A couple of oil questions

[OLD MAN BJ]

Hi guys
No oil wars, just a couple of questions which I hope you can help me with. My bike calls for a 10w-40 oil, but I want to know if 15w-40 is ok for our climate in Auckland.

Secondly, was in the Pennzoil depot the other day, and they have a heap of oils in yellow containers called "Oilpro".Just says its made in Aussie. The guy recons its premium stuff but I have never heard of it. Anyone throw any light on this stuff? They even have a bike 10-40 semi synth. I googled it but they have no website.

Appreciate your views.

John

[Vern]

Hi guys
No oil wars, just a couple of questions which I hope you can help me with. My bike calls for a 10w-40 oil, but I want to know if 15w-40 is ok for our climate in Auckland.

Secondly, was in the Pennzoil depot the other day, and they have a heap of oils in yellow containers called "Oilpro".Just says its made in Aussie. The guy recons its premium stuff but I have never heard of it. Anyone throw any light on this stuff? They even have a bike 10-40 semi synth. I googled it but they have no website.

Appreciate your views.

John
Hi in my bikes I use castrol 4T which is 15w-50w as it is a motorbike oil to work with the gear box as part of the sump. Vern:2thumbsup

[Max Preload]

If it is wet clutch compatible, it'll certainly be fine. But I'd say it isn't.

[AllanB]

My Honda dealer in Christchurch has put a Castrol GPS semi-synthetic 10-50W in my Hornet on the 2 services it has had (1,000 & 6,000 kms). I rang the Honda importers (yeah yeah, anal I know) - they said its cool. I also note my Honda Warranty book is covered in Castrol advertising!

Now I am wondering about going to a full synthetic on the next oil change..... I see the Castrol R4 is a 5-40W


As far as the 'yellow Aussie' oil goes - if you do not know what it is don't use it, oil is way cheaper than engine rebuilds!

[Motu]

Oilpro is workshop oil.When Pennzoil Aussie put the price up many years ago,all the workshops dropped Pennzoil,so they repackaged it as Oilpro...and sold it at the old price.It used to be Pennzoil Longlife - a HDEO,an extended oil change interval diesel oil.....good for cars and bikes too.I bought it in bulk and used it in all my customers cars and all my own vehicles for years.

10/40 was not considered a good brew some years ago,and has always been hard to find - 15/40 will do just fine.

[Pussy]

Castrol GPS is now 10W40... it's good oil.

I prefer to use the manufacturer's recommendation for viscosity

[AllanB]

Castrol GPS is now 10W40... it's good oil.


Guess I'm running 10-40W now then! :2thumbsup

Any idea why it went 'back' - I'm thinking that there are a load of bikes running 10-40 and they possibly lost some sales with it labelled 10-50?

[CookMySock]

No oil wars, just a couple of questions which I hope you can help me with. My bike calls for a 10w-40 oil, but I want to know if 15w-40 is ok for our climate in Auckland.In general, the answer is no. You should match the SAE spec exactly, and use an oil that exceeds the recommended API spec. Engines are set up to use a certain viscosity oil, and you must not just use a different oil at your whim. Maybe you will get away with a slightly thicker oil, and maybe you will not.


Secondly, was in the Pennzoil depot the other day, and they have a heap of oils in yellow containers called "Oilpro".Just says its made in Aussie. The guy recons its premium stuff but I have never heard of it. Anyone throw any light on this stuff? They even have a bike 10-40 semi synth. I googled it but they have no website.I cannot comment on this exact product, but I have had several bad (diesel) engine responses with pennzoil, and I refuse to use it again. Also I was warned against using it by a mechanic.


My Honda dealer in Christchurch has put a Castrol GPS semi-synthetic 10-50W in my Hornet on the 2 services it has had (1,000 & 6,000 kms). I rang the Honda importers (yeah yeah, anal I know) - they said its cool. I also note my Honda Warranty book is covered in Castrol advertising!

Now I am wondering about going to a full synthetic on the next oil change..... I see the Castrol R4 is a 5-40WI was told that a 50W oil would be way way too heavy for a tiny high revving engine.

