Struggling? Here's why (My mark in the sand) [Archive]

vtec

9th March 2009, 15:13

ACC should be scrapped as should most benefits. The economy is screwed because there are too many leeches. There is so little productivity.

Leeches include:
Bankers
Insurance
Beneficiaries
Government (local councils, and politicians who seem to only be capable of making the justice system more and more unjust all the time, innocent before being proven guilty is dead, as is punishments suiting crimes).
and everybody else who is sucking from the teat of productivity while being completely unproductive themselves. There is no reason to work hard in a productive job anymore, because you get raped from all angles. Went to work one day on Friday before I leave for San Fran, and I'm working as a bicycle courier. Pedal my arse off in the pouring rain 20k's to just get to town from where I'm living then pedal around for 8 or 9 hours trying to eek out a living $2 at a time. The company I work for takes 40% of what we make for them which is fair enough, then you have the bicycle running costs which are more than you'd think, they're not very reliable, then you have food of which my intake quadruples when I'm couriering. Costs about $100 a week extra in food to run my body, and that's buying to maximise calories per dollar after having to filter through all the bullcrap "light/fat free" rubbish and you get charged GST on top of that. Then the government takes 25% of what's left, then at the end of a year of doing this extremely fatiguing job you get ACC sending you a bill for several thousand dollars.

Then to top it all off my courier bicycle gets stolen at 4pm from our bases undercover carpark... fuck. Was absolutely livid. Soaking wet, about $500 of bicycle down, after working my arse off and having to shovel in tonnes of food. And do you think the police who get so many of my tax dollars are interested in looking for a bicycle... no chance they've got motorcyclists to catch for speeding revenue. Thank god my good friend and fellow bicycle courier Max spotted the guy on it cycling up Queen St, and recommandeered it for me. The guy just jumped off and ran when Max grabbed the head stem. 6 foot 2 islander guy.

All though this isn't the polices fault, just got pulled over today 30seconds from my house, my warrant was just expired and the cop let me get away with it. Then a further 2 minutes down the road, some bitch rear ends my VFR400 at the traffic lights. And proceeds to tell me how it's my fault for stopping at a green light ... WTF. I stopped at a red light, and she's telling me how I'm a palangi snake. I gave her ten seconds to admit guilt or I was calling the cops. She tries to guilt me into not doing it while still barraging me with how her rear ending me is my fault. Cops arrive and her tune changes straight away... WTF, I swear any of the hundreds of people I know will just capitulate when they've fucking rear ended someone but these people were lying to me telling me that it was all my fault for stopping at a green light. I'm going overseas on Friday for a while and I can't tell you it's not soon enough. NZ is fucked. This coming depression will be the best thing for it.

Will make people sort their shit out. And will hopefully bring down lots of the leeches.

3L4NS1R

9th March 2009, 15:18

NZ is fucked. This coming depression will be the best thing for it.

Will make people sort their shit out. And will hopefully bring down lots of the leeches.

Here's hoping.

MisterD

9th March 2009, 15:19

The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings; the inherent virtue of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries - Winston Churchill

Bend-it

9th March 2009, 15:24

This coming depression will be the best thing for it. Will make people sort their shit out. And will hopefully bring down lots of the leeches.

Nahh, it'll just make them leech more, and those who already work hard will just have to work harder...

Until we have the guts to hold people accoujntable for their decisions and say "if you refuse to work, then don't eat". But of course the feelgoods around won't allow that because human rights blah blah blah... :yawn:

Please note, I'm not talking about people who cannot work, I'm talking about people who will not work.

Hitcher

9th March 2009, 15:24

Stephem

Don't you mean stuphem?

And what was that 28-page attachment supposed to be about?

ManDownUnder

9th March 2009, 15:33

Don't you mean stuphem?

And what was that 28-page attachment supposed to be about?

Stuggling... Jesus man - please keep up...

NighthawkNZ

9th March 2009, 15:39

I can't read...

vtec

9th March 2009, 15:54

Hopefully people will realise soon that insurance is one of society's evils. First of all it's a leech system, second of all it negates fault or responsibility for negative productivity, thirdly it costs the victims not the perpetrators. Fourthly victims of crime or accidents not of their doing are blamed for getting shafted when they are not insured. It's a big part of the failure of the economy in the states, and the taxpayer is having to bail insurance giants out to the tune of trillions of dollars now.

Next fish to fry. Local councils. Anyone notice how government departments have the nicest buildings in Henderson. Much nicer than all of the businesses that actually produce stuff and don't just shuffle paper. My good friend and flatmate is attempting to subdivide his modest property in Henderson, it's going to cost him $70,000 and he's well underway so there's no turning back. Most of this is random fees to the council that constantly pop up when you least expect them, and the workers at the council are so busy trying to justify their livelihoods that they invent faults for you to fix, get you to do things that are fucking retarded at great expense. I don't know why I'm so angry about it, it's not actually me getting shafted by them. Just property owners. And they make you PAY for special rubbish bags to get your rubbish collected despite the exhorbitant council fees. Fucking joke.

Next fish. The banks. They invented a whole lot of fairy tale financial products so they could show huge profits on their balance sheets and hand themselves huge bonuses and salaries thus coring out the real capital that the banks actually had so now, nearly all of the banks the world over are insolvent. Once all the credit derivatives are all valued at their true values, there will be very few banks left standing. I don't know how bad the problem is in NZ cause they are good at keeping joe public uneducated and in the dark, but in the states and europe, the systems are on life support but are totally braindead, it's only a matter of time before the life support systems fail. If something is bankrupt, it is bankrupt, let it fail. The sooner the system finds it's true base the sooner we can start rebuilding it from a solid base. Also, I'm with Commbank in Aus, and ASB here, effectively the same bank, now every time I want to transfer money between those accounts they charge me fucking $22 the wankers. That's just to change a fucking number on two accounts. And they are still haemorrhaging like anything. Retarded.

Next fish. The education system and baby boomers. When the boomers were young, they didn't need degrees or tertiary qualifications, they got on the job training. Now that they hold all the power, they are demanding full qualifications and most likely experience, to get even a menial job. I have one such qualification, but hate that I am limited to this one field by it. Furthermore, the education system has been running rampant, putting up the cost of education by insane amounts, because of the dickheads in charge and the easy money loaned by the government, thus sticking the current generations in debt slavery even BEFORE they own a house. Now you would think that's okay because they are going to come out the other end into a job that pays well because they have said qualification... in NZ? Dreaming. 90% of tertiary qualifications will get you into jobs where you have survival earnings. I have talked to Accounting graduates working for the likes of PwC for a couple of years, and I was earning more as a pushbike courier, not to mention how much more I was earning as a QS in Melbourne. I know plenty of Software engineers who get peanuts aswell. Also, the only real reason for the people running most of these businesses to demand qualifications for their fields, is so that they can protect their worth in the market. Dentists have been masters of this for years (sorry Leong, just how I see it). Sure training is required, but the extreme costs, stupidly perfect grades required and years of unsupported study from within the establishments just smack of livelihood exclusivity leading to the ability to put prices through the roof. Most education systems are retarded. My QS qualification, I feel that it is a joke. You need real world experience under guidance to do any job. Education needs to change focus. And the boomers have been the designers of their own demise with their property based retirement plans now collapsing because the young generations have NO MONEY because of the boomers, and they have made them unproductive.

I wondered why there are so few motards in motorcycle shops. And as Botany Honda explained to me, it's because the target market of 18-30 year olds HAS NO MONEY. It's been like this for quite a few years now. Because the rampant and ruthless expansion of the boomer generation at the cost of coming generations has already done untold damage. I have the answers to all of these problems, but my post is too long as it is. If you are interested ask me how I would solve each problem. The people in power never want to change anything, because the status quo is what gave them their power and money in the first place and they are the only people with the ability to change things for the common good. That's why the system is designed so the rich get richer and the poor get poorer, just nowadays it's been that the middle class have been getting poorer real fast.

Over the last 20 years there has been few times in history when so many of the educated elites have done so little for the many while doing so much for the few.

I've been reading shitloads from the marketoracle.org over the last year. And I've just got angrier and angrier about how the hardworker is shafted and the leeches and paperpushers have been grandly reimbursed, tables are turning but governments are trying to stop it from happening.

Also when I say earnings are survival, it's mostly just because of the cost of shelter these days. Housing speculation has been a growing bubble for far too long, now is the pop. I just hope you are not overinvested in property.

vtec

9th March 2009, 16:10

Nahh, it'll just make them leech more, and those who already work hard will just have to work harder...

Until we have the guts to hold people accoujntable for their decisions and say "if you refuse to work, then don't eat". But of course the feelgoods around won't allow that because human rights blah blah blah... :yawn:

Please note, I'm not talking about people who cannot work, I'm talking about people who will not work.

Governments are at risk of insolvency in the coming crisis. The bludger is hopefully going to get dumped on his head, unfortunately along with loads of genuinely needy recipients.

If you're wondering why I'm so annoyed today, it's cause I had my bicycle stolen (and recovered luckily) on Friday. And got rear ended today on my motorbike, and had to deal with a lying abusive bitch and restrain myself at the same time. And had to be all meek to charm the police twice in the space of 2 minutes. Fuck. I actually tried to accelerate when I heard the screech and saw her coming. But barely got rolling in time. Still I think I saved my bike and limited the damage to her car.

Also, if some of that benefit money was spent on public transport like a decent electric train network, and maybe even electric trams aswell, it would get a lot of the retarded off the roads and keep heaps more money circulating in the local economy. I'm pretty sure my single sided swingarm is okay, but it's going to bug me for quite some time.

Anyone have the figures for sickness benefit/dpb/dole/acc? I would hazard a guess at $20billion NZD per annum. Of which I would hazard a further guess 2/3'rds of it goes to bludgers. What do you think you could achieve with $13 billion NZD. Currently a fair chunk of it goes into Alcohol and drug suppliers.

peasea

9th March 2009, 16:17

ACC should be scrapped as should most benefits.

Agreed. Too many dodgey payouts and too many bludgers out there. Sad for the genuine cases though.

Brian d marge

9th March 2009, 16:22

Don't you mean stuphem? ( possibly, )

And what was that 28-page attachment supposed to be about?

I assume you can read because I am not going to illustrate it ...

Oscar

9th March 2009, 16:30

trustme

9th March 2009, 16:32

Mate, you are looking back at the early eighties through rose tinted spectocacles.

Oscar

9th March 2009, 16:37

Next fish. The banks. They invented a whole lot of fairy tale financial products so they could show huge profits on their balance sheets and hand themselves huge bonuses and salaries thus coring out the real capital that the banks actually had so now, nearly all of the banks the world over are insolvent. Once all the credit derivatives are all valued at their true values, there will be very few banks left standing. I don't know how bad the problem is in NZ cause they are good at keeping joe public uneducated and in the dark, but in the states and europe, the systems are on life support but are totally braindead, it's only a matter of time before the life support systems fail. If something is bankrupt, it is bankrupt, let it fail. The sooner the system finds it's true base the sooner we can start rebuilding it from a solid base. Also, I'm with Commbank in Aus, and ASB here, effectively the same bank, now every time I want to transfer money between those accounts they charge me fucking $22 the wankers. That's just to change a fucking number on two accounts. And they are still haemorrhaging like anything. Retarded.

