Got hit by a car and getting reemed again..

[Capt M Stubbing]

after nearly twenty years and four hundred thousand ks, i had a guy in ute drive into me. the bright yellow lid and blazing headlights on my 03 R1 didnt help. 2 weeks in hos and broken shoulder, wrist arm , thumb and a lot of bruising later..i got to see my R1, wow, no front, he missed my knee by about 10cm, the rim was peeled open, the headers were squashed flat against the head. i'm lucky to be alive.
Now his insurance company want to devalue my lid, jacket, gloves... my argument is that i wouldnt need to buy new ones if that prick had of looked!.
whats the deal? surely i should be put back to prior the accident? with no cost to me?
has anyone had this issue or knows how to sort it? any help is greatly appriciated, but expect slow replies, i got both arms in casts.
regards Ben

[pritch]

Sorry to read of your misfortune. Have you asked your insurance company what they think? They are supposed to know about these things...

Failing that, I think there are people on KB who work in the industry and should be able to help.

[Capt M Stubbing]

I'm chasing it, i was more wonmdering if this is the norm to devalue everything, even if the cops blame the other chap.
Tuesday has a lot of calls lined up...
thanks

[A_Mans_Ruin]

Dam, that shit sux!
Yeah I agree with Pritch, ring your insurance tell them ya gears been totalled and your gona claim on it...
They will probably chase the other guy or his insurance company for the $$$.
Anyways, hope it all works out for ya...
Rest up and Heal well.

[Patch]

his insurance company want to devalue my lid, jacket, gloves...
quite common.

I'd be paying more attention to what your own ins. company is doing for you tho, that is why you pay them.

[bsasuper]

Its their job to pay you as little as possible, DONT accept anything less than what you had,TELL your ins company what you expect and put it in writing.

[tommygun]

Its their job to pay you as little as possible, DONT accept anything less than what you had,TELL your ins company what you expect and put it in writing.

+1 to that and take a note of names and times you talked to some one. Nothing worse than ringing back again and they ask who you spoke to etc. Detail is everything!

Good luck.

[Capt M Stubbing]

right, but is it help from my bike insurance (kiwibike) or from my contents insurance (ami)?
my contents is the same as the car driver and its AMI that want to depresheate it.

[Patch]

right, but is it help from my bike insurance (kiwibike) or from my contents insurance (ami)?
my contents is the same as the car driver and its AMI that want to depresheate it.
your policy should state whether it is replacement value or market value

[Capt M Stubbing]

while i got out of hos, i spoke to the cop in charge, he said it didnt matter weather i had insurance, as it was the other guys fault, and to claim on him...but its still through my insurance company..right?

[dipshit]

while i got out of hos, i spoke to the cop in charge, he said it didnt matter weather i had insurance, as it was the other guys fault, and to claim on him...but its still through my insurance company..right?

Ysually your insurance company fixes you up then covers its costs by getting the money back off the other guy or his insurance company.

You deal with your insurance company and let them worry about getting the money off the other guy.

[_Shrek_]

while i got out of hos, i spoke to the cop in charge, he said it didnt matter weather i had insurance, as it was the other guys fault, and to claim on him...but its still through my insurance company..right?

good to see you're alive CMS

my gear was fully replaced after my acc.. & my pants & helmet were up graded because they could not get the same ones for one reason or another, but at no cost to me,

my understanding is that if the gear is over five years old they put a value on it, but in this case you were not at fault therefore it must be replace in the same condition or better

pm timg he's into ins see what he can do for ya

cheers Shrek

[thepom]

I had no insurance when the asian driver opened his car door on me,he got a ticket from the cop,s but his company refused to pay,I had to threaten them with the small claims court to get any money and they still did not give me full worth as they said my helmet was second hand -six weeks old and a receipt for 1100 bucks,so I claimed for my spectacles too which have to be paid in full so worked out in the end,insurance companies----I shit them...