There is also the issue that an oil with this wide range is going to chop down real fast to its base stock, due to the massive load of VI improvers breaking down. Not an issue if you change it regularly.


Castrol GPS is now 10W40... it's good oil. I prefer to use the manufacturer's recommendation for viscosityI agree, and I agree, and this man will know.

Match the SAE (like 10W40) viscosity rating exactly, and exceed the API (like SG) rating. Another good rule of thumb is to always buy the highest API rated oil you can find - I don't know what the latest API rating is for spark ignition engines, but all the top quality oils will have this rating. Just use them.

Steve

[Max Preload]

I don't know what the latest API rating is for spark ignition engines, but all the top quality oils will have this rating. Just use them.

Last time I checked they were up to SL or SM. But that's not usually suitable for bikes because it contains friction modifiers which can cause clutch slippage. The highest 4T I've seen was SG.

[AllanB]

A quote from my Honda Warranty book:

Only Castrol Lubricants carry the Blue Wing stamp of recommendation.
Castrol GPS-Extreme Protection at High Temperatures
Castrol GPS is a synthetic based SAE 10W-50 (now 40 apparently) 4-stroke motorcycle engine oil. Recommended for use in performance, touring or off road motorcycles. Castrol GPS offers a tough heat reactive layer of protection that resists thermal break down, provides outstanding engine cleanliness and excellent cold flow properties for easy starting.
All round good shit :clap:

Of interest the Activt 4T, a mineral based only oil is a 15W-50 (or was at time of warranty book).

I do recall a period where Castrol did not make a 10W-40 motorcycle oil.

The other Honda dealer in town uses a oil I've never heard of. Some fancy Euro stuff apparently. I must ask them if their warranty books are covered in Castrol advertising:rolleyes:

I must say I've always liked my Castrols. Moto went in the Suzuki I had due to the dealer using it.

If its under warranty you end up with what your dealer is stocking.

[CookMySock]

Only Castrol Lubricants carry the Blue Wing stamp of recommendation.That is <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doublespeak">doublespeak</a> for "We get a kickback from Castrol when you buy their motorcycle products, so we will try to persuade you to use them using any technique we can.


Castrol GPS-Extreme Protection at High Temperatures
Castrol GPS is a synthetic based SAE 10W-50 (now 40 apparently) 4-stroke motorcycle engine oil. Recommended for use in performance, touring or off road motorcycles. Castrol GPS offers a tough heat reactive layer of protection that resists thermal break down, provides outstanding engine cleanliness and excellent cold flow properties for easy starting.Again, that means nothing. All modern oils do that.


If its under warranty you end up with what your dealer is stocking.No, you do not have to buy their oils to stay under warranty. You must use the correct SAE and API rated oil - thats all.

I used to sell Amsoil products. I gave up, because it was like trying to get someone to change what brand of beer they drank - impossible. No one was interested in hearing logic, and some of their products were just too ahead of their time for people to feel comfortable using them - take for example their 100:1 two-stroke oil.. damn that stuff brings out the best in engines and the WORST in people. :girlfight:

edit: <a href="http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/mcf.aspx">This</a> shit is top of the range. Unlikely you will find it in NZ though.

Steve

[Quasievil]

Castrol basically pay a workshop large amounts of cash up front if they use their oils exclusively, Castrol to their credit are brilliant at advertising and branding their product.
Interestingly Castrol also dont make a fully synthetic oil, their Base stocks are highly refined mineral oils with additives, a true synthetic oil will come from ethanol basestocks ie polyalphaolefins (POA) not many companies actually have this.
I work for Mobil (BDM Lubes) and have a bit of inside info as ya would, I use Mobil 1 4T (for bikes) and rate it higher than most, generally its cheaper than the apparant brilliant Castrol stuff also..............ie around $80 for a 4lt pack.
In My opinion Mobil 1 would be the best synthetic oil on the market and is certainly internationally the world leader (we can legally say that as it actually is) the rest follow, but due to a re structure we arent promoting that fact in NZ a hell of a lot at the moment.

