Ts/tf100

[Yow Ling]

I have a bucket with TF 100 motor. This motor is from Sketchys old bucket RG100, a Pete Sales engine. took it to the track today , did some jetting and messing round. It has a dark side It has wicked vibration about 5-6-7-8K (no tacho just guessing) then it comes smooth. this is the kind of vibration that turns your hands to jelly, im thinking the most likley suspect is the crank cant really be much else, before I put another crank in Is this just the way they are and I should harden up and weld the exhaust on better so it dosent fall off so quickly, or is this un-natural behavior that can be resolved easily?

[Buckets4Me]

have you asked Pete Sales about it ????
asuming he built the engine. Quick phone call may tell you it's normall
or you are in for a big rebuild :clap:

just a thought

[Buddha#81]

or you are in for a big rebuild :clap:

just a thought

Looks like you may have more than one rebuild Mr Ling!

[diesel pig]

Speedpro posted on another thread about getting aluminum stuffers put in the balancing holes in the crank of his TS100 motor, He did this to up the crankcase compression but did notice it smoothed out the motor too.;)

[speedpro]

They do that. Remember the motors are built as farm bikes and as such are designed to max out at about 5-7000rpm and are balanced accordingly. If you dismantle the engine and take the crank out you will see that each flywheel has two holes it, one each side of the crank pin. Press a slug of aluminium into each large hole and she'll be silky up round 10-11000rpm. It'll rock a bit down low but who cares. I got Pete to do it to mine and it worked great. Stopped things breaking off EVERY meeting.

The cranks are crap and it is a good idea to replace the mains with phenolic resin caged C3 bearings for reliability. The rods are all superseded to RM silver plated cage type kits so that's good. Don't go ballistic on the piston port they don't like it. Whatever you do leave the intake port bridge in. The pistons crack as it is and taking the bridge out is inviting disaster every 2nd meeting. I used RG400 rear pistons and found they were good for a couple of reasons. I used to spend quite a bit of time preparing the pistons before use which seemed to help reliability. PM me if you want some more info.

[speedpro]

Speedpro posted on another thread about getting aluminum stuffers put in the balancing holes in the crank of his TS100 motor, He did this to up the crankcase compression but did notice it smoothed out the motor too.;)

Actually i did it purely to rebalance the crank.

[Yow Ling]

Looks like you may have more than one rebuild Mr Ling!

My 4 stroke guy is on to it , not as bad as we first thought

[F5 Dave]

So is that still in the RG frame? I had a bit of a tussle with young Hooziwhatsit in the last race at the BOB on my 50. I think he beat me, I should have been well ahead but had crashed my brains out & broken some ribs as it turned out. Sketchy had a problem staying on it in those days:lol:. Was that one Goat's before I think. He was a hard charger on it.

[Yow Ling]

So is that still in the RG frame? I had a bit of a tussle with young Hooziwhatsit in the last race at the BOB on my 50. I think he beat me, I should have been well ahead but had crashed my brains out & broken some ribs as it turned out. Sketchy had a problem staying on it in those days:lol:. Was that one Goat's before I think. He was a hard charger on it.

We have had a round of musical frames, the RG50 frame now has a KV or KC100 or something, and the TF is in an old RG250 frame. Man you break yourself even more than me, and i thought I was doing it tough!

[F5 Dave]

Well at least I did mine racing motorcycles rather than loading them::Pokey:::

[Buddha#81]

Well at least I did mine racing motorcycles rather than loading them::Pokey:::

hehehehe......try getting it to the trailer......loading it would be far more stylee than crashing in the driveway!:rolleyes:

[Yow Ling]

Wernt we talking about cranks and stuff about bucket engines?

[Kickaha]

Wernt we talking about cranks and stuff about bucket engines?

Yes but a better opportunity to take the piss came up

[Buddha#81]

Yes but a better opportunity to take the piss came up

What he said......Like any KB thread, you will need to drag any useful info out of the BS:clap:

[Bren_chch]

wot did you decide to do in the end?

[Yow Ling]

wot did you decide to do in the end?

Borrow your TS100 bottom end?

Will pull it apart this weekend and clock the crank, maybe try another crank , maybe fit some plugs like Speedpro suggests

[Sketchy_Racer]

The question looming in my head is has that motor/bike claimed any more victims yet? I never did get on well with that bike and spent more time on my arse wondering what just happened!

[Yow Ling]

It claimed me at Nelson , then I replaced the rear shock which was the main problem. Got it some new forks brakes wheels etc Bren painted it and fitted a different engine Ill post a picture later

[Chambers]

It has a dark side It has wicked vibration about 5-6-7-8K (no tacho just guessing) then it comes smooth. this is the kind of vibration that turns your hands to jelly, im thinking the most likley suspect is the crank cant really be much else,

For what its worth. A picture of a TF and RM crank. Different balance factors.

TF on the left RM on the right.

.

[SHELRACING]

Whilst the experts are all here talking about vibration.

I had to reluctantly return the FXR motor I borrowed, and have just repowered the Delta with a Yamaha RX125 motor.

Had it running for the first time a couple of days ago and sorted the jetting. When I took it to the track for a few test laps. I had a similar vibration to the one described by Yow Ling. Right through the whole bike. making it difficult to ride.

I mounted the engine using the rear 2 mounts only and left the front mount off. I assumed it was an engine mount problem. Is it more likely to be a problem with the motor. Crank ? Bearings ? The motor sounds ok. with no undue noises. Come to think of it I have experienced vibration through an RX motor before, but not this bad

The bike is showing a lot of potential if I can get rid of the vibration.

[Korea]

It claimed me at Nelson , then I replaced the rear shock which was the main problem. Got it some new forks brakes wheels etc Bren painted it and fitted a different engine Ill post a picture later

Pictures man! Pictures!

