Privateers Cup and Naked Class?

[CHOPPA]

I got this email from Peter Fenton, nothing is set in concrete but its just showing how there are people that are really trying to pick up the racing scene and getting some ideas out there!

He has some really good ideas that i hope come into place!

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I am aiming to have implimented a "Privateer Class" within both Superbikes and 600's. So that those riders who are not directly supported by the factory, also have something else to race for...........the "Privateer's Cup". With the main prize (I hope) to win more factory support, from which ever manufactuer the winner wants, where the manufacturer will assist them with either a bike, or parts etc to help them the following season.

Also I want to see more input from the Tyre Companies, where 1st, 2nd and/or 3rd privateers win a set of tyres per round. Along with Chains, brake pads, fuel vouchers, ferry crossing vouchers, accommodation vouchers etc etc........this way I feel it really gives the non factory riders so,ething else to race for in their own championship.
I would also like them to have Red number boards and white numbers, so that the public can tell the difference between factory and non factory.

There will also be some technical changes for next season possibly. Maybe a limit on tyres, both in 600's and SBK. Also, possibly having SBK's on Prodie tyres, this way, it is then easier to on sell 2nd hand tyres to club racers. I know our Dunlop Prodie tyres will handle our SBK's, so I am sure the other tyre manufacturers will too.

There are also other ideas I am working on. As well as working with the new promoter of the Aussie Series (Suzuki Australia get me to look after Robbie in Aussie too). The new promoters there want to seriously look at the option of bringing a round of the Aussie SBK'S here..........for examlpe their 1st round would possible tie in with our final round. And this would also include, say our top 6 competing for "Trans- Tasman Points" and also the top 6 going over there to race in a round of the Aussie SBK Series, for the 2nd part of the Trans Tasman Series...............or something along those lines anyway.

So, hopefully we can keep this sport growing. I have to admit, I was very dissapointed in the North Island's representaion of local riders at the Manfield round and also the Pukekohe round. If the local club riders don't want to race against the best in NZ, then I feel the clubs should then at least have run a "Clubman's Class", so the local club riders could have at least taken part in the rounds and then compared their lap times to their equiverlent class, whether it be 600's, SBK, or even Pro twins and would then see how they would have fared in the proper classes.....!!!!........well, that is what I think anyway.

Oh, possibly you could ask people's oppunion on a new class I would like to be included next year and that is a Naked Bike Production class. Really tightly controlled, with limited mods, on production Naked bikes. Whether it be a Super Duke, B-King, SV 1000, Honet, Frazer, Speed Triple..........etc.etc. From 675cc up wards. I feel this is another way of getting people out racing, without having to have too big a cheque book.

[Shaun P]

Finally some clear thinking, I think most of those initiatives would be a step in a positive direction.

[White trash]

Red's always been a forward thinker and let's face it, devotes a huge ammount of time to our chosen sport.

Privateer Cup is an awesome idea. I would hope that it would fish out a few more people keen to race in each class.

Proddy tyre rule wouldn't suit everyone perfectly. Especially if a trans tasman series started. Also, those that do want to run slicks at club level would pay through the nose as ditributors wouldn't be bringing decent numbers in.

Transtasman riders would be awesome.

NAked bike class would rock.

Red Fenton for MNZ CEO:D

[DEATH_INC.]

NAked bike class would rock.
YEH BABY!!!!!!! :banana:

[Skunk]

then I feel the clubs should then at least have run a "Clubman's Class", so the local club riders could have at least taken part in the rounds and then compared their lap times to their equiverlent class, whether it be 600's, SBK, or even Pro twins and would then see how they would have fared in the proper classes.....!!!!........well, that is what I think anyway.I agree with him up to this. That just pisses me off. We do everything we can to do what the riders want and when they don't show up it's our fault... Can't bloody win.
If the riders wanted to compare times they SHOULDA BLOODY ENTERED!! :mad: Bloody :mad:

Sorry - got my back up this time.

[sinfull]

Imagine the hoons that would come out to play if there was a naked class ! Todays bears races were chocka with riders throwing everthing into their races, nakeds everywhere !
I look at the future of my speed triple and think, i got to trade it if i wanna keep doin this cause there aint nothin past clubmans ! Sure i move into F1, yay, unless i can find 10 others who would want to do the same, i'm racing myself !