[AllanB]

No, you do not have to buy their oils to stay under warranty. You must use the correct SAE and API rated oil - thats all.
Steve

True, any oil of the recommended range is fine - but lets face it if you turn up at their Honda workshop with your new bike for a service and tell them that you don't want their oil in the bike, use this stuff i have brought with me ....... yep that relationship will go well. You'll probably get a extra long labour charge to make up for their loss on the oil! Sad but realistic.

To add interest to the oil info, I've just got off the phone from both Honda dealers regarding running a fully synthetic in the Hornet - both say don't bother, stick with the semi. If it was a Fireblade or similar high revving engine then yes go fully. Nice to hear an opinion that is not $ driven.

[CookMySock]

use this stuff i have brought with me ....... yep that relationship will go well. You'll probably get a extra long labour charge to make up for their loss on the oil! Sad but realistic.Well, thats stiff titty, coz its my way or the highway, and I can get it cheaper elsewhere, well, yeah.


[...] both [honda dealers] say don't bother, stick with the semi. If it was a Fireblade or similar high revving engine then yes go fully.In my opinion, the only engines worth running the full monty engine oil in, is the little little 150cc air-cooleds with a fat person riding them (wince), little 250-400cc inline fours that howl along all day at massive rpms, any race engine, and the two strokes. All the rest will cope fine with a modern semi-syn as long as its changed regularly. E&OE.

I think may bike shops these days are past the "lets scam the customer for an extra dollar" days. Bikers are the worst bunch to pull that sort of crap on - one such stunt can spell their demise on a forum such as KB, and really they would rather be seen to be a pack of lunatic riders just like bikers are. We drop in at our Whakatane bike shop and eat chips and drink piss with them, and they call a spade a fucken spade. No bullshit. No upsell. No ripoff. I'll chip in my bit so they are still there next month.

Steve

[LittleJohn]

Well my 5 cents worth is I've had no problems with Motul, both road and dirt...... But I'm no road racer like some of the guys on here.

[OLD MAN BJ]

Hi guys,
My understanding about viscosity is that any --- to 40 oil is a 40 weight oil when its hot. The lower number is an indication of how easily it flows when cold. Ok, my manual states a 10w-40 but lets face it we are not living in Siberia. Thats why I asked about a 15w-40. With our mild winter climate, would a 15w flow ok at start up? Most of these oils state a lower flow temp of -27 deg C. It will still behave as a 40 when warm. The reason I asked is there is a much better selection of oils available if 15w-40 is ok to use. Including the mixed fleet oils etc.

John

[xwhatsit]

Personally I think you sound a little paranoid but I use diesel oil and change it every 1600kms :)

In my workshop manual from 1977 or 1979 or whatever it is (for an air-cooled 4V 250 single SOHC, yep, very applicable), it says 10W-40 if temp falls below -5 degrees. Or +5 degrees. Can't remember. Otherwise 15W-40 is fine.

I ran 20W-50 for a while :stupid: The top-end rattle that appears in traffic in hot weather was quieter!

[AllanB]

Well this thread got me thinking. I called my Honda dealer - apparently GPS has been 10W-40 for some time - Honda warranty books were printed a while back. All good so I've got the specified 10W40 in the Hornet. A quick call to Castrol backs this up. Both also said the earlier mix was 100% sweet.

Back to the original post, I see in the Honda Hornet manual they list a couple of oil viscosity's both start with 10W. I'd stick with that.

Pop onto a American website like 'wrist twisters' and the 919 (AKA Hornet) section finds all sorts of oil being used over there - brands I've never heard of.

My comment regarding getting the oil brand your servicing dealer has is standard - during the warranty period you get a dealer service and they put in what they sell (standard practise). If you use more than one dealer during your warranty period you'll probably end up with a different brand. All should use the correct viscosity.
All will claim the oil they sell is the best stuff ever invented!

[MotoKuzzi]

In the Guzzi I'm using Morris lubricants " Ring Free " 15/40 diesel oil. Buy it in 25l containers for about $180 delivered to my door. Reason I chose it because I get a good 9000km out of it in my diesel Safari before I need to add a litre top up, until I do a change at 10,000km. Any of the other cheap oils like repco diesel etc would only get half that before it breaks down. From what i have seen so far it keeps the engine spotless.

