Here I go again on my own...

[AD345]

Got told today that I have a meeting about a "restructure" tomorrow.......


........and its just me, my boss and the HR director.....

........and I might want to bring a "support person"



Starting over at 44


again


I'm tired of this shit

[BMWST?]

hope it goes well for you,take the bike to work,then go for a ride to a favourite spot and plan a longer ride!

[AD345]

hope it goes well for you,take the bike to work,then go for a ride to a favourite spot and plan a longer ride!


Cheers

There will be something like that for sure

[Pedrostt500]

Yep keep up beat about it,

[Headbanger]

That's got to suck.

If they want to slim the ranks they should get rid of shit like HR director's.

Take along a Tongan with a cricket bat for a support person.


And a medic, Inform the fuckers the medic is going to be their support person.

[steve_t]

That sux mate. Dirty old economy I guess. Guess your contract probably has a restraint of trade clause preventing you from starting your own business in direct competition to your boss :whistle:
Hope u can get on the new redundancy thingy... has National put that into place yet??

[AD345]

That's got to suck.

If they want to slim the ranks they should get rid of shit like HR director's.

Take along a Tongan with a cricket bay for a support person.


And a medic, Inform the fuckers the medic is going to be their support person.

Oh it sucks big time

I might just take the cricket bat though

[AD345]

That sux mate. Dirty old economy I guess. Guess your contract probably has a restraint of trade clause preventing you from starting your own business in direct competition to your boss :whistle:
Hope u can get on the new redundancy thingy... has National put that into place yet??

Dunno know about a redundancy thingy


I've never yet had any money back (directly - a 1 night hospital stay doesn't count) from the govt. Might have to look into it

[steve_t]

Dunno know about a redundancy thingy


I've never yet had any money back (directly - a 1 night hospital stay doesn't count) from the govt. Might have to look into it

http://www.ers.dol.govt.nz/redundancy/index.html

[Dave Lobster]

What line of work are you in?

[nallac]

shit that sux,

Headbangers idea sounds good but.

my works going thru the same situation
25 jobs to go.....got another meeting tomorrow

[AD345]

shit that sux,

Headbangers idea sounds good but.

my works going thru the same situation
25 jobs to go.....got another meeting tomorrow


Here's hoping the day goes well for at least one of us.


Good luck

[nallac]

should be ok tomorrow, its the 2nd meeting of 3.(they gotta do it by the book)
Next weeks one is going to be the BIG one.......

[rainman]

I'm tired of this shit

I hear ya. There's a lot of it about... I've had a few of those meetings too.

Best of luck. :calm:

And if you don't take Headbanger's advice, remember to take notes, and stick it to them if they step out of line. And it might be good to find your contract and read it, so you know about notice periods and redundancy provisions...

[Headbanger]

So.....how did it work out?

[Lias]

So.....how did it work out?

Well he came home and found these cops trying to serve a search warrant for cannabis.. and how hes a bit busy:whistle:

[Big Dog]

Sometimes being made redundant is a good thing.

Other times you just need to hammer something into submission.

[Beemer]

I've been made redundant twice and it's not fun. At least both times I got another job (one within a few days, the other within six months), but now I am self-employed and work has slowed a lot so there's very little money coming in. I'm actually now looking for a 'real' job as I can't see things improving much and there's only so many articles you can write before the magazines get sick of you and start using another writer!

[AD345]

OK - update

I've been a bit slow on it because th e "running full tilt into a wall" effect.

Stunning is a word you don't fully appreciate until you are actually, y'know, stunned...

Annnnnyways

Its a 2 into 1 deal, my position and someone elses being rolled up, downsized, restructured, realigned, call-it-what-you-will into 1 super position, said position coincidentally being positiond so that my existing qualifications don't make the grade....


I get to respond by Monday if I think there is aother way of doing this (cos they REALLLY want my advice right?) and then they go from there (cue axe swinging noises).

The cricket bat got everyones full attention - I think next time I'll smack it down on the boardroom table.

So I'm half in- half out and looking for options.

At least I'm not wasting so much time in useless things like sleeping

[Kiwi Graham]

Mate, you do make the grade!!! You've been doing the job or part of it already! So they have made two jobs one big deal, go at them with confidence and a 'what you have to offer' attitude together with some ideas for productivity improvement etc and see what they will do to support you with in this new role. Flick some of the responsibility back on to them, now is not the time to role over dude.

Good luck

[Max Preload]

Guess your contract probably has a restraint of trade clause preventing you from starting your own business in direct competition to your boss :whistle:

Wouldn't matter if it did - it's unenforcable.


...now I am self-employed and work has slowed a lot so there's very little money coming in. I'm actually now looking for a 'real' job...

Being self-employed is a real job - otherwise you're just lining someone else's pockets.

