the appearance of hypocrisy to the general public who have never had any experience of the GLDS that we as motorcyclists have had to go through.


The 'Tony laws' accomodate the 4 wheel drive or farm truck. (see original thread posting). They also accomodate junior driving dad's car with dad in the passenger seat. If dad has a GSX 750 we don't expect junior to ride it on his restricted - so what's the difference. When Dad has a Audi turbo and junior wants to drive it by himself? I would think Dads will be pleased to be able to say "Son the law doesn't allow you to drive my it".

lol funny you should mention turbo Audi's when I did see one with an 'L' plate over the weekend.

[Scouse]

The trouble with giving the Police more powers to deal with boy racers is the cops then migrate the new laws to deal with any other sections of the community that it suits them to use it against, take that Wanganui business man that had his Mercedes confiscated under the boy racer sustained loss of traction laws, this guy was obviously not a boy racer so these laws should not have applied. But in typical fashion give the cops more power and they will abuse it.

[Genestho]

My own gut feeling on this is that there needs to be some kind of legislation where the courts have imposed some penalty by way of loss of licence and the car impounded etc there needs to be some measures taken for the prevention of purchasing a new vehicle. Shut down the credit supply by making it an offence to give credit for the purchase of a vehicle for say five years coupled with an extended period of loss of licence for an equivalent time for weekends (when most of these problem occure) and you will solve this problem over night.
Skyryder

I would support the prevention of purchasing new and second hand vehicles in these, and some recidivist drink driving cases.

[JMemonic]

But in typical fashion give the cops more power and they will abuse it.

If I may it is important to alter your statement a little to give the cops more power and some will abuse it, unfortunately.

[quickbuck]

What he said,crush their cars.

I reckon the caption on 3 News was onto it....
"Crush Boy Racers".

That will stop repeat offending.

[Scouse]

If I may it is important to alter your statement a little to give the cops more power and some will abuse it, unfortunately.fuck off its my statement and im sticking to it

[Molly]

fuck off its my statement and im sticking to it

Calm down. Calm down...

[DEATH_INC.]

But this issue is not one of cars or boy racers but one of simple lawlessness.
Fuck yeh!
This fuckin BS comes up every time some retard in a modded car does something retarded. Boy racers are NOT ALL THE SAME!!!! Same as we are not all 'moron few'. Just because you like modding your car DOESN'T mean you are gonna attack the cops! And since when did a burnout do any harm? Why can't they just give them somewhere to go?
These stupid fuckin laws will just make more people run, and lead to more abuse by some of the asshole cops that are out there, that have no fucken accountability for there decisions!
AAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!

[Fatjim]

why the fuck do they need to make another bullshit law to deal with these fuckwits? what is wrong with using the dangerous driving, speeding, drunk driving, assualt, etc laws that already exist.




Exactly. Those 300 already broke some pretty serious laws. Whats one more.




Perhaps you feel it is ok to have you life ruined by lack of sleep, for both you and your family, your property trashed with people urinating on you garden, to find excrement on your lawns, and should you have the audacity to complain or attempt to suggest that perhaps consideration towards sleep and your sanity would be nice you are subjected to stand over tactics with threats of personal harm to yourself and your family including children not limited to but including fire-bombing you home, physical harm, even in one case that I know of gang rape.



Mate, if you need a hand, why don't you ask?





Remove the incentive by limiting them to communter cars.


Limit the guys to pink cars with love hearts , and the girls to black cars with white spots and horns that go moooo!

[Dragon]

OK what is the definiton of a boy racer?

and second the people that I consider to be them will run if they know the cops can crush cars. Also these guys can drive well and will do whatever it takes to get away including putting the public at risk. I also know a few racers which have different plates for there cars.

[Dave-]

Tony I just don't think your system would work mate, it's too relaxed and easy to work around.

the suggested legislation is worse though.

but tbh I haven't got any better ideas really...boy racers don't really bother me, infact I find their antics quite humerous...but I have a sick sense of humor.

[madbikeboy]

Okay, my $0.02.

1. Lack of self regulation from a group means government regulation.
Boy racers mobbing and shooting at cops. I think the cop showed incredible self restraint. I would have given it shit and gotten out of there.

You're worried about laws getting wide application, inappropriate application. I see bikers dying a lot over the summer, and getting news attention. As a group, community, whatever, we need to positively lobby the government, media, and bikers. We'd get momentum, do you think anything the boy racers would say would?

2. Blanket laws and the fallout.
With any legislation, there is a process to get ammendments - stop whining and start lobbying your local MP.

I actually don't give a rats ass, but if they start crushing cars, tell 'em to target repeat drunk drivers.

[Tony]

Tony I just don't think your system would work mate, it's too relaxed and easy to work around.

the suggested legislation is worse though.

Dave I think 'relaxed' needs to be the tone to solve the problem.

I am curious what might be the possible work arounds. I am keen to hear suggestions. I think one of the attractions to the "Tony' restrictions is the ease of policing them.

Here i how I think the "Tony" restrictions" could be simply policed.

1. If your caught driving a car your not licensed to drive the vehicle is confiscated on the spot and towed to a holding yard. If you can't defend your actions in court the car is crushed.

2. If someone is caught driving your car it still gets confiscated and crushed - unless it was stolen. In which case the driver is charged with theft as well as a breach of license conditions (They can be jailed for theft).

3. Insurance companies are advised not to ensure vehicles over 1350cc to drivers under 20 years of age who can't produce an exemption certificate.

4. Insurance companies are advised not to pay out for claims by owners for vehicles driven by drivers who are not licensed to drive them.

5. Obviously drivers less than 20 years old won't be able to register vehicles over 1350cc

6. Because the law is simple to understand and the costs are significant to their children some parents will police their own children.

7. If the vehicle is suspected of engine mods e.g modified exhausts and mufflers (they will be defined as part of the engine) are easy to spot and a quick look under the bonnet in some cases will reveal headers, turbos (turbos are not allowed - under the Tony restrictions), after market air filters, Nitrous kits. the car will be confiscated and impounded and crushed. If the officer suspects internal modifications but can't see any evidence then the benefit of the doubt goes to the car driver.

[JMemonic]

Mate, if you need a hand, why don't you ask?

Thankfully the members of my family who had this happen are no longer in a position to worry but that does not remove the problem for others, some in rural areas that are suffering from the actions of these idiots.

The media in this case are not making things look worse than they are, perhaps they look safer and better in some cases, and people are becoming too afraid to report the intimidation to the police.

[JMemonic]

fuck off its my statement and im sticking to it

Ok, I guess that is how you feel, life has introduced me to some asshole cops, but also some dam good genuine people doing a difficult jobs in hellish circumstances.

[rastuscat]

why the fuck do they need to make another bullshit law to deal with these fuckwits? what is wrong with using the dangerous driving, speeding, drunk driving, assualt, etc laws that already exist.

there is going to be so many variations of basically the same type of law soon, that the coppers are going to have to have fuckin lawyers degrees to work out which one to apply.

they need to simplify the existing laws and apply them properly instead of inventing new ones.



Sorry chap, the laws you quote all are dependent on identifying the individual who broke the law. 18 months ago I was in the middle of a crowd of Boy Racers in McLeans Island Road. I was dealing with one of their number who had been doing a huge burnout. I was dealing with that individual when the bottle shower started. We ducked for cover, and I can tell you there was no way we could identify who had thrown the bottles.