[CookMySock]

All should use the correct viscosity.
All will claim the oil they sell is the best stuff ever invented!Yes, and yes. Ignore the brand name. Match the SAE spec, Exceed the API spec by whatever you can afford. Don't extend your oil changes. Don't over or under fill. Nothing else matters.

Steve

[AllanB]

I called the Castrol man today with your question - he looked up their spec sheet for your bike - both oil options they list start with a 5 or 10W. He said from a technical point of view the lighter weight cold start is preferable to the higher 15W you asked about.

But then he said, unless you live in Southland it doesn't really get super cold in NZ winters! Which brings us full circle with your first post :brick::brick:


oil threads - excellent stuff!

[Flip]

Well here is my 2c worth. The 15w40 number describes the viscosity in comparasion to a straight mineral oil. The 15 at low temperature (0 deg F)as being the same viscosity as a 15 weight mineral oil, the 40 number at high temperature (210 deg F) as being the same as a straight 40 weight oil.
The SG, SH is the performance raiting as set by SAE (society automotive engineers). The higher the 2nd letter the "better" the oil. With the qualifier that some of the modern oils do not work well in vintage motors. eg Mobil 1 has been known to cause HD big V twin big ends to fail as the rollers can skid and cause bearing failure also the new additives can disolve old types of seals.
If you were is central otago well then the oils cold flow performance might be of some interest but its not often minus 18 deg C in Auckland even then the diference between a 10 and 15 weight oil is minimal.
I would rather have nice fresh good quality 15w40 oil in my crank case than old dirty worn out 10w40 oil. Pick an oil that is from a reputable maker that is commonly available as the oil makers do not reccomend mixing brands and types of oils unless it is an emergency.

[Quasievil]

Well here is my 2c worth. The 15w40 number describes the viscosity in comparasion to a straight mineral oil. The 15 at low temperature (0 deg F)as being the same viscosity as a 15 weight mineral oil, the 40 number at high temperature (210 deg F) as being the same as a straight 40 weight oil.
The SG, SH is the performance raiting as set by SAE (society automotive engineers). The higher the 2nd letter the "better" the oil. With the qualifier that some of the modern oils do not work well in vintage motors. eg Mobil 1 has been known to cause HD big V twin big ends to fail as the rollers can skid and cause bearing failure also the new additives can disolve old types of seals.
If you were is central otago well then the oils cold flow performance might be of some interest but its not often minus 18 deg C in Auckland even then the diference between a 10 and 15 weight oil is minimal.
I would rather have nice fresh good quality 15w40 oil in my crank case than old dirty worn out 10w40 oil. Pick an oil that is from a reputable maker that is commonly available as the oil makers do not reccomend mixing brands and types of oils unless it is an emergency.



I assume youre talking about Mobil 1 V Twin 20w-50 if so there is no way that the product is responsible for a Big End Failure. However it is typical that an oil gets the blame but in this case I doubt it very much so.
Mobil 1 V Twin is a widely sought after oil around the world and is a success story oil.

[kiwi cowboy]

I assume youre talking about Mobil 1 V Twin 20w-50 if so there is no way that the product is responsible for a Big End Failure. However it is typical that an oil gets the blame but in this case I doubt it very much so.
Mobil 1 V Twin is a widely sought after oil around the world and is a success story oil.

S whot is the diference between mobil2000 10w-40 and this mobil 1 4t 10w-40 as the garage i use say they are the same only the price is diferent

[OLD MAN BJ]

Well guys,
Thanks for all the good replies. Today I had a reply back from Shell regarding their SX4 15w-50 API SJ bike oil. The tech person said it would be fine in my bike anywhere in New Zealand (maybe not central otago in middle of winter, as I have been there). Decided to stay away from the OILPRO oils as they are same price as the big players so you might as well have the real thing.

John

[Motu]

As I mentioned,Oilpro is the real thing.Pennzoil won't discount their premium oil for the trade....but call it another name and they will.It's just a marketing thing....swapping names on products.

The HD roller skid is urban legend....it only happens on oil threads.