More bullshit.

How long did they have to hold the gun at your head to make you bank with those two banks? If you don't like it, go elsewhere.

As for the financial meltdown - The CBA is one of the most solvent banks in the world (in fact all the Aussie banks are rated very highly). This fact has been reported on several times in the general media in the las week alone.

So it isn't Joe Public that's undereducated, it's just you.

vtec

9th March 2009, 16:46

Oscar

9th March 2009, 16:48

I don't buy it, but it absolves criminals of and moral implications, thus increasing the crime rate and increasing the need to get it or get shafted. I think the worst thing about this country is the number of people who keep their head buried in the ground while shit gets worse and worse.

Criminals?
How does insurance absolve criminal behaviour?
What on earth are you on about?

vtec

9th March 2009, 16:49

More bullshit.

How long did they have to hold the gun at your head to make you bank with those two banks? If you don't like it, go elsewhere.

As for the financial meltdown - The CBA is one of the most solvent banks in the world (in fact all the Aussie banks are rated very highly). This fact has been reported on several times in the general media in the las week alone.

So it isn't Joe Public that's undereducated, it's just you.

Hey I didn't say all banks, I said most were insolvent, I think ASB and Commbank are a couple of the safest that's why I'm with them. However nearly all banks extract lots of fees for pathetic reasons to fund their excesses. I'm still waiting to see how well Kiwibank is run, and considering credit unions aswell, but the functionality of ASB is an advantage. The reason why I'm with them... I've been with them since I was 5, they came to my school to sell their wares. And I've only just started to realise the evils of our current banking systems through reading... and reading, and reading. And only recently have I been using more of the banks functionalities because I've swapped between countries and am heading off again soon.

General media = Head + Sand. Sorry, but they only report anything about the economy long after the horse has bolted. They even blatantly talk about trying to maintain the public confidence... ie. keep YOU in the dark, so people in the know can make or save money before you. The government does the same thing. Only report a recession long after it has happened. I'll go find a graph that is very easy to understand and will show you how long ago many people knew this was happening and yet your beloved general media were another 18 months behind.

Edit again: The graph I've attached shows the ASX200 it started to collapse back in 2007. That was when everything was starting to collapse, yet your mainstream media was only reporting economic issues in late 2008. That means that people were knowledgeable and informed about the problems in banking and insurance and the property bubble way back then, and your mainstream media either had no idea, or didn't want to alarm you, or were purposely keeping you in the dark so that they could keep their friends in the winning seats.

The best sources for information for me have been marketoracle.org, and www.larouchepac.com - I learnt from them in person in Melbourne about the insolvency of the banking system back in early 08. They said the system had passed the point of no return in 2007. I didn't know how much to believe back then, enough to keep all my money in cash at that stage.

Brian d marge

9th March 2009, 16:52

I put the document up ,because I get tired listening to people expound ideals which are proven , not once but twice in only a few years ,to fail,,,,, ( the current buzz word is Keynesian economics ....but wasn't it market forces ??? )

It gets me riled, when a country the size of New Zealand , with only 4 million people , struggles to feed itself We have all the stuff required to provide a very good standard of living for most people ... and we fail. ( yes, I said " we " I still spend a lot of time trying to get the overpaid idiots in the beehive to stop dipping in to the stupid sauce )

Poverty is the real issue in NZ , all the other stuff we read about stems from poverty , I am not exactly rich here in Japan, but I only work 5 hours a day ,,, more if i feel like it ,, I am at home today with both kids ,,, they get both parents ,,, LOTS of quality time ... I couldn't be happier about that ... ( well I will be when I get my I phone tomorrow ! )

we dont have debt , we can afford to go out when we feel like it , I can play around with bikes ( ok thhe business pays for some of that ) ..... and I have super fast broad band , and some of the wierdest Pron on this planet ! :2thumbsup

I dont want to work over 40 hours a week only to spend more than 60 % in rent / morgage ,,,, then overly priced food etc ..... .

So I put my line in the sand . thats the history of how NZ changed , Who changed it and some EASY things people can do to fix it . ..In the future I will refer to it ,

Stephen

Jeaves

9th March 2009, 16:54

Nice post's vtec.

More bullshit.

How long did they have to hold the gun at your head to make you bank with those two banks? If you don't like it, go elsewhere.

Just curious , which banks could he try that wont charge for an international transfer?

Brian d marge

9th March 2009, 16:54

Mate, you are looking back at the early eighties through rose tinted spectocacles.

no. I have it here in another country .

Stephen

vtec

9th March 2009, 16:56

Criminals?
How does insurance absolve criminal behaviour?
What on earth are you on about?

Ok I'll spell it out for you. Lets say your car is stolen, whats the first question you get asked by your neighbour, the police, etc. Was it insured. Now, the police don't care about your car getting stolen for several reasons. It's not going to make them any revenue if they find it. Next reason, if it is insured, they see it as no harm done, and again no revenue for them. Now your neighbour, if it is insured... no harm done, if it isn't you're a fucking retard for not insuring your car. Now nowhere in there is there any thought or care or attempt to recover said car. It just doesn't happen these days, because there are too many. And the criminal himself thinks...(that is if he has a conscience left after the P abuse) it's Ok they will have had insurance, and if you don't you're a retard. It has encouraged and fostered burglaries and car thefts and the lack of care on the behalf of the police, and your fellow citizens. It also removes a lot of the care about how people drive their vehicles.

I don't insure, I just make sure I don't hit anything on the road, I'm lucky, my outlet is the track at which I'm not insured either.

Oh and even the NZ government had your money invested in credit derivatives through the hedge funds etc that it invested billions of your money overseas. To date it has already realised billions in losses. Pretty sure it was mostly from the labour government reign.

And Jeaves, I'm not looking for a free transfer, just the transfer charge should be on an order of magnitude less than it is. Not to mention you have to pay more than the going rate to the bank for the transfer, and they buy it off someone else at less than the going rate... They win everywhere by lots. They are thieves.

Jeaves

9th March 2009, 17:03

vtec

9th March 2009, 17:11

I agree vtec , my post was more less trying to imply that you'd be shafted no matter who ya go with. ( One would assume most bank fees hover around the same price) So was genuinely asking if there was an alternative bank.

Yeah just letting people know that I don't expect something for nothing. And you are right, the alternatives are all crap too, because the way the current capital systems are run they lead to monopoly/oligarchy which means that YOU get shafted. Currently the banks operate oligarchy's.

And with regard to the current Keynesian economics being meted out in Europe and the US, printing money works wonders. Just ask Mugabe or look at the German Weimar republic. hahahah. Printing money is just theft off the public by stealth, thankfully I don't think the NZ government is doing it... yet. The US is doing it, so all the dopes who are investing in US treasuries are going to get shafted when the USD collapses due to money printing and a stalled economy.

What am I invested in? The only thing left that's safe physical metal, specifically gold. It's pretty high, but when the USD fails Gold will go way higher.

Brian d marge

9th March 2009, 17:15

Acc doesn't need to be privatised , Just run correctly and some forms of payout need to be cut ,,,basic household budgeting , Strangely I agree with the current government cost cuttings , but you don't have to fire people just pay them a normal salary ...Why does Nick smith get 2 or 3 times the average salary ... its a shitty job I know ...but then haven't we all done such work?? for a lot less????? can people be distributed among other departments ............o

I am sure government department IF held accountable ( ie job / or monetary fines ) can be run in lean efficient manners ,,, especially in this day and age ...

Stephen

Hitcher

9th March 2009, 17:46

I assume you can read because I am not going to illustrate it ...

But, but, but, I have a Discovery Channel attention span...

Oscar

9th March 2009, 17:56

Nice post's vtec.

Just curious , which banks could he try that wont charge for an international transfer?

My bank charges a lot less than $22 for an international transfer.
Depending on which bank I used, I could get money in Yrup for NZ$0 -NZ$10.

Oscar

9th March 2009, 18:08

Ok I'll spell it out for you. Lets say your car is stolen, whats the first question you get asked by your neighbour, the police, etc. Was it insured. Now, the police don't care about your car getting stolen for several reasons. It's not going to make them any revenue if they find it. Next reason, if it is insured, they see it as no harm done, and again no revenue for them. Now your neighbour, if it is insured... no harm done, if it isn't you're a fucking retard for not insuring your car. Now nowhere in there is there any thought or care or attempt to recover said car. It just doesn't happen these days, because there are too many. And the criminal himself thinks...(that is if he has a conscience left after the P abuse) it's Ok they will have had insurance, and if you don't you're a retard. It has encouraged and fostered burglaries and car thefts and the lack of care on the behalf of the police, and your fellow citizens. It also removes a lot of the care about how people drive their vehicles.

I don't insure, I just make sure I don't hit anything on the road, I'm lucky, my outlet is the track at which I'm not insured either.

That's an awful lot of assumptions going on there.
Insurers and Police have a vested interest in recovering stolen vehicles, which is why both have specialist units set up to do it.

Notwithstanding that, what people think about the process (particularly the criminals) is not particularly relevant is it? And it's a huge stretch to say the system condones criminal behaviour - do you have one scintilla of proof?

Oh and even the NZ government had your money invested in credit derivatives through the hedge funds etc that it invested billions of your money overseas. To date it has already realised billions in losses. Pretty sure it was mostly from the labour government reign.

Wrong again.
It has realised no losses at all.
It has suffered a drop in value, based on the market, but there is no loss until these investments are actually sold.

Leaving aside that fundamental flaw in your argument, what funds are you talking about?
The NZ Govt is a net debtor, so any surpluses are used to retire old debt.
If you're refering to the ACC, EQC or NZ Super - see above, no loss until sold...

And Jeaves, I'm not looking for a free transfer, just the transfer charge should be on an order of magnitude less than it is. Not to mention you have to pay more than the going rate to the bank for the transfer, and they buy it off someone else at less than the going rate... They win everywhere by lots. They are thieves.

Why are they thieves?
Because you're stupid enough to pay?
Taking advantage of the feeble minded is not theft.
Find another bank and stop whining.

Brian d marge

9th March 2009, 18:12

But, but, but, I have a Discovery Channel attention span...

and I'm wearing my National heath specs , couldn't change the title of this thread for me .......

Stephen

Oscar

9th March 2009, 18:15

Hey I didn't say all banks, I said most were insolvent, I think ASB and Commbank are a couple of the safest that's why I'm with them. However nearly all banks extract lots of fees for pathetic reasons to fund their excesses. I'm still waiting to see how well Kiwibank is run, and considering credit unions aswell, but the functionality of ASB is an advantage. The reason why I'm with them... I've been with them since I was 5, they came to my school to sell their wares. And I've only just started to realise the evils of our current banking systems through reading... and reading, and reading. And only recently have I been using more of the banks functionalities because I've swapped between countries and am heading off again soon.