[CHOPPA]

Imagine the hoons that would come out to play if there was a naked class ! Todays bears races were chocka with riders throwing everthing into their races, nakeds everywhere !
I look at the future of my speed triple and think, i got to trade it if i wanna keep doin this cause there aint nothin past clubmans ! Sure i move into F1, yay, unless i can find 10 others who would want to do the same, i'm racing myself !

got a zx10 for sale thats pretty fast...

[White trash]

I agree with him up to this. That just pisses me off. We do everything we can to do what the riders want and when they don't show up it's our fault... Can't bloody win.
If the riders wanted to compare times they SHOULDA BLOODY ENTERED!! :mad: Bloody :mad:

Sorry - got my back up this time.
Andrew. Simmer down bro. Read the last sentence again. It's someone's opinion, and let's face it. we all have one. He's clearly stated that.

I don't know Red, never been introduced. But someone that states that it's "their view" is normally very open to discussion.

I do not want to critisise VMCC in the slightest, in my mind you guys are the best in the country without doubt. HOWEVER, I did wonder at the logic of having an "Open Twins" class at Manfield round of the Nats. PERSONALLY I thought there would have been more merit in running a Clubmans class.

And I do agree with Red's senitiments to an extent. It surely seems strange that the North Island had the lowest subscribed meetings.

I also see the clubs involved side of the coin. You ran events, few entered. What the fuck is wrong with people?

[sinfull]

got a zx10 for sale thats pretty fast...
Don't think i aint looked at it Lol Just couldn't scrape that much together !

[MVnut]

a Naked Bike Production class. Really tightly controlled, with limited mods

MV Brutale 1078 .........hmmmmmmmmmm:cool:

[puddytat]

So, hopefully we can keep this sport growing. I have to admit, I was very dissapointed in the North Island's representaion of local riders at the Manfield round and also the Pukekohe round. If the local club riders don't want to race against the best in NZ, then I feel the clubs should then at least have run a "Clubman's Class", so the local club riders could have at least taken part in the rounds and then compared their lap times to their equiverlent class, whether it be 600's, SBK, or even Pro twins and would then see how they would have fared in the proper classes.....!!!!........well, that is what I think anyway.

The reason I went to the Nats at Ruapuna was that they held a Clubmans class...
We had 26 bikes in that class that wouldve otherwise not have been racing.
I was about a second off qualifying pace for the 6 hundies.I personally think I learnt a lot more about racing ,racing the 6 guys in front of me than I wouldve if I had qualified for F2 & left for dead off the line & having a boring race at the tail end of the field, & possibly fucking it for the quick fellas.As it was , in the F2 races I watched,backmarkers in my view certainly played a part in the results....
Like Red says, What I got out of it was being able to compare my lap times against the F2 guys,as well as some shit hot racing against fellas in my own league. And, there were some spectators there for a change.
There are certainly several good ideas in what Red is saying,& for me personally,stepping up to a privateers cup type competion would be the more attainable financially as well as suiting my skill level more.

[steveyb]

OK, so Clubmans class at Manfeild round of NZSBK.
Will bring out all the punters you say.
Agreed, Clubmans class at Ruapuna brought out a bunch of riders.
The same would have happened at Manfeild ay?

Only it didn't.

In order to boost the entry numbers at Manfield in 2007 the club (VMCC) invited the Post Classic riders to enter, as the local Postie riders asked for the spot.

But they didn't turn up.

So in 2008 the club reverted back to Clubmans as the support class.

But they didn't turn up (8-10 entries as I recall).

So in 2009 the club tried something different for all the riders who state that their two cyl bikes are not competitive in Superbike. An Open twins class for the support class.

But they didn't turn up!

One has to acknowledge that the high entry fee played a part in that, but following the pattern of the past two (and more) years, the club could not take the risk in losing revenues that even at a reduced entry fee, the riders would not turn up.

So, other than the entry fee (which I will be the first to argue should have really been $60-80 like at Ruapuna) why did Open twin riders not turn up (other than the 6 that did)?

This is all a bit off topic, and I think that Peter (Red) does a really great job and is always thinking about new ideas. But I have issues with further dilution. My own opinion is that we have all the racing classes that our market can really stand, as we are now.

