Settling Maori claims. Someone explain.

[Finn]

From Oswalds blog... A new word.

aBROpriate (comparative more aBROpriate, superlative most aBROpriate)

The act of grabbing taxpayers money for that which no other group would get funding for.

The Government aBROpriated huge sums to settle outstanding land claims.
Set apart for a particular use or race; reserved.
Hence, belonging peculiarly; peculiar; suitable; fit; proper.

The head of the iwi wondered what an aBROpriate measure would be to make the tangata whenua feel better.

Suitable to the social situation or to social respect or social discreetness; socially correct; socially discreet; well-mannered; proper.

I don't think it was aBROpriate for the cashier to tell me outloud in front of all those people at the check-out that my fisheries compensation cheque looked like it was way too large.

[GIXser]

its not a big bag of money delivered to the tribe people, the amounts are mostly made up of land and assets and a small amount of cash, for example the tribe im associated with has a reasonable asset base to enable them to offer the tribe some bennifits for example i am part owner of the bulls police station and a few other stupid little dwellings and some land with some trees on it, big frecking deal, but the tribe who owed it in the first place with its own legal borders has got something back.............it was basically stolen via mean nasty english tossers.
I dont really care about the issue, but i take pride that we as a country address them as opposed to forget them and hope they will go away which seems to be the standard around the globe.

Besides why should the government own some the the assets in question, they basically fuck up everything they touch, land is better with the maori in many respects.

rolf..........lol

[Mr Merde]

......
And Dr Bob, Maggie Thatcher got as corrupt and evil as any other politician after her first term in office.

Having lived through the Thatcher years in the UK, I was there from 1977 till 2004 altogether, I can agree to nthis statement.

Maggie moved her political stance more and morde to the extreme right wing as her period in office lengthened.

Labour cam into power by changing their positition in the political compass by taking up the middle ground, which appealed to more of the electorate. Then what happened?

Tony Blair and this government have both gone more to the right wing as time has progressed.

The Conservatives problem was finding their position again. Their traditional area had been usurped by "New Labour".

I dont have any answers, I dont pretend to know or pontificate a point of view. All I have learnt from a few years in this life is that whatever party is in "power", we get screwed. They all suck up to us at election time promising us what they think we want and then once in power they just ignore those people who elected them and push their own agendas. Any of which has the ultimkate objective of keeping them in a position where we are subserviant to them.

You can argue political propganda as much as you like, all we the populace want is an easier life. We want a health system that works, a lifestyle that allows us to enjoy what time we have, an education system that allows us and our decendants to develop and a safe and stable family life that we can be relaxed with.

We are the silent majority and I'm tired of being ignored.

I will vote for anyone or any party that will give me these. Until they do you can take all this theorising and stick it where the sun doesnt shine.

Take your "pissing" competition and stick it there as well because I for one am finding it very tedious. Your continual bickering is boring and so very predictable.

[Robert Taylor]

Having lived through the Thatcher years in the UK, I was there from 1977 till 2004 altogether, I can agree to nthis statement.

Maggie moved her political stance more and morde to the extreme right wing as her period in office lengthened.

Labour cam into power by changing their positition in the political compass by taking up the middle ground, which appealed to more of the electorate. Then what happened?

Tony Blair and this government have both gone more to the right wing as time has progressed.

The Conservatives problem was finding their position again. Their traditional area had been usurped by "New Labour".

I dont have any answers, I dont pretend to know or pontificate a point of view. All I have learnt from a few years in this life is that whatever party is in "power", we get screwed. They all suck up to us at election time promising us what they think we want and then once in power they just ignore those people who elected them and push their own agendas. Any of which has the ultimkate objective of keeping them in a position where we are subserviant to them.

You can argue political propganda as much as you like, all we the populace want is an easier life. We want a health system that works, a lifestyle that allows us to enjoy what time we have, an education system that allows us and our decendants to develop and a safe and stable family life that we can be relaxed with.

We are the silent majority and I'm tired of being ignored.

I will vote for anyone or any party that will give me these. Until they do you can take all this theorising and stick it where the sun doesnt shine.

Take your "pissing" competition and stick it there as well because I for one am finding it very tedious. Your continual bickering is boring and so very predictable.