General media = Head + Sand. Sorry, but they only report anything about the economy long after the horse has bolted. They even blatantly talk about trying to maintain the public confidence... ie. keep YOU in the dark, so people in the know can make or save money before you. The government does the same thing. Only report a recession long after it has happened. I'll go find a graph that is very easy to understand and will show you how long ago many people knew this was happening and yet your beloved general media were another 18 months behind.

Edit again: The graph I've attached shows the ASX200 it started to collapse back in 2007. That was when everything was starting to collapse, yet your mainstream media was only reporting economic issues in late 2008. That means that people were knowledgeable and informed about the problems in banking and insurance and the property bubble way back then, and your mainstream media either had no idea, or didn't want to alarm you, or were purposely keeping you in the dark so that they could keep their friends in the winning seats.

The best sources for information for me have been marketoracle.org, and www.larouchepac.com - I learnt from them in person in Melbourne about the insolvency of the banking system back in early 08. They said the system had passed the point of no return in 2007. I didn't know how much to believe back then, enough to keep all my money in cash at that stage.

Err...the media have been reporting the impending slow down in both the NZ and Aussie economies since 2006. It was accepted by most experts that NZ could not maintain that level of growth for much longer. The discussion centered on not if, but when and if it would be a hard landing or a soft one.

I don't know what you mean by "mainstream media" but National Radio has had that sort of info for ages.

vtec

9th March 2009, 18:28

That's an awful lot of assumptions going on there.
Insurers and Police have a vested interest in recovering stolen vehicles, which is why both have specialist units set up to do it.

Notwithstanding that, what people think about the process (particularly the criminals) is not particularly relevant is it? And it's a huge stretch to say the system condones criminal behaviour - do you have one scintilla of proof?

My proof is just personal experience. [edit]Insurers have an interest to recover stolen vehicles yes, but that doesn't help the people who are paying for it being stolen in the first place, recovered cars by insurer's only add to the insurance company coffers. They don't help the insured public getting reamed. The police have a specialist car theft unit? Really? I haven't seen one skirrick of evidence of this. When I had a car stolen a few years ago. The only help I got from the police was a form sent for me to fill out the details about the car about 3 months after it was stolen.
What goes on in peoples heads is very relevant to their behaviour yes.

Wrong again.
It has realised no losses at all.
It has suffered a drop in value, based on the market, but there is no loss until these investments are actually sold.

Leaving aside that fundamental flaw in your argument, what funds are you talking about?
The NZ Govt is a net debtor, so any surpluses are used to retire old debt.
If you're refering to the ACC, EQC or NZ Super - see above, no loss until sold...

Hahaha, I remember watching on the news in Aussie they were talking to this group of housewife stocktraders in October after a few big falls, and you know what they said. You don't actually make any losses unless you sell them. Well I promise you that they see themselves on the TV in their head saying that every night as they go to sleep. Hahaha. 40% of the worlds wealth has been wiped out by this crash. There is going to be no bounceback for many of these losses. In fact there are going to be many investments that become worthless and with no possibility of ever being worth more than zero... but hey, if you haven't sold it, you haven't realised your loss.

Why are they thieves?
Because you're stupid enough to pay?
Taking advantage of the feeble minded is not theft.
Find another bank and stop whining.

They're thieves because you have to use a bank these days, and they are all run hugely innefficiently and really quite corruptly with their bonus schemes encouraging psychopathic behaviours. And their high salaries encouraging a culture of don't change a good thing or say anything that might jeopardise it. Their fees are price gouging and change regularly with no notice. And they do price match between them. And yes so far I'm stupid enough to pay. Soon there will be better options though. If enough people wise up, especially people with power and with public interest at heart, I'm hoping theres a few left. The accounting bollocks that has gone on by executives at the banks has pointed to huge profits that they have then been able to extract with bonuses, where really the profits were far more meagre and now that the encouragement of irresponsible lending/borrowing (which they used to create fancy financial products like securities and derivatives that they could sell to hedge funds but which they were also buying as they were flying up in price) offering twisted financial advice to the public, has finally broken down and they are now having to make massive writeoffs. Of which there are far more to come.

Which bank are you with, there's some credit card schemes for purchases in foreign currency that don't have exhorbitant fees attached. Is that how you got your cheap international transfers. I wanted money not stuff though.

reofix

9th March 2009, 18:33

wow brian and i thought you guys were extinct!!!! then out of the backwoods wanders a fully fledged conspirational ... jargon spouting fuckwit

elevenhundred

9th March 2009, 18:33

Everyone needs to HTFU

NZ is a shit load better than a lot of other countries, people just have no perspective

vtec

9th March 2009, 18:41

Err...the media have been reporting the impending slow down in both the NZ and Aussie economies since 2006. It was accepted by most experts that NZ could not maintain that level of growth for much longer. The discussion centered on not if, but when and if it would be a hard landing or a soft one.

I don't know what you mean by "mainstream media" but National Radio has had that sort of info for ages.

Even now, you get them trying to delude people into thinking it's all going to be business as normal in a year or two's time. Maybe National radio is onto it, I don't listen to radio. I do watch the news. You just said slowdown. That doesn't mean a recession or a depression. A slowdown compared to what we have is like a housefire compared to the recent bushfires they've had in aussie.

I was looking at property prices in 07 in NZ, and I worked out how much it would cost to maintain a mortgage even a much smaller one than most people had. Everybody was relying on their properties going up in value 10% per annum. And everybody thought they were going to get rich on their properties. Only thing was more and more people like me noticed that there could no longer be buyers for these properties as maintaining the mortgage was becoming stupid. If a trend is unsustainable it won't be sustained. It got to a point people realised this. I was having arguments with people in late 07 about the sustainability of property price increases being unsustainable. But often people only hear/believe what they want to (I'm not immune to this either).

Skyryder

9th March 2009, 19:30

If you don't like it - don't fucking buy it.
It isn't compulsory in this country.
As for tax payers bailing them out: NZ taxpayers haven't paid a bean to an insurer or bank.

The worst thing about this country (and that's not that much wrong with it), is the whiners.

Yep your are right. Funny how that never occured to you under Labour.

So now it's my turn. Get used to it.

There has been a long and sustained campaign by the far right to portray New Zealand in a poor light. Without going into the details of this the end result is that now many New Zealanders have and extremely poor concept of our traditions and way of life. We came from working class origins where the concept of a fair days pay for a fair days work was the accepted norm. This changed during the 51 wharfies strike in which our army was used as a strike breaker by Sid Holland. This sore was the beginning of the divide where we once worked as a Nation........together. Not any more. To me the second division was the Wine box affair. This epitomized corporate greed and was a result of so called free market where companies were plundered of assets and the employees left to fend for themselves with only a pittance in welfare. This attitude is still alive and well in NZ today.

That a man who has never contributed to our society by way of meaningful employment, who was caught lying to the New Zealand public and now pretends to have New Zealand’s best interests at heart, is our Prime Minister, suggests to me just how gullible the NZ public has become and our own lack of self respect as nation. Key is the epitome of the ‘me’ society but what most have not realized is that Key is the ‘we’ and that does not include ‘you’: that is most on here at KB. Might take some time for this to sink in but sink in it will............make no mistake.

Skyryder

Oscar

9th March 2009, 19:36

Yep your are right. Funny how that never occured to you under Labour.

So now it's my turn. Get used to it.

There has been a long and sustained campaign by the far right to portray New Zealand in a poor light. Without going into the details of this the end result is that now many New Zealanders have and extremely poor concept of our traditions and way of life. We came from working class origins where the concept of a fair days pay for a fair days work was the accepted norm. This changed during the 51 wharfies strike in which our army was used as a strike breaker by Sid Holland. This sore was the beginning of the divide where we once worked as a Nation........together. Not any more. To me the second division was the Wine box affair. This epitomized corporate greed and was a result of so called free market where companies were plundered of assets and the employees left to fend for themselves with only a pittance in welfare. This attitude is still alive and well in NZ today.

That a man who has never contributed to our society by way of meaningful employment, who was caught lying to the New Zealand public and now pretends to have New Zealand’s best interests at heart, is our Prime Minister, suggests to me just how gullible the NZ public has become and our own lack of self respect as nation. Key is the epitome of the ‘me’ society but what most have not realized is that Key is the ‘we’ and that does not include ‘you’: that is most on here at KB. Might take some time for this to sink in but sink in it will............make no mistake.

Skyryder

Meaningful employment?
What an incredibly stupid comment.
Please name one member of the former labour cabinet that ever worked for a living....

You need a user name change - how about "Left wing sore loser"?

vtec

9th March 2009, 19:38

Timber020

9th March 2009, 20:06

vtec

9th March 2009, 20:12

ACC isnt well managed but its a better system than the lawyer and insurance cash grab that we would be left with otherwise. Its easy to bag something thats not working well, but its quite another to find something that works better.

Changing it will just make Lawyers and Insurance companies alot richer with more power to screw us over. I lived and worked in the US and couldnt believe how screwed up it all was, then in aus you could see it heading the same way, not as bad but there insurance council (or whatever it was) was trying to extend there powers.

Too true, is much better than the lawyers etc. My brother and his wife both working as physiotherapists. Told me that most of their "productive" time was taken up with people milking ACC. And as pain is totally subjective, there's no way to prove that they weren't in pain, and thus were unable to remove them from the sickness benefit. Unemployment figures are another fudged stat trying to fool the productive public into working to support the bloated financialised leech economy. As is inflation.

The justice and law system is another thing that needs fixing. There is no way lawyers should get the money that they do. Again all to do with invented exclusivity. Justice is only for the rich. If lawyers were public servants with fixed salaries and the legal simplified so that people could represent themselves... do away with the pomp and righteousness, then there could be a legal system for average joe aswell. These are just ideas, I can't guarantee they don't have flaws.

Oscar

9th March 2009, 20:15

Skyrider - Thanks for the insight to John Key. I don't really know much about him at all apart from the fact he is part of the educated (and rich) elite. So far I haven't been able to fault him with what he's done though. I have a sinking feeling you are right.

How did he lie to NZ? I was in Aussie all last year. We don't touch the news much there.

He fucked up ACC estimates by $1.5b...no, wait a minute that was Labour.
Lesse now, his limo was caught speeding and he blamed it on his bodyguard...nope, that was Helen Clarke....er..I know he gave a signed piece of art to a charity, but had some else do it...nope that was Helen Clarke, too.

I give up, what did he lie about?

vtec

9th March 2009, 20:20

He fucked up ACC estimates by $1.5b...no, wait a minute that was Labour.
Lesse now, his limo was caught speeding and he blamed it on his bodyguard...nope, that was Helen Clarke....er..I know he gave a signed piece of art to a charity, but had some else do it...nope that was Helen Clarke, too.

I give up, what did he lie about?

bahahaha... Yeah labour was pretty shit, vote buying bribing thieves. I never voted for them. always used to be a national supporter. But after seeing the failures and corruptness of capitalism as it stands I wasn't up for voting National either. I just abstained but was looking very keenly at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_and_Ben_Party

puddytat

9th March 2009, 20:22

Oscar

9th March 2009, 20:22

bahahaha... Yeah labour was pretty shit. I never voted for them. always used to be a national supporter. But after seeing the failures and corruptness of capitalism as it stands I wasn't up for voting National either. I just abstained but was looking very keenly at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_and_Ben_Party

So if you didn't vote - why are you complaining?

vtec

9th March 2009, 20:28

So if you didn't vote - why are you complaining?