At national level we have the SBK class for the top tier, the SP600 class for the up-and-comers, the F3 class for the fiddlers and smaller of budgets, the Pro-twin class for up-and-comers of smaller budgets, 125GP as our only internationally relevent race class for younger and not so younger riders, SuperMoto for the dirtrackers (not at national level, but it is there), sidecars for the terminally insane, SS150 for youth (pseudo national class which I think should be an officially national class), and Clubmans for support for everyone else. Not to mention the BEARS meetings for a large number of these so-called Naked bikes anyway as who will turn up on an FZ6 when ther will be SuperDukes, SpeedTriples and Hypermotos or something in the same race?

Really, what more do we need? What is really to be gained by diluting that even further? More classes = less tracktime at any given meeting, plain and simple. Why is it that a Naked class needs to be formed? Why is it that these riders will not ride in another class, such as Pro-Twin?

Granted, the FZ6 cup in Australia seems to be working, and the SuperDuke cup in the UK is not too bad, but our market here is so much smaller that further fragmentation into smaller and smaller sub-markets can only serve to damage the offering that we already have. Our Pro-Twin is our equivalent, it is already there.

Bear in mind that these one-brand type classes are created by the distributors as a marketing exercise and when they deem their life to be over they do simply pull the plug.

BUT, I fully fully fully support the idea of a privateers cup within NZSBK and NZSP600. But, who determines who is distributor/factory supported and who is not? If you get your bike on a "racers programme" does that constitute "factory supported". Some will argue that it does. Nit-picking I know, it can work, it works in the UK and Oz, but I wonder if we are all to precious over here to get by without moaning!

I also mooted some time ago, at club and MNZ level, a Club cup. I.E. at the end of the NZSBK season, all points across all classes are tallied and the club with the most points wins a cup. Not much I know, but a little something to try and instil a little club community spirit. I even volunteered to buy a trophy out of my own pocket and count up the points (now there is a taxing task ay?), but no one else really seemed too bothered with it, so I joined them.

Whew, run out of ink ribbon......

[CHOPPA]

Don't think i aint looked at it Lol Just couldn't scrape that much together !

you would probably get more for the triumph!

[wbks]

got a zx10 for sale thats pretty fast...Suit commuter purposes?...

[CHOPPA]

Suit commuter purposes?...

As long as you have some throttle control to idle along at the speed limit

[sinfull]

you would probably get more for the triumph!
For sale ! One 03 955 speed 3 20 odd thousand km, oils changed every 3/5 k as a road bike and 300/400 km on the track (around 2000km) 20k service just done ! Just as quick on the track as my 1050 ! (Fucked if i know why)

Suit commuter purposes?...
Be a waste of a bike but fuck you'd look good ! You'd look even better on a naked though !

[GIXser]

I also see the clubs involved side of the coin. You ran events, few entered. What the fuck is wrong with people?

in my view it is still the lack of advertising, and promotion, if the series was heavily advertised/promoted well before hand, you would get more entries!!!!

[White trash]

in my view it is still the lack of advertising, and promotion, if the series was heavily advertised/promoted well before hand, you would get more entries!!!!
You tryin to tell me that racers didn't know the National rounds were approaching? Doubt it.

[Rcktfsh]

[QUOTE=steveyb;1991977]But I have issues with further dilution. My own opinion is that we have all the racing classes that our market can really stand, as we are now.

At national level we have the SBK class for the top tier, the SP600 class for the up-and-comers, the F3 class for the fiddlers and smaller of budgets, the Pro-twin class for up-and-comers of smaller budgets, 125GP as our only internationally relevent race class for younger and not so younger riders, SuperMoto for the dirtrackers (not at national level, but it is there), sidecars for the terminally insane, SS150 for youth (pseudo national class which I think should be an officially national class), and Clubmans for support for everyone else. Not to mention the BEARS meetings for a large number of these so-called Naked bikes anyway as who will turn up on an FZ6 when ther will be SuperDukes, SpeedTriples and Hypermotos or something in the same race?

Really, what more do we need? What is really to be gained by diluting that even further? More classes = less tracktime at any given meeting, plain and simple. Why is it that a Naked class needs to be formed? Why is it that these riders will not ride in another class, such as Pro-Twin?


couldn't agree more

[scrivy]

sidecars for the terminally insane

You taking the piss Steve??