Trying to control a mob with the laws that exist today is impossible. I don't like having to solve problems by having new laws passed, but what we have today just doesn't even start to solve this problem.

[Robbo]

To make a law like this work they will have to crush their cars with them still inside them!

I could vote for something like that. :niceone: John.

Well done John. This has been the best suggestion so far and it will certainly stop re-offending. The Boy Racers, as they are being refered to, have had more than enough time to pull their heads in and to start acting like mature and responsible citizens but unfortunately there are still a number of them who have evolved into total arseholes with no respect for anybody or anything.
Why should you and i or anybody have to put up with the crap that they create. The answer is "We Should'nt" So Burn the bastards and crush their cars. I'm sure it won't take long for the message to get accross then.:2thumbsup

[Ixion]

Sorry chap, the laws you quote all are dependent on identifying the individual who broke the law. 18 months ago I was in the middle of a crowd of Boy Racers in McLeans Island Road. I was dealing with one of their number who had been doing a huge burnout. I was dealing with that individual when the bottle shower started. We ducked for cover, and I can tell you there was no way we could identify who had thrown the bottles.

Trying to control a mob with the laws that exist today is impossible. I don't like having to solve problems by having new laws passed, but what we have today just doesn't even start to solve this problem.

And how would hasher demerit points for speeding (one of the police proposals) have helped you there?

The problem is , that almost everyone supports giving the police whatever they need to sort out shit like what you are describing. But, once granted , those powers won't be limited to those sort of situations. The present "boy racer" laws, enacted purportedly specficially to deal with boy racers are now used , by an enormous predominance, in situations where there are no boy racers involved.

[mark247]

Sorry chap, the laws you quote all are dependent on identifying the individual who broke the law. 18 months ago I was in the middle of a crowd of Boy Racers in McLeans Island Road. I was dealing with one of their number who had been doing a huge burnout. I was dealing with that individual when the bottle shower started. We ducked for cover, and I can tell you there was no way we could identify who had thrown the bottles.

Trying to control a mob with the laws that exist today is impossible. I don't like having to solve problems by having new laws passed, but what we have today just doesn't even start to solve this problem.

The only thing that would fix that is having more police there in my opinion.

[Skyryder]

And how would hasher demerit points for speeding (one of the police proposals) have helped you there?

The problem is , that almost everyone supports giving the police whatever they need to sort out shit like what you are describing. But, once granted , those powers won't be limited to those sort of situations. The present "boy racer" laws, enacted purportedly specficially to deal with boy racers are now used , by an enormous predominance, in situations where there are no boy racers involved.


That's why there needs to be a expiray clause built in.

Skyryder

[Max Preload]

Sorry chap, the laws you quote all are dependent on identifying the individual who broke the law. 18 months ago I was in the middle of a crowd of Boy Racers in McLeans Island Road. I was dealing with one of their number who had been doing a huge burnout. I was dealing with that individual when the bottle shower started. We ducked for cover, and I can tell you there was no way we could identify who had thrown the bottles.

Trying to control a mob with the laws that exist today is impossible. I don't like having to solve problems by having new laws passed, but what we have today just doesn't even start to solve this problem.

So what you want is a law that means you don't have to identify the culprit. Sounds fair. :blink: :wacko:

[Pedrostt500]

Crushing cars isnt the answer, its a knee jerk reaction, There are currently enough laws on the books to deal with most situations, and the ones who are over 20? you make bad asumptions that it is the under 20s that are the root of the problem. what about alcohol fueled 20s 30s and 40s, you start crushing cars then finance for any vechicle for any person gets harder, who would invest in a finance company that loaned to car yards Period, if cars got crushed.
keep in mind that these laws will be applied to Motorcyclests just as fast as they would be to boy racers.
Where I see the root of the problem is in the justice system that allows people to rack up tens of thousands of dollars in fines, to be paid back at $5 per week, its a laugh to a youngster who knows he can go and trade the lot off for a few hours of comunity service. You crush his car he defaults on his loan, gets slapped with oh no yet another fine, and adds it to the rest to be paid off at $5 per week or to be traded off against comunity service.
So who realy looses out here, its those who have struggled to save a nest egg, invested it, to find that the security that was a car on a $15000 loan has been crushed and is now only worth $25, ( keep in mind the arse has fallen out of the scrap meatal markets).
Start handing out life time bans from driving and owning vechicles, impound the cars that they drive allow the courts and finance companies to reclaim their money and if there is any over donate it to charity.
Those who choose to drive with out a licence, have the car that they are caught driving , the owner of the vechicle is notified, and if the vechicle owner is unaware that the driver does not have a licence, then the driver gets charged with theft, if the driver is caught driving the same vechicle a second time then the vechicle is impounded and sold. thae only exception is ion an emergency situation where they are getting some one to immediate medical help.
a register is made of all those who are on a life time ban from owning vechicles, this is made available to car yards and finance companies so they know they cant loan these people money to buy vechicles.

[Tony]

Trying to control a mob with the laws that exist today is impossible. I don't like having to solve problems by having new laws passed, but what we have today just doesn't even start to solve this problem.

If we have police trying to police a mob - we are trying to deal with the issue at the wrong end of the problem. The solution is to ensure that we do not have mob of young kids showing off in cars.

Policing a mob with any laws is too expensive in so many ways to our police and our future.

The solution has to be to remove the motivation for them to do this. (unless we want exciting news footage and even more serious and deep rooted problems with our youth.

[Pedrostt500]

Um we have had serious deep rooted problems with some of our youth for many decades, 90% of the problem is that very few people wish to stand up and be leaders in a positive way, we as parents and adults have failed to teach our youth about leadership, and taking responsibility for our selves, and hence they do not learn to take responsibility for their actions.
What alot of the youth have twigged to is that most parents and politicians can say what they want and make all the rules and laws that they want, but at the end of the day they know that it is only breaking the rules or the law IF YOU GET CAUGHT, and the game is not to get caught.
Its easy to sit here on our fat middle aged arses and try to put the world to rights, but the hard bit is actualy getting off our arses and doing something positve about the situation, what ever that may be.
Boy racers of today remind me of the bike gangs of the 60s and 70s, gee I wonder where they learned that from.

[inlinefour]

As Judith Collins said herself on the news - cars should be crushed.

That would really start sending the message to these very immature youths.

They show no respect for the law or anyone else.

I would love for them to stream the crushing of their tin can cars on website.

Thats about the size of what needs to happen. Within this polictically correct world we live in in NZ the real joke is the NZ Justice system and its gross inability to deal with anything effectively. These kids see it also and its honestly no wonder the law is getting broken in a country that makes the criminal have all the rights! Why does anyone expect anything different in NZ? We have brutal attacks, home invasions, child abuse/brutality, murder, brutal road rage, drug & alcohol abuse out of control amongst many other issues that NZ's pathetic justice system throws bus tickets at instead of real consequences that puts people off repeating the offence. Along with many kids being brought up without responsibility and consequence as the norm and being told they have all the rights. Its societies acceptance of political correctness plus these related issues and a system that is unable or unwilling to effectively deal with problems, is it any wonder that the problems are just getting worse? :buggerd:

[Jantar]

...
"1. Learner drivers are not permitted to drive a non turbovehicle greater than 1350cc (rotarys subject to 1.7 mulitiplication factor) until they reach the age of 20. No engine modifications (including induction and exhauxst systsems) are permitted, but owners may modify the personalise the vehicle in any other way that is compliant with Warrant Of Fitness regulations.....
You suggestion would force boy racers to buy either tiny wee shopping baskets, or larger turbo charged vehicles. I know which one they would buy. So how does that help the situation.