Damn it Oscar another simple answer for you. Because nobody with power or in any position to gain it was worth voting for. But I still think NZ is great in many ways, it's just pretty fucked in many too. Just because I didn't vote doesn't mean I don't care. I very obviously care by all the posts I've put up here today. I didn't like either National or Labour policies, but didn't see a viable alternative.

Abstaining is a form of protest.

puddytat

9th March 2009, 20:28

Mully

9th March 2009, 20:40

Skyrider - Thanks for the insight to John Key. I don't really know much about him at all apart from the fact he is part of the educated (and rich) elite. So far I haven't been able to fault him with what he's done though. I have a sinking feeling you are right.

How did he lie to NZ? I was in Aussie all last year. We don't touch the news much there.

Fuck, don't start him on this rant again.

I think it's cos he owned Toll rail shares in his own name, and his family trust owned some too, or some such.

Winston001

9th March 2009, 20:42

When has a state run enterprise thats been privatised EVER given better service....I listened to all that shit when "they" said privatising meant that everything would be cheaper & better service....YEAH RIGHT!! All I get now is prerecorded menu & letters informing me that whatever it is , is going up in price.....I wish my fucking wages would.

Hmmm...ok, lets see. NZ Post and Telegraph became Telecom and NZ Post. Suddenly you could get a phone on in 3 days - not 3 weeks. My phone line costs about $40 today, $33 in 1987, toll calls are much cheaper today. And mail gets from Invercargill to Auckland overnight when it used to take 5 days or longer.

Quotable Value - used to be Government Valuation service and very laid back. Now they are jumping down the phone to help. Solid Energy - its a million miles from the old Ministry of Mines which had a lot in common with old NZ Rail. Jobs for life. And even KiwiRail despite all the problems does a good fast job today.

Skyryder

9th March 2009, 20:44

Skyrider - Thanks for the insight to John Key. I don't really know much about him at all apart from the fact he is part of the educated (and rich) elite. So far I haven't been able to fault him with what he's done though. I have a sinking feeling you are right.

How did he lie to NZ? I was in Aussie all last year. We don't touch the news much there.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VeJSFVWKnsE&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iaEXa202Q6M&feature=related

Merril Lynch Key stating they got it wrong. When did Merril Lynch ever get wrong?? Just look at his body language.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tg95X-A94vs&feature=related

Skyryder

Mully

9th March 2009, 20:46

Fuck, too late.

BMWST?

9th March 2009, 20:47

Now, the police don't care about your car getting stolen for several reasons. It's not going to make them any revenue if they find it.
I didnt realise then Police were trying to earn money for solving crime

To date it has already realised billions in losses. Pretty sure it was mostly from the labour government reign.

this scheme was set up by the labour government but if it had dropped in value it will be only over the last year or so

And Jeaves, I'm not looking for a free transfer, just the transfer charge should be on an order of magnitude less than it is. Not to mention you have to pay more than the going rate to the bank for the transfer, and they buy it off someone else at less than the going rate... They win everywhere by lots. They are thieves.

i beleive that is the real function of a bank...to make money for their shareholders

Mully

9th March 2009, 20:54

I didnt realise then Police were trying to earn money for solving crime

Yes, yes. The heinous Godless crime of driving or riding at 61km/h

With the non-existent quota.

Sorry, back on topic, lads.

Skyryder

9th March 2009, 21:00

Meaningful employment?
What an incredibly stupid comment.
Please name one member of the former labour cabinet that ever worked for a living....
You need a user name change - how about "Left wing sore loser"?

Ya going to love this one. Mallard was a teacher. He's worked as a teacher in Wellington and the King Country.

Now if you had asked for two............................?? But you didn't. Ya just got to think before you use ya hands.

Skyryder

Forest

9th March 2009, 21:05

Edit again: The graph I've attached shows the ASX200 it started to collapse back in 2007. That was when everything was starting to collapse, yet your mainstream media was only reporting economic issues in late 2008. That means that people were knowledgeable and informed about the problems in banking and insurance and the property bubble way back then, and your mainstream media either had no idea, or didn't want to alarm you, or were purposely keeping you in the dark so that they could keep their friends in the winning seats.

The best sources for information for me have been marketoracle.org, and www.larouchepac.com - I learnt from them in person in Melbourne about the insolvency of the banking system back in early 08. They said the system had passed the point of no return in 2007. I didn't know how much to believe back then, enough to keep all my money in cash at that stage.

Sorry buddy, but you're way off the mark there.

In general terms, share prices reflect the expected financial performance for a listed entity. This means that the share prices tend to run about 12-18 months ahead of the entity's financial reporting. If you think about this it does make sense - investors buy shares because they expect the company to do better in the future (and anticipate a rise in the share's value) or they sell shares because they expect the company to do worse in the future (and anticipate a fall in the share's value).

Back in 2007, the market began to realise that problems were coming up and the share prices dropped in expectation of lowered financial performance. It isn't a conspiracy.

Oscar

9th March 2009, 21:08

Damn it Oscar another simple answer for you. Because nobody with power or in any position to gain it was worth voting for. But I still think NZ is great in many ways, it's just pretty fucked in many too. Just because I didn't vote doesn't mean I don't care. I very obviously care by all the posts I've put up here today. I didn't like either National or Labour policies, but didn't see a viable alternative.

Abstaining is a form of protest.

You accuse me of simplistic answers after you say all insurers are thieves and banks invent fairy tale products.

You don't vote, yet you complain about the government.
Abstaining is a form of cop out.

There were more than two parties in the last election, spend less time on your conspiracy theories and more time in the real world - those who don't engage, shouldn't whinge.

Oscar

9th March 2009, 21:15

Ya going to love this one. Mallard was a teacher. He's worked as a teacher in Wellington and the King Country.

Now if you had asked for two............................?? But you didn't. Ya just got to think before you use ya hands.

Skyryder

Mallard's been in Parliament since what? 1984?
The best you can do is someone who worked as a teacher a generation ago?
Gimme a break.

The reason that losers like you complain about people like Key is very simple.
Jealousy.
Not just the wealth, but the power and the popular support.

Key took the working man off labour (maybe not forever, but for the election day), and he took Maori off of Labour.
He killed off the undead that is Winston Peters.
He made the Greens irrelevant and even sidelined Peter Dunne.

And he did that in the time it takes a Labour Cabinet to decide if they should have a committee to study if the tea breaks should include plain or fancy biscuits.

Brian d marge

9th March 2009, 21:17

wow brian and i thought you guys were extinct!!!! then out of the backwoods wanders a fully fledged conspirational ... jargon spouting fuckwit

who isnt being reamed up the arse like some morons ... Did you use enough jelly ...???

Stephen

Jargon ,,,I am sorry did the remedial classes not teach that ?

Swampdonkey

9th March 2009, 21:18

The Greens are our saviour......fark off Charlie!!

Brian d marge

9th March 2009, 21:22

Everyone needs to HTFU

NZ is a shit load better than a lot of other countries, people just have no perspective

and those countries would be????? Nz was up in the top 5 or 10 .... for standards of living ...now where is it ...

still must not grumble eh

Stephen

Big Dave

9th March 2009, 22:22

still must not grumble eh

I have nothing worth grumbling about and enjoy an enviable standard of living.

Ixion

9th March 2009, 22:27

I have nothing worth grumbling about.

Well, that's a very poor attitude. You need to try harder.

I mean , almost all of us could say that, but the rest of us get stuck in and make an effort and FIND something to grumble about.

Where would the country be if everybody was as apathetic as you? Pull up your socks and put your mind to it, if you try you're bound to find something. Even if you can't you can grumble about the time you've wasted trying to find something to grumble about. See ! You just have to be a bit creative. It's everybody's duty in these difficult times to pull their weight, you can't expect the rest of us to grumble for you. I mean, I have somewhat of an apptitude for it, and don't mind grumbling on behalf of the disabled who can't do it for themeselves, but I draw the line at the able bodied.

pete376403

9th March 2009, 22:33

.... I collected lots of information ..and so I finally put it together ( a lot of it was hidden in books , so I have used the internet , for example the IMF website and the World bank web site , sorry bout that , but I m dont have the time to retype ,,all the pages ...so do excuse me )

it is long and in some places a boring read , it is not my opinion, but fact, to the best of my knowledge.

please add to it or point out any flaws ....

Stephem

that's an interesting read, thanks for putting it together. Went looking for more info about Andy Krieger and his relationship with John Key. Found this:
http://aotearoaawiderperspective.wordpress.com/2008/08/04/john-key-and-the-things-he-does-not-want-you-to-know-part-1-the-attack-on-the-nz-dollar-in-1987/
which draws the interesting conclusion: "John Key and Andrew Krieger can only have worked toegether in 1987 thus putting John Key firmly in the traders chair on the other side of the telephone line to the Bankers Trust New York were Andrew Krieger was giving orders in what was to be the biggest attack on the New Zealand currency putting tens of thousands of New Zealand jobs and incomes at risk."

Nice to know the Keys heart is in the right place when it comes to NZ.

Big Dave

9th March 2009, 22:40

Can I start with peeved.

Look on the bright side - you could live here.

http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m135/rdkingryder/Stuff273.jpg

pete376403

9th March 2009, 22:42

"Buellton - home of split pea soup"? Doesn't sound very exciting.

Big Dave

9th March 2009, 22:43

"Buellton - home of split pea soup"? Doesn't sound very exciting.

Lot of wind maybe.

trustme

10th March 2009, 06:45

I have nothing worth grumbling about and enjoy an enviable standard of living.

But you've had to work for it Dave , all those years of effort & application with no handouts or freebies, all that work & time wasted on furthering your career & bettering yourself when you could have been sitting at home on your lazy fat arse having a fucking good snivel
Have a good grumble , go on, you've earnt it.

:hug::hug::hug:

vtec

10th March 2009, 08:21

Sorry buddy, but you're way off the mark there.

In general terms, share prices reflect the expected financial performance for a listed entity. This means that the share prices tend to run about 12-18 months ahead of the entity's financial reporting. If you think about this it does make sense - investors buy shares because they expect the company to do better in the future (and anticipate a rise in the share's value) or they sell shares because they expect the company to do worse in the future (and anticipate a fall in the share's value).

Back in 2007, the market began to realise that problems were coming up and the share prices dropped in expectation of lowered financial performance. It isn't a conspiracy.

That's exactly what I'm saying. Damn it. The market knew it was happening. But the media was keeping it quiet.

Finn

10th March 2009, 08:31

please add to it or point out any flaws ....

Stephem

To answer your thread subject, no I'm not struggling. The reason for this is quite simple. I don't expect anything on a plate and I'm not at all afraid of hard work.

