Born not to ride?

[Maki]

Is it possible that some people should just stay away from bikes? Do some people just not have the coordination and or mindset needed to safely ride motorcycles? If so, where they born like that or did their uppbringing ruin them? Can they be helped to overcome their problems?

I thought I would throw up this topic since I came across the following thread on another forum. If you have any insights or stories that can shed light on this issue feel free...

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http://www.600rr.net/vb/showthread.php?t=134627

"He just bought a 08 zx-6r a few months ago, and completely wrecked it. I was there, and thought he was dead, it scared the **** outta me. The bike was obviously too much for his first bike.

So what does he do? Decides he wants to buy a brand new 09 ducati 848. As soon as I heard this, I knew it was a bad idea. Obviously if u can't handle a 6, don't go and get the 848!

SO, Before he could even come out to meet us, he called saying he laid it down. He bought it, and less than 24 hours, laid it down..."

[Burtha]

just have the first aid kit and be certified ready I guess ?! :eek:

[munterk6]

Yip..they're out there alright. This is precisely why HD riders should stay that way..a sweeping generalisation I know, but hey, have you seen a Harley rider get on a decent sports bike...........
Not pretty LOL :baby:

[Mom]

Yip..they're out there alright. This is precisely why HD riders should stay that way..a sweeping generalisation I know, but hey, have you seen a Harley rider get on a decent sports bike...........
Not pretty LOL :baby:

NO, but I have seen plenty of sports bike riders change to HD mate, you want to be a leetle bit careful there.

[slofox]

Don't get on the pillion seat with that dude in charge....(please note I did not say in control...

[SARGE]

yip..they're out there alright. This is precisely why hd riders should stay that way..a sweeping generalisation i know, but hey, have you seen a harley rider get on a decent sports bike...........
Not pretty lol :baby:

meh .. I grew up on harley's and indians back in the states .. Jump behind me and lets go up scenic drive some time and i'll let you rethink that statement

[Str8 Jacket]

I thought I would throw up this topic since I came across the following thread on another forum. If you have any insights or stories that can shed light on this issue feel free...


She'll be right mate. He obviously just needs a little more practice...

[Duke girl]

How can a ZX 6R be his 1st bike as I thought your 1st bike has to be any bike 250cc and under.
Y is it that there are riders out there who go out and buy themselves big cc bikes as there 1st bike and think that they are bullet proof whilst riding them.
Starting at the bottom of the ladder and moving your way up when starting to ride for the 1st time is the proper way of doing it.
With experience and confidence, there will be plenty of time to finally reach the bigger cc bike and know that when you have reached that time you have gone about it the right way.

[Maki]

This was in the USA. They have the freedoom to buy whatever they want as their first bike....

[Mystic13]

Yep, some folks shouldn't ride. My brother kept falling off and finally gave it away. I'd be behind him heading down the road and his head would swivel and follow some lady down the road. There he'd be looking back and riding forward.

I could never figure how he came off so much though. It wasn't like he was pushing the limits.

Unlike another guy I worked with who rode and he fell off about once a week but he rode well past the bikes limits. I remember being behind him in the wet 20 years ago when tyres were crap and he'd be so far leaned over it was amazing to watch for a corner or two before he disappeared into the distance.

My second oldest daughter struggled to learn to drive and my 3rd oldest was a natural. She just instinctively knows. Both have been like that since I first saw them in pedal cars.

I wish your friend well and if you've said your bit and they still go for it then that's there call.

[Paulo]

Yes some people just have no natural balance, sense of momentum or any spacial awareness, You'd hope that some-one like this would have at least hurt themselves enough on bicycles or rollar skates or whatever in their life to rule out motorbikes as a sensible option. To most people this stuff comes naturally and their abilities improve further with experience.

Reminds me of a guy I knew who was dead set on being a dj, he bought all the gear, turnatables mixers loads of vinyl and at the end of the day he sucked, I realized why, when I heard him trying to clap in time, he couldn't! he just had no sense of rythm at all. zilch it was pretty funny.

[Big Dave]

Absolutely there are people who should not ride - tell them so and call it an 'intervention'.