I take offence to that..... actually, I'll take the gate as well.......:shifty::laugh:

[sinfull]

Not to mention the BEARS meetings for a large number of these so-called Naked bikes anyway as who will turn up on an FZ6 when ther will be SuperDukes, SpeedTriples and Hypermotos or something in the same race?

Really, what more do we need? What is really to be gained by diluting that even further? More classes = less tracktime at any given meeting, plain and simple. Why is it that a Naked class needs to be formed? Why is it that these riders will not ride in another class, such as Pro-Twin?



Sure Bro sweet as, you swing it for me and i'll race in every READ EVERY pro twin class you can get me into !
There was a pro twin class at the Manfield Nats ! How many Bikes ?
Like to see a list of bears events for the north island too for that matter !

[Teambwr47]

'Factory supported' riders in NZ...... really?

Do we actually mean riders that get some help in the funding of a bike from the New Zealand distributor, because I sincerely doubt there are any 'factory' rides in NZ.

I like the idea presented but where would you draw the line in NZ?

I got my bike through Yamaha NZ on a race programme, they still own the base bike now but I paid for absolutely everything else to be done to it via my finances or that of sponsors and its only in the next few weeks I'll take on ownership of the bike.

Does that mean I wouldn't qualify for the Privateers cup as the bike is Yamaha's even though I get no further help/assistance and race as a one man band team being Rider/mechanic/gofor on a race day?

[Robert Taylor]

You taking the piss Steve??

I take offence to that..... actually, I'll take the gate as well.......:shifty::laugh:

Yes Scrivvy I think he was having fun. Seriously though if you were a caveman and were given a pencil and a piece of paper would you seriously draw an inherently unstable three track vehicle? (Sidecars do have their place though)
I agree with Steve entirely, why dilute everything further. Stop grizzling, run with what weve got and promote it well. There is going to be some harsh reality with the world economic mess but that is no justification in itself to mess with the current classes too much. For some people it will never be cheap enough, even if our premier class was racing stripped down CT90s

[roogazza]

Imagine the hoons that would come out to play if there was a naked class ! Todays bears races were chocka with riders throwing everthing into their races, nakeds everywhere !
I look at the future of my speed triple and think, i got to trade it if i wanna keep doin this cause there aint nothin past clubmans ! Sure i move into F1, yay, unless i can find 10 others who would want to do the same, i'm racing myself !

Willy,Willy, think about it before you go throwing the dollars around ! Why not just stay a clubman ? 1.17's before you get kicked out, and you are not there yet are you ?
With a little bit of experience you can still have fun.
Times are going to get tougher, I'd think long and hard before doing what I think a lot of novices do before they need to ? Just a thought bud ! Gaz.

[sinfull]

1.17's before you get kicked out, and you are not there yet are you ?
With a little bit of experience you can still have fun.
Times are going to get tougher, I'd think long and hard before doing what I think a lot of novices do before they need to ? Just a thought bud ! Gaz.
There lies the problem Gazza !
Last official time was 1.19 flat on jan 18 pmcc round 2 and the Mrs had me on the stop watch at 1.21 the week before
She had me at mid 1.18's consistantly on the stop watch three weeks ago ! What do i do, Slow down ?

[FROSTY]

Ya know right on up till yesterday I 100% agreed that advertising was the way to attract the crowds and the entrys.
That was before the Wings over Whenuapai happened.
People in their tens of thousands flocked to the event.
There was stuff all advertising for it relative to the event size.
But why?? Whats different? How did so many peoples imagination get captured?
-I wouldnt have a clue but might be worth figuring out.

[scrivy]

Yes Scrivvy I think he was having fun. Seriously though if you were a caveman and were given a pencil and a piece of paper would you seriously draw an inherently unstable three track vehicle? (Sidecars do have their place though)

Firstly, what caveman had pencils and paper??? :bleh:

Yes he would have drawn a conventional sidecar - but not a carbon fibre made long bike (fags weren't around back then)!! :laugh:

And why would he have drawn an unbalanced machine that only had 2 wheels?? :niceone:

[CHOPPA]

'Factory supported' riders in NZ...... really?

Do we actually mean riders that get some help in the funding of a bike from the New Zealand distributor, because I sincerely doubt there are any 'factory' rides in NZ.

I like the idea presented but where would you draw the line in NZ?