[Quasievil]

S whot is the diference between mobil2000 10w-40 and this mobil 1 4t 10w-40 as the garage i use say they are the same only the price is diferent

The 4t is a motorcycle oil and is formulated as such, the Mobil 2000 is a car engine oil and is formulated as such, thats the essential difference.

[dipshit]

I assume youre talking about Mobil 1 V Twin 20w-50 if so there is no way that the product is responsible for a Big End Failure.

A mechanic at work was telling me about a jet boat company in Queenstown losing an engine to big end failure every other week for months on end. They were using Mobil 1. They finally worked out what was going on. Under high temperatures the oil was foaming and when they shut the engine off - the hot oil would just run off all the metal surfaces. When the engine was started up again, there was virtually no oil protection.

They changed to a different oil and the problem stopped.

I was a bit sceptical about his story... but then just the other day i was taking a look at this ( http://www.amsoil.com/lit/g2156.pdf ) and noticed Mobil 1 MX4T was rated as worst at foaming at high temperatures. So perhaps there is something to it.

[Quasievil]

A mechanic at work was telling me about a jet boat company in Queenstown losing an engine to big end failure every other week for months on end. They were using Mobil 1. They finally worked out what was going on. Under high temperatures the oil was foaming and when they shut the engine off - the oil would just run off all the metal surfaces. When the engine was started up again, there was virtually no oil protection.

They changed to a different oil and the problem stopped.

I was a bit sceptical about his story... but then just the other day i was taking a look at this ( http://www.amsoil.com/lit/g2156.pdf ) and noticed Mobil 1 MX4T was rated as worst at foaming at high temperatures. So perhaps there is something to it.

yeah the mechanic knows everything scenario, get it all the time, yet Mobil 1 has been used by HRT for years and is the prefered oil for many leading performance car engines.
Mobil 1 wont foam, it got additives to prevent it, there is more to this story I believe.

[dipshit]

yeah the mechanic knows everything scenario, get it all the time

I know. I don't put too much weight on their particular opinions either.



Mobil 1 wont foam, it got additives to prevent it, there is more to this story I believe.

Yet that page did show a particular Mobil 1 was the worst for foaming. And that company was having the trouble back in the mid to late 80's. The oil has had a few changes since then.

[dipshit]

yeah the mechanic knows everything scenario, get it all the time

I know. I don't put too much weight on their particular opinions either.



Mobil 1 wont foam, it got additives to prevent it, there is more to this story I believe.

Yet that page did show a particular Mobil 1 was the worst for foaming. And that company was having the trouble back in the late 80's. The oil has had a few changes since then.

[Quasievil]

I know. I don't put too much weight on their particular opinions either.


Yet that page did show a particular Mobil 1 was the worst for foaming. And that company was having the trouble back in the late 80's. The oil has had a few changes since then.

That page was a Amsoil test, hardly independant. Mobil 1 is the world market leader in synthetic technology, this isnt a comment of speculation but a comment of actual fact, the Mobil 1 brand is the flagship of Mobil and there is a large international following of the oil for its superior performance benefits, weather the Delvac Mobil 1, Mobil 1 or the Racing 4t mobil 1, each product is highly specified.

Believe me when I say you wont have an issue with Mobil 1

Incidently I run Mobil1 4T in my race bike a single cylinder engine the revs to about 9000rpm, it doesnt foam, so a big v8 engine reving at 2000 rpm per cylinder is unlikely to foam.

[2_SL0]

Not all Mobil 1 is synthetic.

Mobil 1 is A GOOD OIL.

Mobil sued Castrol for making that same statement and lost.

[Cajun]

Well guys,
Thanks for all the good replies. Today I had a reply back from Shell regarding their SX4 15w-50 API SJ bike oil. The tech person said it would be fine in my bike anywhere in New Zealand (maybe not central otago in middle of winter, as I have been there). Decided to stay away from the OILPRO oils as they are same price as the big players so you might as well have the real thing.

John

I have been using 'Shell Advance Ultra 4' in my bike(gsxr600) since brand new, coming up 5 years old, with out any issues. So Sx4 be fine for your hornet

I personally choose shell, since when i brought my bike in 04, that was what shop perfered brand, the brian bernard race team used shell in there race bikes, And in turn i have always used the same oil even when its no longer the perfered brand of local suzuki dealer.