When the seasons permit, I hunt and gather. What is surplus, I put aside for a rainy day. I protect my gatherings with a good tax accountant to ensure my hard work is not stolen from me and given to fat lazy cunts.

vtec

10th March 2009, 08:34

I didnt realise then Police were trying to earn money for solving crime
You been burgled or had a vehicle or property stolen or vandalised? Have you been issued a ticket for any reason?

this scheme was set up by the labour government but if it had dropped in value it will be only over the last year or so
Yes

i beleive that is the real function of a bank...to make money for their shareholders
Again, yes. It's just how much money they are making for their shareholders from every transaction. Working as a bicycle courier opened my eyes to how fat laden these companies are. Cause i deliver to individual people. I'd say that 20% of the office space in town goes to banks. For instance ANZ Tower, is mostly full of bank staff, there's also lawyers there too. Same with Phillips Fox Tower, and The National bank towers on the corner of Victoria and Queen St, Westpac has lots of floors in the PwC Tower down on the Waterfront, plus more offices in other buildings along the waterfront. The ASB and Commbank hold many of the floors in The 135 Albert St tower. These buildings aren't even the IT Hubs or call centres for these banks. There are countless middle managers, marketers, executives, who mostly don't achieve anything, yet are paid far more than the average populace. This has become one of the most burdonsome leech on the populace. Not to mention having to support the shareholders investment aswell. Let's hope Kiwibank isn't run as obese as these other banks.

Big Dave

10th March 2009, 08:52

In the context of the OP - struggling could mean Tokyo.

http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,25161993-5006003,00.html

Oscar

10th March 2009, 09:05

Again, yes. It's just how much money they are making for their shareholders from every transaction. Working as a bicycle courier opened my eyes to how fat laden these companies are. Cause i deliver to individual people. I'd say that 20% of the office space in town goes to banks. For instance ANZ Tower, is mostly full of bank staff, there's also lawyers there too. Same with Phillips Fox Tower, and The National bank towers on the corner of Victoria and Queen St, Westpac has lots of floors in the PwC Tower down on the Waterfront, plus more offices in other buildings along the waterfront. The ASB and Commbank hold many of the floors in The 135 Albert St tower. These buildings aren't even the IT Hubs or call centres for these banks. There are countless middle managers, marketers, executives, who mostly don't achieve anything, yet are paid far more than the average populace. This has become one of the most burdonsome leech on the populace. Not to mention having to support the shareholders investment aswell. Let's hope Kiwibank isn't run as obese as these other banks.

So as a Bicycle Courier, and by dint of the fact that you occasionally visit their offices, you're qualified to comment on Bank Management?

How do you know that these people "..mostly don't achieve anything..", or indeed how much they are paid? The only burdensome leeches on the population are first time callers and conspiracy theorists such as yourself who run off at the mouth about subjects that they only barely comprehend.

Talk to your Therapist about increasing the dosage.

Big Dave

10th March 2009, 09:11

[quote=trustme;1973050]
Have a good grumble , go on, you've earnt it.
/quote]

Complaining is soft. Don't complain. HTFU.

How's that?

Big Dave

10th March 2009, 09:14

And another thing - there should be a comma between fat and lazy.

Finn

10th March 2009, 09:17

And another thing - there should be a comma between fat and lazy.

There was but they ate it.

vtec

10th March 2009, 09:24

So as a Bicycle Courier, and by dint of the fact that you occasionally visit their offices, you're qualified to comment on Bank Management?

How do you know that these people "..mostly don't achieve anything..", or indeed how much they are paid? The only burdensome leeches on the population are first time callers and conspiracy theorists such as yourself who run off at the mouth about subjects that they only barely comprehend.

Talk to your Therapist about increasing the dosage.

Haha, nice. Working as a bicycle courier has given me a broad view of a lot of things, as has living and working the corporate lifestyle in Australia last year. I speak to lots of people all day, and I see everything in town. How is someone who runs their mouth off (or as I would call it, discussing) a leech? Your logic is broken again.

I'm very aware that most cubicle jockeys are unproductive as are most middle and even upper managers, and a very recent invention... most. A good friend of mine worked for Telecom until recently, one would describe it as a hell hole of cubicles and middle managers trying to justify their positions by making and enforcing pointless rules, and hiding behind the computer screen 90% of the time.

What do you do for a living? How old are you? What am I not comprehending? So far I've adressed every one of your queries about my theories.

I don't have a therapist. What would you diagnose me with that requires one?

Have a read of this: http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article9316.html
And what happens in the US very obviously affects us here.

Oscar

10th March 2009, 09:49

Haha, nice. Working as a bicycle courier has given me a broad view of a lot of things, as has living and working the corporate lifestyle in Australia last year. I speak to lots of people all day, and I see everything in town. How is someone who runs their mouth off (or as I would call it, discussing) a leech? Your logic is broken again.

I'm very aware that most cubicle jockeys are unproductive as are most middle and even upper managers, and a very recent invention... most.

What do you do for a living? How old are you? What am I not comprehending? So far I've adressed every one of your queries about my theories.

I don't have a therapist. What would you diagnose me with that requires one?

Nuthin' broken about my logic.
If middle managers are leeches because they don't do anything, then first time callers and malcontents such as yourself are also leeches because they suck the optimism out of the rest of us, causing attacks of ennui and lethargy, thereby ruining the economy.

Ergo, it's Talkback Radio that's ruining this country.

A therapist is anyone that gives you therapy. Therefore it can include Psychologists, Psychiatrists or in your case, the Asylum Intern.

Oscar

10th March 2009, 09:53

And what happens in the US very obviously affects us here.

This is the first cogent remark you have made, however it is a little obvious.
So obvious in fact, it hovers between "Wife" and "Mother-in-law" on the Sybil Fawlty Bleeding Obvious Remarks Scale .

Forest

10th March 2009, 09:54

That's exactly what I'm saying. Damn it. The market knew it was happening. But the media was keeping it quiet.

Sorry. I must have misunderstood.

FWIW the traditional media cannot by definition report on something until after it has happened, so news reporting always occurs after the fact.

Oscar

10th March 2009, 09:57

Sorry. I must have misunderstood.

FWIW the traditional media cannot by definition report on something until after it has happened, so news reporting always occurs after the fact.

Nah, what he's saying is that the media were/are suppressing the story.
God knows why he'd think that, when a google search would say otherwise.

vtec

10th March 2009, 11:11

Nuthin' broken about my logic.
If middle managers are leeches because they don't do anything, then first time callers and malcontents such as yourself are also leeches because they suck the optimism out of the rest of us, causing attacks of ennui and lethargy, thereby ruining the economy.

Ergo, it's Talkback Radio that's ruining this country.

A therapist is anyone that gives you therapy. Therefore it can include Psychologists, Psychiatrists or in your case, the Asylum Intern.

Someone highlighting the problems is a leech. Alright then. I'm responsible for lethargy? I blame the current system as responsible for that, sucking the need and desire and worth out of being productive.

I don't listen to talkback.

How does a google search show that the media keeps the public well informed about the welfare of the economy and the world. The media's first responsibility seems to be to the powers that be, or their funders. Which is to keep the populace ignorant of the reality that they are getting shafted.

People like you are the problem, you've possibly done alright out of the system and so are happy to keep the status quo. You're coming across like a baby boomer (are you not?) who've had the best economic run in history due to economic tinkering by governments that have forestalled any little economic bushfires (ie. deflation) at the cost of a huge economic firestorm that we are witnessing now, due to government aided financialisation of society, due to a massive fall in productive enterprise, due to the credit built economic bubble.

Oscar

10th March 2009, 11:17

Someone highlighting the problems is a leech. Alright then. I'm responsible for lethargy? I blame the current system as responsible for that, sucking the need and desire and worth out of being productive.

I don't listen to talkback.

How does a google search show that the media keeps the public well informed about the welfare of the economy and the world. The media's first responsibility seems to be to the powers that be, or their funders. Which is to keep the populace ignorant of the reality that they are getting shafted.

People like you are the problem, you've possibly done alright out of the system and so are happy to keep the status quo. You're coming across like a baby boomer (are you not?) who've had the best economic run in history due to economic tinkering by governments that have forestalled any little economic bushfires (ie. deflation) at the cost of a huge economic firestorm that we are witnessing now, due to government aided financialisation of society, due to a massive fall in productive enterprise, due to the credit built economic bubble.

You're not highlighting problems.
You're highlighting your own frustrations and jealousy.
Very little you've said here is fact, merely your own opinion.

You must get very tired jumping to all those conclusions.

Grahameeboy

10th March 2009, 11:21

vtec

10th March 2009, 11:26

You're not highlighting problems.
You're highlighting your own frustrations and jealousy.
Very little you've said here is fact, merely your own opinion.

You must get very tired jumping to all those conclusions.

I'm not jealous at all, I'm about to go on an overseas adventure to San Fran and South America, I don't have a property crashing in value, I haven't lost anything in this crisis, in fact I'm currently invested in gold. I just don't like seeing hardworking people getting shafted. So what do you do for a living, that I've obviously offended you? How old are you, guessing I'm spot on with the baby boomer guess, also guessing I'm accurate about you being a cubicle jockey?

You say there aren't problems... head and sand again. And yes this is definitely a frustration i have, and a symptom of boomer priviledge.

Please correct me, I don't want to jump to any conclusions.

NZ is a great place to live, but Aucklands been going downhill since I was a kid.

Oscar

10th March 2009, 11:30

I'm not jealous at all, I don't have a property crashing in value, I haven't lost anything in this crisis, in fact I'm currently invested in gold. I just don't like seeing hardworking people getting shafted. So what do you do for a living, that I've obviously offended you? How old are you, guessing I'm spot on with the baby boomer guess, also guessing I'm accurate about you being a cubicle jockey?

Please correct me, I don't want to jump to any conclusions.

Actually I am technically in year one of Gen X and I work from home.

You haven't offended me, but if you like try this: go back in this thread and delete every comment that you can't actually prove. I'm guessing there won't be much left..

Grahameeboy

10th March 2009, 11:32

Grahameeboy

10th March 2009, 11:32

I'm not jealous at all, I'm about to go on an overseas adventure to San Fran and South America, I don't have a property crashing in value, I haven't lost anything in this crisis, in fact I'm currently invested in gold. I just don't like seeing hardworking people getting shafted. So what do you do for a living, that I've obviously offended you? How old are you, guessing I'm spot on with the baby boomer guess, also guessing I'm accurate about you being a cubicle jockey?

You say there aren't problems... head and sand again. And yes this is definitely a frustration i have, and a symptom of boomer priviledge.

Please correct me, I don't want to jump to any conclusions.

NZ is a great place to live, but Aucklands been going downhill since I was a kid.

Why is Auckland going downhill?

vtec

10th March 2009, 11:34

Actually I am technically in year one of Gen X and I work from home.

You haven't offended me, but if you like try this: go back in this thread and delete every comment that you can't actually prove. I'm guessing there won't be much left..

Ok, you want to silence me, I must really have touched a cord with you. There is overlaps in the generations obviously. It's not a perfect science. And the generation descriptions are very general. But you are classic boomer by your mentality.

All my posts stand. Sorry. I addressed all of your queries quite well I thought.

Here's some good information about the baby boomers. http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article8800.html

Grahameeboy

10th March 2009, 11:36

idb

10th March 2009, 11:38

I'm a baby boomer, white, middle class, I work at a desk mostly, own a house and 2.4 motorbikes.
Oh yes, life is good, I'm sitting pretty...mwahahahahahaaaaa!!!

