View Full Version : Maybe time for a new bike
Blair.DRZ
18th February 2009, 08:55
Ok, thinking about upgrading the DRZ ( something with electric start ). Have been looking at the KTM 400 exec ( which i think are trail bikes ) as I only do trail riding so don't really need a motorcross bike. Was even looking at the KTM 250 exec but as I'm a 6 foot 3 and a tad under 90kg, was worried about size and power. I love the grunt of the DRZ 400, how much different would the KTM 400 power be ? Anyone had any experience with these bike, whats maintenance like etc etc
Any help/advice is hugely appreciated
Cheers !!
DELLORTO
18th February 2009, 15:47
a ktm 400 is pretty bloody fast.......drz400's are realy gutless for their cc rating because their stock exhaust pipe limits them........:shifty:
but drz400's are still fast even though heavy and resricted
if i was you id go for a rmz250.... those ktm 250's are good though.....also electric start is useless......if your legs work perfectly why have electric start??
kezzafish
18th February 2009, 17:36
I used to have a DRZ and have a mate who has an '04 400EXC which i've ridden a wee bit. Are you looking at the brand new 400EXC? cos that may be different. They stopped making them for a few years so they're not as easy to find as many bikes. The exc is in no way crazy power and i'd say that my DR had more whollop down low (although i had a big bad home made header pipe on mine cos as dellorto said the standard one is just cruel). The question is why do you need to change bikes?
The EXC is a better bike than the drz. They are better built but parts are generally more expensive. They're not much lighter (look up on the net for weight) and don't have noticeably more power (it's easy to get power out of your dr if power is what you're after) the big advantage over your dr is suspension, handling and brakes which are all heaps better on the EXC, the conventional forks on the dr are super gay. The EXC also has 6 gears which is cool.
I sold my DR cos of the weight, the gay suspension and cos it was past it's use by date. I bought a 450 MXer which is good but i regretted not riding a few more bikes before i bought it. My 450 has a huge amount more grunt than my DR did but i didn't need the grunt to go faster i needed the suspension. Therefore i have often thought that a 250 4stroke may have been a better choice and i could probably go harder for longer on one. I'm no midget either (6"5 and 95kg).
The best advice i ever got about buying a bike (although i didn't listen to it 'cos i'm a know it all fuckwit) is ride heaps of different bikes before you decide. Ride a 450 mxer and ride a 2stroke enduro bike (KTM, GASGAS or similar) i'm pretty sure you'll hate a 2stroke mxer as your used to the low down tow of your dr but still worth a hoon. A 250 4stroke is DEFINATELY something you should ride, for peace of mind if nothing else.
I've ranted off on some random tangent here so if you have any Q's abou the 400EXC i'll do my best to answer em (and i'll keep it short! ha haa)
noobi
18th February 2009, 17:38
if i was you id go for a rmz250.... those ktm 250's are good though.....also electric start is useless......if your legs work perfectly why have electric start??
Ah someone who has never had the bike stuck in a rut up to the pegs and cant kick start because the kick start hits the ground, you learn quickly that electric start is awesome for a trail bike because we get in muck that motocrossers dont :eek:
Two strokes not so much but a big bore four stroke, electric start is magic :niceone:
gasgas or similar
no dont get one, everyone tells me there gay <_<
flyingcr250
18th February 2009, 17:44
Ah someone who has never had the bike stuck in a rut up to the pegs and cant kick start because the kick start hits the ground, you learn quickly that electric start is awesome for a trail bike because we get in muck that motocrossers dont :eek:
Two strokes not so much but a big bore four stroke, electric start is magic :niceone:
i agree, or if your stuck on the side of a hill (which sorta resembles everest) and your too f****d to get your leg over electric start is the best, wish my bike had it
Oper8r
18th February 2009, 17:56
I've got a 250 SXF. I am 5ft10, 80kg's and the bike is awesome BUT, i would really love an electric start, as the bike stalls easily and when you are buggered, stuck in mud with a slippery boot, in a deep rut, on the side of a hill, it is just way up there on my list of things that would have been handy right then. I have ridden a mates DRZ400, nice, but after a KTM i would find it less of a fun ride. Cheers
DELLORTO
18th February 2009, 19:02
Ah someone who has never had the bike stuck in a rut up to the pegs and cant kick start because the kick start hits the ground, you learn quickly that electric start is awesome for a trail bike because we get in muck that motocrossers dont :eek:
Two strokes not so much but a big bore four stroke, electric start is magic :niceone:
no dont get one, everyone tells me there gay <_<
actauly that did happen to me..........at river-head the first and last time ill go there........:mad:
KTMDad
18th February 2009, 20:12
I just (december) got an 07 ktm250exc-f, I reckon its one of the best bikes I've ever had. I rode a heap of 450's(helps to have a mate who works at a bike shop) and finally jumped on the ktm250 and within 20mins was sold.