[Quasievil]

Not all Mobil 1 is synthetic.

Mobil 1 is A GOOD OIL.

Mobil sued Castrol for making that same statement and lost.

Mobil 1 is a fully synthetic oil developed from group 4 base stocks ie Polyalphaolefins (POA)

Mobil sued Castrol and lost yes correct, why? the reason is Castrol claim to have fully synthetic oils hawever they DO NOT, Castrol use highly refined Group 3 Base stocks (mineral oil) however they label their product as fully synthetic oil, which by industry understandings it is not, it is a highly refined mineral oil. Mobil challenged this in court on the basis of it isnt POA, Mobil lost as the court felt that due to the highly refined nature of the castrol product it must be described as Synthetic.
In simplistic terms however it isnt and never will be, the particle (molecular structure) of the Castrol synthetic oil is not a uniform size as what gives a POA oil its bennifits.

Castrol oil is a mineral oil with mineral oil charactheristics wrapped up in big marketing hype.


Seen ya raised it.

[OLD MAN BJ]

Hey guys,
Just lettin you know, decided to ugrade me cycle. Pick up the new Bandit in about 2 weeks.Cany wait.

John

[Pixie]

Match the SAE (like 10W40) viscosity rating exactly, and exceed the API (like SG) rating. Another good rule of thumb is to always buy the highest API rated oil you can find - I don't know what the latest API rating is for spark ignition engines, but all the top quality oils will have this rating. Just use them.

Steve

Exceeding the API rating can put you in the realm of low friction "eco" oils
which may not be too good for a wet clutch.

JASO rating is more important for bikes - MA or T903

[CookMySock]

It is pointless having any group discussion on engine oils. Everyone ends up raving about their favourite brand, and belittling the others. Then it comes the building their loved products up with baseless, unreferenced "statistics", and FUD to put down the others. Some members on KB are known for this, and not just on engine oils either. We end up with the same baseless "evidence" - opinion presented as fact, and personal remarks, ala ;


That page was a Amsoil test, hardly independant. Mobil 1 is the world market leader in synthetic technology, this isnt a comment of speculation but a comment of actual fact, the Mobil 1 brand is the flagship of Mobil and there is a large international following of the oil for its superior performance benefits, weather the Delvac Mobil 1, Mobil 1 or the Racing 4t mobil 1, each product is highly specified.

Believe me when I say you wont have an issue with Mobil 1

Incidently I run Mobil1 4T in my race bike a single cylinder engine the revs to about 9000rpm, it doesnt foam, so a big v8 engine reving at 2000 rpm per cylinder is unlikely to foam.Well I ran Mobil 1 in a high performance diesel, and alarmingly, it rattled like a stone in a tin can, and yes I know the difference between diesel rattle and engine rattle.

It is a little unfortunate to suggest that tests done to the ASTM standards are "hardly independant." Perhaps you can point us at a higher testing authority you subscribe to, or maybe even include any reference at all for your statements, because at even second and third reading, they smack strongly of your personal opinion, and not much else.

Most companies make a product as cheaply as possible, and then go about fixing its problems. In the case of automotive oils - they use additive packages to address the deficiencies of the base stocks. They COULD just use a better base stock, but thats the pricey way to do it - they are far better off (financially) to resolve the issues as they come to hand (or rather as they embarrasingly come to the medias' attention), but then that causes other problems as well.

Take for example, while the base stocks might be stable, the additive packages are often not, resulting in damaging nasties appearing very quickly in the oil as the additive package breaks down, or the whole oil package not being remotely what the original specification suggested it was capable of.

It depends on the ethic of the oil company. Do they make engine oil to pass tests or do they make engine oil to lubricate engines?

Maybe you note that I do not side with any oil company? Mostly, the "best" oil for any task is overkill. There are only a very few exceptions to this rule, and even then, there are alternatives that will get you by.

Heres my first sentence again. It is pointless having any group discussion on engine oils. Everyone ends up raving about their favourite brand, and belittling the others.