Sometimes, at home, I look over the wall at the poor people pushing their old prams and shopping carts up and down the streets picking up cigarette butts and checking in the rubbish bins and I think to myself..."I'm never looking out there again, it's too depressing!!"
I wish you poor people would just smile once in a while, it would make life a lot more pleasant for everyone!

vtec

10th March 2009, 11:42

Why is Auckland going downhill?

Crime, poverty, violence, cost of living, peoples attitudes, local government, work ethic, big box monopolies destroying regular mainstreet outlets, alcoholism and drug usage. These are some of the symptoms, I feel I've been outlining a fair few of the causes.

Grahameeboy

10th March 2009, 11:48

Crime, poverty, cost of living, peoples attitudes, local government, work ethic, big box monopolies destroying regular mainstreet outlets, alcoholism and drug usage. These are some of the symptoms, I feel I've been outlining a fair few of the causes.

Have you been to New York, Orlando...in fact most big Cities in the US...maybe you should spend a week (if you make it that long) in St Paul's, Bristol....for starters....maybe you should try Zimbabwee...UK has one of the highest rates of child poverty in the world....how do you think the Aborigines in Australia feel about life...the list is endless and makes NZ a paradise in comparison...

We coud go back through the ages and realise that we are still better off....I am sure my ancestor's did not enjoy the Vikings raiding their village in the morning.

Sorry geezer....yes you are entitled to feel the way you do...however, before you start barrating NZ (as many insular Kiwi's do)...look out the window

Skyryder

10th March 2009, 11:55

Mallard's been in Parliament since what? 1984?
The best you can do is someone who worked as a teacher a generation ago?
Gimme a break.

The reason that losers like you complain about people like Key is very simple.
Jealousy.
Not just the wealth, but the power and the popular support.

Key took the working man off labour (maybe not forever, but for the election day), and he took Maori off of Labour.
He killed off the undead that is Winston Peters.
He made the Greens irrelevant and even sidelined Peter Dunne.

And he did that in the time it takes a Labour Cabinet to decide if they should have a committee to study if the tea breaks should include plain or fancy biscuits.

You asked for one.............period. Now you complain.

You make assumptions as regards too jealousy. It's the typical response as this can never be disproved. It's a putdown used when there is no alternitive arguement.

Yes Key has the popular support of NZ on this I have never made a statement to the contrary. how long it will take4 NZ to wake up to be truthful I realy don't know. But one thing is certain..............they will one day.....................sooner or later the wolf casts aside his sheep's clothing and gobble up those that let him in the paddack suchas yourself. . I fear by then it may be too late.

Skyryder

Finn

10th March 2009, 12:09

how long it will take4 NZ to wake up to be truthful I realy don't know.

Skyryder

It took 9 years last time but it really depends on what your definition of truth is Skyryder. You prefer to live in a welfare state with the Government making decisions for you but the majority us are a little more ambitious than that.

Grahameeboy

10th March 2009, 12:09

You asked for one.............period. Now you complain.

You make assumptions as regards too jealousy. It's the typical response as this can never be disproved. It's a putdown used when there is no alternitive arguement.

Yes Key has the popular support of NZ on this I have never made a statement to the contrary. how long it will take4 NZ to wake up to be truthful I realy don't know. But one thing is certain..............they will one day.....................sooner or later the wolf casts aside his sheep's clothing and gobble up those that let him in the paddack suchas yourself. . I fear by then it may be too late.

Skyryder

Be positive.............not wishing to turn this into a religious thread but one thing about being a follower of Jesus is that I enjoy NZ....

Finn

10th March 2009, 12:13

Be positive.............not wishing to turn this into a religious thread but one thing about being a follower of Jesus is that I enjoy NZ....

GB, he hasn't been here since the late 1700's when he visited the Maori's. His last words to them were, "Stay here and do nothing until I return."

idb

10th March 2009, 12:13

Be positive.............not wishing to turn this into a religious thread but one thing about being a follower of Jesus is that I enjoy NZ....

He works in mysterious ways...but at least he works!!!

Grahameeboy

10th March 2009, 12:14

It took 9 years last time but it really depends on what your definition of truth is Skyryder. You prefer to live in a welfare state with the Government making decisions for you but the majority us are a little more ambitious than that.

9 years is a mere pin prick....I can never understand all this stuff about the Govt making decisions for us...maybe I am not as ambitious as you because I have a different slant on life...not knocking you Finn but you do allright in the whole scheme of things yet I hear you complain a lot...I don't feel that the Govt runs my life and in fact I like the challenge of hardship....life would be boring otherwise...and please reply with something other than a gay tinge

Grahameeboy

10th March 2009, 12:14

He works in mysterious ways...but at least he works!!!

Indeed.....................

Grahameeboy

10th March 2009, 12:15

GB, he hasn't been here since the late 1700's when he visited the Maori's. His last words to them were, "Stay here and do nothing until I return."

Well you made me laugh........

Finn

10th March 2009, 12:16

9 years is a mere pin prick....

Don't call me a prick, fag. ;)

Grahameeboy

10th March 2009, 12:17

Don't call me a prick, fag. ;)

Will you please stop making me laugh......

Brian d marge

10th March 2009, 12:47

In the context of the OP - struggling could mean Tokyo.

http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,25161993-5006003,00.html

heres your on the spot reporter LIVE from Tokyo.... its cheaper than chch to live in ....my rent is 1/4 of my income ...

went out Sunday night ,,,to a bbq place, ate nearly a whole cow, a1/2 bottle of whiskey , and or 3 bottles of beer ,,,,,500ml

3500 yen ( a bottle of Scottish single malt ,,is only 50 dollars ) ... last week we went out and between the 4 of us we ate and drank 600 dollars of beer and cow and roast chicken ,,,( thank &'(() the company paid for that one !!!)

Earning Japanese money and living in Japan ...it can say is quite cheap ..

Stephen

ps... if you try and trade a currency that isnt worth anything ,,,then yes it seems expensive ,,, 3500 is about 70 dollars

Finn

10th March 2009, 13:22

However folks, despite the high cost of living, it still remains very popular.

Brian d marge

10th March 2009, 13:33

Please read the doc I posted , even if it is skim read.. At NO POINT do I say conspiricy , It was a response to market conditions

it was a BAD series of decitions made by a few people. WHICH could have been different ,,( Australia )

The BIGGEST problem is the do nothing attitude of NZ people that allow small interest groups to push through their ideas , at the expense of Joe Plumber.

YES , if the Govenment runs a state owned organisation , history has proved that is isnt as well run as privcate BECAUSE the managers are NOT HELD ACCOUNTABLE

Now the recient sacking of the head of a dept because he didnt have the confidence oof the minister , COULD BE a good thing ... finally some people are being held to account

OR ...the thing is going to be privatised and the guy didnt agree with it .....

Waving a magic wand here ,,,,, lets say I become El douche ( any puts bag after that and i ll send the boys round !)

I would buy back ( actually why buy when I run the place ,,, piss off or we shoot !!!:Playnice:) all the utilities , gas electricity , health

install a CEO ( renamed a minister of health ) and a board of Directors ... they get a civil servant pay ... ( a nicce little earner for them , everyone must get something )

Then with th use of lapttops and computers ...the structure is ... minister , assistant//2 accountants ....., head of hospital , head of nurse/doctors ..matron ... paitient .

get more indian back on the shop floor and get rid off the chiefs ..... Middle managers dont cure sick people ,,,doctors do ,,,,

I would free up areas . ( or allow urban area to be redeveloped to allow affordable housing ,,,)

feed and house NZ first ,,,pay overseas second ....... Why do I have to borrow money from Australia to biuld my house here in NZ ....we grow the trees and produce preety much all the stuff required , and NZ tradesmen ( I still think they are pretty good ) ...

Dont worry if something s good and overseas money see a chance to make money ,..they will come ...even though 51% of the money will stay here ....

oh and I will revive the car indusrty ... I will brind back the most ECO car I can thing of ,,see photos ..Mine ( being El douce') is the streched limo version ....

Trust me ..it will work .....

Stephen

on a more serious note if NZ people actually had some political balls , and realised its not national/Labour/social credit ...but ouside interest stuffing NZ up ...Total protectionism doent work , we have seen that ...niether does a lasse fair free trade .
ther is a middle ground ......

Brian d marge

10th March 2009, 13:34

However folks, despite the high cost of living, it still remains very popular.

there is a reason......

Finn

10th March 2009, 13:36

there is a reason......

You no risten. I meant "living" remains very popular.

Big Dave

10th March 2009, 13:36

Earning Japanese money and living in Japan ...it can say is quite cheap ..

I too have worked in Japan, Taiwan and Korea - and for my lifestyle - disagree.

MisterD

10th March 2009, 13:57

Hell yeah...how much for a house on 400sqm 8k's from the centre of the commercial capital? Mine cost me the same as a 1-bedroom flat just outside the North Circular in London...

Brian d marge

10th March 2009, 14:07

You no risten. I meant "living" remains very popular.

aint that living????

Stephen

Brian d marge

10th March 2009, 14:08

I too have worked in Japan, Taiwan and Korea - and for my lifestyle - disagree.

what an earth do you get up to?????

Stephen

Finn

10th March 2009, 14:11

what an earth do you get up to?????

Stephen

He was in the army.

Brian d marge

10th March 2009, 14:14

He was in the army.

I just fly direct now , Island hopping can be an expensive way to get somewhere ... then there is shore leave .......( they may only be $ 2 , even for a long time ) ,, but those $ 2 mount up ....

Stephen

Oscar

10th March 2009, 14:23

Ok, you want to silence me, I must really have touched a cord with you. There is overlaps in the generations obviously. It's not a perfect science. And the generation descriptions are very general. But you are classic boomer by your mentality.

All my posts stand. Sorry. I addressed all of your queries quite well I thought.

Here's some good information about the baby boomers. http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article8800.html

Who said I wanted to silence you?
I asked you to prove some of your assumptions.
For example, let's go back to what you said about middle level management in banks. Please elucidate on your comments.

Try expressing something in your own words.

Oscar

10th March 2009, 14:29

You asked for one.............period. Now you complain.

You make assumptions as regards too jealousy. It's the typical response as this can never be disproved. It's a putdown used when there is no alternitive arguement.

Yes Key has the popular support of NZ on this I have never made a statement to the contrary. how long it will take4 NZ to wake up to be truthful I realy don't know. But one thing is certain..............they will one day.....................sooner or later the wolf casts aside his sheep's clothing and gobble up those that let him in the paddack suchas yourself. . I fear by then it may be too late.

Skyryder

Oh, aren't we being pedantic.

Speaking of arguments and putdowns etc, I note a complete lack of substance in your posts. In this one you crap on about waking up to the truth.

What truth?

You have one piece of evidence in respect of Key fucking up on an investment disclosure. What else has the man done?

Big Dave

10th March 2009, 14:44

what an earth do you get up to?????

Stephen

Steak. Big, thick juicy steaks.