I got my bike through Yamaha NZ on a race programme, they still own the base bike now but I paid for absolutely everything else to be done to it via my finances or that of sponsors and its only in the next few weeks I'll take on ownership of the bike.

Does that mean I wouldn't qualify for the Privateers cup as the bike is Yamaha's even though I get no further help/assistance and race as a one man band team being Rider/mechanic/gofor on a race day?

If your getting a free bike from a manufacturer then you would be a 'factory' rider, we all know its not FACTORY but were in nz...

[Danger Dave]

You tryin to tell me that racers didn't know the National rounds were approaching? Doubt it.

i'm sure the racers knew but no one else did, i work in a bike shop and we got no posters or advertising to put up about the nationals, when i got out to the track (puke) there was no signs or advertising to say there was any racing on, it seems like if you don't follow racing closely you wouldn't know when the rounds were.

[cowpoos]

You taking the piss Steve??

I take offence to that..... actually, I'll take the gate as well.......:shifty::laugh:
I thought it was for those that need training wheels...or is that just for demmocks and annan??

[slowpoke]

Ya know right on up till yesterday I 100% agreed that advertising was the way to attract the crowds and the entrys.
That was before the Wings over Whenuapai happened.
People in their tens of thousands flocked to the event.
There was stuff all advertising for it relative to the event size.
But why?? Whats different? How did so many peoples imagination get captured?
-I wouldnt have a clue but might be worth figuring out.

Because the event is almost uniquely spectacular and tens of thousands of people have been to it in the past: they tell two friends...and those friends tell two friends etc.

Our events on the other hand attract hundreds of people not tens of thousands and the competitor numbers have been a bit down (although the racing itself was fuggin' awesome, at Manfeild anyway) so it doesn't self generate the same level of interest.

Red's ideas are great and his commitment is amazing. Basically he's our only representative in Oz at the moment, even if he is running convict offspring as a rider. I'll be watching his team a lot closer now that that lil' penny has dropped, good luck that team.

Like Dr Steve the only issue I have is with another class diluting things.

Speaking for myself I enquired with Vic Club about a Clubman's class at the Manfeild Nat's round, but it wasn't to be unfortunately, or I would have been all over it like white on rice.

Just to harp on about the cross entry rules, if I'd had a few more opportunities to actually get on track I could very well have felt comfortable enough to enter the Nat's class. Same goes for 2010, if I can get enough race time I'll be seriously considering fronting up to the back of the field at all the Nat's rounds I can get to (mongrel work commitments).

I understand that club's are damned if they do and damned if they don't with regards to the classes they run and this is in no way intended as a kick in the guts. You peoples make it all possible for us and I/we appreciate it no end. Just an idea: how's about a show of hands/emails in response to a poll of the club? Vic Club send out a flyer each month (I don't appear to be on the list but that's prolly my fault) so just attach a few options to gauge levels of interest. Once again, not a criticism, just a suggestion.

[GIXser]

You tryin to tell me that racers didn't know the National rounds were approaching? Doubt it.

ah... but its exactly what im saying Grasshoppa,, because many racers will be dissalusioned by the lack of promotion in recent years hence forth no sponsors because there has been no advertising/promotion..... therefore less money to go around.......therefore low race entries.....

[Drew]

Great ideas, provided mods aren't limited for privateer superbikes.

[sosman]

I like the idea of privateer's group in SBK class,then maybe i can get some race fairings etc for the 7friddy

[brads]

ah... but its exactly what im saying Grasshoppa,, because many racers will be dissalusioned by the lack of promotion in recent years hence forth no sponsors because there has been no advertising/promotion..... therefore less money to go around.......therefore low race entries.....

Can someone please answer why back in the late 90s early 00s,when the only form of advertising was posters plastered around town telling people that it was on(no tv ads,no nzsbk website,no coverage of any round on tv,riders got prize money thou)) there were strong numbers in all classes,decent crowds,yet today with what I think is a great job being done by Paul Stewart and his team over the past 3 years the numbers are falling away?
Is it really down to lack of promotion? or are people just not willing to spend there hard earned cash on there chosen hobbie?/sport?
My thoughts on the reds ideas,
Naked class- no,we cant even fill the classes we have now.
600sp,leave it as is.
SBK,Leave rules as is,however privateer class should have dumbed down rules,no motor mods at all,slip ons,brake lines,DR BOBS,pcs.Slicks.