>>a sweeping generalisation I know<<

Not at all! It's preposterous. :-P

[Conquiztador]

Yip..they're out there alright. This is precisely why HD riders should stay that way..a sweeping generalisation I know, but hey, have you seen a Harley rider get on a decent sports bike...........
Not pretty LOL :baby:

Red bling given. Because I can. :laugh: To consider your self superior to someone else normally ends in tears. Most Harley riders have been there done that and does not need to prove anything to anyone.:blank:

[Maki]

Take it easy with the HD vs the rest stuff... The thread was meant to be about NATURAL ability. I reckon you need a fair bit of that to safely ride a Harley... :shifty:

[BM-GS]

Yup, some can, some just can't, others just shouldn't.

Some like the idea, but can't do the practical. You can see this every day on the roads with cages. Some only drive because there's no other way for them to get from where they are to where they have to get to on the same day if they were to rely on public transport, and the roads would be safer if these folk were allowed to do that. Not to mention less clogged with thjose others who'd rather be reading the paper without the steering wheel getting in the way.

Having said that, we all have our moments...

[kevfromcoro]

had a mate like that
couldnt ride 50 mtrs without arsing off.
but dont give up.a bit of tuition may help

[MarkH]

To most people this stuff comes naturally and their abilities improve further with experience.

Yep that's me, I had no problem riding a bike as a kid, it came pretty easy.


Reminds me of a guy I knew who was dead set on being a dj, he bought all the gear, turnatables mixers loads of vinyl and at the end of the day he sucked, I realized why, when I heard him trying to clap in time, he couldn't! he just had no sense of rythm at all. zilch it was pretty funny.

That's me too. :o
I realized while still at school that even while listening to a song on a walkman I couldn't carry a tune well enough to sing along to it. Of course I am smart enough to realise my limitations and have never tried to be a DJ.

[SARGE]

This was in the USA. They have the freedoom to buy whatever they want as their first bike....

and we do.....

i built mine out of shit stuffed in boxes.. shovelhead .. springer forks .. sporty frame .. fatbob tank..




Still looked better than Skiddy's Streetfighter

[Headbanger]

My cousin fell off 4 times in three weeks, Then we buried him.

[Weta]

I was thinking about this, sort of, today as I followed a woman home in a station wagon whose mind was obviously elsewhere. I was in my car, by the way, but couldn't help notiing that she just didn't scan ahead at all, reacting to things like blocked lanes or merges when they were in her face. As a biker you just instinctively are more aware of whats going on and I think this transfers into any driving situation.
I'd hate to think of that woman on a bike. I'm not the best rider out there but at least I pay attention.
I had a converstion recently with a non biker re 'zoning out' y'know when you drift off when driving (a car) and suddenly think 'shit I can't remember the last 5 kms" I said that NEVER happens on a bike. NEVER

[Motu]

We had the freedom to ride whatever we wanted as our first bike too....and to wear no helmet.The sad thing is,they are too scared to go back to those days...they want to be wrapped in cotton wool so they can't hurt themselves.

[Ixion]

freedom to ride whatever we wanted. Just not the money to buy it!

[Gareth51]

We had the freedom to ride whatever we wanted as our first bike too....and to wear no helmet.The sad thing is,they are too scared to go back to those days...they want to be wrapped in cotton wool so they can't hurt themselves.

And now we have a country fill of whimps

[BM-GS]

I had a converstion recently with a non biker re 'zoning out' y'know when you drift off when driving (a car) and suddenly think 'shit I can't remember the last 5 kms" I said that NEVER happens on a bike. NEVER

Spot on mate. Mrs GS used to mention doing that coming home from work, then she got her bike lic and started to worry about others doing it. Sadly, it got me today. But now I'm aware of it and wont let it happen again. Get thee behind me Satan!

I was talking to a cage-owner about my old commute to work and how I lane split this way sometimes & that way sometimes, or not at all, depending on what the traffic was doing. He said that it sounded like I had to do a lot of thinking. I figured he didn't do a lot of that behind the wheel...

[CookMySock]

I see plenty of people who don't have the basics down, and now they are damned to a life of not being able to steer. No matter what remedial training they get I do not think they can undo their old brain patterns. That first hour on the bike sets everything in place forever.

Getting a fright mid-corner and locking up not being able to steer kills or frightens lots and lots of bikers - some of them get off the bike and stay off it, and some of them crash and crash.