Just use the correct viscosity, and change it regularly. ;)

Steve

[Quasievil]

Well I ran Mobil 1 in a high performance diesel, and alarmingly, it rattled like a stone in a tin can, and yes I know the difference between diesel rattle and engine rattle

The opposite happened with my Diesel



It is a little unfortunate to suggest that tests done to the ASTM standards are "hardly independant." Perhaps you can point us at a higher testing authority you subscribe to, or maybe even include any reference at all for your statements, because at even second and third reading, they smack strongly of your personal opinion, and not much else.

Im in the industry and get plenty of good readings to understand what goes on in the oil world.



Most companies make a product as cheaply as possible, and then go about fixing its problems. In the case of automotive oils - they use additive packages to address the deficiencies of the base stocks. They COULD just use a better base stock, but thats the pricey way to do it - they are far better off (financially) to resolve the issues as they come to hand (or rather as they embarrasingly come to the medias' attention), but then that causes other problems as well.

They use additives to gain advantages that base stocks wont offer, ie anit oxidizing agents anti foaming agents etc etc, Mobil use in the Mobil 1 the only synthetic base stoch there is, POA anything else isnt a synthetic but a refined mineral oil.


Take for example, while the base stocks might be stable, the additive packages are often not, resulting in damaging nasties appearing very quickly in the oil as the additive package breaks down, or the whole oil package not being remotely what the original specification suggested it was capable of..

Correct and this is where the engineering of the oil comes in to play, this is where many companies tend to have issues.




Just use the correct viscosity, and change it regularly. ;)


Basically yes, but use a decent grade and brand, dont go grabbibg the cheapest you can get as its cheap for a reason, same argument over anything in this world.

[2_SL0]

They use additives to gain advantages that base stocks wont offer, ie anit oxidizing agents anti foaming agents etc etc, Mobil use in the Mobil 1 the only synthetic base stoch there is, POA anything else isnt a synthetic but a refined mineral oil.



Not entirely true,
independant testing has proven that not all Mobil 1 has been using POA all of the time.

I'll dig it out for you.
Mobil 1 is not the best oil in the world, it is not the only true synthetic in the world either.

Infact it is outperformed in many independent tests by mineral based oils, including the the very Castrol product it took to court.

Is it a good oil, YES, is it the best, NO, it’s a good oil that performs better than other oils in some situations and worse in others.

However Quasi should stand by his product, I would be disappointed if he did not. I certainly don’t claim it’s a crap product. But maybe don’t see it in the same light as Quasi.

[cruza]

Mobil 1 is a fully synthetic oil developed from group 4 base stocks ie Polyalphaolefins (POA)

Mobil sued Castrol and lost yes correct, why? the reason is Castrol claim to have fully synthetic oils hawever they DO NOT, Castrol use highly refined Group 3 Base stocks (mineral oil) however they label their product as fully synthetic oil, which by industry understandings it is not, it is a highly refined mineral oil. Mobil challenged this in court on the basis of it isnt POA, Mobil lost as the court felt that due to the highly refined nature of the castrol product it must be described as Synthetic.
In simplistic terms however it isnt and never will be, the particle (molecular structure) of the Castrol synthetic oil is not a uniform size as what gives a POA oil its bennifits.

Castrol oil is a mineral oil with mineral oil charactheristics wrapped up in big marketing hype.


Seen ya raised it.

Read somewhere that that is the case in the usa,where they can get away with naming it fully syn, But castrol europe/uk and south pacific they can't , just can't remember where I read it .........:confused:

[Quasievil]

Read somewhere that that is the case in the usa,where they can get away with naming it fully syn, But castrol europe/uk and south pacific they can't , just can't remember where I read it .........:confused:

Yeah it was a USA case, dont know about the restrictions......to be honest dont really care either lol, just seemed interesting.

[AllanB]

Hey guys,
Just lettin you know, decided to ugrade me cycle. Pick up the new Bandit in about 2 weeks.Cany wait.

John


Mate - you'd better run good oil in that motor - after all it's a flipping Suzuki.....:girlfight:

Ha ha - just pulling..... nice bike them Bandits.