I agree with much of what you reasonably wish for from Governments and I also lived in the UK during the Thatcher period, but beg to differ because warts and all she took that country by the scruff of the kneck and made something of it again. By and large New Labour inherited a much stronger economy and overall wellbeing post Tory control than the state that Callaghan left it in. From what I can make out Botchup Brown is going to leave it in an even bigger mess than what Callaghan did.
Similiar to Maggie David Cameron is going to have to make some very unpleasant decisions.
I often wonder how things would have panned out had Michael Heseltine scored the top job, he truly defined ''compassionate consevatism'' ( yikes thats probably going to start an argument )
Its also fair to say that in line with the original theme of this thread ''Once Great Britain'' is paying for its history. And there I go again thinking that it would now be a much better place had Enoch Powell scored the top job. ( that will mark me as a racist in some quarters )
I love the UK but can also understand why many of its inhabitants are leaving.

[idleidolidyll]

Well the world is full of hypocrisy! Just take a look at what is happening in England with MPs expenses, the worst perpetrators are the ruling but soon to be electorally annihilated Labour party.

Yawn, straw man argument. boring ad infinitum

Thankfully there is hope yet, the poms have invented synthetic sperm. With all of the other medical advances they will be able to create another Margaret Thatcher.

Maggie was a ruthless dictator (no less than Hitler, Mussolini and other right wing dictators) and cared bugger all for the masses. Your support for her and your constant calls for fascist policies in NZ is abhorrent.

Dont lecture me about socialism Ignoramuslefty, Ive seen plenty of the damage created by that mentality over the 50 plus years Ive been around. Capitalism with appropriate controls is fine by me, and demonstably by most reading this thread and all of your previous verbosity reference the subject.

that's an easy statement to make dickheadrighty when you rarely to never explain what you think capitalism is although your rhetoric does indicate that you feel it is of benefit to you and your current situation and screw the rest.
Capitalism with 'appropriate controls' is called socialism; the centre way between the extremes of capitalist and communist authoritarianism.

Of course if we dont subscribe to your version of propganda then we are doubtless all ignorant hicks.

and don't sanctimoniously post open ended blather about communism and socialism being one and the same and nonsense about compassionate conservatism in which wealthy people get to keep the system that makes them wealthier in place as other are screwed over while chucking a few breadcrumbs to 'the peasants' to keep them quiet.
The demonstration, oft exhibited here, of blind adherence to right wing propaganda as above is tedious and boring but i refuse to let it be spoke without refutation.

The left wing media is a myth; the media has been a right wing tool for at least a century. It is the source of most right wing propaganda and is a mouthpiece for politicians, businesses and elites who understand the contol it has even though the controlled masses often do not. The essence of Capitalism stands for control of humanity by a tiny elite of which you are not, and never be a member.

And in my book, that makes your attitude all the more inecusable.

[idleidolidyll]

I agree with much of what you reasonably wish for from Governments and I also lived in the UK during the Thatcher period, but beg to differ because warts and all she took that country by the scruff of the kneck and made something of it again. By and large New Labour inherited a much stronger economy and overall wellbeing post Tory control than the state that Callaghan left it in. From what I can make out Botchup Brown is going to leave it in an even bigger mess than what Callaghan did.
Similiar to Maggie David Cameron is going to have to make some very unpleasant decisions.
I often wonder how things would have panned out had Michael Heseltine scored the top job, he truly defined ''compassionate consevatism'' ( yikes thats probably going to start an argument )
Its also fair to say that in line with the original theme of this thread ''Once Great Britain'' is paying for its history. And there I go again thinking that it would now be a much better place had Enoch Powell scored the top job. ( that will mark me as a racist in some quarters )
I love the UK but can also understand why many of its inhabitants are leaving.

actually, what she did was destroy lives and increase the transfer of power and capital to the wealthy and elite.

i was in Wales under her and saw the violence she created and the communities she destroyed.

Maggie was a bitch and I applaud Elvis Costello's songs about her and her policies. I too would take the opportunity to piss on her grave:

Elvis Costello: "When England was the whore of the world, Margaret was her Madam"

[Robert Taylor]

actually, what she did was destroy lives and increase the transfer of power and capital to the wealthy and elite.

i was in Wales under her and saw the violence she created and the communities she destroyed.