Steve

[Supermac Jr]

[QUOTE=Duke girl;2008437].
Y is it that there are riders out there who go out and buy themselves big cc bikes as there 1st bike and think that they are bullet proof whilst riding them.
QUOTE]

because they don't know what they don't know - looking back when I started (just the other day), it quickly became clear that a 250 is the max (law etc). At first i wanted to get a 500-600cc thinking 'its not a 1000'. Since getting my bike i quickly realised that its not that difficult to get into trouble very quickly - but with the 250 the risk is much smaller (still there but more forgiving)

I learn everyday things that i don't know/realise (the experience thing).
IMO: zero experience + big cc = OUCH

[MarkH]

IMO: zero experience + big cc = OUCH

Not always OUCH - some times it equals no OUCH at all, ever!

There was a story in the paper a few years back, a young asian guy came to NZ and bought a very fast & powerful car - he slid into a service station at high speed, hitting someone. They reported at the scene he was saying something like "no stopping, no stopping" (this is all from memory, so don't shoot me if I don't have the details 100%). It seems that he got going very fast and when he applied the brakes it didn't stop right away - momentum takes time to disappear. If he didn't understand stopping distances and how dangerous the speed he was travelling was, how would he have done on a fast bike instead? I would guess that on a fast bike the fool would have had an 80%+ chance of death!

With experience and practise and training most people could become competent motorcyclists. With a learning period on a 250cc, followed by a couple of years on a 600cc, a good rider could go on to ride a 1000cc bike and not kill themselves. A newby on a GSXR1000 needs to be lucky to survive his first week of riding, NZ laws restricting the learner bike to 250cc may annoy some - but they beat US laws allowing someone to try to learn riding a bike on a 1000cc racer.

[madbikeboy]

Not always OUCH - some times it equals no OUCH at all, ever!

There was a story in the paper a few years back, a young asian guy came to NZ and bought a very fast & powerful car - he slid into a service station at high speed, hitting someone. They reported at the scene he was saying something like "no stopping, no stopping" (this is all from memory, so don't shoot me if I don't have the details 100%). It seems that he got going very fast and when he applied the brakes it didn't stop right away - momentum takes time to disappear. If he didn't understand stopping distances and how dangerous the speed he was travelling was, how would he have done on a fast bike instead? I would guess that on a fast bike the fool would have had an 80%+ chance of death!

With experience and practise and training most people could become competent motorcyclists. With a learning period on a 250cc, followed by a couple of years on a 600cc, a good rider could go on to ride a 1000cc bike and not kill themselves. A newby on a GSXR1000 needs to be lucky to survive his first week of riding, NZ laws restricting the learner bike to 250cc may annoy some - but they beat US laws allowing someone to try to learn riding a bike on a 1000cc racer.

To be honest, even the jump from a 250 to a 600 is a big 'un. Putting this in perspective, a 600 with good pilot on board will be tough for a 1000 to keep up with, let alone overtake on tight twisties. Of course, there are exceptions, I'm sure Rossi could have ridden a GSXR1000 turbo as his first bike with no trouble...

I reckon the danger period of bike ownership is that first 90 days - that's the point where you think you've got it sussed, and overconfidence clashes with intention and ability...

[Anarkist]

NO, but I have seen plenty of sports bike riders change to HD mate, you want to be a leetle bit careful there.

It's called old ages.
Specifically, the bit where your balls shrink and the testosterone production is downregulated :p

[my_r32]

To be honest, even the jump from a 250 to a 600 is a big 'un. Putting this in perspective, a 600 with good pilot on board will be tough for a 1000 to keep up with, let alone overtake on tight twisties.
It sure is. I jumped from a 125 to a 600, blew myself away on the test ride, but after that when I bought the bike, my biker mentality kicked in and it told me to take it easy till I get used to the darn thing. Had the bike for 5 months now and only just got it up to 11.5grand in 2nd or 3rd gear, and I'm going for a blat around a track on sat, to learn more aboutme and my bikes abilities. I dont think a n00b should be on a big bike for a few years until they have the basics down pat.