Enough power for me without gettting tired from "hanging" onto a wild thing!
Mostly I follow my 8yr old around trails but when I get out with mates I have all the power I could need.
I'm 6'1 and up round the 100kg mark and thought I would never own anything but 450's.
As said before get on as many bikes as you can before you comit, Whats good for me might be short of your goals.
If you see a ktm250 following a kx65 with full monster engery kit around the trails come say hi, I'll give you a ride so you know what your in for.
Cheers:beer:
flyingcr250
18th February 2009, 20:18
I just (december) got an 07 ktm250exc-f, I reckon its one of the best bikes I've ever had. I rode a heap of 450's(helps to have a mate who works at a bike shop) and finally jumped on the ktm250 and within 20mins was sold.
Enough power for me without gettting tired from "hanging" onto a wild thing!
Mostly I follow my 8yr old around trails but when I get out with mates I have all the power I could need.
I'm 6'1 and up round the 100kg mark and thought I would never own anything but 450's.
As said before get on as many bikes as you can before you comit, Whats good for me might be short of your goals.
If you see a ktm250 following a kx65 with full monster engery kit around the trails come say hi, I'll give you a ride so you know what your in for.
Cheers:beer:
i felt exactly the same way when i jumped on my 300 exc for the first time. great bikes :banana:
DELLORTO
18th February 2009, 20:20
nothing can be compared to the "bummer hummer' though.......:drool:
hospitalfood
18th February 2009, 20:24
it is always time for a new bike. the trick is not to sell the one you already have. its like houses and the property market.
Paulus
18th February 2009, 20:25
Was even looking at the KTM 250 exec
Cheers !!
KTM 250EXC is a 2 stroke. 250EXC-F is a 4 stroke. The 2 stroke 250 will have about the same power as the 4 stroke 400 so I wouldn't worry about the power (unless you meant the 250EXC-F). 2 strokes require a lot less maintenance than 4 strokes these days for the slight hassle of having to mix your gas.
Blair.DRZ
19th February 2009, 07:08
Yeah I had my eye on the 250 Exec-F, not really after a 2 stroke, four stroke are probably better for my riding.
The DRZ is great but I'm looking for something that could be a bit more fun to ride, its like when you've been with your missus for a while and you want something a bit newer and perkier.
But sounds like I need to take several for a test ride first and I'll find what I'm looking for.
Dent
19th February 2009, 09:11
I had a DR-Z400e for a while, before changing to a Gasgas EC300. I didnt expect that I would ever like a 2 stroke (based on bikes from 20 years ago), but the modern 300 enduros are quite different to the older 125/200 cc bikes.
Big step up in suspension quality, which gives you more confidence. Huge difference in center-of-gravity (lower) and overall a lighter bike. Hydro clutch, 6 speed close ratio g/box.
Kickstart only is not that big a deal, unless you have some medical issues with your leg etc.
I would try a 300 ktm or gasgas if you can, before you decide. Preferably one thats been jetted for smooth/progressive throttle response.