Maggie was a bitch and I applaud Elvis Costello's songs about her and her policies. I too would take the opportunity to piss on her grave:

Elvis Costello: "When England was the whore of the world, Margaret was her Madam"

Man you are one very obnoxious lefty, nothing to be proud of. Also nothing to be proud of that unless someone agrees with you to the letter you rip them to shreds with your verbal poison.

Those coal mining communities were artificially propped up by previous Governments and you know it. Why dig deeper holes when its no longer profitable to do so?

BTW Michael Heseltine was born in Wales, an infinitely better man than the biggest windbag of all, Neil Kinnock ( he and his wife currently living luxuriously off the public purse, somewhat hypocritical considering their past very public viewpoints )

I can see the good in a lot of people, even though I dont agree with their politics. For example I thought politicians such as Mike Moore, Denis Healey and David Owen were thoroughly decent people.

And while this thread is about Maori claims I quite like Pita Sharples, even though some of his views are off the wall. Heck even the new Green co leader ( That Maori woman lawyer ) I dont subscribe to the Greens pseudo communism but that woman has got a lot of decorum and class when she speaks in Parliament.

So who is a better person, one that is fully blinkered and completely rubbishes opposing viewpoints or one that can see others views?

[idleidolidyll]

Man you are one very obnoxious lefty, nothing to be proud of.

Plenty to be proud of when it exposes the ugliness of 'compassionate conservatism' as espoused by a person who calls for fascist policies in NZ and a return to a dictatorship as per Maggie the bitch in Britain.

Also nothing to be proud of that unless someone agrees with you to the letter you rip them to shreds with your verbal poison.

Even prouder when that person regurgitates right wing propaganda and advocates systems that prey on the poor in order to enhance the wealthy

Those coal mining communities were artificially propped up by previous Governments and you know it. Why dig deeper holes when its no longer profitable to do so?

Because maggie the bitch gave them nothing else in place of those jobs.
capitalists ripped the people off and left them high and dry. they were told to abandon their communities; homes their relatives had lived in for generations.
maggie turned her back on their suffering and instead supported the rich and their power structures

BTW Michael Heseltine was born in Wales, an infinitely better man than the biggest windbag of all, Neil Kinnock ( he and his wife currently living luxuriously off the public purse, somewhat hypocritical considering their past very public viewpoints )

anther straw man; who bloody cares

I can see the good in a lot of people, even though I dont agree with their politics. For example I thought politicians such as Mike Moore, Denis Healey and David Owen were thoroughly decent people.

more straw men, oh so dull.

And while this thread is about Maori claims I quite like Pita Sharples, even though some of his views are off the wall. Heck even the new Green co leader ( That Maori woman lawyer ) I dont subscribe to the Greens pseudo communism but that woman has got a lot of decorum and class when she speaks in Parliament.

the greens aren't communist or even pseudo communists and that is why I think you are deluded and a sponge for propaganda; you don't know the meaning of the word but throw it around as if you were an authority.

please provide some examples of green party 'communist' policies

So who is a better person, one that is fully blinkered and completely rubbishes opposing viewpoints or one that can see others views?

you, the blinkered, you are so steeped in your baseless propaganda you even believe it yourself. the elite like people like you, they need as many people as they can get who refuse to see through the veil of bullshit fed to us every day

[idleidolidyll]

Labour cam into power by changing their positition in the political compass by taking up the middle ground, which appealed to more of the electorate. Then what happened?

That's correct: Labour in Britain became New Labour and are as right wing as our National Party. Like Roger Douglas, they cheated their constituents and members and created a mockery of the very principles the party was founded on.

[Robert Taylor]

Man you are one very obnoxious lefty, nothing to be proud of.

Plenty to be proud of when it exposes the ugliness of 'compassionate conservatism' as espoused by a person who calls for fascist policies in NZ and a return to a dictatorship as per Maggie the bitch in Britain.

Also nothing to be proud of that unless someone agrees with you to the letter you rip them to shreds with your verbal poison.

Even prouder when that person regurgitates right wing propaganda and advocates systems that prey on the poor in order to enhance the wealthy

Those coal mining communities were artificially propped up by previous Governments and you know it. Why dig deeper holes when its no longer profitable to do so?