I will agree that many people pick things up easily and naturally, and many others dont. Me = I taught myself how to ride a motorbike, picked it up real easy, only needed a couple of tips and have learnt everything else so far just from riding. Same with learning to drive a cage....and most other things like sports for example.
......and then theres the people with 2 left feet


But I'm also kinda tone deaf, can keep rhythm tho:whistle:

[FROSTY]

Being a dad of a passle of kids im lucky enough to see the full spectrum of riding "skills" from newbee riders.
One lad doesn't have natural ability but he sees a problem with his riding and practices untill he gets it right.
Another lad has natural ability which gets him out of the trouble his overcooking matters gets him into.
The third boy doesnt listen doesnt have a lot of natural skill and has to win so he crashes A LOT
The youngest knows hes not all that flash at riding but he doesn't crash because he rides within his ability all the time

Im kinda hoping they get the crashing bit out of their system before old enough to go on the road

[DarkLord]

Yet another reason why the US needs a cc restriction rule when it comes to people buying their first bikes.

Indeed, this guy maybe a total moron, but he'd have much less of a chance of severely hurting himself if he started on a 250.

[Little Miss Trouble]

With experience and practise and training most people could become competent motorcyclists. With a learning period on a 250cc, followed by a couple of years on a 600cc, a good rider could go on to ride a 1000cc bike and not kill themselves. A newby on a GSXR1000 needs to be lucky to survive his first week of riding, NZ laws restricting the learner bike to 250cc may annoy some - but they beat US laws allowing someone to try to learn riding a bike on a 1000cc racer.

Have to disagree there, I've recently met a guy riding a shiny new ZX-10, which he rides very well, so well that I thought his mates were having me on when they said hes only been riding for 8 weeks

[DarkLord]

There are always going to be those with natural talent for riding who will just be able to get on a ZX-10 and not have any problems.

I'd be willing to bet that's not most of us though. I think the US should re-evaluate their laws when it comes to that sort of thing.

[Okey Dokey]

Just thought I'd mention that each of the USA's 50 states has it's own laws regarding licencing. Without researching, probably many of them DO have a graduated style system. Maybe someone on here knows for sure...

[MarkH]

Have to disagree there, I've recently met a guy riding a shiny new ZX-10, which he rides very well, so well that I thought his mates were having me on when they said hes only been riding for 8 weeks

Ahh, but there's the rub - the laws are set for average Joe, there will always be exceptions. But please tell me, if what I said isn't true then why were you surprised that this guy you met on the ZX-10 had only been riding 8 weeks? Could it be that you also find it rare that someone without much experience could handle a 1000cc bike?

I think that despite a few talented individuals that could go straight to a big bike, it is better to have a graduated system so that the other 99% don't kill themselves.

[Little Miss Trouble]

Ahh, but there's the rub - the laws are set for average Joe, there will always be exceptions. But please tell me, if what I said isn't true then why were you surprised that this guy you met on the ZX-10 had only been riding 8 weeks? Could it be that you also find it rare that someone without much experience could handle a 1000cc bike?

I think that despite a few talented individuals that could go straight to a big bike, it is better to have a graduated system so that the other 99% don't kill themselves.

When I said 'so well' I meant reasonably sensibly (sensible after all is a relative term depending on your views) and within his abilities.

If I'd had the money and didn't care about the other consequences of being caught riding outside license conditions would I have still been riding the GPX? hell no, would I still be here? probably, its all about controlling the right hand.

How about making it up to the individual to decide what they can and can't handle, and stop wrapping people in cotton wool. A moron is going to be a moron on a 250 or 1000cc

[MarkH]

How about making it up to the individual to decide what they can and can't handle, and stop wrapping people in cotton wool. A moron is going to be a moron on a 250 or 1000cc

I agree about morons being morons, and really morons shouldn't ride bikes at all. But if someone lacks experience and doesn't take enough care then the potential for disaster is greater on a thou than a too-fitty.

The big problem is that there are morons that would kill other people if we let them do what they want, the laws are not only for the protection of the moron riders (darwin bless 'em).

[Little Miss Trouble]

So why not turn our joke of a driver licensing system into an actual driver training programme so people learn in a safer environment rather than being thrown out on the road with 5 minutes experience and being expected to figure it out for themselves?

[Aaron_newrider]

Yep that's me, I had no problem riding a bike as a kid, it came pretty easy.



That's me too. :o
I realized while still at school that even while listening to a song on a walkman I couldn't carry a tune well enough to sing along to it. Of course I am smart enough to realise my limitations and have never tried to be a DJ.

Mate, your partner is lucky, I can't carry a tune to save myself but I still sing along at the top of my lungs! Should see me in the car with a broken stereo!

Some people just fall, fall and fall again. Some people can't drive, catch the bus, it'll save you life :)