Stats, stats, oh how we hate them, but?

[MSTRS:Me]

So it seems, Education vs Legislation is an issue.
What about the good old kiwi can do attitude. "I can do anything, I'm the worlds best driver I don't need to be told by a namby pamby politician how to drive safely". Or is it the old "get outta my way you idiot I own this piece of road" and "how dare you hold me up" mentality that needs moving along..?

What needs moving along is the attitude that goes something like..."I'll drive how I like, and bugger the rest of you". That covers all the idiots, fast, slow and inconsiderate.

[Mikkel]

One of the accidents was a truck trying to avoid a pedestrian. Both were killed, plus a chemical spill to boot.

And the pedestrian was in that situation because they had rolled their car earlier and was walking into town.

I don't know why the ped would be walking in the middle of the road or why the truck would be on the shoulder - either would have to be the case in order for there being any need for evasive action.

I will say this though; if you are driving a motorvehicle - ever the more so a huge truck carrying dangerous goods - and someone steps out in front of you, you have the duty to run over the ped rather than loosing control of your vehicle escalating the consequences.
Swerving to avoid hitting some drunken jaywalker only to risk killing half of the young family heading the opposite way is not good tradeoff.

New Zealand's speed limits are amongst the world's lowest. Why then are our road accidents higher than other comparable countries? Absence of driver training, I would postulate.

No, they are not. In mainland Europe it is very seldom to see speedlimits above 80 km/h for anything less than dual-carriageways seperated by a green and an impact barrier. And they even use proper tarmac and signage. There is however much denser traffic, generally.

That said, the road toll on the German Autobahn - considering the sheer number of motorists and kilometers travelled - is virtually zero and... there's no speedlimit in most places.

I very much agree with your last sentence, education beats badhabits passed on from father to son everytime.

Don't make me come over all righteously indignant.

Why not, it'll probably just piss her off even more?

I don't think it is "driver training" in NZ, as from what I've seen the new young drivers are being well educated in this, especially insofar as the driver training schools go.

While you always will get the occasional wild youth, the issues that confront us are rarely caused by the young. As so many times before you'll see the older generations blame the youth for their own inadequacies. Nothing new in that either.

[Hitcher]

I don't think it is "driver training" in NZ, as from what I've seen the new young drivers are being well educated in this, especially insofar as the driver training schools go.

"Insofar as the driver training schools go" is the nub of it. These aren't mandatory, as in some countries. I have no idea what percentage of newly-licensed drivers/riders have received formal training from qualified instructors. I suspect less than half.

The only competence required is that which is necessary to pass a license, although even that is debateable, given the knowledge of English necessary for such which is clearly absent in many seemingly accomplished drivers.

[Edbear]

"Insofar as the driver training schools go" is the nub of it. These aren't mandatory, as in some countries. I have no idea what percentage of newly-licensed drivers/riders have received formal training from qualified instructors. I suspect less than half.

The only competence required is that which is necessary to pass a license, although even that is debateable, given the knowledge of English necessary for such which is clearly absent in many seemingly accomplished drivers.

I agree, which is why I opined they should be. I also did a defensive driving course which stood me in good stead over the years and this should also be part of learning to drive. A recent episode of a TV program on emergency services featured a young lady who broke her leg when a car pulled out in front of her. Her comment afterwards was that it had taught her to be more aware of her environment and to be ready for such. Perhaps an accident that she may have been better able to avoid had she done a course?

But it is plainly obvious that many drivers are blissfully unaware that they are behind the wheel of a moving vehicle as they engage in all manner of activities unrelated to driving.

[FJRider]

The only competence required is that which is necessary to pass a license, although even that is debateable, given the knowledge of English necessary for such which is clearly absent in many seemingly accomplished drivers.

Perhaps more emphasis should be put on better instruction on hand signals ....

ie. :slap:

Was that a Hitcher spelling mistake .... ????

[peasea]

My theory is that the focus has been on speeding (any forms) at the expense of improving driver training (which includes inappropriate speeding). There is, of course, no revenue in doing it any other way.

My theory also is that newer (and therefore safer) vehicles and vehicle technology ( better tyres, ABS, etc) have been the main reason for the road toll reducing. Because NZers still drive like idiots, that reduction has plateaued somewhat.

People who can't drive therefore deduce that because they are driving at below the limit and they aren't drunk and their vehicle got a new WOF 5 months ago, they they are perfectly safe.

Couldn't agree more. Speeding can be recorded by a tested (supposedly accurate) machine, whereas doing something completely stupid will entail the courts taking the word of the copper who witnessed the stupid act. These days the cops are pretty good at doing stupid things on the road themselves, such as u-turns on State Highways....(http://www.stuff.co.nz/nelson-mail/n...h-in-spotlight) so their credibility is questionable at best.

With that in mind, the law (ass or not) is more likely to accept that someone was speeding when the act was recorded via a 'trusted' method. When the cops (if the cops) manage to recoup some the trust/faith that has been lost in the public's eye through constant bungling, bullying and dishonesty then their finger-pointing might have greater credibility. At the same time those who pull dumb-arse stunts on public roads could more often end up being prosecuted. Don't hold your breath though.

It could be that carrying a video camera at all times could come in handy. (I was overtaken by a complete idiot this morning, wish I'd taped that but it's a bugger trying to operate a Handicam in winter gloves.)

Driver education is seriously lacking in NZ and the one thing that really stands out is the general public's inability to drive to the conditions.

[peasea]

Perhaps more emphasis should be put on better instruction on hand signals ....

ie. :slap:

Was that a Hitcher spelling mistake .... ????

There's no 'e' in debatable in my 'Websters' matey. I'm with H.

[peasea]

But it is plainly obvious that many drivers are blissfully unaware that they are behind the wheel of a moving vehicle as they engage in all manner of activities unrelated to driving.

Especially the younger drivers. (Texting, brushing hair, applying makeup etc, and that's just the boy racers.) It's sad that something serious has to happen to wake them up and in some cases they don't wake up, ever. I don't have any problem with the banning of handheld cell phones while driving but what about cabbies and truckies on their RT's? Couriers? Coppers? (Oops, just had to slip that one in.....)

[FJRider]

There's no 'e' in debatable in my 'Websters' matey. I'm with H.

It was "H" that put the e in my friend ... check his post ...

[peasea]

It was "H" that put the e in my friend ... check his post ...

Oops, my bad, I thought you'd corrected HIM with the highlight. Arse about face, let's gang up on him.

Sorry.