[PirateJafa]

1. Lack of self regulation from a group means government regulation.

The boy racer problem is way out of control - most Fridays and Saturdays the boy racers use my road as a fucking race track

...


...and I totally lose it. He pulls into a bus stop, I pull alongside and drop a burnout to get everyone's attention...

I need to live in America, if I did I would have been able to pull out my handgun and shoot his tires out...!

Tui.




But on another note, as I've said many times before - all these problems can be solved by using laws already in place. Dangerous/Careless driving, noise laws - there's a plethora of legislation that could be used.

Pity though that all that doesn't give the politicians any screen time though. :rolleyes:

[nodrog]

Sorry chap, the laws you quote all are dependent on identifying the individual who broke the law. .................................

Trying to control a mob with the laws that exist today is impossible........................................ ... but what we have today just doesn't even start to solve this problem.


.... Right now there is a law pertaining to illegal gatherings and/or gathering for the purposes of committing a criminal act. Use that one.

so what is this new law you require?

[Lonebull]

Bullshit.

If 300 bikers mobbed and shot at a police officer, we'd deserve to get this legislation on us.

The boy racer problem is way out of control - most Fridays and Saturdays the boy racers use my road as a fucking race track - I've lost count of the amount of times they've crashed on my corner. Most of the time they're drunk. I've stopped bothering to go help, if they bleed to death, it's their problem.

This doesn't affect us, or concern us.



I agree, there is just no excuse for the behaviour these idiots exhibit. I've spun the odd donut in my time (long time ago) but I'm pretty sure I knew where to draw the line. These guys are now in the same league as English football hooligans. They can't handle their booze and have no respect for themselves or anyone else. I don't have any sympathy for these dickheads and I hope the car crusher arrives soon I also can't understand why horsepower limits are not imposed on learner drivers.


What seems like an eternity under the politically correct brigade has made me cynical about any New Zealand governments ability to cut through the red tape and actually do something. National may be a little different than Uncle Helens mob but I still have doubts these guys can find a crusher let alone get it on site and find the start button.

Still not convinced that the proposed legislation changes won't affect us all though. I will ponder on that a little longer.

[Scouse]

Another thing about the proposed illegal gathering law, suppose that your kids are at a party doing nothing wrong, but there are some dick heads elements there as well, all of a sudden the dick heads erupt and the cops are called. Now because it is now the easiest way to deal with a large gathering the new boy racer illegal gathering laws are enacted, which basically means that all the good innocent kids at the party cannot go to another party for 12 months for fear of dick heads making trouble, with the risk of your kids being caught up in another illegal gathering situation, and then being labled as criminals.

[Ixion]

Bullshit.

If 300 bikers mobbed and shot at a police officer, we'd deserve to get this legislation on us.

The boy racer problem is way out of control - most Fridays and Saturdays the boy racers use my road as a fucking race track - I've lost count of the amount of times they've crashed on my corner. Most of the time they're drunk. I've stopped bothering to go help, if they bleed to death, it's their problem.

This doesn't affect us, or concern us.

I beg to differ . It will concern us and affect us.

There is absolutely no difference between the abhorred boi-racers and the ATNR or a Ulysses ride. We may not deserve the 'get the legislation on us' but once passed it WILL apply to us and WILL be used against us.

There are certainly plenty of locals who would be happy to come forward and tell the cops that they have been alarmed and distressed by "Bikies using their road as a fucking race track"

Not to mention the Coro loop. Want to be that no-one along that route gets pissed off by all the bikes. And the Akaroa GP is already in the sights.

Tell me one reason why the proposed legislation would not be used to ban bikes from Coro and Akaroa?

[The Pastor]

i beg to differ . It will concern us and affect us.

There is absolutely no difference between the abhorred boi-racers and the atnr or a ulysses ride. We may deserve the 'get the legislation on us' but once passed it will apply to us and will be used against us.

There are certainly plenty of locals who would be happy to come forward and tell the cops that they have been alarmed and distressed by "bikies using their road as a fucking race track"

not to mention the coro loop. Want to be that no-one along that route gets pissed off by all the bikes. And the akaroa gp is already in the sights.

Tell me one reason why the proposed legislation would not be used to ban bikes from coro and akaroa?
not my precious coro loop! Please no!

[Max Preload]

Talk about a rigged poll! :rofl:

[rastuscat]

So what you want is a law that means you don't have to identify the culprit. Sounds fair. :blink: :wacko:

Nope. I'm keen to have a law that prevents the situation. Like a Cease and Desist Order. That's better than waiting for it to happen then trying to identify the culprits.

People bang on about being the fence at the top of the cliff rather than the ambulance at the bottom. The Cease and Desist Order is a fence at the top of the cliff.

[Scouse]

People bang on about being the fence at the top of the cliff rather than the ambulance at the bottom. The Cease and Desist Order is a fence at the top of the cliff.Nope the Cease and desist order is the thin end of the wedge that will find itself used everywere that there is a gathering of people.

[Tony]

Talk about a rigged poll! :rofl:

Is it possible to add another option now that it's started?
Max do you have a suggested option you would like me to try and add?

[Tony]

People bang on about being the fence at the top of the cliff rather than the ambulance at the bottom. The Cease and Desist Order is a fence at the top of the cliff.

Nope the Cease and Desist order is at still at the bottom of the cliff. Correct me if I am wrong you can only issue a Cease and Desist order once someone has been involved in an 'illegal' gathering.

The ultimate solution is to stop putting members of the public and police in situations where they have to try and deal with out of control mobs.

If you take the 'racers' away from the 'boy racers' all you have is 'boys'. Or better still use the 'Tony' restrictions to stop them buying and driving them in the first place.

Now that's a fence closer to the top of the cliff.

When I was 16 (soooo many years ago) I had a very highly modified Ford Escort and I also got to drive my grannys Daihatsu Charade when my Escort was off the road getting further work done on it.

In the Escort I was the terror of the neighbourhood - just lucky I didn't kill anyone. My parents would have been very happy to have crushed it themselves if they were allowed to.

In the Charade I was a lamb - It's just wasn't possible to impress anyone (incluing yourself) in a standard 900 cc shopping basket.

After a few years I matured (a little) and discovered the best place to hoon was on the track. I discovered saloon car racing and karting. I also discovered how much I didn't know and actually learnt to drive while having a ball competing against other boy and dad racers in the right environment.

The reason I am hot on the 'Tony' restrictions in the original post is I see a truly workable solution that I believe will solve the vast majority of the problem.

[nodrog]

Nope the Cease and Desist order is at still at the bottom of the cliff. Correct me if I am wrong you can only issue a Cease and Desist order once someone has been involved in an 'illegal' gathering.