[martybabe]

now is not the time to role over dude.

Good luck

Well said mate. Don't make it easy for them AD, stand proud mate, it may or may not be a lost cause but what have you got to lose by selling yourself.

Good luck mate, something tells me this won't be the last thread on 'CUTBACKS'

[Mom]

I'm actually now looking for a 'real' job as I can't see things improving much and there's only so many articles you can write before the magazines get sick of you and start using another writer!

Going into an interview as a self employed person can actually backfire. I was told point blank they would not employ someone who was/had been self employed because as soon as things picked up they would be off chasing the good money :D True! Keep going though, you will find something to fill some hours. Friggen horrible place to be, not enough hours earning, and too many hours spending (well paying important bills like mortgage/insurances/food etc).


OK - update

So I'm half in- half out and looking for options.

No way mate, you have a golden opportunity to state your case and really make something of your job. Attitude is everything in these situations. You want the job? You show them how much!

Good luck too, times are hard.

[nallac]

Its a 2 into 1 deal, my position and someone elses being rolled up, downsized, restructured, realigned, call-it-what-you-will into 1 super position, said position coincidentally being positiond so that my existing qualifications don't make the grade....



so as you say they've moved the goal posts to push you out......wankers.
an easy way for them to say you are no longer required..
But but but you can come up with some ideas they might be interested in...yeah right its a load of shit..PC crap

Had our 3rd meeting this morning..
Big Boss; yes we've been thru the sugestions and are going to procede withour orginal plan(as if they werent going to)25 jobs to go
had to do everything PC...
they're doing employee evaluations at the mo to see who's getting the chop


Mate feel sorry for you its a horrible place to be...
just cut to the chase and get the shit over with is all i want.

[justsomeguy]

Hey mate,

Sucks to be laid off. I got laid off in Nov, luckily had some cash to play with, thought long and hard and now have decided to start life again - from scratch - going back to Uni.

Just gonna throw my 2c in........most of this you probably know already.

They can't make a person redundant - they can only make a position redundant.

So they mess around with the position description to make it this way.

Is there any kind of Union there you can join? If you haven't already?

Under a union you come under a collective agreement and they will screw you less because of this.

WHATEVER YOU DO DON'T QUIT.

LET THEM MAKE YOU REDUNDANT.

If you quit = sometime wrong with you = 4 weeks paid notice or whatever it says on your contract.

If they make you redundant = They are letting you go as they can't support your position = their fault = they must pay some sort of redundancy + your notice.

PLEASE DON'T LET PRIDE COME INTO IT.

These are hard economic times and you are simply another expense the company is reducing. Being made redundant is nothing personal. PLEASE don't take this as an indication of your abilities.

Also remember that it's business not - personal - so they will do everything to upset you in the hope that you can quit.

Offer to do all the training and or anything else required to keep your job - if they want to play the skill's gap card - ask them what they recommend you do to get those skills....

A decision has been made, you need to find another job - just try and get as much as you can out of the situation.

A lawyer should cost you between $50-$100 for a chat.

But first - go in to your local Citizens Advice Bureau and talk to someone for free.

Good Luck mate.:hug:

Ujwal

[davebullet]

If the new role is 80% or more the same as your current role they must offer it to you... unless two or more meet that criteria then you both reapply.

Qualifications have nothing to do with it. Either when the 80% criteria comes in.

Your JD means shit when you have been doing a job for 6+ months. What you do day in day out defines your role and responsibilities. What the piece of paper says counts for less if you can prove you have been doing other duties and this new super position also includes those = more to argue for 80% + fit.

[crash harry]

OK - update

I've been a bit slow on it because th e "running full tilt into a wall" effect.

Stunning is a word you don't fully appreciate until you are actually, y'know, stunned...

Annnnnyways

Its a 2 into 1 deal, my position and someone elses being rolled up, downsized, restructured, realigned, call-it-what-you-will into 1 super position, said position coincidentally being positiond so that my existing qualifications don't make the grade....


I get to respond by Monday if I think there is aother way of doing this (cos they REALLLY want my advice right?) and then they go from there (cue axe swinging noises).

The cricket bat got everyones full attention - I think next time I'll smack it down on the boardroom table.

So I'm half in- half out and looking for options.

At least I'm not wasting so much time in useless things like sleeping

Mate, I've just recently been sitting on the other side of the table in one of these situations, and I can tell you 100% that it sucked. We had to let one of my guys go and even though it was the right thing to do for the company, on a personal level I hated every second of it and I still hate the fact that we had to do it. However, sometimes these choices are the good of the many vs the good of the few.