B0000M
19th February 2009, 10:31
not really after a 2 stroke, four stroke are probably better for my riding.
sorry to tear your post to shreads....
have you ridden an one of those ktm exec 2 strokes?
a lot of people rode a 2 stroke once apon a time and it had light switch power (all on or all off) or have a friend who had one once and has told them that
i personally have not ridden an exec (though next time im near any of u guys id like a go for my own judgement) but i ride a honda CR250, and this thing has plenty of low down power - more than 250 4 strokes, with even more if you're prepared to open it up up high. from what im told by all the guys on here that have gone from mx 250 2 strokes - the CR's, KX's, RM's, YZ's, SX's etc to the ktm EXEC's is that the ktm makes so much power down low and they are very easy to ride.
if you are looking for something a bit more perkier and fun to ride, then a 2 stroke would definately be worth looking at! 2 strokes = fun
B0000M
19th February 2009, 10:32
nothing can be compared to the "bummer hummer' though.......:drool:
hummers make you an expert at attaching parts- all the ones that fall off
Blair.DRZ
19th February 2009, 11:28
I guess I was under the impression that with a 2 stroke you had to be revving the snot out of it and were pretty gnarly to ride.
For me smoother, easily controlled power is what i'm after, something that you can get through the tighter/harder stuff in low revs with, so if the 2 stroke exec's are more like that to ride then I'm more than open to trying them.
Dent
19th February 2009, 11:51
Jetting and PV tuning/pipe can make a huge difference to how a 2 stroke performs. The "enduro" tuned 300's are the sort of bike you should try.
In the really slow twisty stuff they're probably easier to ride than a 4 stroke, as you dont have the rapid decel (engine braking) when you close the throttle.
camchain
19th February 2009, 12:27
Feel the power of the dark side. You should definitely try a 2 stroke at some point, although a short ride probably not enough to get used to the differences. Took me a few rides to get back into it (but mine is pretty short tempered due to it's current power valve issue).
Two things I really like about them in the tighter stuff:
1. Light and flickable. less engine rotating mass an important factor, not just lighter overall weight. Think of what happens when trying to twist a spinning bicycle wheel by holding its axle.
2. (You beat me to the punch dent) My personal favourite 2 stroke trait - No engine braking. Makes it much easier and smoother through the trees when dialling gas on and off in small doses. I used to turn the idle up a fair bit on my 4 stroke to try and soften the engine braking effect. Engine braking is great on long steep downhills but overall I'm much happier without it.
fergie
19th February 2009, 12:51
It's a pleasure to read a thread that has usefull information and clear reasoning instead of off the cuff,brash statements with no substance or examples to back it up,well done guys.:first:
B0000M
19th February 2009, 12:58
something i find with the 2 stroke vs 4 stroke thing, is i find the 2 stroke a lot harder to stall than the 4 stroke, and as an added bonus a lot easier to start again if you do.
+1 for the rotating mass comment, riding a 450 4t vs a 250 2t (comparable power amount), the 4t feels like you're trying to manouvre a truck through a trail compared to a 2t. the bike's weight on the scales is not too much different, but you feel it with the rotating mass
B0000M
19th February 2009, 13:00
It's a pleasure to read a thread that has usefull information and clear reasoning instead of off the cuff,brash statements with no substance or examples to back it up,well done guys.:first:
here in the off road section our debates usually have substance, which is why some in here tend to get annoyed when some road bikers jump in and say irrelvant things with no basis :wari:
thanks for not being one of them.
Dent
19th February 2009, 13:32
The old drz400 has so much crank/flywheel weight that its pretty hard to stall, compared to the newer 450's.
The gasgas feels like a nimble mountain bike compared to the drz, in a good way :) Mind you, so did a ktm 525 4 stroke :)
A link to some gasgas reviews. Worth a look, not that im trying to sell you a gasgas or anything - and its more likely that you will find a ktm 300exc to try, as there are more around. The 250's are also worth a try if a ride is offered.
http://www.gasgasrider.org/forum/showthread.php?t=1959
secondfield
19th February 2009, 15:27
Hmmm, The modern 450 is an entirely different beast to the DRZ 400. As you all know the flywheel is almost non existant, which makes a huge difference in riding style. You ride it more like you would an old two stroke (feathering the clutch).
I agree with the statement re engine braking/stalling and to compensate I wind up my idle. You have to get it within quite a fine tolerance, so as to reduce the chances of stalling in a trailriding / tight situation, and also not to have the bike 'push' you when off the gas going down hill. There is a compromise to be found. After riding xr250's/400's/600's most off my life I find a 450 to be beautifully rideable. Its a real lightweight for me (6'3 and 94kg's).