[mikeey01]

Ben,
This sucks big time dude.
I feel ya pain as I've been there before.

Shit like this really pisses me off....
What part of any of this was your fault? none.
Yet you have to wear the loss of income, the loss of use (wrist) and the pain in the short term.. long term affects, who knows.

Now his insurance company is trying to be cheap skates?
Dam I wish we could sue the bastards that do shit like this!

Shrek's onto it in his PM, nothing should be at your cost. Get a bike shop to support you for replacement leathers / helmet and the value of yours... chances are, as in most cases leathers de-value by stuff all!

[Fatjim]

As its his fault, you don't need to claim through your insurance neccesarily, they'll tell you you do but you're not legelly bound to deal with your insurance company. You can deal directly with the guy/his insurance company (even though they're the same as your one. You could take him to small claims for the loss (not your bike though as its worth too much).

[Matt_TG]

Here's my take on things, Capt'n.

1. If you are insured claim through your insurance and they seek recovery of costs from the other person. You don't have to deal with the other party at all. In fact you should have a quicker process dealing with your insurers as a third party insurer is not bound to do anything 'quickly'. Of course you don't have to use your insurance, but ...

2. A third party's financial legal liability is "what the property is worth at the time". Not what it's worth to you, but a fair market value. You cannot claim new for old when you chase costs through the courts. Otherwise I'd imagine all these people chasing at fault drivers up for new cars every time there's an accident and theirs is written off. It doesn't buy you a new helmet / jacket etc but the law doesn't intend to buy you that, just compensate you for its value. It doesn't matter who's fault it is - fault doesn't change the value of something or change what you think something is worth.

3. So you claim on your insurance. Your insurer will probably want to pay you a market value for clothing too. You can't really groan at that as you will have agreed to the basis of settlement for those items when you took out the policy. You didn't read it? Oh, shame, not that it makes any difference to your position now. Insurance is intended to put you back financially in a position you were before the loss. Nowdays companies offer all sorts of goodies, like replacement / new for old etc on many items, but clothing, sports equipment etc generally stays with the indemnity principal of insurance.

4. You'll get the replies from those who have been 'screwed' when they got what they were entitled to but they felt they were entitled to more. It's not fair that you suffered a loss due to someone elses numb-nutness but you either had insurance and knew (or should have known) what would happen when this occurs or didn't have insurance and took the risk that this would happen.

5. I would deal with KiwiBike first. See if they cover your clothing / accessories. Sometimes the specialist bike cover will be better than your standard domestic contents policy. Then perhaps see what AMI will cover. Just beware that AMI will probably want to back out of matters if the gear is insured elsewhere...

Good luck Capt'n, hope things work out for you

Matt

[Suzi Q]

Here's my take on things, Capt'n.

1. If you are insured claim through your insurance and they seek recovery of costs from the other person. You don't have to deal with the other party at all. In fact you should have a quicker process dealing with your insurers as a third party insurer is not bound to do anything 'quickly'. Of course you don't have to use your insurance, but ...

2. A third party's financial legal liability is "what the property is worth at the time". Not what it's worth to you, but a fair market value. You cannot claim new for old when you chase costs through the courts. Otherwise I'd imagine all these people chasing at fault drivers up for new cars every time there's an accident and theirs is written off. It doesn't buy you a new helmet / jacket etc but the law doesn't intend to buy you that, just compensate you for its value. It doesn't matter who's fault it is - fault doesn't change the value of something or change what you think something is worth.

3. So you claim on your insurance. Your insurer will probably want to pay you a market value for clothing too. You can't really groan at that as you will have agreed to the basis of settlement for those items when you took out the policy. You didn't read it? Oh, shame, not that it makes any difference to your position now. Insurance is intended to put you back financially in a position you were before the loss. Nowdays companies offer all sorts of goodies, like replacement / new for old etc on many items, but clothing, sports equipment etc generally stays with the indemnity principal of insurance.

4. You'll get the replies from those who have been 'screwed' when they got what they were entitled to but they felt they were entitled to more. It's not fair that you suffered a loss due to someone elses numb-nutness but you either had insurance and knew (or should have known) what would happen when this occurs or didn't have insurance and took the risk that this would happen.

5. I would deal with KiwiBike first. See if they cover your clothing / accessories. Sometimes the specialist bike cover will be better than your standard domestic contents policy. Then perhaps see what AMI will cover. Just beware that AMI will probably want to back out of matters if the gear is insured elsewhere...

Good luck Capt'n, hope things work out for you

Matt


I completely agree with Matt, I work in the industry and this is how it works. If you want to check out insurers then David Golightly insurance services is a good place to start as his policy covers clothing and helmets. He is based in CHCH and the insurance is through Vero. He is the best!!!!

[red675]

I'm chasing it, i was more wonmdering if this is the norm to devalue everything, even if the cops blame the other chap.
thanks
yes it is (the norm: to factor in the age of depreciating assets like clothing to assess their value, just like your bike) - and whereas your policy could provide for new for old you can't expect someone else's insurance to do likewise - did you have clothing cover on your insurance, if so then maybe your company will provide new for old and the other side will be forced to compensate them at a similar level

[MarkH]

If your own insurance policy covers you for replacement cost then you should have no problems getting a new helmet, even if it doesn't then you should still put it straight to them that there is NO way you are willing to accept a 2nd hand helmet as a replacement for your fucked one. You should NEVER get a 2nd hand helmet, this is a safety issue! Due to the accident you have to replace your helmet, a 2nd hand one can NOT be trusted so therefore you need to go out and buy a new helmet, insist that the insurance company pays for it fully. They will try and pay you less, don't accept it, they save money by people not being willing to argue the point with them - don't be a sucker, stick to your guns!

[Capt M Stubbing]

thanks for your feedback, i'll be writing a letter to each insurance company (bike/contents), so there is no mistake about what i want.
thanks again.
next bike??? something with a turbo!!! and jump the farker

[discotex]

When I went through this I got replacement cost of my gear minus depreciation (I think it was ~15% off the original price as they were a year old). I thought that was a fair way to approach it.

It took a while to get the contents insurer to understand that the accident was someone else's fault and that I wouldn't be paying an excess though :doh:

[Capt M Stubbing]

i have just read my policy for riders equipment, and its market value...oh dear.
do i have a shot a claiming against the other chap to bring it up to replacement? or even through small claims?

[Matt_TG]

Replied to your PM Captn. Give that line of thought a go :)

For anyone here that may be able to assist...

You could argue that the "value" of your lid was its replacement cost, as you should never buy a secondhand helmet. If you can prove to them that you cannot get an identical one as in as good of a condition as yours on the secondhand market then the measure of 'indemnity' may not necessarily be the depreciated value. You should be put back into the financial position you were before the accident. Your argument is that in order to protect your head to the same standard would be to buy a new lid, as there is not a readily available secondhand market - because people generally hang on to their lids till this sort of thing happens.

Can someone provide info to support the "do not buy a secondhand helmet" argument to help Captn prove that the indemnity value of his helmet is actually replacement?

[dieseldave]

I was recently involved in a car accident on an intersection.
Thiis is what I did.
Contacted my insurance company within 48 hours. I was lucky enough to have had a short stay in hospital. Explained the circumstances to them and eventually told them the police incident number after receiving that from the police.
The rest of it is left to the insurance companies to fight out themselves and it hinges on who was in the right or wrong..
If charges are made and it sounds like there will be you may eventually be given a victim impact report which allows you to express the inconvenience to you of being involved in the accident. This is used for sentencing but the police will explain all this to you.
So first and most important thing is to contact your insurance company. The follow on is pretty much automatic. Concentrate on mending!

[Capt M Stubbing]

i finally got my meeting with the police. they took down an accident report from me and filled in the blanks for me. Demographically, over 60 years males dont pay attention. i was hit by a 70 year old guy who was going home for lunch and didnt look properly. several witnesses saw me riding smoothly and then watched this guy just turn into me. they couldnt believe it. The cop was a nice chap, and went through the process. Looks like the guy is going to get nailed, but apparently was very shocked and wobbly himself.
Surgery is booked for this thursday, i looking forward to another step out of the way. thanks for support and feedback.

[Rayray401]

i finally got my meeting with the police. they took down an accident report from me and filled in the blanks for me. Demographically, over 60 years males dont pay attention. i was hit by a 70 year old guy who was going home for lunch and didnt look properly. several witnesses saw me riding smoothly and then watched this guy just turn into me. they couldnt believe it. The cop was a nice chap, and went through the process. Looks like the guy is going to get nailed, but apparently was very shocked and wobbly himself.
Surgery is booked for this thursday, i looking forward to another step out of the way. thanks for support and feedback.

thats exactly what happened to me 2 years ago when i was still on my learners @@..except this guy was 93..i escaped with only a few stitches and 2 twisted ankles though...get better dude! hope everything goes well! ^^

[Capt M Stubbing]

im totally out of hospital now, and the 29 staples have been removed.
what have i learnt? get a cop bike, and leave the flashing light on and get private medical insurance. i should be back on a bike within a few months. time to go shopping for a bargin.:woohoo:

[NOMIS]

I'm chasing it, i was more wonmdering if this is the norm to devalue everything, even if the cops blame the other chap.
Tuesday has a lot of calls lined up...
thanks

lie and tell them its worth more to make up for it, get quotes from companies for the "upgrade" version of you gear. - but hey. good luck with it they marked down all of my gear when i got hit my a car to. :argh:

[robboh]

It does just kind of suck at times when they dont consider your gear to be worth much, but its still actually going to cost you $$$ personally to put yourself back to a similar MATERIAL (not financial) position as to where you were prior to an accident, that wasnt any fault of your own.

Eg. Say you brought a top-of-the-line Shoei 18 months ago for $1100, and it was in perfect nick the day of the accident, and its still current model, etc. But they only give you $750 'market value' for it.

So, to achieve a similar position to where you were prior, a top-of-the-line Shoei, you now have to go and SPEND an additional $350.

OR you end up paying the $800 to buy the RF1000 instead, which ISNT the top-of-the-line.

Understand how it works etc, but its still something that is a bit on the nose if you are going through that process.

[CookMySock]

i have just read my policy for riders equipment, and its market value...oh dear. do i have a shot a claiming against the other chap to bring it up to replacement? or even through small claims?I wouldn't bother even talking to his insurance company, or yours.

I'd make a (large, long, and expensive) list of shit that got broken, and get one of your expensive business-looking mates go around there and sit him down at his kitchen table and politely and kindly tell him, that if he doesn't come up with the cash in 28 days you will file against him in the small claims court, and then after that you will file an order in the district court to have payment enforced, and if he still doesn't pay every cent of it (you are not a bank) you and your mates will move to stage two. And then say "ok bro, you better give me a ring at the end of the week, ok?"

Don't do it yourself unless you can pull it off. You need a rather well-dressed an intimidating business person, or well, just an intimidating person. Don't threaten. Just tell him. Threatening comes later. ;)

Enough fucking around. Whats yours is yours, not his.

Steve

[MarkH]

It does just kind of suck at times when they dont consider your gear to be worth much, but its still actually going to cost you $$$ personally to put yourself back to a similar MATERIAL (not financial) position as to where you were prior to an accident, that wasnt any fault of your own.

Eg. Say you brought a top-of-the-line Shoei 18 months ago for $1100, and it was in perfect nick the day of the accident, and its still current model, etc. But they only give you $750 'market value' for it.

So, to achieve a similar position to where you were prior, a top-of-the-line Shoei, you now have to go and SPEND an additional $350.

OR you end up paying the $800 to buy the RF1000 instead, which ISNT the top-of-the-line.

Understand how it works etc, but its still something that is a bit on the nose if you are going through that process.

Does anyone know what policies the insurance companies offer? I figure that if you had replacement cost insurance on your gear then in the event of someone causing an accident and damaging your gear, you could claim for the replacement cost then let your insurance company sort out finances with the at-fault driver (or their insurance co.).

I figure with a helmet they are generally good until they absorb an impact, but you can't really be sure of a 2nd hand one - so you need to buy a new one when you replace a damaged one. If you might go for 3 years, then have an off and damage the helmet - that is 3 years of use then replace with new. If after 2 years some dick pulls out in front of you causing a crash and damaging your helmet, then a year later you have an off and have to replace the helmet again - you have bought 1 more helmet due to the dick that failed to give way. That makes you poorer by one brand new helmet - I wouldn't think it is unreasonable to receive sufficient payment to buy a brand new helmet. My thinking is that generally* a helmet is good or not - good before a crash and not good afterwards. So for most riders the helmet was not partially worn out before the crash, therefore depreciating it for age leaves the rider having to find some money to pay the difference between the payout and the cost of a new helmet.

[dogsnbikes]

depends on your company and terms

my riding gear is covered by my contents helmet is full replacement and the remaining gear is depreciation and is common with insurance companies...

last year I had to replace my gear at first they were going to devalue the gear by 40% but that was reduced to 10% by getting letters from bike shops that knew the condition of my gear even if it was 2 years old

you will find they will be reasonable

[Capt M Stubbing]

I'm still alive, as bad as i thought my smash was, everytime i got back to hospital for a check-up i see much worse off blokes, and they are thanking thier stars because they have seen other guys in even worse states.
Insurance had almost been sorted. Got me a new Schurbert lid with built-in sunvisor. and a new BMW jacket, just like Ewan and Charlie. cool, now i'm a Ewan wannabe! I wish i had this jacket on, the backprotector is three times better than in my older Jacket. Anyway, thanks for the responses and comments. Ride safe, but looked double and expect the nothing from old blokes in utes, even when you have write-of-way!!
thanks, Regards Capt M Stubbing. The Love Boat!

[mossy1200]

Two quotes for replacement value from bike shops required if you dispute the insurance companies valuation.In writing and they will fold.Same goes for vehicle that you dispute insurance valuation after accident.

[scracha]

your policy should state whether it is replacement value or market value

Doesn't apply. He's making a claim against the other guy and this is refunded by the other guy's insurance.

[Boob Johnson]

im totally out of hospital now, and the 29 staples have been removed.
what have i learnt? get a cop bike, and leave the flashing light on and get private medical insurance. i should be back on a bike within a few months. time to go shopping for a bargin.:woohoo:
Nice one :niceone:

Sorry to read about your plight! I got taken out nearly two years ago to the day by an 18 year old female learner license holder pulling out in front of me. Her insurance company requested my my insurance details to which I quickly refused citing why they needed to be involved at all? Has nothing to do with them I said. They must have taken this as a sign of "don't mess this one around" as they (quickly) paid me $300 more than I paid for the bike (even when I told them how much I paid for it 5 months prior) & never battered an eye lid at the value I stated over the phone for replacing my gear. A cheque arrived in the mail shortly afterwards & that was that! Couldn't have been an easier process if they tried!

Some insurance companies just suck I guess

[Katman]

They must have taken this as a sign of "don't mess this one around"

:rofl:<hgvhgvhjv>

[firefighter]

depends on your company and terms

my riding gear is covered by my contents helmet is full replacement

Who is that through?

[dogsnbikes]

Who is that through?

psis Assetcare

[Pixie]

right, but is it help from my bike insurance (kiwibike) or from my contents insurance (ami)?
my contents is the same as the car driver and its AMI that want to depresheate it.

Don't let them depresheate it.It sounds horrible and I don't know what it means.