[xwhatsit]

Not that I know shit, but I know when the top engine mount of my 250RS fell off (yes, it really did fall off, dunno where the hell it went), it began to vibrate like an absolute whore. So much so that other things started to vibrate off. Particularly about mid-range, but certainly lots more vibes throughout the whole range.

When I had the bike apart to do my steering head bearings last weekend, noticed the mount was missing and stole one from my spare chassis. It's now turbine-smooth again (well, as far as a single can be, but this engine is known for being pretty smooth).

So, anecdotally, maybe it's just an engine mount problem?

[speedpro]

Whilst the experts are all here talking about vibration.

I had to reluctantly return the FXR motor I borrowed, and have just repowered the Delta with a Yamaha RX125 motor.

Had it running for the first time a couple of days ago and sorted the jetting. When I took it to the track for a few test laps. I had a similar vibration to the one described by Yow Ling. Right through the whole bike. making it difficult to ride.

I mounted the engine using the rear 2 mounts only and left the front mount off. I assumed it was an engine mount problem. Is it more likely to be a problem with the motor. Crank ? Bearings ? The motor sounds ok. with no undue noises. Come to think of it I have experienced vibration through an RX motor before, but not this bad

The bike is showing a lot of potential if I can get rid of the vibration.
when I first fitted the TF engine to my RG50 chassis it vibrated REAL bad. I then made a better not so flexible front engine mount then it only vibrated bad. Then I rebalanced the crank and it didn't vibrate at all.

The front mount made a big differance. Without a good one it let the motor "start" vibrating then it just built up with revs.

[SHELRACING]

when I first fitted the TF engine to my RG50 chassis it vibrated REAL bad. I then made a better not so flexible front engine mount then it only vibrated bad. Then I rebalanced the crank and it didn't vibrate at all.

The front mount made a big differance. Without a good one it let the motor "start" vibrating then it just built up with revs.

Cheers speedpro, I remember your FZR / MB100 doesn't use a front engine mount. That's one reason I didn't bother. Do you notice any vibration through your FZR chassis.

I have removed the flywheel today, wondering if it will make a difference, but haven't run the motor yet. If that's no better I'll make up a front engine mount.

What is the method for checking and balancing the crank

[speedpro]

That MB bottom end is a bit different. I've removed the counter balancer which will make them vibe pretty badly, but, I rebalanced the crank to compensate. It does still vibrate but not too bad. At the moment I have no plans to change the balance factor again.
I doubt that removing the flywheel will affect vibration unless the rotor is unbalanced.
I actually did a "bit" of science to alter the balance on the MB but on my TS when I did it, all I did was note that it vibrated at high revs and therefore I had to reduce the counterbalance, which I did by pressing a slug of alloy into the larger hole in each crank wheel. Purely guesswork and a suck-it-and-see procedure. It just happened that it was pretty well spot-on. It'll be the same for all the motors we use as they are all being revved beyond the design intention. Remember as speed goes up the forces generated by the piston going up and down rise linearly but the forces generated by the crank rotating rise with a square law - 2X the speed & 4X the force. That's what you modify to rematch at higher revs.

[SHELRACING]

I'll just give the motor a quick run to see the difference with the flywheel off.

Looks like I'll be making an engine mount this weekend then. I have the basis for one already from the FXR motor, which incidently showed no vibrations at all. The trouble is the mount will end up being a bit heavy. I've dropped over 20kg changing the motor and was reluctant to put weight back on. Another reason for not making the front mount in the first place.

I have another gearbox/crank so I might pull it apart and take a look.

[SHELRACING]

Ran the bike yesterday and there was a big improvement throught the low - Mid range with the flywheel removed. Still vibrating through the top end but not so bad. Still going to make the front mount to see how that goes.

Running the motor with a YZ125 chamber, flywheel removed as well, motor feels very responsive. YZ chamber is awesome. :woohoo:

[Yow Ling]

I was sorting through some bits and pieces the other day and found this crank, seems sombody has already done the hard work and added the weights, just needs a rod kit and some bearings and we will be racing

[F5 Dave]

yeah you might consider running a wire brush over it as it looks like it was dredged from a sea wreck. Maybe some lapping paste for the flywheel or it will loosen (std flywheels should not be used if you intend to rev as they snap the crank end off, not sure if mentioned above). & autosol the seal surface of course.

So the later model 125 has the 6 speeder for some dumb reason.

[Yow Ling]

Yea its not super pretty is it. Maybe Ill run it under a cold tap. Ill get it back from the crankshaft guy tomorrow, pretty good service really I only took it in this afternoon. I think he feels sorry for me sometimes. It will get an early RM125 rotor on the end, and yea it does have the 6 speed although first is really not alot of good for anything.

[SS90]

Hmmm,

i am battling something similar at the moment, and think I have got it beaten....

As a matter of interest, how much does your flywheel weigh?

[Yow Ling]

Pictures man! Pictures!

The frame tank and seat are all that are left from the RG100

[SHELRACING]

Nice job. should be an interesting ride :2thumbsup

[Bren_chch]

RIDE??? you didnt say you were actually going to ride it!!! :shit:

[dangerous]

I have a bucket with TF 100 motor. This motor is from Sketchys old bucket RG100, a Pete Sales engine. took it to the track today , did some jetting and messing round. It has a dark side It has wicked vibration about 5-6-7-8K (no tacho just guessing) then it comes smooth. this is the kind of vibration that turns your hands to jelly, im thinking the most likley suspect is the crank cant really be much else, before I put another crank in Is this just the way they are and I should harden up and weld the exhaust on better so it dosent fall off so quickly, or is this un-natural behavior that can be resolved easily?

TonyBs GP is just like that, as said it seems to be what they do