The ultimate solution is to stop putting members of the public and police in situations where they have to try and deal with out of control mobs.

If you take the 'racers' away from the 'boy racers' all you have is 'boys'. Or better still use the 'Tony' restrictions to stop them buying and driving them in the first place.

Now that's a fence closer to the top of the cliff.

When I was 16 (soooo many years ago) I had a very highly modified Ford Escort and I also got to drive my grannys Daihatsu Charade when my Escort was off the road getting further work done on it.

In the escort I was the terror of the neighbourhood - just lucky I didn't kill anyone.

In the Charade I was a lamb - It's just wasn't possible to impress anyone (incluing yourself) in a standard 900 cc shopping basket.

After a few years I matured (a little) discovered the best place to hoon was on the track and I discovered saloon car racing and karting. I also discovered how much I didn't know and actually learnt to drive while having a ball competing against other boy and dad racers in the right environment.

The reason I am hot on this subject is I see a truly workable solution that I believe will solve the vast majority of the problem.

fuck that bullshit, so you want to tell people what they can and cant drive? awesome, tar everybody with the same brush! all that will do is move the trend from "boy racers" into "men racers", as they will older before the discover the power of the "donut"

edit. i had 800cc of raw power when was at school, it was more dangerous than my 351ci falcon, the dodgy manouvers i had to pull to beat the school bus, no power to pass on a straight but i would smoke it through the downhill blind corner section. the girls on the bus were well impressed.

[Max Preload]

Max do you have a suggested option you would like me to try and add?

Yep. Police should use enforce the laws that already exist.


Nope the Cease and desist order is the thin end of the wedge that will find itself used everywere that there is a gathering of people.

Indeed. It'll be used to further bully and intimidate citizens who don't conform to a particular officer's narrow definition of how people should behave.

[Swoop]

Surely after 9 years of Liarbour and all the various laws that they introduced, the problem has been solved.
:shifty:

[Marmoot]

People bang on about being the fence at the top of the cliff rather than the ambulance at the bottom. The Cease and Desist Order is a fence at the top of the cliff.

The Cease and Desist order is the ambulance across the road at the top of the cliff. Everyone will bang on to it not knowing what went wrong.

Give the police even greater power while we are bordering on a police state, and you can kiss your common sense and free choices good bye.

Now, on the boyracer issue, where are their parents and what responsibility should be assigned to them? Afterall, they're the one bringing these little rascals into this world?

[Tony]

Yep. Police should use enforce the laws that already exist.

Max do you or any of the moderators know how I can add your option to the poll?

It should be one of the options on the poll. I don't seem to have the necessary rights to modify the poll I started.

[nodrog]

.... I don't seem to have the necessary rights to modify the poll I started.

your rights have been taken off you, just like having the right to drive whatever you want.

[SPman]

Why restrict them to 1350cc non turbo cars? Better a "non high performance" vehicle, surely. And why 20? Is this to appease the "all teenagers are a threat to society" brigade, that seems prevalent in a lot of (older) people!
What about the majority of newer drivers who are responsible drivers? Or the younger enthusiasts who do have a sense of responsibility and are affected by "Boy Racers" just as much, through continual police harrassment, among other things. Throw them all into the same pot as the fuckwits and tar them with the same brush?
Some restrictions on vehicles when drivers are on L plates and under restricted licenses, yes, but once you have your full license I can see no reasonable excuse not to let them drive what they want - unless you bring in a system of "type ratings" for cars and apply it to ALL drivers.

Half of these dickheads probably haven't even got a license, anyway.......

[mark247]

All this sounds too complex. Why doesnt the government just knock down a bit of Gore, concrete in a skid pad, and let them go there. All fixed.

[DarkLord]

Then it wouldn't be as much fun for them, because it's legal.

[Tony]

just to pur some more diesel on the fire...

Here's how well the Scottish experiment is going that Judith Collins and John key is quoting as the solution model.

Scottish police gained their new powers on the 17/3/05.
ref https://www.scotland.gov.uk/News/Releases/2005/03/17101429

The rules allowed them to issue a Cease and Deisist notice (think of it as yellow card - One warning and then they get serious)

Gettting serious can mean as well as new increased fines the car is seized and if you don't pay the fines the car is scrapped.

Or the police can also issue you with a $40 infringement notice for anti social behaviour. The police don't need to prove a case before fineing you. Being able to issue an infringement notice for anti social behaviour means the onus is then on you to defend it just like a speeding ticket.


They have also removed your ability to appeal the infringement notice. All this saves on paper work.

And look what happens when you do try to appeal it
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/scotland/4916556.stm

At first glance the anti-congregating/anti-social laws appear to make sense and as long as the police just target the boy racers it won't effect me?

Of course because it's the same law for everyone there are some people suprised that they are getting caught out by the law for congregating in their cars but apparently not breaking other laws. See the end of this link where the safety campaigner Grant Butler who supported the legislation got caught by the same law and now risks loosing his car.

ref: http://www.kilmarnockstandard.co.uk/ayrshire-news/editors-pick/2008/12/05/asbo-warnings-for-kilmarnock-s-boy-racers-81430-22394355/

Will these laws affect the Jaguar owners club, the Fiat car club, the ATNR, Ulysses and other group rides?

Have the Scottish police solved their boy racer problem?

Google search "scotland scottish boy racers" at www.google.co.uk (http://www.google.co.uk)

How do you define anti-social behaviour?
When you give laws to police for arbitary and discretionary use and allow them to make summary judgement you are putting them in a very difficult judgement position. Different officers will make their best but different judgements and we may not all like all the results.

[nodrog]

i reckon everything should be made illegal, and if you want to do something without getting fined, you need to produce a note from your mum.

who pays the finance companies when their cars get crushed?

[Scouse]

i reckon everything should be made illegal, and if you want to do something without getting fined, you need to produce a note from your mum.

who pays the finance companies when their cars get crushed?your mum....

[nodrog]

your mum....

like fuck she would, and like fuck i would if i was a 16 year old fuckwit (again)

[Max Preload]

That all seems like the perfect precursor to a Police State. I'm certainly not interested in living under such a regime for the sake of a few louts.

[Wingnut]

Please people let's have no more disagreement on my proposed law changes.


Whatever - a 12 gauge is a workable solution tony.............:2guns:

[Skyryder]

I wouldn't fuck Collins even if she's the last woman on earth let alone vote for her.

Tony ya gota be better looking and more intelligent. Let's meet.:whocares::done:


Skyryder

[Pedrostt500]

i reckon everything should be made illegal, and if you want to do something without getting fined, you need to produce a note from your mum.

who pays the finance companies when their cars get crushed?

Ah so you are a beliver in that every one should have to sit at a table with hands on table not allowed to speak or move, then there is a possibility that person sat at table might not be doing any thing ileagal.

[CheeseWeeder]

This problem should have been more aggressively addressed a long time ago, now we see what happens when people sit with their heads up their asses for too long. Police didn't show a strong enough or positive presence, now they don't get any respect from the public and here is our problem.

[Howsie]

Bringing in subjective laws will not help the current situation. Lots of us have already experienced the judgements of our boys in blue and found many to be lacking common sense and its even worse if you get them on a bad day. I do believe that a complete overhaul of the justice system and traffic laws is needed to clear up grey areas and remove confusion.

Officers discretion comes in as many colours as the sky and is like playing russian roulette. I am thinking of the car enthusiast who does everything right, legal car all certified etc drives past a cop having a bad day and looses his car (potentially crushed) just because he looks like a "boy racer" or he "took off too fast" and other subjective bullshit laws they have made in the past.

All you need to do is look at Ixions post about the Buslanes. Something so simple yet has complete confusion around it because there are so many exemptions etc.

Whats with labelling "boy racers" as "young"? I see just as many old farts driving modded cars as young guys/girls and quite often they drive worse because they are trying to reclaim their youth in some fashion, or having a mid life crisis and they couldnt afford the convertible!

This country is going to the dogs :(

[CheeseWeeder]

Totally agree.

[bucket boy]

Whats with labelling "boy racers" as "young"? I see just as many old farts driving modded vans as young guys/girls and quite often they drive worse because they are trying to reclaim their youth in some fashion, or having a mid life crisis and they couldnt afford the convertible!

This country is going to the dogs :([/QUOTE]

YOU SEEN NODROG DRIVING AS WELL

[quack]

Its pretty hard to apply such legislation to motorcyclists, and so it shouldnt effect us. Boyracers deserve everything they get... cos theyr all wankers

[mark247]

Its pretty hard to apply such legislation to motorcyclists, and so it shouldnt effect us. Boyracers deserve everything they get... cos theyr all wankers

You will find motorcycles come under all the same laws as cars.. we are all on the same roads at the end of the day.

Do a burnout infront of a cop on your bike infront of a cop and see what happens :clap:

[DEATH_INC.]

You will find motorcycles come under all the same laws as cars.. we are all on the same roads at the end of the day.

Do a burnout infront of a cop on your bike infront of a cop and see what happens :clap:
Bikes make smaller cubes :eek5:

[dipshit]

Bullshit.

If 300 bikers mobbed and shot at a police officer, we'd deserve to get this legislation on us.

Perhaps that cop was the boyraces version of the Gingaa cop.

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?p=1586731#post1586731

Your scenario wouldn't be that far-fetched if some of the wankers around here had their way.

[carver]

im something of a veteran of the boy racer scene.
the boy racers will just fight back against the cops, as they are starting to do, crushing cars is giving the police too much power.
this problem has been going on for ages.
the cops drive em out of industrial area's where its more deserted and safer.

if someone crushed my vehicle, i would be angry with the officer that issued it to be crushed.

[dipshit]

See... there's not that much difference from the wankers in cars to wankers on bikes.

[carver]

See... there's not that much difference from the wankers in cars to wankers on bikes.

the wanker on bikes are older and are very righteous

[Slicksta]

im something of a veteran of the boy racer scene.
the boy racers will just fight back against the cops, as they are starting to do, crushing cars is giving the police too much power.
this problem has been going on for ages.
the cops drive em out of industrial area's where its more deserted and safer.

if someone crushed my vehicle, i would be angry with the officer that issued it to be crushed.

Could not agree more. Giving the police such power is never a good thing! Its not just the "boy racers" that are "out of control" but the way they are delt with also...
How many of you on your bikes have gone over the speed limit? How many of you will admit to running from the police? We are just as guilty as a "boy racer" doing burn outs or racing in a deserted part of town at 2am on a friday night..

[Swoop]

who pays the finance companies when their cars get crushed?
Easy. The price of scrap steel should cover that...<_<

[ducatilover]

as i always say, license restriction should be power to weight. an ep92 starlet will hold an ae111 bzr down the quarter. its not the engine size, vk/vl/vn etc commonwhores never pulled the skin off a rice pudding. power to weight is the problem. a pod filter should not be a penalty but yes a wanky exhaust over xxx decibels at xx% of the cars rev range is a penalty. laws like the 250cc are not totally dumb and may help but the power to weight idea is best.
and bring back capital punishment, i would love to beat every dumb fuck who pours diesel on the roads in palmy.:angry2::bash::bash:

[Leyton]

Crush cars involved in "Boy Racer" type acts... is quite clear when a car is doing donuts on the road Vs poor granny letting out clutch to fast in the wet
CC Rating does not mean alot, I have a small Rav4 that drives like a Slug, It is a 2.0L Camery motor. A CC limit on a "L" wont matter much anyhow as they need to be occompained anyhow.
Enforce 3rd party insurance, However is this not going to drive up our premiums so we loose anyways ? hehe, Crush the fuckers!


The boy racers make the road unsafe for all road users and pedestrians. Cost the tax payer a bucket load (You/Me). Today just on my short trip I had to putup with sticky lines in the road from burnouts messing up the tar they make it unsafe for us bikers!. I certainly am not a boy racer nor would be court in a position were my sluggy would get crushed doing boy racer acts :P

I used to be a little hoony in my Honda Accord when I was a teeny... but nothing to the scale that has been done today, at least I was considerate!, Probably not that safe and alot less careless but never in the harm of others. Well halming others is clearly a boy racer sport. CRUSH CRUSH CRUSH CRUSH CRUSH CRUSH!!!

:clap:

[Max Preload]

Crush cars involved in "Boy Racer" type acts... is quite clear when a car is doing donuts on the road Vs poor granny letting out clutch to fast in the wet
CC Rating does not mean alot, I have a small Rav4 that drives like a Slug, It is a 2.0L Camery motor. A CC limit on a "L" wont matter much anyhow as they need to be occompained anyhow.
Enforce 3rd party insurance, However is this not going to drive up our premiums so we loose anyways ? hehe, Crush the fuckers!


The boy racers make the road unsafe for all road users and pedestrians. Cost the tax payer a bucket load (You/Me). Today just on my short trip I had to putup with sticky lines in the road from burnouts messing up the tar they make it unsafe for us bikers!. I certainly am not a boy racer nor would be court in a position were my sluggy would get crushed doing boy racer acts :P

I used to be a little hoony in my Honda Accord when I was a teeny... but nothing to the scale that has been done today, at least I was considerate!, Probably not that safe and alot less careless but never in the harm of others. Well halming others is clearly a boy racer sport. CRUSH CRUSH CRUSH CRUSH CRUSH CRUSH!!!

:clap:

You sound just like one of those grannys. Perhaps that's your angle - "Let me off! I'm an old woman!"

[Leyton]

You sound just like one of those grannys. Perhaps that's your angle - "Let me off! I'm an old woman!"

Exaclty :P You are not going to get a boy racer saying "Please officer, let me off, I am just an old Granny"

[reofix]

i live on a busy road in hamiltron (sh1) and yes the boy racers are a damn nuisance distant noise in the industrial areas at 3 am but the worst racket is the mild hog brigade on a sunday ...Is american steel worth the same as japanese steel at the scrappie?

[kevie]

why the fuck do they need to make another bullshit law to deal with these fuckwits? what is wrong with using the dangerous driving, speeding, drunk driving, assualt, etc laws that already exist.

there is going to be so many variations of basically the same type of law soon, that the coppers are going to have to have fuckin lawyers degrees to work out which one to apply.

they need to simplify the existing laws and apply them properly instead of inventing new ones.

I agree .... a prime example is the dumbass remaking of the laws on lighting that effected all the innocent people including the trucking industry as well as the ones they were targeting, what was wrong with the law that had always said "white and amber to the front, red and amber to the rear... alll other colours are illegal".

When they tack on all these complicated law amendments all it achieves is the venue for more and more lawbreakers to get off on a technicality and the good ones (like all the members on here of course) being targeted with rediculous regulations.

I say let the police do the policing and get rid of the 'political correctness crap' that hinders this country.

I spent 10 days in Tasmania last year and there was NONE of the road crap you see here, the motorists dont dare cos the cops have a "first time youre done" policy, not like NZ police that pussyfoot around with the offenders.

[N1CK]

Think about it.

Do you think a boy racer is going to pull over for a cop, who is going to crush his car???

Or do you think the boy racer will try run and get away?? :weird:



300 boi racers congregated at 100kph+ would be quite a sight.


Yea it is. :yes:

[scumdog]

Think about it.

Do you think a boy racer is going to pull over for a cop, who is going to crush his car???

Or do you think the boy racer will try run and get away?? :weird:




Yea it is. :yes:

They do runners for a lot less than that too...

[N1CK]

They do runners for a lot less than that too...

Yip, and so this would just make it worse.

[scumdog]

Whats with labelling "boy racers" as "young"? I see just as many old farts driving modded cars as young guys/girls and quite often they drive worse because they are trying to reclaim their youth in some fashion, or having a mid life crisis and they couldnt afford the convertible!

This country is going to the dogs :(


They don't tend to congregate in brainless masses outside motels on inner city streets and conduct non-stop burn-outs late at night.

Of course the old farts actually have something to lose too....

[Grahameeboy]

Why the Law...all it has done is give the Boy Racers the attention they crave...all this effort when we have Laws in place...too much moral ground.

If you are going to scap these cars then it should be done for drunk drivers...sadly these Country seems to accept drinking and driving...imagine the outcry if they scrapped cars of drink drivers...

These guys are just car enthusiasts....like us...yes there are idiots but again there are the same in all groups...they just want to have a place to meet...surely we can do this...

NZ forgets that they have signed World agreements and this proposed Law is in breach of these rights...

This Country is too PC with too many do gooders who don't want youngsters to have fun...

I guess the alternative is to do drugs instead..the Govt offers Rehab..whbat do the Govt offer 'Boy Racers'....nothing

[Leyton]

CRUSH CRUSH CRUSH CRUSH CRUSH! :blank:

[Leyton]

who pays the finance companies when their cars get crushed?

The garentour, And pass something that makes buying a off the shelf fast car a right prick under 25's unless they have a garentour (over 25 with proof that they can cover the cost). Fuk em.

They are righting there cars off without insurance anyways... and others.

[FROSTY]

WOA THERE GUYS-- think about this a mo.
Replace the word car with bike and replace night drags with midarvo/late arvo stunt session.
The PUBLIC perception of the two events is gonna be the same innit??
Think about it
from aunty joan in her 1984 toyota corolla.
1) a group of Yoofs are gathered round doing burnouts and yahooing at night in their cars --reasonable sized crowd of em
2) A group of "yoofs" are on their motorbikes doing loud wheelies and burnouts n stuff. a crowd of em gather to watch the stunter

[hayd3n]

WOA THERE GUYS-- think about this a mo.
Replace the word car with bike and replace night drags with midarvo/late arvo stunt session.
The PUBLIC perception of the two events is gonna be the same innit??
Think about it
from aunty joan in her 1984 toyota corolla.
1) a group of Yoofs are gathered round doing burnouts and yahooing at night in their cars --reasonable sized crowd of em
2) A group of "yoofs" are on their motorbikes doing loud wheelies and burnouts n stuff. a crowd of em gather to watch the stunter

yes but what can be done??
save it for the track!!

[Slyer]

The law is fine how it is.
Just do them for speeding/noise.

[Howsie]

yes but what can be done??
save it for the track!!

they can save it for the track also! There are track days round the country for cars and bikes. Sadly as we all know this isnt the case as it is more to do with doing something illegal and not getting caught, thats what these youth of today thrive on.

We have enough laws for the police to easily deal with the "boy racers" as it is.

Sustained loss of traction
Excessive noise
Dangerous driving

......just to name a few and that would be more than sufficient to deal a substanstial financial/demerit/loss of licence blow to any individual caught doing this.

Clarification is needed on the exisiting laws to help the police. Just look at the bus lane debocle in Auckland!!

Careful KBers, it wont be long before the first bike gets crushed if this legislation comes in and then who will be whining? Perhaps it wasnt such a good idea after all........?

[Leyton]

Crush the bikes too... don't need crap on our streets. If you are loosing traction on a bike on the streets or road then you should really be on a track..

(Or do it when no one is around at your own Risk of Crushing) :)

[scracha]

Why crush the boy racers cars though? Seems like such a waste. Flog em on trademe and use the money to partially pay off their fines.

[Leyton]

Why crush the boy racers cars though? Seems like such a waste. Flog em on trademe and use the money to partially pay off their fines.

+1

Pay off the finance on the car first.

[ducatilover]

why pay their fines off?
include court costs, reposestion costs, selling fees etc just to fuck them over. they want to be wankers they have to take the consequences

[Leyton]

why pay their fines off?
include court costs, reposestion costs, selling fees etc just to fuck them over. they want to be wankers they have to take the consequences

I am of the mind set, if there car sells and helps pay off the finance co they are in the clear, Surely there will not be enough to cover any legal fee's so the offender will have a debt still, and more then likely still fines to pay.

Best case scenaro for offender is that they walk out with $20 in there pocket, No car. And unable to finance one as they have been marked a bad payer.

They still get the chance for a clean slate, and shame on them to there pairs as they now have no car and they are starting from scratch.

[ducatilover]

I am of the mind set, if there car sells and helps pay off the finance co they are in the clear, Surely there will not be enough to cover any legal fee's so the offender will have a debt still, and more then likely still fines to pay.

Best case scenaro for offender is that they walk out with $20 in there pocket, No car. And unable to finance one as they have been marked a bad payer.

They still get the chance for a clean slate, and shame on them to there pairs as they now have no car and they are starting from scratch.

i see, thats a good idea. i just wouldnt wnat them to walk away with no debt. your idea seems bloody good though ;)

[Leyton]

Cheers :) Leyton for Prime Minister ?

[peasea]

I am of the mind set, if there car sells and helps pay off the finance co they are in the clear, Surely there will not be enough to cover any legal fee's so the offender will have a debt still, and more then likely still fines to pay.

Best case scenaro for offender is that they walk out with $20 in there pocket, No car. And unable to finance one as they have been marked a bad payer.

They still get the chance for a clean slate, and shame on them to there pairs as they now have no car and they are starting from scratch.

I read today (in The Press) that some boy racers who have huge fines are often being able to work them off doing community work. In some cases it amounted to paying their fines off at 100 bucks per hour! WTF? That means if they have a 1,000 buck fine they only have to do ten hours to pay it off? that sucks big time, it should be ten bucks an hour tops! They won't learn any lessons with this soft-cock approach. Who the fuck set that system up? These judges need rooting.

[ducatilover]

Cheers :) Leyton for Prime Minister ?

ill vote for you:Police:
for a small fee

[Leyton]

ill vote for you:Police:
for a small fee

Hahah I will let you know when I run for palament :)

Eeek 100/hr. Yeah make the buggers suffer... Infact.. put them to work, Road maintenance.

The can be supervised doing the poo jobs like sweeping off gravel at intersections :P. That unsettled chip from their fellow boy racers mis adventures with the diesal drops.

Perhaps they could work car salvage aswell to see what modern cars look like folded into nothing.

[ducatilover]

Hahah I will let you know when I run for palament :)

Eeek 100/hr. Yeah make the buggers suffer... Infact.. put them to work, Road maintenance.

The can be supervised doing the poo jobs like sweeping off gravel at intersections :P. That unsettled chip from their fellow boy racers mis adventures with the diesal drops.

Perhaps they could work car salvage aswell to see what modern cars look like folded into nothing.

they can lick up the diesel they put down. im fuckin sick of sliding on that shit:spanking:

[Leyton]

they can lick up the diesel they put down. im fuckin sick of sliding on that shit:spanking:


You can be my next cheif of police.

[ducatilover]

You can be my next cheif of police.

but i want to be in the air force as well! ah what the hell ill sort those cunts out :wari::2guns::Punk::done:

[DEATH_INC.]

Best case scenaro for offender is that they walk out with $20 in there pocket, No car. And unable to finance one as they have been marked a bad payer.
This is a great f****n idea, lets take their cars and stop 'em getting another, then they can get to work via the great public transport system we have......na, may as well stay home and make some P to flog off....

[ducatilover]

dont get me started on p............:no:

[Leyton]

This is a great f****n idea, lets take their cars and stop 'em getting another, then they can get to work via the great public transport system we have......na, may as well stay home and make some P to flog off....

Yeah I thought about that too, but lets face it. Even druggys need a ride down to the local dodgy pharmacy, a Scooter is not going to cut it.

If all they can offord is a Bongo van, then double LOL

Did not know boy racers were smart enough to make P ?

[Tony]

Please note that I have amended the original proposed "Tony Restrctions".

Rule No. 2 has been changed due to emerging popular consensus (From Leyton and fellow T.O.A.S.T. party members) and because my self esteem can't withstand losing votes to Judith Collins!

2.Vehicles of drivers caught breaking this rule will be sold to defray fines, court costs, victim compensation and any damages to third party property.

To see full list of proposed "Tony Restrictions" please see the first post in this thread.

I also just learnt that in Victoria, Australia Sixteen-year-olds can get learner's permits but are ineligible for unrestricted licenses until they're 18. During the probationary period before teens are fully licensed, their vehicles cannot surpass a certain ratio of horsepower to vehicle weight. (similar to suggested "Tony Restriction" rule No. 1)

[Renegade]

I read today (in The Press) that some boy racers who have huge fines are often being able to work them off doing community work. In some cases it amounted to paying their fines off at 100 bucks per hour! WTF? That means if they have a 1,000 buck fine they only have to do ten hours to pay it off? that sucks big time, it should be ten bucks an hour tops! They won't learn any lessons with this soft-cock approach. Who the fuck set that system up? These judges need rooting.

its true, had a mate who did that, worked out at like $150 an hour but ya know he actually paid the fine by doin the work.

As for the new laws they are designed to target those boy racers that just ignore the rules and do as they please clocking up big fines, so pass a law that crushes the car when they wont pay the fines, and thats the point they WONT pay, the only people it affects are those that flaut the law.

Cars loans wont be paid if the cars crushed, screwing up thier credit.

The court should stop issuing fines warrants and just send in baycorp, thatll sort em out, no finance = no alloys,springs or sound systems or jap imports.

The only down side i see to the crusher is classic cars being crushed such as rotaries but they can crush all the hondas, corrollas and evo's they like.

[Skyryder]

Crusing cars today....crushing bikes tomorrow.


Skyryder

[Tony]

Using the existing laws...

21/02/09 http://nz.news.yahoo.com/a/-/top-stories/5335296

Fifteen boy racers are without their cars this morning after a police operation in Christchurch overnight.

Acting Senior Sergeant Greg Murton said 70 police were involved and targeted illegally modified vehicles and driver behaviour.

Fifteen vehicles were impounded for unpaid fines, and/or being illegally modified. As well, a large number of infringement notices were issued for driving offences.

The operation would continue tonight.

It is part of a clampdown on boy racers in the city following an attack on a police officer on January 31.

Sergeant Nigel Armstrong was ambushed by up to 300 boy racers when he responded to a complaint in Wigram. They threw bottles at him and fired at his patrol car with an air or slug rifle, forcing him to flee.

Lewis John Garton, 17, has been charged with assaulting a police officer with a weapon, and unlawful assembly. He will reappear in Christchurch District Court on Wednesday.

[old git]

COMPULSORY INSURANCE (fully comprehensive preferably)..............it would cost the kiddies so many zillions of $$$$$$$$$$'s that they would all be driving a 1300cc nanny car......and if caught without then crush it ..........Simple.

[Marmoot]

Crusing cars today....crushing bikes tomorrow.


Skyryder

I reckon too.

To unite, a democratic society always need a common enemy. In the absence, one needs to be created.

Sad but true...

[Max Preload]

COMPULSORY INSURANCE (fully comprehensive preferably)..............it would cost the kiddies so many zillions of $$$$$$$$$$'s that they would all be driving a 1300cc nanny car......and if caught without then crush it ..........Simple.

Complete bullshit. Most of their cars are security to loans used to purchase them and a requirement of those loans is the security must be insured.

[kiwi cowboy]

Tony I just don't think your system would work mate, it's too relaxed and easy to work around.

the suggested legislation is worse though.

but tbh I haven't got any better ideas really...boy racers don't really bother me,infact I find their antics quite humerous...but I have a sick sense of humor.

Tell that to my disabled brother that turned onto a road and ended up in the middle of the little fuckers and they were climbing all over the race cars on the trailer and all and he had a doughter and two young sons with him.
YER FUCKIN HUMEROUS A !!!!!!:no::no:

[3umph]

Using the existing laws...

21/02/09 http://nz.news.yahoo.com/a/-/top-stories/5335296

Fifteen boy racers are without their cars this morning after a police operation in Christchurch overnight.

Acting Senior Sergeant Greg Murton said 70 police were involved and targeted illegally modified vehicles and driver behaviour.

Fifteen vehicles were impounded for unpaid fines, and/or being illegally modified. As well, a large number of infringement notices were issued for driving offences.

The operation would continue tonight.

It is part of a clampdown on boy racers in the city following an attack on a police officer on January 31.

Sergeant Nigel Armstrong was ambushed by up to 300 boy racers when he responded to a complaint in Wigram. They threw bottles at him and fired at his patrol car with an air or slug rifle, forcing him to flee.

Lewis John Garton, 17, has been charged with assaulting a police officer with a weapon, and unlawful assembly. He will reappear in Christchurch District Court on Wednesday.
Fast 4's and rotary show here at the moment... that's less confiscations then last year I think

[cold comfort]

Any thoughts on yet another largely unnecessary law. Recently a group of "boy racers" in Christchurch were apprehended parked on a the side of a motorway off ramp. They were all rounded up,handcuffed with the plastic shit they use and "processed" . As i understand it their transgression was to congregate rather than causing a public nuisance (correct me if i am wrong).
What really gets up my nose is my son (who has a good job, wears a suit, and is not a "boy racer") unwisely stopped his Mitsi Evo whilst passing to chat with one of the other "car enthusiasts" He was unceremoniously bundled up with the rest and charged. A conviction for this stupid and rather arbitrary law could affect his traveling future.
My stepson wasn't too bothered until i pointed out it could equally be applied to him and his surfing mates camped on a beach drinking around a fire.
Any comments?

[miloking]

Sorry to burst your bubble but a non modified non turbo car less than 1350 cc can't take down much. But far more importantly doesn't motivate anyone to try.

We have lots of rules the cops can use after the offence.

What the intent of the 'Tony' rules is to stop the offences occuring in the first place!

If your young and want excitement behind the wheel then get a race license and race cars or karts - it's way more fun on a track.

Bullshit, me and my mates used to thrash my mates rolla (and mazda familia) to 8,000 rpm(suprisingly sounds like f1 car :D) ... trying to see how fast we can get it around corners, longest burn outs in 1st and 2nd off the lights (yep even corolla can do burnout in 2nd if you try), how high we can jump it on speed bumps etc ...so dont tell me that 1300cc will stop young males from doing stupid shit with them.
If you actualy believe that you are more naive than i thought!

[Indoo]

As i understand it their transgression was to congregate rather than causing a public nuisance (correct me if i am wrong).

Yep I'm sure they chose such a likely location as a great place to meet up for a cup of tea and to have a chat. Nothing of course to do with them blocking off an entire onramp and using it for racing. The arrogance and utter disregard for the general publics rights and safety these boyracers have finally caught up wtih them. Law working exactly as intended and now the muppets will have criminal convictions they will have to explain to future employers.

[cold comfort]

you were there then?

[SMOKEU]

You would have to be an ignorant fool to believe everything you read in the media.

[Indoo]

you were there then?

No were you?

Lemme guess this is just another vast conspiracy engineered by a group of corrupt cops who colluded together to lie about the behaviour of this completely innocent group of law abiding car enthusiasts who were merely parked on a motorway onramp because its such a nice quiet and completely logical place for a few friends to stop and have a chat.

Looks like they are going to have a very sympathetic Judge as well...

"Lawyer Jared Bell told the judge his client hoped for a discharge without conviction.

The judge's response was: "Oh, ho, ho, ho. No." " :yes:

[jahrasti]

Any thoughts on yet another largely unnecessary law. Recently a group of "boy racers" in Christchurch were apprehended parked on a the side of a motorway off ramp. They were all rounded up,handcuffed with the plastic shit they use and "processed" . As i understand it their transgression was to congregate rather than causing a public nuisance (correct me if i am wrong).
What really gets up my nose is my son (who has a good job, wears a suit, and is not a "boy racer") unwisely stopped his Mitsi Evo whilst passing to chat with one of the other "car enthusiasts" He was unceremoniously bundled up with the rest and charged. A conviction for this stupid and rather arbitrary law could affect his traveling future.
My stepson wasn't too bothered until i pointed out it could equally be applied to him and his surfing mates camped on a beach drinking around a fire.
Any comments?

Its the typical my son is not a criminal/boiracer/whatever. Are you that naive to think that your precious son did not know what was going on?

[SMOKEU]

Do a skid.

[cold comfort]

Its the typical my son is not a criminal/boiracer/whatever. Are you that naive to think that your precious son did not know what was going on?

No, agreed it was a really stupid move, i'm really pissed off and disappointed that he should associate with these losers,and i told him so, however its rather like stopping to chat with a bike gang member you once knew. Guilt by association. Regardless of whether you had contributed to any disturbance. I had hoped for some sensible comments about freedom of association but should not surprised at the uninformed self righteous pontification instead.

[Jantar]

No, agreed it was a really stupid move, i'm really pissed off and disappointed that he should associate with these losers,and i told him so, however its rather like stopping to chat with a bike gang member you once knew. Guilt by association. Regardless of whether you had contributed to any disturbance. I had hoped for some sensible comments about freedom of association but should not surprised at the uninformed self righteous pontification instead.
If what your son tells you is true, then he has a good defence. He stopped to talk to a mate, and as the boy racers had entirely blocked the onramp he would have been right at the back when the police arrived. In this type of circumstance the police are required to ask the assembly to disperse, and those that don't (or can't) may then be arrested. Obviously he didn't disperse when requested, in which case he will be found guilty. However if the police didn't request the assembly to disperse, then he has a valid defence.

Maybe he had his car in the middle of the gathering and couldn't dispers, or didn't hear the call to disperse. But then he was part of the gathering, and not just someone who stopped at the back for a chat. Tell him to get a lawyer and fight it,or advise him to plead guilty. Your call.

[SMOKEU]

No, agreed it was a really stupid move, i'm really pissed off and disappointed that he should associate with these losers,and i told him so, however its rather like stopping to chat with a bike gang member you once knew. Guilt by association. Regardless of whether you had contributed to any disturbance. I had hoped for some sensible comments about freedom of association but should not surprised at the uninformed self righteous pontification instead.

Tell him to keep pleading not guilty.

[Flip]

Poor little Johnnie.

Got busted hanging out with the boy racers.

Ummmm wrx, middle of the night, motorway on ramp. Wrong car, wrong time, wrong place.

Sorry no sympathy from anybody here in Christchurch.

[imdying]

I love how parents are always like, "Not my child, he's an angel". :rofl:

[dipshit]

I love how parents are always like, "Not my child, he's an angel".

Yeah, like the mother of those boys on Underbelly on TV last night. :shifty:

[jahrasti]

No, agreed it was a really stupid move, i'm really pissed off and disappointed that he should associate with these losers,and i told him so, however its rather like stopping to chat with a bike gang member you once knew. Guilt by association. Regardless of whether you had contributed to any disturbance. I had hoped for some sensible comments about freedom of association but should not surprised at the uninformed self righteous pontification instead.

I think by some of the posts below, its not self righeousness but dondemnation of a stupid action.

What those shit heads did was wrong plain and simple.

If you and your son feel that strongly then defend it. It is your right.

[cold comfort]

I love how parents are always like, "Not my child, he's an angel". :rofl:

Again there seems to be the conclusion that that I'm defending his actions, I'm not. If you do dumb shit as an adult you get to reap the consequences. His problem entirely. However as the police summary of facts said, each driver had gathered with ``the intention of participating in burnouts and high-speed racing''. Did EACH driver admit this? I doubt it. (I know one who didn't) Therefore it is an assumption.
My only concern here, knowing one person involved, is there is a fine line between "unlawful assembly" and "freedom of association" . I am always concerned when the police can tailor the facts to suit the situation. In attempting to rid ourselves of nuisance elements we allow legislation that can potentially infringe all our civil liberties. Thin end of the wedge stuff. That's all

[Indoo]

Not really. It's more like seeing a group of gang members patched up harrassing and threatening to bash people walking by, if you chose to go and join them even if just to talk to a mate you are deemed to be part of that assembly. Even if you don't threaten anyone your still part of and adding to threat, which is the very reason this law was implemented.

[imdying]

Just an observation in general.

An acuter understanding of the adage, "sleep with dogs and you end up with fleas", might be his now though.