[Tony.OK]

Can someone please answer why back in the late 90s early 00s,when the only form of advertising was posters plastered around town telling people that it was on(no tv ads,no nzsbk website,no coverage of any round on tv,riders got prize money thou)) there were strong numbers in all classes,decent crowds,yet today with what I think is a great job being done by Paul Stewart and his team over the past 3 years the numbers are falling away?
Is it really down to lack of promotion? or are people just not willing to spend there hard earned cash on there chosen hobbie?/sport?
My thoughts on the reds ideas,
Naked class- no,we cant even fill the classes we have now.
600sp,leave it as is.
SBK,Leave rules as is,however privateer class should have dumbed down rules,no motor mods at all,slip ons,brake lines,DR BOBS,pcs.Slicks.

Maybe you've just answered your own question..............was it the lack of promotion back then that has been a cause in sponsors being rare and spectators of a new generation not knowing it exists.

[Drew]

SBK,Leave rules as is,however privateer class should have dumbed down rules,no motor mods at all,slip ons,brake lines,DR BOBS,pcs.Slicks.

Then it's not Superbike, it's superstock, so it's another class.

Will they run in conjunction? Probably since there isn't enough time in the day now.

But will qualifying still be as it is now in the interest of safety those first few laps? Hardly a seperate class if they line up all mixed up as they most certainly would.

[CHOPPA]

Then it's not Superbike, it's superstock, so it's another class.

Will they run in conjunction? Probably since there isn't enough time in the day now.

But will qualifying still be as it is now in the interest of safety those first few laps? Hardly a seperate class if they line up all mixed up as they most certainly would.

They wont change rules for bikes that are already set up and exclude them because that defeats the purpose but they might put a limit on 09 bikes

[brads]

Then it's not Superbike, it's superstock, so it's another class.

Will they run in conjunction? Probably since there isn't enough time in the day now.

But will qualifying still be as it is now in the interest of safety those first few laps? Hardly a seperate class if they line up all mixed up as they most certainly would.

Yeah run with superbikes,lets face it,our tracks here are not that fast(excluding puke) so the difference between a sbk and stk is not that much when ridden well,Like red said maybe red backgrounds to show the difference,pro twins and f3 line up together and that seems to work.

[steveyb]

You taking the piss Steve??

I take offence to that..... actually, I'll take the gate as well.......:shifty::laugh:

Don't you know it big boy!!! :clap::buggerd:

[steveyb]

The Privateers Cup idea is not about new rules for building bikes, the rules for the bikes stay the same for everyone.
It is about being able to recognise the 'privateers' within each class over those with higher level technical etc support.
In NZ that means distributor support, like it does in Oz and the UK. In the UK in 2005/06 there was one Factory team, the Honda team, now there are about three I think (??) Honda, Ducati and Suzuki (not 100% sure), but there are good distributor and store supported teams.
They run a Privateers cup there in BSB, so if someone can dig up a set of their rules for who is one and who is not then that would be a good starting point.
So the upshot is, that it is possible for a Privateer to win both the NZSBK and the Privateers Cup titles.

I see no one has supported the Club Cup idea.

[wharfy]

Ya know right on up till yesterday I 100% agreed that advertising was the way to attract the crowds and the entrys.
That was before the Wings over Whenuapai happened.
People in their tens of thousands flocked to the event.
There was stuff all advertising for it relative to the event size.
But why?? Whats different? How did so many peoples imagination get captured?
-I wouldnt have a clue but might be worth figuring out.

I am pretty sure I saw an add or two on TV. Complete with action shots, explosions etc.

They have them in Wairarapa as well I went once, it was great except for the bloody crowd...

[brads]

Anyone know what the difference in bikes is between the white backgrounds and the red are in the Aussie sbk championship last year?
ie, what mods were done to Allertons Honda to Konskys?

[steveyb]

Ya know right on up till yesterday I 100% agreed that advertising was the way to attract the crowds and the entrys.
That was before the Wings over Whenuapai happened.
People in their tens of thousands flocked to the event.
There was stuff all advertising for it relative to the event size.
But why?? Whats different? How did so many peoples imagination get captured?
-I wouldnt have a clue but might be worth figuring out.