And other things :whistle:

Whiskey-hi was a fave.

vtec

10th March 2009, 15:01

Who said I wanted to silence you?
I asked you to prove some of your assumptions.
For example, let's go back to what you said about middle level management in banks. Please elucidate on your comments.

Try expressing something in your own words.

You wanted me to delete my posts, because you felt that I had no evidence. That seems like you want to silence me. Yet you fail to be specific about what evidence I am lacking. Proof means evidence beyond reasonable doubt, evidence can be experiential, observational and come in many other forms.

I've broken stuff down for you pretty simple Oscar, but you're either obtuse or stupid.

What would you like to know about middle management? Send me a pm, cause otherwise we're going to fill this thread up with bickering.

And I do suggest you read that link from market oracle. There is some truly enlightening stuff on there. It's a lot of words I know, but could give you some insight into what might be coming soon. There's pictures often aswell.

Here's a beaut about the systemic failure of capitalism and collapse of the real (productive) economy. http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article9222.html

Oscar

10th March 2009, 15:23

You wanted me to delete my posts, because you felt that I had no evidence. That seems like you want to silence me. Yet you fail to be specific about what evidence I am lacking. Proof means evidence beyond reasonable doubt, evidence can be experiential, observational and come in many other forms.

I've broken stuff down for you pretty simple Oscar, but you're either obtuse or stupid.

What would you like to know about middle management? Send me a pm, cause otherwise we're going to fill this thread up with bickering.

And I do suggest you read that link from market oracle. There is some truly enlightening stuff on there. It's a lot of words I know, but could give you some insight into what might be coming soon. There's pictures often aswell.

Here's a beaut about the systemic failure of capitalism and collapse of the real (productive) economy. http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article9222.html

Before you go calling me stupid, I suggest you look up the definitions of the words "fact", "evidence" and "opinion". What you've posted so far are opinions based on your own limited observations, and it appears you have nothing factual to present as evidence.

I didn't ask you to delete your posts, I asked you to substantiate the information in them.
Asking you to present a scintilla of fact makes me neither stupid nor obtuse. Far from silencing you, I'd like to hear what you have to say, not unsubstantiated claims or links to websites.

So why would I discuss your regurgitated half baked opinions by PM?
You made your assertions in the thread, and those claims are related to the thread subject so prove them.

Why does insurance make criminals of us all?
Why are banking middle management so bad?
You say: "...nearly all of the banks the world over are insolvent." Are they? Who told you this - do you have facts?
You also said: "...90% of tertiary qualifications will get you into jobs where you have survival earnings." Really? Where was that published?

vtec

10th March 2009, 15:51

[1]Why does insurance make criminals of us all?
[2]Why are banking middle management so bad?
[3]You say: "...nearly all of the banks the world over are insolvent." Are they? Who told you this - do you have facts?
[4]You also said: "...90% of tertiary qualifications will get you into jobs where you have survival earnings." Really? Where was that published?

These are only small parts of my argument, some of which you have obviously misinterpreted.
1) Don't know how you came to that. I said insurance is one of society's evils. And i went into quite a lot of depth to explain why I think back on page 2. If you didn't understand it you either didn't read my response then or you're in the cognitive dissonance mental stage.

2) Middle management are very often completely unnecessary and a result of bloated companies (and leech like in character), and they often create rules and do unnecessary things to make themselves feel that they are needed, this isn't bank specific, and is only one of many areas in society where there is waste... have you seen "the office"? It is like that just not so funny. But looking through the countless staff lists on the different floors where I delivered to, and seeing the people's names and their job titles it was pretty obvious that banks are full to bursting of this same excess, I was thinking of Telecom and when I worked for Compaqcare computer repairs. I wish I had taken a photo of a couple of the lists of people's names and job titles... Hilarious.

3) Banks insolvent due to derivatives. I don't know which ones exactly but their sure as hell not going to tell you until it's all over. Derivatives market in excess of $500 trillion dollars. That much money doesn't exist, and this is the true bubble bursting that bought down the economy (via the banks) many more to fail. http://larouchepac.com/news/2008/10/09/derivatives-hyperinflationary-bomb-crushing-international-fi.html - nices short one for you from October last year. These people were telling me in Jan 08 that it was all about to explode, they've got an active group on a university campus near Heidelberg in Melbourne that I went to a couple of times.

4) This is opinion from talking to many graduates, ie. experiential evidence. You only start to make money once you've been in a company for years, and have outlasted the directors which may or may not happen. Yet you are required to get tertiary qualifications for just about any job these days, at which point (in NZ) you will be lucky to get $40k (how would you buy a property to live in, or support a family on that salary?), which might go up at 2-5% per annum (which recently hasn't covered the REAL inflation figures) until you make a breakthrough into being a partner in a company or working for yourself.

Now explain to me why there has been such a mass exodus from NZ of graduates?
What bank are you with?
Had you read the marketoracle links that I'd put up as references?

Oscar

10th March 2009, 16:12

These are only small parts of my argument, some of which you have obviously misinterpreted.
1) Don't know how you came to that. I said insurance is one of society's evils. And i went into quite a lot of depth to explain why I think back on page 2. If you didn't understand it you either didn't read my response then or you're in the cognitive dissonance mental stage.

You said insurance increases the crime rate.
Prove it.

2) Middle management are very often completely unnecessary and a result of bloated companies (and leech like in character), and they often create rules and do unnecessary things to make themselves feel that they are needed, this isn't bank specific, and is only one of many areas in society where there is waste... have you seen "the office"? It is like that just not so funny. But looking through the countless staff lists on the different floors where I delivered to, and seeing the people's names and their job titles it was pretty obvious that banks are full to bursting of this same excess, I was thinking of Telecom and when I worked for Compaqcare computer repairs. I wish I had taken a photo of a couple of the lists of people's names and job titles... Hilarious.

So you haven't got any facts or figures.
In fact, you confuse TV comedy with real life (if you have one).

3) Banks insolvent due to derivatives. I don't know which ones exactly but their sure as hell not going to tell you until it's all over. Derivatives market in excess of $500 trillion dollars. That much money doesn't exist, and this is the true bubble bursting that bought down the economy (via the banks) many more to fail. http://larouchepac.com/news/2008/10/09/derivatives-hyperinflationary-bomb-crushing-international-fi.html - nices short one for you from October last year. These people were telling me in Jan 08 that it was all about to explode, they've got an active group on a university campus near Heidelberg in Melbourne that I went to a couple of times.

That doesn't make 90% of all banks insolvent.
You remind me of the old saying "..89.9% of all statistics are made up on the spot...and that's up 5% from last year.."

4) This is opinion from talking to many graduates, ie. experiential evidence. You only start to make money once you've been in a company for years, and have outlasted the directors which may or may not happen. Yet you are required to get tertiary qualifications for just about any job these days, at which point (in NZ) you will be lucky to get $40k (how would you buy a property to live in, or support a family on that salary?), which might go up at 2-5% per annum (which recently hasn't covered the REAL inflation figures) until you make a breakthrough into being a partner in a company or working for yourself.

So when you said "..90% of tertiary qualifications will get you into jobs where you have survival earnings.." you had no proof either?

And what degree have you got that allows you to earn 40k? Bone carving?
My assistant makes more than that and she's only 22 with no degree.

Now explain to me why there has been such a mass exodus from NZ of graduates?
What bank are you with?
Had you read the marketoracle links that I'd put up as references?

I have no idea why or even if this "mass exodus" exists.
Do you have any figures on how many recent graduates leave?
Can you differentiate between a graduate leaving on his/her OE, and one fleeing the grinding poverty of NZ?

I'm not with a bank, and I have looked at your website.
The site doesn't seem to provide any evidence for your assertions though.

My conclusion therefore is that you're a whinger, a gullible whinger with little life experience and a penchant for conspiracy theories.

vtec

10th March 2009, 16:33

You said insurance increases the crime rate.
Prove it.

So you haven't got any facts or figures.
In fact, you confuse TV comedy with real life (if you have one).

That doesn't make 90% of all banks insolvent.
You remind me of the old saying "..89.9% of all statistics are made up on the spot...and that's up 5% from last year.."

So when you said "..90% of tertiary qualifications will get you into jobs where you have survival earnings.." you had no proof either?

And what degree have you got that allows you to earn 40k? Bone carving?
My assistant makes more than that and she's only 22 with no degree.

I have no idea why or even if this "mass exodus" exists.
Do you have any figures on how many recent graduates leave?
Can you differentiate between a graduate leaving on his/her OE, and one fleeing the grinding poverty of NZ?

I'm not with a bank, and I have looked at your website.
The site doesn't seem to provide any evidence for your assertions though.

My conclusion therefore is that you're a whinger, a gullible whinger with little life experience and a penchant for conspiracy theories.

Here's one example of the exodus, was the first thing I found when i searched google for you. http://www.cmaj.ca/cgi/content/full/164/1/80-b
I was going from my numerous friends and even family who've left once qualified. I'm not going to stay in NZ to make money... there's none here in productive enterprise apart from in farming, health and construction (and I'm tired of construction).

give it a year and you'll see many more banks start to break or get bailed (hopefully not bailed though).

My conclusion is you're a boomer happy with the status quo despite it's failings and massive inequities and subsequent poverty for the working class... because you're doing OK, good for you. That's really looking out for the common good.

I've asked about 3 times what bank you are with that provides free to $10 international money transfers, I'm genuinely interested.

Just because you're unaware of the normal pay rates in this country, doesn't mean that I'm wrong. She's unqualified and in a job earning more than $40k? Maybe she's been at it for a long time? Or maybe she must be like one of the many token stunning administrators/PA's/receptionists that I see the lawyers and accountants hiring, for their looks.

Hey well the credit derivatives crash which took down the multibillion dollar investment banks like Lehman Bro's and Bear Sterns etc, turned out to be a bit more than just a conspiracy theory. I was struggling to believe it before I started seeing it happening. Give it another year, and then see where you are. Actually no, then the banks should be looking like seriously cheap investments, now's your time to dive right in.

You'd be amazed what you hear in office building elevators when you spend as much time in them as I have. People aren't concerned about their work, they're only concerned about politics in the office, and trying to sound all managerial "moving forward". Why, because they're not doing anything productive.

What do you do for a living? You know what I've been up to. Can I get both my questions answered since I've been busy answering heaps of yours.

Here's another article about economic depression. http://majorityrights.com/index.php/weblog/comments/depression_wealth_and_moral_depravity/

Go the boomers.

Oscar

10th March 2009, 16:36

Here's one example of the exodus, was the first thing I found when i searched google for you. http://www.cmaj.ca/cgi/content/full/164/1/80-b
I was going from my numerous friends and even family who've left once qualified. I'm not going to stay in NZ to make money... there's none here in productive enterprise apart from in farming, health and construction (and I'm tired of construction).

give it a year and you'll see many more banks start to break or get bailed (hopefully not bailed though).

My conclusion is you're a boomer happy with the status quo despite it's failings and massive inequities and subsequent poverty for the working class... because you're doing OK, good for you. That's really looking out for the common good.

I've asked about 3 times what bank you are with that provides free to $10 international money transfers, I'm genuinely interested.

