Opposed-piston, opposed-cylinder engine

[Slyer]

http://engineeringtv.com/blogs/etv/archive/2008/07/01/opposed-piston-opposed-cylinder-engine.aspx
Very interesting. Have people tried things like this before?

[CookMySock]

One of the old truck engines (TS3) had two opposing pistons in one combustion chamber. They ran six pistons in three combustion chambers, countilevered onto a single crankshaft (I think). They were two stroke with a big rootes supercharger. They were widely respected as a powerful lightweight engine, and had a mean sound to them, especially with the exhaust off. Not a patch on todays modern truck engines of course.

Steve

[BMWST?]

some of the old steam engines in ships used that design too

[Ixion]

Come back Dr Fred, we need you. It's as old as the industry , and older.

I think the engine DB referred to is the Napier Deltic. Ask Mr Motu about that it's one of his favourites.

[DangerMice]

It's been a few years and my memory is fuzzy, but isn't there something similar at MOTAT? In same hall as the vintage cars?

[CookMySock]

I think the engine DB referred to is the Napier Deltic. Ask Mr Motu about that it's one of his favourites.no no, the Deltic was another two-stroke engine - often used in patrol boats and locomotives. The Deltic was a spectaularly beautiful engine to listen to.

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/gBkQQftn-AM&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/gBkQQftn-AM&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBkQQftn-AM

Steve

[Bass]

Come back Dr Fred, we need you. It's as old as the industry , and older.

I think the engine DB referred to is the Napier Deltic. Ask Mr Motu about that it's one of his favourites.

Actually, if he's including levers in there, isn't it more likely to be a Commer?
The Deltic (magnificent beast) avoided levers by having the cranks at the corners IIRC.

[CookMySock]

Actually, if he's including levers in there, isn't it more likely to be a Commer?Yes it was the commer TS3.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfKmkitnqQY

[JMemonic]

Interesting find, isnt it great when they revive older ideas and use modern machining and technology to produce something.

[Bass]

Yes it was the commer TS3.



Two Stroke x 3 cylinder maybe?

[Laava]

Commer Knocker they nick-named it I think. It sounded awesome!

[Motu]

I think you will find all opposed piston engines are 2 stroke diesels...although with direct injection a 2 stroke petrol would work too.

The TS3 was only 202cu in,same as an HQ Holden - and I have a picture in front of me of a TS3 powered Commer CB stock truck pulling a 2 axle trailer and a box over the cab loaded with sheep.I doubt if a 202 Holden could pulled that combo empty down hill,let alone loaded and pull it over the Kaimai's

I grew up to the sound of TS3's and my father was a big fan of them,and once worked at a Commer dealer so he could work on them more.My uncle also had a TS3 stock truck.The TS3 was disapearing when I was working on trucks in the '70's,but I did get to do a bit on them.....and more importantly to drive them and revell in the glorious noise.

[peasea]

One of the old truck engines (TS3) had two opposing pistons in one combustion chamber. They ran six pistons in three combustion chambers, countilevered onto a single crankshaft (I think). They were two stroke with a big rootes supercharger. They were widely respected as a powerful lightweight engine, and had a mean sound to them, especially with the exhaust off. Not a patch on todays modern truck engines of course.

Steve


You're right, I used to recondition them in Wellington. Certified Concrete used to run them in their trucks, weird cube-shaped block, big fuck-off cantilever 'rockers' and a central crank. Commer I think they were, really heavy to work with but by all accounts a good machine when running right.

[peasea]

Yes it was the commer TS3.

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/mfKmkitnqQY&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/mfKmkitnqQY&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfKmkitnqQY

Ahhhhhh, the memories!!!!

Oops, showing my age again.

[Slyer]

Must have now...

[paturoa]

Not a new idea, but I haven't seen that layout before.

Over the years the triangular config would also be one of the more common layouts (referrerd to above) but I think also used in planes from memory.