One reason is that the Wings thing is a complete show. There is not just some aircraft flying past the crowd, then landing and then another one, and then another one that looks a bit different, but is another aircraft, oh, and then another one, these look a bit different too, but they are bikes just like the other ones ......

Catch my drift?

They have a whole show with food stands, sideshows of a sort, related clubs doing stuff, things for the kids etc etc etc.

What do we do?

Bike racing and some shabby looking garages filled with some shabby and some flash looking bikes, shabby (on the whole) people and crap strewn from arsehole to breakfast.

Why, WHY would anyone who is not a bike nut want to pay money (at national level anyway) to come and see that when they have 2.5 kids and a missus who is not that keen to entertain at the same time?

Where are the retailers flogging off stuff?
Where are the distributors displaying bikes?
Where are the concession stands?
Where were the V8 simulators?
Where are the kids play areas?
Where is the decent, tasty, healthy food? Manfield is an utter disgrace in this regard!
Where are the smart teams and garages (like the RRR, Bernard and Team VB Racing setups)?

All these things add up to a show that people will want to come and be a part of, pay money for and tell their friends about.

"Oh there was some racing? Yeah it was fantastic, but did you see .......?"

I had a friend and her husband go to Manfield for NZSBK on my recommendation. They are self-confessed boguns, drive new Holdens and love motorsport. So are precisely the converts we are looking for.
Got to Manfield, put off coming in, right at the gate.
Managed that, wondered what was going on. No programme of events and times, just a little book with lists of names. No blurb, no preamble, no information about the history of NZSBK or anything.
No PA system.
Watched some races which they said were fantastic.
Wanted food, could only find pig-swill (my word), wanted to look at stuff and be informed and entertained, couldn't find anything.
Left after about 2 h.
Will not be coming back, nor recommending it to any friends.

There were issues with gear such as the PA. But you don't see the car people having the same issues do you. Preparation.

If we continue to do this only for ourselves then we will continue to get what we have always got.

If we decide to do it for the spectators and audiences AS WELL AS OURSELVES then we will grow the pie and more people and resources will flow.

Mindset change required.

It starts with the riders. ABSOLUTELY NO amount of money spent by organisers on advertising will change a fine product with crap packaging into a great product with fantastic packaging. (By packaging I mean all the stuff around the races themselves: team attire, bike presentation, garage presentation, deportment of riders and teams, banners, flags, concession stands, food, entertainment etc).

It is possible to grow any business and pay virtually nothing on advertising. Word of mouth and viral marketing do that for you. All you need to do is scrub up your offering and then acutally ask customers to recommend your offering to others. But if your offering is substandard (as our currently is) then it will not happen.

Enjoy.

[Shaun P]

Anyone know what the difference in bikes is between the white backgrounds and the red are in the Aussie sbk championship last year?
ie, what mods were done to Allertons Honda to Konskys?

White is superbike, red is superstock 1000

Superbike rules are a bit more open with datalogging, motec type ecu's traction control alot of engine modifaction, suspension etc

Superstock is basically just exhaust, pc, no engine mod and suspension

[brads]

White is superbike, red is superstock 1000

Superbike rules are a bit more open with datalogging, motec type ecu's traction control alot of engine modifaction, suspension etc

Superstock is basically just exhaust, pc, no engine mod and suspension

Thanks,thats what I thought it was,if it can work in australia..............

[Shaun P]

They are seperately run classes but at some events like Phillip Island there is no Superstock so they cross enter to superbike.

[FROSTY]

One reason is that the Wings thing is a complete show. There is not just some aircraft flying past the crowd, They have a whole show with food stands, sideshows of a sort, related clubs doing stuff, things for the kids etc etc etc.

-Sorry Stevey your entire post was too big to quote.
Have a look at -this thread----- http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?p=1294354#post1294354
Check the date it was started.
Without going into stupid politics over it I got into a power of shit because instead of starting the thread in the RACING forum I started it in GBR
My opinion is that people are asking the wrong question and to the wrong people.
I wanted to ask the NORMAL general biker population to say what would attract them to a national bike race event.
I think we need to first capture the imagination of the countrys bikers first then the petrolheads then maybee normal people

[svs]

They run a Privateers cup there in BSB, so if someone can dig up a set of their rules for who is one and who is not then that would be a good starting point.
So the upshot is, that it is possible for a Privateer to win both the NZSBK and the Privateers Cup titles.
.