Having just been through the legalities of the whole process though, I can tell you the following:
1) YOU cannot be made redundant. Only your position can be made redundant. So, if there are two people in the same position, the normal procedure is to base the redundancy on Knowlege, Skills, and Experience. Position relevant of course. That also means that if a person is made redundant, they cannot be replaced within a certain amount of time (I think it's a year or two)

2) The fact that they are asking for your suggestions of another way to save your job is a legal requirement. If you have some suggestions, voice them. In our company there were a couple of jobs saved that way. Not many, but a couple.

3) If your employer doesn't follow due process, you may be able to claim against them for lost income while you look for another job. It sounds like they are being careful to follow the process properly, but there are lawyers who specialise in this stuff if you think you've been shafted. I personally don't have much truck with that sort of thing, but if they break the rules you can make them pay if you want to.

4) There are still jobs out there. Remember above all, you can't keep a good man down. If you are a motivated person, you will bounce back. Look for your openings and take what's offered. Don't be afraid of self-employment. And don't be afraid to completely change careers - in these economic times flexable people will flourish. A couple of examples I know of recently:

Electronics Technician -> redundant -> School Caretaker (he's happy as a pig in sh*t)
Toolmaker ->redundant -> Lawnmowing Contractor (making more money than ever and lost 10kg!)


Mate, I'm not trying to say that this is a good thing, but if points 1-3 don't help you save your job, I hope point 4 will help you bounce back.

Best of luck,
AJ

[Beemer]

Going into an interview as a self employed person can actually backfire. I was told point blank they would not employ someone who was/had been self employed because as soon as things picked up they would be off chasing the good money :D True! Keep going though, you will find something to fill some hours. Friggen horrible place to be, not enough hours earning, and too many hours spending (well paying important bills like mortgage/insurances/food etc).

I've been to many job interviews over the years I've been self-employed (last seven years) as many contract jobs are advertised rather than the employer contacting me directly. Some were part time and I could slot my other work around them, while some were just short-term contracts for a few months.

I do consider self-employment as a 'real' job, don't get me wrong, but with the recession, many of the government departments I work for have been told to tighten their belts and are not using contractors as much as before. There is little I can do about that, and even the magazines I've been regular contributors to have experienced falling advertising revenues so the editorial is smaller as a result. Newspapers I've worked for on a casual basis are shedding staff - so everyone is feeling the pinch. By a 'real' job I mean one where I work for a boss, work regular hours, full time, know how much I will be earning from week to week - a scary thought in one respect but a reassuring one in some ways too.

[AD345]

OK - second update.

Finished up last Friday with 3 possibilities. 1 of them rang to make an offer at 4:00pm last Friday (yes, same day). Thought about it over the weekend and then declined.

They called me back in again this evening and 20 minutes before I get into the car to go see them possibility No. 2 rings to say they want to make an offer later this week. Possibility No. 2 is definitely my preferred option


So..

I went to see possibility No.1 and for the first time in my life I turned down an offer of employment, even after they upped the not inconsiderable salary by a significant amount.

There are few opportunities in our lives to make a choice to do something that challenges when we could also choose to do what we have always done.

I'm going to take a chance and try something reallly different.

This whole experience has been surreal with every second phone call over the last month having the possibility to significantly alter my, and my partners, life.

The way things have been going I expect possibility No.3 to call tomorrow :doh:


Hopfully there will be a final installment in this wee saga by the end of the week.

[Blackbird]

Fantastic and sincere congratulations. Y'know, as an anal (and cynical) engineer, I'm surprised to find myself believing more and more in Karma as I get older.

All the very best,

Geoff

P.S I'm also a believer that if you work hard, doors open for you that you never expected. A purely personal choice to step through one!

[Beemer]

Sounds good, hope you get lucky with the job you really want.

I've applied for six jobs since posting - five fulltime and one part-time. I didn't even get an interview for one job, but I did get interviewed and offered the part-time job, which I accepted. Went in and picked up all the forms I needed to fill in before I started, got introduced to people I'd be working with, and told to call in the following day to drop off the completed forms. The following day arrives with a phone call from the woman who employed me, saying she was really sorry but there was no money in the budget to employ me! So I lost my job a week before I was due to start! That REALLY pissed me off!

With the other four, one will be deciding who they want to interview this week, applications for one closed last week and I'm waiting to hear back, one closed on Monday and the other closes next Monday. I could do any of the jobs standing on my head, but I've got a bet with my husband that I won't even get interviewed for most of them. Years ago you'd apply for a job and they'd get 30 applicants, only 10 of whom could actually do the job, and they'd interview the best of them. Now they probably get 100 applicants and more than half have the skills for the job so they only need to interview the very best of them.

I rang WINZ to see if I could get any assistance but my husband works fulltime (in retail, so he's not on a huge wage) and I'm not eligible. I can apply for an accommodation supplement, but after filling in the forms I find that's worth about $6 a week, which is not a lot!