Just because you're unaware of the normal pay rates in this country, doesn't mean that I'm wrong. She's unqualified and in a job earning more than $40k? Maybe she's been at it for a long time? Or maybe she must be like one of the many token stunning administrators/PA's/receptionists that I see the lawyers and accountants hiring, for their looks.

Hey well the credit derivatives crash which took down the multibillion dollar investment banks like Lehman Bro's and Bear Sterns etc, turned out to be a bit more than just a conspiracy theory. I was struggling to believe it before I started seeing it happening. Give it another year, and then see where you are. Actually no, then the banks should be looking like seriously cheap investments, now's your time to dive right in.

You'd be amazed what you hear in office building elevators when you spend as much time in them as I have. People aren't concerned about their work, they're only concerned about politics in the office, and trying to sound all managerial "moving forward". Why, because they're not doing anything productive.

What do you do for a living? You know what I've been up to. Can I get both my questions answered since I've been busy answering heaps of yours.

Go the boomers.

You've haven't answered one question of mine (in fact they're not some much questions as pleas for information to back up your fevered ravings).

When you asked me which bank I was with I assumed you meant employment. I bank with Westpac.

vtec

10th March 2009, 16:48

You've haven't answered one question of mine (in fact they're not some much questions as pleas for information to back up your fevered ravings).

When you asked me which bank I was with I assumed you meant employment. I bank with Westpac.

Just cause you don't understand doesn't mean my "rantings" haven't been explained. Anyway, I got 1 out of 2 questions answered that time which is pretty good going, so I'll have to look into Westpac and see how their fees are structured.

Got to get ready for a hot date tonight now, hope you learnt something. Take it easy.

Brian d marge

10th March 2009, 17:02

Oh, aren't we being pedantic.

You have one piece of evidence in respect of Key fucking up on an investment disclosure. What else has the man done?

well he has been very economical with the truth esp about past dealing , He had to have known Krieger before ....If he brings good management to the country , fine. but Utilities are the core of a country , they should NOT be in the hands of an outside interest , We all suffer when they are ... ( see last post about accountability )

Stephen.

Oscar

10th March 2009, 17:05

Just cause you don't understand doesn't mean my "rantings" haven't been explained. Anyway, I got 1 out of 2 questions answered that time which is pretty good going, so I'll have to look into Westpac and see how their fees are structured.

Got to get ready for a hot date tonight now, hope you learnt something. Take it easy.

I do understand actually.
You post your opinions, and when challenged on them, refer us to a web site that does not provide any fact either..
When further challenged you resort to ad hominem argument (the boomer thing).

If your 'hot date" has as much substance as your posts here, I warrant your first move involves an air valve...

Oscar

10th March 2009, 17:10

well he has been very economical with the truth esp about past dealing , He had to have known Krieger before ....If he brings good management to the country , fine. but Utilities are the core of a country , they should NOT be in the hands of an outside interest , We all suffer when they are ... ( see last post about accountability )

Stephen.

He looks like a good manager. he runs cabinet like a CEO and seems to have had a golden run in first hundred-odd days. I do worry about the ACT influence though.

Brian d marge

10th March 2009, 17:14

can I interupt ,,,for a moment ,,,
Just read this ,,on the herald of othe news paper ,,,

The first signs of household ''de-leveraging'' have emerged as families spend less and pay down debt to cope with the recession. The latest Reserve Bank data shows the ratio of household debt to disposable income has fallen. In the March quarter it was 162.1%; in the following three months, the ratio plunged to 159.5%.
''I think it's reasonable to say the household sector is de-leveraging,'' said BNZ chief economist, Tony Alexander.

160% ???????????????

dude ,,,,,,, HOPE that includes the morgage!!!!!!!...... per month based including our rent ,,, ours is 60% ..( and thats cause I put a fancy computer on the card !)

it would be zero if the wife had her way !!!

OUCH , if cash is freedom ...... Rollerston is looking Real nice about now

Stephen

Forest

10th March 2009, 17:51

I've asked about 3 times what bank you are with that provides free to $10 international money transfers, I'm genuinely interested.

I get free international wire transfers through my National Bank Private Banking accounts.

In fact I pay no bank fees at all.

Brian d marge

10th March 2009, 18:12

An increase of $32 to the motor vehicle levy was announced today by ACC Minister Nick Smith.
The increase will come into effect from July 1, meaning a licence fee for a petrol car will increase from $136.44 to $168.46, and the ACC petrol levy will rise from 9.34 cents per litre to 9.90 cents per litre.

:gob: :yes: I would be ordering the large tub of arse grease ,,,,,,, or there are specials to Melbourne at the mo

Stephen

davereid

10th March 2009, 19:59

If you don't like it - don't fucking buy it.
It isn't compulsory in this country.
As for tax payers bailing them out: NZ taxpayers haven't paid a bean to an insurer or bank.

New Zealand is full of compulsory insurance.

ACC of course is at the head of the field, but we enjoy a compulsory health insurance system, as well as compulsory superannuation taxation.

And with regard to our banks, its fair and infact undisputable to say that they are ALL inherently insolvent.

In fact, its an essential part of fractional reserve banking.

There are never enough chairs for all the dancers. The current response of (the worlds) government is to insist that the music is still playing, and we still dont need to look for a seat.

Personally, I chose a nice comfy chair much earlier in the year.

I don't much like the current music, so I will stay seated.

Indeed, I may even sign up up the $$ available for staying in the chair, Mr. Key has promised a few bob, if I don't go to work.

I might designate every 2nd Tuesday as "upskilling day". And me and the missus will go fishing.

Oscar

10th March 2009, 21:47

I get free international wire transfers through my National Bank Private Banking accounts.

In fact I pay no bank fees at all.

I got socked a few fees in Yrup 'cause I couldnae be arsed finding the proper ATM. If I could it was either zero or five bucks depending on the account. Otherwise I pay no fees with Westpac.

Oscar

10th March 2009, 21:56

New Zealand is full of compulsory insurance.

ACC of course is at the head of the field, but we enjoy a compulsory health insurance system, as well as compulsory superannuation taxation.

And with regard to our banks, its fair and infact undisputable to say that they are ALL inherently insolvent.

In fact, its an essential part of fractional reserve banking.

There are never enough chairs for all the dancers. The current response of (the worlds) government is to insist that the music is still playing, and we still dont need to look for a seat.

Personally, I chose a nice comfy chair much earlier in the year.

I don't much like the current music, so I will stay seated.

Indeed, I may even sign up up the $$ available for staying in the chair, Mr. Key has promised a few bob, if I don't go to work.

I might designate every 2nd Tuesday as "upskilling day". And me and the missus will go fishing.

I don't think he was including Gummint schemes in his rant. It referred to motor insurance and burglary.

Notwithstanding your definition of solvency, in banking terms the Aussie banks are some of the most solvent on the planet. This makes me smile when I see the Kiwi Bank ad on TV. The situation in NZ presently could have been much worse if we relied on small locally funded banks, or were say dominated by the US banking fraternity.

TLDV8

10th March 2009, 22:11

I
Poverty is the real issue in NZ , all the other stuff we read about stems from poverty , I am not exactly rich here in Japan, but I only work 5 hours a day ,,, more if i feel like it ,, I am at home today with both kids ,,, they get both parents ,,, LOTS of quality time ... I couldn't be happier about that ... ( well I will be when I get my I phone tomorrow ! )

we dont have debt , we can afford to go out when we feel like it , I can play around with bikes ( ok thhe business pays for some of that ) ..... and I have super fast broad band , and some of the wierdest Pron on this planet ! :2thumbsup

I dont want to work over 40 hours a week only to spend more than 60 % in rent / morgage ,,,, then overly priced food etc ..... .

Stephen

I take it you own your home freehold also ?.

.

Brian d marge

10th March 2009, 22:24

I take it you own your home freehold also ?.

.

nope renting ... and should be making plans for retirement ... but I can squeeze a few more bikes in till then

Stephen

Skyryder

11th March 2009, 15:26

You've haven't answered one question of mine (in fact they're not some much questions as pleas for information to back up your fevered ravings).

When you asked me which bank I was with I assumed you meant employment. I bank with Westpac.

Oh please. You bitch and moan when another poster fails to come up to your expectations but look what you do when I go after Key. You are unable to defend him and instead direct your comments at me.

Bit like calling the pot back or is the kettle. Either way if you want some serious answers show that you can give them also.

Skyryder

Oscar

11th March 2009, 16:15

Oh please. You bitch and moan when another poster fails to come up to your expectations but look what you do when I go after Key. You are unable to defend him and instead direct your comments at me.

Bit like calling the pot back or is the kettle. Either way if you want some serious answers show that you can give them also.

Skyryder

You went after Key?
Is that all you got?

Pretty wussy, really...

vtec

15th March 2009, 05:39

I do understand actually.
You post your opinions, and when challenged on them, refer us to a web site that does not provide any fact either..
When further challenged you resort to ad hominem argument (the boomer thing).

If your 'hot date" has as much substance as your posts here, I warrant your first move involves an air valve...

No you very obviously don't understand. As someone with classic boomer syndrome chance are you won't be able to, that's why I pointed out your being a boomer (I actually just guessed it initially). And I have plenty of evidence, it is in the form of experience, observation, and discussion. The fact that I've had green rep from 8 different people in this one thread lends me to believe that I'm on to something. Either that or there's just tonnes of other "whiners" out there aswell (do I also need to point out that not everyone who agrees with me is going to use the reputation system). You are definitely in the minority Oscar.

I haven't gone and collected references for everything I've bitched about on here, because I can't be bothered, I'm on holiday in the States at the moment. Should give me further interesting insight into the issues, however, I won't be collecting rock samples or whatever to provide for evidence on the KB forums.

You need to open your eyes more. And if you had read anything off marketoracle.org with an open, non-boomer mind you would also understand.

Oscar

15th March 2009, 19:02

No you very obviously don't understand. As someone with classic boomer syndrome chance are you won't be able to, that's why I pointed out your being a boomer (I actually just guessed it initially). And I have plenty of evidence, it is in the form of experience, observation, and discussion. The fact that I've had green rep from 8 different people in this one thread lends me to believe that I'm on to something. Either that or there's just tonnes of other "whiners" out there aswell (do I also need to point out that not everyone who agrees with me is going to use the reputation system). You are definitely in the minority Oscar.

I haven't gone and collected references for everything I've bitched about on here, because I can't be bothered, I'm on holiday in the States at the moment. Should give me further interesting insight into the issues, however, I won't be collecting rock samples or whatever to provide for evidence on the KB forums.

You need to open your eyes more. And if you had read anything off marketoracle.org with an open, non-boomer mind you would also understand.

Are you being consciously funny?
If so it's brilliant.

How can you tell my politics or if I'm gonna understand your half-arsed web site based on when I was born? If yer going to try and predict how I think, surely where I was born (and I wasn't born in NZ) and my ethnic background counts at least as much?

Basically you posted some opinions (and most of them weren't even your own).
Please get an adult to tell you the difference between a fact and an opinion.

Oh, and green rep?
What does that prove?
That there are other half arsed social credit conspiracy theorists on KB?
What a shock...:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh: