Next BIG Protest with StoneY and the Unions

[GOONR]

Extracted from Parliament Q&A yesterday...

Accident Compensation—Government Actions

5. MICHAEL WOODHOUSE (National) to the Minister for ACC: What steps is the Government taking to secure the long-term future of ACC and why are these necessary?

Hon Dr NICK SMITH (Minister for ACC): The Government has strengthened the financial governance skills on the Accident Compensation Corporation’s (ACC’s) board and reversed the decisions of the previous Government in costly areas like physiotherapy and suicide coverage extensions. We have taken steps to improve rehabilitation rates, and we have extended the fullfunding date for the scheme to 2019. These steps are necessary to address the steep rise in the accident compensation scheme’s claim costs, large losses, and the huge increase in the scheme’s unfunded liabilities.

Michael Woodhouse: What reports has the Minister received on the claims today by former ACC Minister Maryan Street that the corporation was in financial good health at the change of Government?

Hon Dr NICK SMITH: The audited accounts of ACC for the year 2007-08, signed by Ms Street and ex - Council of Trade Unions chair Ross Wilson, declared a loss of $2.4 billion—the largest in ACC’s 35-year history. Those reports also showed that the scheme’s unfunded liability during the previous Government’s term ballooned by $9 billion, and that claim costs were growing at five times the rate of inflation. Labour is clearly in denial on the scheme’s mismanagement.

Michael Woodhouse: What message does he take from today’s protest on Parliament’s steps of about 150 people over accident compensation, when it is compared with the 6,000 who protested last year?

Mr SPEAKER: I apologise to the honourable Minister, but I could not hear that question. I ask Michael Woodhouse to repeat it.

Michael Woodhouse: Thank you, Mr Speaker; I would be delighted to. What message does he take from today’s protest on Parliament’s steps of about 150 people over accident compensation, when it is compared with the 6,000 who protested last year?

Hon Dr NICK SMITH: The message I take is that the public now well understands the reasons for the changes the Government is making to the scheme. The bikers today were taken for a bit of a ride by the unions. It was an ideological protest, led by those responsible for the scheme’s financial woes, against a pragmatic Government determined to make the scheme affordable and fair, and to secure it for the future.

[Scuba_Steve]

I think one of our biggest problems is corporate news media, they NEVER report the true, full or unbiased story. Rupert Murdoch himself said it best when he said "the media create the news", Until the media stop creating the news & start reporting it, it will always be an uphill battle.

[Ixion]

Hon Dr NICK SMITH: The message I take is that the public now well understands the reasons for the changes the Government is making to the scheme. The bikers today were taken for a bit of a ride by the unions. It was an ideological protest, led by those responsible for the scheme’s financial woes, against a pragmatic Government determined to make the scheme affordable and fair, and to secure it for the future.

Hmm. Need to think about this.

[CherryB]

We can't all turn out every time, so we need to be strategic from here on out.

We need to not bag the unions/ journalists who do give us cover/any other allies, even if we are disappointed with their comms efforts and turn out. Divide and conquer is the Govt's gig, we don't need to help them.

We need to hype and be positive about what has happened, whether it fits our hopes or not. Tell the public and media it is raising awareness that even Treasury says it is unjust to make us use our holiday pay before getting ACC, the Health Ministry opposed the changes to cover and access to treatment, and that ACC ain't broke.

Our ongoing strategy should be targeted, focused on getting messages out about why what they are doing is wrong and embarrassing Govt. Look for their photo ops and turn up with a small noisy group and big signs. Turn up to their election gigs next year with reminders of their screw ups (not just ACC tho keep it a big message) and sneaky acts.

Some of my messages:
ACC was brought in so we don't have to sue. This Government is moving it back towards a private system where we'll have to sue.

ACC’s logic seems to be that you are not at fault if careless or dangerous if your vehicle is big enough but you are "at fault" (even if you’re riding safely) on a small vehicle if you have a number plate? Riders who weren't at fault under the old system and could sue are now the ones being charged more.

That's not fair, it doesn't fit the no-fault model, and it doesn't make sense.

Not all activities or jobs are as safe as each other. But without people living an active life and doing the dangerous jobs society wouldn't work and we'd die out as a species.

Without the freedom to live an active life, Hillary wouldn’t have been the first to climb Everest, the All Blacks wouldn’t be a force to reckon with in rugby, Burt Munro wouldn’t have become a legend and Kiwis wouldn’t have won an America’s Cup.

ACC is not broke or in deficit by most people’s standards. It takes in 1/3 to 1/4 more than it spends in a year (on admin and past and current accident costs) – at the OLD LEVY RATES, and its investments are doing well.

ACC ain’t broke, and we don’t want it broken.
· One levy rate for all!
· Keep levies to what is needed.
· Don’t take away our holidays.
· Give treatment where it is needed.

See also http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA1002/S00163.htm

[CherryB]

p.s. when I say 'my' messages, they are my distillation of what 'we' have been saying, thinking about what to focus on, keeping it clear, getting public aware, showing it ain't just us, etc. In a short no of words... that is the hard bit!!!

[Fatt Max]

Dont make it too long StoneY. I understand you with needing a break, i bowed out up here for a rest at the end of last year. I am refreshed now, and about ready to get out and have another crack at this. Dont be discouraged, or depressed mate. The message is still being heard, we are still here and we are still not happy. I am with Ixion on this, it will be the bikers that will be the force to be reckoned with.
Have a good rest, I promise in a couple of months you will feel much better.

Thank you for all the effort you hav eput in to date, I appreciate it as I am sure many other do too.

+1 on this, well done Mom,

Yeah StoneY, see why you need to takle some time out and it's well deserved. But we need you mate like all the others that get out there and put the work in.

And, if you stay away too long I will come looking for you wearing nothing but a thong......and noone wants that...

[Ratti]

[QUOTE=Fatt Max;1129652462

And, if you stay away too long I will come looking for you wearing nothing but a thong......and noone wants that...[/QUOTE]

O, I don't know FM.. .

[riffer]

Got to admit I was not happy when I read Glenn Barclay's email this morning discussing what the cowardly weasel had said in parliament yesterday.

I'm thinking we really do need a combination of guerilla tactics (small disruptive groups upsetting their meets/photo ops) and a few big big events.

We've pussyfooted around not wanting to upset the public and I reckon yesterday was the end result of not wanting to upset anyone. It ain't going to make ANY difference if we be nice. I think we need to actually give them something to worry about. And if this means civil disruption I'm okay with that. I hope the weasel does take out of yesterday that most bikers aren't lefties and that votes are on the line. Maybe we need some bikes waiting at the airports on days he flies in so that we can shadow his crown car all the way to parliament. We need to get him worried again. Right now he's feeling ten foot tall.

[Ixion]

We can't all turn out every time, so we need to be strategic from here on out.

We need to not bag the unions/ journalists who do give us cover/any other allies, even if we are disappointed with their comms efforts and turn out. Divide and conquer is the Govt's gig, we don't need to help them.

I suspect that the Labour/union comms was OK, at least as gooda s the BIKEOI!. But Joe Q just wasn't interested.

Partly because a lot of the changes are technical , partly because of the "never happen to me anyway' syndrome, partly cos of general apathy.

We need to remember, we always said it was a two YEAR campaign.

I think I'm also seeing a take out that (a) marches don't work. The anti-smacking march was a let-down, ditto this. For some reason the "protest march " thing just doesn't engage people anymore. This is where we have an advantage, bikers will ALWAYS turn out for a ride.

(b) - I think that there needs to be a single clear easily understandable focus to any protest action. BIKEOI! worked . "Why should I protest? " . "Because ACC want to put your rego up to $1000. " "Right, I'm in". Versus Tuesday "Why should I protest?" . "Because - long winded complicated explanation about ACC changes". "Uh, sorry , got to wash my poodle".

If we want to engage Joe we need a focus point . A single clear easily understood message. Joe Q doesn't understand Woodhouse,and doesn't care. He thought that bikers were being rorted with a $1000 rego fee, and supported us. $1000 he understands. The changes going through now, he doesn't understand. Even if they affect him, he doesn't understand.

[oldrider]

well well well.

What a fucking surprise.

So we let the unions take over the protest and make bikers look like they were just cover for a government bashing campaign. and then they fuck it up. Typical.

Feel like we're getting our voice heard now? Think we've fixed ACC yet? Think the Government will listen? Or maybe think that plonker Smith now knows no-one cares enough to complain.

There's a lesson in here. Never let the focus of your campaign be co-opted by others. Stay focused, stay on topic. The protest about fee hikes was legitimate. A multi-purpose mixed objective save ACC from the evil government campaign was dumb as a rock. Funnily enough, some people might have mentioned this earlier.

But hey, with thousands of brother unionists marching in unison, how could the evil Nats do anything but quail at the people's will unleashed. What could possibly go wrong?

Bwuhahaha.

You may well gloat but while the points you highlight may have some validity in hindsight, the adage:

"To try but fail, is far more noble than to fail to try at all" springs to mind!

Not that I believe our (biker) reps failed yesterday.

They merely learned a lesson on where their support and loyalties can be utilised to advantage or not!

This was always going to be a long campaign!

[cowboyz]

people dont care. It is as simple as that. And they dont care because no one has given them a reason to care. The whole premise about not upsetting the public.. If they are not upset then they dont care. Doesnt make any difference to them. The govt got what they wanted. People got all up in arms about it and then realised there is frik all you can do about it.. why? because at the end of the day there will be people saying.. dont upset anyone.
We had the oppourtnity to bring the country to a standstill. We had the oppourinity to have chaos and really make a statement. We went in peace and peacefully got told to shove it up our arse.

Now I am not negating any of the effort that has been put it. Its just if you try and make an omelette without breaking the eggs you cant complain about finding shell in your food.

[Squiggles]

people dont care. It is as simple as that. And they dont care because no one has given them a reason to care. The whole premise about not upsetting the public.. If they are not upset then they dont care. Doesnt make any difference to them. The govt got what they wanted. People got all up in arms about it and then realised there is frik all you can do about it.. why? because at the end of the day there will be people saying.. dont upset anyone.
We had the oppourtnity to bring the country to a standstill. We had the oppourinity to have chaos and really make a statement. We went in peace and peacefully got told to shove it up our arse.

Now I am not negating any of the effort that has been put it. Its just if you try and make an omelette without breaking the eggs you cant complain about finding shell in your food.

The "march for democracy" on queen street was disruptive, but did what in the end?

[Headbanger]

Rghto, Lets have a few hundred bikes doing laps through Wellington, once we have more mass then the traffic lights then the city will come to a standstill, afterwords we can just dissipate.

That will fuck em.

Personally I think that without the masses willing to do anything we should concentrate on biker issues, Perhaps the public are happy with the changes to ACC, They do at least seem to act that way.

[CherryB]

re:
Hon Dr NICK SMITH: The message I take is that the public now well understands the reasons for the changes the Government is making to the scheme. The bikers today were taken for a bit of a ride by the unions. It was an ideological protest, led by those responsible for the scheme’s financial woes, against a pragmatic Government determined to make the scheme affordable and fair, and to secure it for the future.

Hm. Affordable? Fair? By whose standards? More expensive, with less cover doesn't seem to fit that bill. If the public was aware of, let alone understood, what was happening they would be a lot more active.

[CherryB]

Lots of people who belong to Unions heard nothing about this from their unions, even reps didn't hear about it. So I do think comms was an issue.

And agree that the messages were too complicated. It needs to stay simple so people understand how they are being screwed and keep to the bits they will emotionally respond to. It ain't about educating them, it is about letting them see what affects them:
- losing your holiday pay (and even Treasury say that is unjust)
- losing some of your cover and treatment
- higher levies out of your wages and regos when ACC is taking in far more than it spends already.
- we're going to end up having to sue each other again if this carries on.

[sunhuntin]

This is where we have an advantage, bikers will ALWAYS turn out for a ride.

and the public will always support a group of bikes, no matter the reason. i remember last year, there were hundreds of joe q's on the overbridges, all excited simply cos we were bikes. hell, i went through otaki alone yesterday, and one small boy was just about waving his arm off, he was so excited, and i was just a solo bike. they may not understand, but they will back us. im sure of it.

[MSTRS:Me]

and the public will always support a group of bikes, no matter the reason. i remember last year, there were hundreds of joe q's on the overbridges, all excited simply cos we were bikes. hell, i went through otaki alone yesterday, and one small boy was just about waving his arm off, he was so excited, and i was just a solo bike. they may not understand, but they will back us. im sure of it.

Kids are often like that.
And last year, we got plenty of support because even JoePublic could understand the raw deal we were working against. The problem is that what affects JoePublic personally, is very subtle and the effect(s) are not being given the highlights that 'our' levies were. The 'big drop' in the levy means that, as far as JoePublic ic concerned, there isn't a problem now, and we are unlikely to enjoy anything close to the support we did last year.

[oldrider]

Rghto, Lets have a few hundred bikes doing laps through Wellington, once we have more mass then the traffic lights then the city will come to a standstill, afterwords we can just dissipate.

That will fuck em.

Personally I think that without the masses willing to do anything we should concentrate on biker issues, Perhaps the public are happy with the changes to ACC, They do at least seem to act that way.

A few years ago we were all outraged by the activities of the Muslim terrorists and now it is just an everyday occurrence that nobody even barley thinks about!

It's called conditioning!

This government made their move, declared their intentions, rode out the initial reaction and waited for the conditioning to settle in and set the date for the next reaction wave!

That will be the date of the commencement for paying the levies, there will be a mini reaction and then it will all settle down to individual grizzling as each individual pays their levy!

Gradually these discontents will accumulate enough until there is a change of government and then (under MMP) it will all begin again with almost the same people back in coalition!

MMP only ensures that the politicians are safe in their jobs and between them "they" decide who and what coalition and will continue to do their own bidding rather than the bidding of the disenfranchised voters!

STV would at least make the politicians accountable to the voters rather than themselves, as they are now!

MMP provides us with nothing more than a "democratically elected dictatorship", finally chosen by the politicians themselves!

Spot the difference between any of the previous MMP coalitions, what have we gained or lost because of them and how many of them have ever been held accountable for their failures?

They just keep on coming back through the back door and the public conditioning process just keeps on keeping on, Nothing changes!

They are completely confidant that they can call the tune and predict how the mob will dance to "their" melody!

So, if we keep on doing the same thing over and over, expecting a different result, we are living in nanna land, we have to find a new strategy with the ability to surprise and kick "them" out of their comfort zone!

[GSL]

Another failed biker protest in Wellington. I think the definition of stupidity is continuing to do the same thing but expecting a different result. When have “polite”, “don’t upset the public” biker protests ever achieved anything – never.
The problem in Wellington is that those with the resources to organise protests are normally inefficient, overpaid public servants more worried about retaining their snouts in the public purse trough than “real protest”. They may get a warm fussy from yesterday but in reality they are just puppets for the Labour party.
A “Real Protest” could shut down Wellington very easily. Just need about 200 bikers, real bikers and not the pathetic “don’t upset the public mob”. A lot of opportunities have gone to waste, especially when about 6,000 bikers were available in Wellington last year.
Maybe I will come across some bikers with real balls at this weeks HOG Rally!

[GOONR]

Another failed biker protest in Wellington.....

Please explain. This was not a biker protest as such and what was a failure about the last one in Wellington?