Random thoughts on rider visibility

[phaedrus]

i just had a rather odd idea. if we were to use the colouring and patterns of poisonous animals would people be less likely to ignore/not see us?
after all, you wouldn't ignore this happy fellow http://www.stetson.edu/~pmay/woodruff/sking.jpg


is this crazy enough to work? or should I lay off the coffee.

[MSTRS]

I see your point but feel compelled to respond with "Stick with the coffee & give the LSD a miss"

[Waylander]

Why is it that when I see that pisture I think Gixxer? Would look pretty good on one of them bikes I think.

[MSTRS]

Why is it that when I see that pisture I think Gixxer? Would look pretty good on one of them bikes I think.
Gixxers - the bikes with bite. New sales pitch WT??

[MacD]

You mean something like this?

The Violator (http://www.teknicgear.com/catalog.php?styleid=1&pid=3) -as worn by certain KB members (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=7834&highlight=violator)! ;)


(what marketing genius came up with that name!?)

[phaedrus]

You mean something like this?

yea, that look about right.

[Timber020]

In summer I often wear my motocross helmet on my 750 since its cooler and it doesnt matter so much if it gets sweaty and grimey inside after a days work.

It has a second more interesting advantage as it has a pattern on it that makes it look like a big skull with two big black eyes on it. I have noticed that cars seem to see me more and are less likely to cut me off while wearing it. It could be that instint of keeping an eye out for and avoid a big set of eyes bearing down on you. But it really does make a difference!
Also I find I can lanesplit, speed, cut people off and generally be completely unsocial and not have a problem as long as I have a chainsaw straped to my back or on my pack rack.

[Waylander]

... as long as I have a chainsaw straped to my back or on my pack rack.

I wanna see a picture of that mate!! with the helmet on ofcourse:2thumbsup

[Wolf]

is this crazy enough to work? or should I lay off the coffee.
I think I could use suma that coffee!

I reckon as bright as possible, use the "natural warning colours" on both bike and armour, fearsome skull or similar on the helmet does sound good and then outfit the bike with spiky bits (foam rubber of course or it will fail the warrant) - that should put the shits up any cager. See you? They'll be pulling over to let you pass!

[inlinefour]

but I reckon there are enough dumbarses in cages that would not see it even if their life depended on it...

[Lou Girardin]

Yellow, blue and white are pretty noticable. especially with red highlights.

[bear]

Painting your bike with the same pattern as the snake could make it stand out - might even look evil!

[Wolf]

Bright coloured retroreflective stuff for night time, especially if it's arranged in a pattern that is attention-grabbing - something that with reach into the psyche of the cager and ring warning bells, like P O L I C E or T R A F F I C :) or, I dunno, maybe a huge skull like the pattern on Timber020's helmet.

Some bikes have the front indicators wired so that they are on whenever the headlamp is on, only turning off when indicating, so that it looks unusual and is (theoretically) more visible. Some sort of unusual, non-standard lighting to evoke a "what the fuck is that, Mabel?" reaction could be very advantageous.

Still would like to have something that has the "take me on and die" look, but that'd probably mean fixing a huge frame onto the bike and decking it out with lights so that it looks like the front/back of a truck...

[Fryin Finn]

That snake has a cuzzy which is non poisonous but has adopted the colour/banding to fool other predators.
I have 2 types of sunglasses. When I wear my John Lennon/Liam Gallagher round glasses, cars tend to ignore me at pedestrian crossings. But when I wear my black dirty dogs they stop in a hurry and avoid eye contact at all cost.
I'm sure there is something to be learned from this. Perhaps if we bikers completely intimidate the cagers they might pay more attention when were about. I reccomend all sub 250 riders beat up cagers that offend them. 250 to 600 riders trash their cars as well and all bigger bikers kill em all. And then we'll take over this country and restore order then make the world our oyster.
Yeah! :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana:
Actually I'm not really into shellfish but quite like crayfish and Grouper steaks

[BM-GS]

Still would like to have something that has the "take me on and die" look, but that'd probably mean fixing a huge frame onto the bike and decking it out with lights so that it looks like the front/back of a truck...