And now just for fergie an off the cuff, coarse comment...
Bum, titty, doodle, bum, titty, doodle. :buggerd:
crazyxr250rider
19th February 2009, 15:54
yep 450s are great im sellin mine if your interested.
laserracer
19th February 2009, 16:18
we have both i have a yz426 and my son has a yz250 2 stroke both have more than enough power the 250 is lighter and better at the tight twisties and the 426 is better for grunting up hills and straught forrest tracks the 250 jumps better.. really depends on your style of riding
oh by the way the 250 has a 13oz ffw and a fmf fatty
its a great woods bike, so it will idle down low and has a great bottom end
ive also ridden a drz 400 totaly different bike than the yz, but i suppose they are really, ones a trail bike and the others a mx bike
Blair.DRZ
19th February 2009, 21:30
I reckon a 450 would have more power than i would ever use, but the 300exc is sounding interesting, always thought I would stick with a 4 stroke but the 2 stroke riders are changing my mind:shit:
I ride up Karapoti mostly which has a bit of everything, so calling on the knowledge of Kezzafish and Secondfield ( sounds like you guys ride Karapoiti a lot ), you reckon a 300exc would be sweet up there ?
Rupe
19th February 2009, 21:37
I reckon a 450 would have more power than i would ever use, but the 300exc is sounding interesting, always thought I would stick with a 4 stroke but the 2 stroke riders are changing my mind:shit:
I ride up Karapoti mostly which has a bit of everything, so calling on the knowledge of Kezzafish and Secondfield ( sounds like you guys ride Karapoiti a lot ), you reckon a 300exc would be sweet up there ?
Just wondering what makes you think you need a big bore 4 or 2stroke?
secondfield
19th February 2009, 22:28
you reckon a 300exc would be sweet up there ?
Christ, if that ain't sweet up there nothing is! ha
My personal take on it is it depends on (not limited too but including):
a. How many bikes youv'e had exposure/familiarity with and actually had a go on or know mates of the same abilites who have (but I guess thats why your here!).
b.Your personal fitness/body weight/strength/stamina has a bearing on it also. We could debate the whole 2t vs 4t thing for YEARS (have been doing it aye!). But ive found each to their own... at the moment Im into 450's. You can still get a huge hit off them when ya crank the throttle and they feel lighter than my past steed's. XR's,IT's and a YZ490 (killer). Remembering my other bikes were 15 years + old and the tech wasn't quite what it is these days..
I did have a KTM exc 400 (circa 98) and found it a wee bit underpowered. The new exc400's are magic apparently.
My mates drz400 is heavy, but you can ride it all day, and when you get stuffed it does the work for you on climbs etc. To me the 450 is a (considerable) notch up in performance and handling. I love working the clutch on them up shitty rutted hills and feeling the fat four stroke power go to the dirt. Also throwing it into a corner and metering out the delivery gives you a feeling of control more so than a heavy flywheel machine. Being a 450 it can tractor around also when my body lacks energy after 4+ hours. I like the light weight of the 450 (112kgs) because I was used to heavy pigs in the past.I guess its relative to what you know and are familiar with.
Id love a crack on a 300exc, being a big bore enduro machine I reckon they will be close to what a modern 450mx'er with a flywheel weight is like. Remember a 2T 250/300 will make as much power as a 450, but they need to be kept 'on the pipe' to get the most out of them.Although I hear the exc300 can be ridden like a four. Generally they are a bit more work if your not an expereinced rider.
But then theres the venerable kdx200. An ass kicker of a bike. User friendly also... and so it goes on :yawn:
My 450 (and the other one ive owned an 05' RMZ450) I love. They are nothing to be afraid of, quite rideable actually, no scary on/off power hit like some ill tuned 2T's. And contrary to popular belief they last ages if looked after. Some exc's (450's) have over 200 hours on them without all the 'oh my god youve gotta do the piston and top end!!' stigma. Unless your riding them HARD OUT ie Mx every weekend, they'll go forever.
Just my 2 cents worth anyway...
Your more than welcome to have a gas on my bike next time your riding Karipoti to see if you like the 450 taste, drop us a PM before you plan your next mission and we'll sort something out.