[cave weta]

Years ago I bought a hillclimb special that in the past had a two litre johnson V4 outboard powerhead.
I tried to re- engine it with a TS3 and Celica box. byt I lost it in a workshop fire that came through the wall.

[Edbear]

I think you will find all opposed piston engines are 2 stroke diesels...although with direct injection a 2 stroke petrol would work too.

The TS3 was only 202cu in,same as an HQ Holden - and I have a picture in front of me of a TS3 powered Commer CB stock truck pulling a 2 axle trailer and a box over the cab loaded with sheep.I doubt if a 202 Holden could pulled that combo empty down hill,let alone loaded and pull it over the Kaimai's

I grew up to the sound of TS3's and my father was a big fan of them,and once worked at a Commer dealer so he could work on them more.My uncle also had a TS3 stock truck.The TS3 was disapearing when I was working on trucks in the '70's,but I did get to do a bit on them.....and more importantly to drive them and revell in the glorious noise.


"Glorious"? Last one I saw I think was in Warkworth, turning right up Hill Street from the main road. I can't recall whether it had it's muffler on, but it screamed like a banshee as the driver hurried it down through as many gears as he had to maintain momentum.


Years ago I bought a hillclimb special that in the past had a two litre johnson V4 outboard powerhead.
I tried to re- engine it with a TS3 and Celica box. byt I lost it in a workshop fire that came through the wall.


Ah, the old 2-stroke outboard trick! There were a lot of these homebuild's around and some of them seemed to work okay but ultimately weren't successful.

[Pussy]

I think you will find all opposed piston engines are 2 stroke diesels...although with direct injection a 2 stroke petrol would work too.

The TS3 was only 202cu in,same as an HQ Holden - and I have a picture in front of me of a TS3 powered Commer CB stock truck pulling a 2 axle trailer and a box over the cab loaded with sheep.I doubt if a 202 Holden could pulled that combo empty down hill,let alone loaded and pull it over the Kaimai's

I grew up to the sound of TS3's and my father was a big fan of them,and once worked at a Commer dealer so he could work on them more.My uncle also had a TS3 stock truck.The TS3 was disapearing when I was working on trucks in the '70's,but I did get to do a bit on them.....and more importantly to drive them and revell in the glorious noise.

The three cylinder assemblies on the TS3 phased at 120 degrees, Motu?

Almost a shame there are bugger all of them around now... I have childhood memories of the distinctive sound

[pete376403]

Junkers or Dornier used the same design (but vertical) as a bomber engine in WWII.

AFAIK the Napier Deltic was/is the only triangular layout. Originally a Motor torpedo boat motor, then used in locomotives, and then they ended up in the "Nasty" class boats in Vietnam ("Apocalypse Now", water skiing up the river)
Nice model here http://craftsmanshipmuseum.com/tomlinson.htm
and an animation of the engine here http://www.wis.co.uk/justin/deltic-engine.html

Apparently there was a TS4 as well, but never got past protoype stage and then was axed to protect the deal between Chrysler and Cummins http://www.commer.org.nz/Commer_Connections/TS4_Motor.html

And finally I think TS refers to Tilling Stevens rather than Two Stroke

[James Deuce]

<img src=http://img160.imageshack.us/img160/9407/gots37gl.gif>

<img src=http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e353/stian1979/Napier_deltic_animation.gif>

[wbks]

Ah, the old 2-stroke outboard trick! There were a lot of these homebuild's around and some of them seemed to work okay but ultimately weren't successful.Like the one that managed second in the world GP:drool:

[gammaguy]

one day,all engines will be that good.

in the meantime,i have my collection......:hug:

[Edbear]

Like the one that managed second in the world GP:drool:

Well, there'll always be a Kiwi who can make a success of something!

Wasn't that Kim Newcomb?

[Pixie]

http://engineeringtv.com/blogs/etv/archive/2008/07/01/opposed-piston-opposed-cylinder-engine.aspx
Very interesting. Have people tried things like this before?

Napier Deltic
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napier_Deltic