British Superbike Cup
The British Superbike Cup is a very important part of BSB. It allows teams and riders of independent status to compete with recognition at the highest level of British Championship racing. Application for entry must be made to MSVR who will consider each application individually on its own merits using the following criteria:
1) Declaration by the team of no direct manufacturer assistance
2) The known ability of the rider
3) The motorcycle
4) The team operation, resources and structure
Note: points (2), (3) and (4) will be assessed as a combination
5) Other promotable elements e.g. media support
From 2010 any Cup class rider who has finished within the top 15 of the main BSB Championship within the preceding will be ineligible to compete in the BSB Cup.
MSVR will be the final arbiter regarding rider eligibility and acceptance.


from here (http://www.msvracing.co.uk/bsb.aspx)

Also intersteing to note are half the regs include team appearance (MUST wear uniform) and must support the event promoters and must make themselves available to media etc.

[Robert Taylor]

One reason is that the Wings thing is a complete show. There is not just some aircraft flying past the crowd, then landing and then another one, and then another one that looks a bit different, but is another aircraft, oh, and then another one, these look a bit different too, but they are bikes just like the other ones ......

Catch my drift?

They have a whole show with food stands, sideshows of a sort, related clubs doing stuff, things for the kids etc etc etc.

What do we do?

Bike racing and some shabby looking garages filled with some shabby and some flash looking bikes, shabby (on the whole) people and crap strewn from arsehole to breakfast.

Why, WHY would anyone who is not a bike nut want to pay money (at national level anyway) to come and see that when they have 2.5 kids and a missus who is not that keen to entertain at the same time?

Where are the retailers flogging off stuff?
Where are the distributors displaying bikes?
Where are the concession stands?
Where were the V8 simulators?
Where are the kids play areas?
Where is the decent, tasty, healthy food? Manfield is an utter disgrace in this regard!
Where are the smart teams and garages (like the RRR, Bernard and Team VB Racing setups)?

All these things add up to a show that people will want to come and be a part of, pay money for and tell their friends about.

"Oh there was some racing? Yeah it was fantastic, but did you see .......?"

I had a friend and her husband go to Manfield for NZSBK on my recommendation. They are self-confessed boguns, drive new Holdens and love motorsport. So are precisely the converts we are looking for.
Got to Manfield, put off coming in, right at the gate.
Managed that, wondered what was going on. No programme of events and times, just a little book with lists of names. No blurb, no preamble, no information about the history of NZSBK or anything.
No PA system.
Watched some races which they said were fantastic.
Wanted food, could only find pig-swill (my word), wanted to look at stuff and be informed and entertained, couldn't find anything.
Left after about 2 h.
Will not be coming back, nor recommending it to any friends.

There were issues with gear such as the PA. But you don't see the car people having the same issues do you. Preparation.

If we continue to do this only for ourselves then we will continue to get what we have always got.

If we decide to do it for the spectators and audiences AS WELL AS OURSELVES then we will grow the pie and more people and resources will flow.

Mindset change required.

It starts with the riders. ABSOLUTELY NO amount of money spent by organisers on advertising will change a fine product with crap packaging into a great product with fantastic packaging. (By packaging I mean all the stuff around the races themselves: team attire, bike presentation, garage presentation, deportment of riders and teams, banners, flags, concession stands, food, entertainment etc).

It is possible to grow any business and pay virtually nothing on advertising. Word of mouth and viral marketing do that for you. All you need to do is scrub up your offering and then acutally ask customers to recommend your offering to others. But if your offering is substandard (as our currently is) then it will not happen.

Enjoy.

Steve, that is totally on the money. Ill probably get a little vilified for saying this but we are also not doing enough to attract would be competitors that are well heeled monetarily. Maybe such people are afraid to do so because there will be an atmosphere of ''you rich pricks''. Before anyone goes off on a tirade I personally have a number of customers who are definitely anything but wealthy and to that end always go out of my way to find cost effective solutions. People irrespective of bank balance should be afforded the same courtesies.
Interesting about what you say about presentation. I thought ( for example ) that the pits at Ruapuna nationals round were not a pretty sight. Everyone has a responsibility to lift the level of presentation to in part attract more interest in the sport.