Blair.DRZ
20th February 2009, 09:04
In reply to your question rupecopp, I guess its what i'm used to, i like the low down grunt that just pulls you up any hill.
I have always heard that smaller 2 strokes are really aggressive, my mate has a RM250, that thing is pretty scary and that the 250 4 stroke mxers are failry high maintenance ( just going on what I was told ), so was going to stick with what I know.
camchain
20th February 2009, 09:59
"no scary on/off power hit like some ill tuned 2T's." Ouch. I resemble that. 'Tis a problem with meat not metal. Spanner wielding monkeys (Moto Sapiens) can bugger up a 4 stroke just as effectively! lol
2 strokes can be cantankerous - and exciting. But even the 200 has surprising ability to tractor up a greasy root infested climb. I was pretty skeptical about this before I got mine.
kezzafish
20th February 2009, 11:36
Blair. the 300 exc would be a great bike up there, you'd be able to get your grunty, wheel standing road rush and super hill munching stompage and you'd be able to stand on the pegs and trials your way through the link track. I wish i had bought one of these instead of my 450 to be honest. In saying that i'm used to big luggy ass grunty bikes and i don't mind having to work hard to hang on to them cos they are super boogy machines from bottom to top. My 450 is different to secondfields and different to others i've ridden. so seconfields offer of riding his bike stands for me too.
I think what the likes of rupecopp have said about the questionable necessity of big bores is very true, if you stuggle like fuck to lift your drz out of a rut (off bike) it will not be much different with the 300, i think they're (elec start ones) around 113kg? and your drz (being a non elec start) will be around 115 odd. They'll feel lighter when ridden (than the dr) but the 200exc will feel easier still. I don't know if i'd go for the 200 cos i like to be scared of my bike and i'd look like a clown on a unicycle.
Mate, i and everyone on here could blather on endlessly but the most important point is... ride anything and everything you can before rushing into any purchase. And don't stick with what you know until you know what the othres are like. Bit of a bastard from where you are but call up and head over to AFC motorcycles in palmy (ktm dealer), they're super helpful and have a good selection (new and used) they'll let you test ride. Ride the 300 exc, 200 exc, 250 excf, 450 excf then come ride my 450 sxf. some people say that there are other manufacturers of motorcycles but i've never seen one, lol
After all that shit i've just written i've decided that it's all bullshit and you should just make a rash decision and go hard and make big mistakes cos that's how i do everything, lol lol
Dent
20th February 2009, 11:50
There are a lot of different figures tossed around for DRZ400 weight.
People who have weighed an E model, with fuel, say approx 134kg.
Now removing the headlight and fitting an aftermarket silencer will reduce that.
I personally went from a DR-Z400e with fmf exhaust, no headlight, to my gasgas with full road gear (sans mirrors). The new bike is much lighter. They advertise 99kg (probably dry, so 112 approx wet?), however the weight is so much lower in the frame, that the perception (by myself) is that there is a huge difference when picking the bike up after I drop it.
Hemex
20th February 2009, 11:52
After all that shit i've just written i've decided that it's all bullshit and you should just make a rash decision and go hard and make big mistakes cos that's how i do everything, lol lol
hahaha... fuck your a retard!
dammad1
20th February 2009, 13:11
Blair.
I think what the likes of rupecopp have said about the questionable necessity of big bores is very true, if you stuggle like fuck to lift your drz out of a rut (off bike) it will not be much different with the 300, i think they're (elec start ones) around 113kg? and your drz (being a non elec start) will be around 115 odd. They'll feel lighter when ridden (than the dr) but the 200exc will feel easier still.
300exc-e is 103kg with fluids and no fuel, so 113kg is fully wet.
kezzafish
20th February 2009, 15:49
300exc-e is 103kg with fluids and no fuel, so 113kg is fully wet.
ah, cheers. Is that with all roadie stuff removed?
dammad1
20th February 2009, 19:30
ah, cheers. Is that with all roadie stuff removed?
good question, not sure but either way the few bits of road gear would weigh next to nothing, couple kilos max.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2025 vBulletin Solutions Inc. All rights reserved.