If the techies could make a hologram widget to project a truck 5m in front of a bike, that should work well!

Personally I do all I can to be seen. Black/yellow leathers, yellow bike, the lairy-est coloured lid I could find which fitted properly and lights on. I even put on more lights to help with lane-splitting - put them all on (flick high beam) and I have 2 pairs of lights on 2 levels which made a big reduction in people changing lanes into me - a lot even moved over to give me space (yes, I did wave to say thanks). The 200 Watts helps me see at night too!

However, there are some people who are beyond hope. Any truckies out there got any good "Didn't see you mate" stories? I saw one on telly from a bus driver in London: "It's a f***ing London bus! It's 40 feet long, it's 15 feet high, it's 8 feet wide, it's painted bright red - what else do you need?!"

There is the school of thought which says that the faster you go, the harder you are to hit... Not sure about that one.

[Wolf]

I reccomend all sub 250 riders beat up cagers that offend them. 250 to 600 riders trash their cars as well and all bigger bikers kill em all. And then we'll take over this country and restore order then make the world our oyster.
I recall that when I was a child, "bikies" were to be feared (note the cager term for "biker") - anti-social, violent, not to be messed with, get outta their way, don't look at 'em, just keep drivin' Mabel etc.

I'd have to search for the statistics to see if the per capita cage-related motorcycle accidents were less then - and then try to factor in the fact that there are a helluva lot more vehicles on the road now: at the age of four I could walk down the main street of Waipawa and see four parked cars and maybe two moving cars on any given Saturday; two years ago we drove through Waipawa on a Saturday and I couldn't see four empty car parks and the bloody road was busy.

Maybe that's the problem right there.

It has been noted on a number of threads that cagers don't even see each other or bloody great trucks, busses, low-flying jumbo jets etc.

Perhaps it is the fact that our roads are so crowded these days that most drivers are overwhelmed by the sensory onslaught - things coming at 'em from all direction - and the fact that they're also trying to formulate their raise request or plan out their day ahead of time rather than focussing on the task at hand - to whit: piloting nearly a ton of metal through crowded streets.

What we need, then, is to go back to the days when there were only a few cars on the road so that the drivers of those cars can safely preplan their lunch or daydream whilst driving.

I'm sure it would be easier to acheive this than teaching the bastards to focus on their driving and properly multi-task...

[Ixion]

I recall that when I was a child, "bikies" were to be feared (note the cager term for "biker") - anti-social, violent, not to be messed with, get outta their way, don't look at 'em, just keep drivin' Mabel etc.

...
Maybe that's the problem right there.

It has been noted on a number of threads that cagers don't even see each other or bloody great trucks, busses, low-flying jumbo jets etc.



When I started riding, most of the Stans and Mabels did indeed fear "those dreadful bikies". And didn't distinguish at all between very lawabiding motorcyclists (like me :whistle:) and Hells Angels. So we did get more respect.

The respect thing won't help with the dorks who don't look at all - but it might with the ones that piss me off more (and worry me more). The ones who you make eye contact with, you know they've seen you, and they still come out at you.

The "don't look at all", I can usually pick up that they're not looking and act accordingly. But the ones who just don't give a stuff, they're harder to deal with . Those are the ones I stop for a "little chat". And if they don't want to chat, then Other Initiatives are in order. :ar15: :ar15:

[vifferman]

The drivers who don't see you at all might if you make yourself more visible (lights, fluoro gear, etc.) The ones who do see you, but ignore you as not being a threat sometimes will do so if you look more threatening. When I had a black bike, and wore all black (helmet, leather gloves, leather jacket and pants) I noticed more cars moved over when I was commuting than when I chose to wear my red cordura jacket and yellow/white/black Spidi gloves. This is despite the fact that black isn't the best colour for visibility - but it makes you look more threatening.
I seem to get more people doing stupid things now that my bike is 'pretty' and quieter; when I owned the rumbly grumbly VTR and had very few people pull out in front of me or whatever.

Not a scientific analysis by any means, but from a qualititative point of view it seems to hold true. I mean, someone's less likely to 'try it on' if they think the bike that's approaching is a Big, Bad, Biker than if they are a scootering commuter ...

[Ixion]

The drivers who don't see you at all might if you make yourself more visible (lights, fluoro gear, etc.) The ones who do see you, but ignore you as not being a threat sometimes will do so if you look more threatening.

Yeah, I agree. Bright/fluoro etc helps with the ones who are willing to be good but have problems spotting a bike in all the traffic clutter. I have some sympathy with these, bikes are a smal frontal area (well some are anyway), and can be hard to see . But obviously does nothing for the real prats who just don't care "he can look out for himself" . They need to have the fear of the biker gods put into them. Question is , how do we make ourselves more threatening ?

Nor of course does it help with the surprising large number of drivers who are obviously stone blind.

[notme]

Going back a page to Wolf's post:


Some bikes have the front indicators wired so that they are on whenever the headlamp is on, only turning off when indicating, so that it looks unusual and is (theoretically) more visible. Some sort of unusual, non-standard lighting to evoke a "what the fuck is that, Mabel?" reaction could be very advantageous.

It's a little bit of an arse that one of the things that would make us stand out the most (different lighting) is probably going to be illegal....

I looked at designing a brake light flasher and any number of LED or other wee lighting enhancements but since it's my career I have to check the legalities - and basically once I (finally) got a direct line to someone at the LTSA I was told off the record that "yes, they agree that a lot of these things would help with visibility but that for now if it's not in the appropriate section of the lighting rules for vehicles, then it's illegal."

Kinda makes me wonder how boy racers get away with all those blue lights and whatnot facing forward...since according to my copy of the lighting rules and regulations that's just plain not allowed.....p.s. my Kwaka has the sidelight type indicators Wolf mentions, and i DO find that compared to the previous bike people seem to see me more.

Mind you it could also be that it's red mate, like a fire engine....and I do quite often make "wooo wooo" noises out loud when riding... :cool:

[ManDownUnder]

If the techies could make a hologram widget to project a truck 5m in front of a bike, that should work well!

Agreed - and if it could hit with the force of a small car it'd be ideal!

[Waylander]

Originally Posted by BM-GS
If the techies could make a hologram widget to project a truck 5m in front of a bike, that should work well!


Hehe that would look funny and probably freak out every cager in the area if you left it on while filtering though traffic. Can't wait till it's invented!!

[Wolf]

When I had a black bike, and wore all black (helmet, leather gloves, leather jacket and pants) I noticed more cars moved over when I was commuting than when I chose to wear my red cordura jacket and yellow/white/black Spidi gloves. This is despite the fact that black isn't the best colour for visibility - but it makes you look more threatening.
I can believe that - the "bikie" image thing. I suspect sporting a full beard, black bad-ass glasses and a black "stahlhelm" as well would cut down the "I don't give a shit" factor (and cause other problems).

What we need is riding gear that changes colour on demand - sections of voltage-sensitive fabric that alter reflection/absorbtion spectra or something - and preset a series of colour patterns that can be changed at the quick press of a button. (OK, I confess, I write Science Fiction)

If the guy/gal looks oblivious, quickly punch up vibrant colours with a high albedo so that you're more visible; and if he has the "yeah, I see ya, so what?" look, punch the preset to total absorbtion (black) and look as mean as.

Also handy would be a shape shifting helmet - full face to stahlhelm (cattle horns optional) - and Insta-beard(TM)

I usually wore black gear and black helmet but didn't notice any people getting out of my way - probably because nobody looks menacing on an LS400.

[Wolf]

Agreed - and if it could hit with the force of a small car it'd be ideal!
So you'd be wanting a Goldwing, then?