Because maggie the bitch gave them nothing else in place of those jobs.
capitalists ripped the people off and left them high and dry. they were told to abandon their communities; homes their relatives had lived in for generations.
maggie turned her back on their suffering and instead supported the rich and their power structures

BTW Michael Heseltine was born in Wales, an infinitely better man than the biggest windbag of all, Neil Kinnock ( he and his wife currently living luxuriously off the public purse, somewhat hypocritical considering their past very public viewpoints )

anther straw man; who bloody cares

I can see the good in a lot of people, even though I dont agree with their politics. For example I thought politicians such as Mike Moore, Denis Healey and David Owen were thoroughly decent people.

more straw men, oh so dull.

And while this thread is about Maori claims I quite like Pita Sharples, even though some of his views are off the wall. Heck even the new Green co leader ( That Maori woman lawyer ) I dont subscribe to the Greens pseudo communism but that woman has got a lot of decorum and class when she speaks in Parliament.

the greens aren't communist or even pseudo communists and that is why I think you are deluded and a sponge for propaganda; you don't know the meaning of the word but throw it around as if you were an authority.

please provide some examples of green party 'communist' policies

So who is a better person, one that is fully blinkered and completely rubbishes opposing viewpoints or one that can see others views?

you, the blinkered, you are so steeped in your baseless propaganda you even believe it yourself. the elite like people like you, they need as many people as they can get who refuse to see through the veil of bullshit fed to us every day

Im not elite and only got where I am through sheer bloody hard work. Neither am I wealthy because I help so many people, hardly the mark of a dirty filthy capitalist ripping off the masses, or other such leftist claptrap emotions. Given the truly combative and downright obnoxious demeanour of your posts I wouldnt have much faith in your compassion or empathy for anyone and everyone.

Yes I do indeed throw around the word communist, at about the same frequency as your all enveloping insinuations of fascism.

Enough said, this is becoming childishly toxic.

[idleidolidyll]

The real problem with Mr Taylors POV is that he tries to postulate that communism and socialism are the same and that they are the greatest cause of misery while his beloved fascist dictators only mean the best.

The issue isn't even about left and right, that's just more propaganda. The issue is about liberalism versus authoritarianism: the worst abusers in history have been, almost without fail, authoritarian.
Mt Taylors heroine, Maggie Thatcher was one of those as were Hitler, Bush, Mussolini, Stalin, Mao and Pol Pot.

If you want violence, intolerence and abuse, choose an extreme authoritarian every time and that's what you'll get.

This extends to the throw away term 'compassionate conservative'. Given that Mr Taylor continues to advocate a dictator of sorts in NZ and openly supports authoritarian abusers like Thatcher and in the past, Bush; the term is nothing more or less than another snow job.
The politicians he identifies again and again as solutions to NZ's problems are quasi or wanna be dictators, bullies or are backed by dictators and oligarchies; Mr Taylors colours are truly hanging out in the breeze for all to see.

'Compassionate Coservativism' is indeed a bogus term used by those who think the system that supports them is good for all of us; Hitler and the others show it clearly isn't.

[idleidolidyll]

Yes,

This thread HAS gone off topic somewhat. However, I refuse to allow bogus political speak go unchallenged and when it is so evident as in the posts of those supporting authoritarianism; i'll attack it every time i see it.

To those positing that authoritarianism is somehow good for all; you'll always be my target

[idleidolidyll]

Im not elite and only got where I am through sheer bloody hard work.

More straw men: I too work hard and so do most of the people you and yours attack.

Neither am I wealthy because I help so many people, hardly the mark of a dirty filthy capitalist ripping off the masses, or other such leftist claptrap emotions.

Yawn, the straw men keep coming. You advocate policies and people who DO rip off the common masses.

Given the truly combative and downright obnoxious demeanour of your posts I wouldnt have much faith in your compassion or empathy for anyone and everyone.

At least I reject rather than support dictators and self righteous abusers. I care for others regardless that it would benefit me to take your stance and embrace authoritarianism.

Yes I do indeed throw around the word communist, at about the same frequency as your all enveloping insinuations of fascism.

The difference is that you throw the word at what you call socialism nopt what it is whereas I suggest fascism becausae of the policies and systems you suggest that ARE fascist. The defining basis of fascism is authoritarianism.

Enough said, this is becoming childishly toxic.

Indeed; it invariably does when your factless doctrine is put up to be shot down in flames

[Robert Taylor]

Yes,

This thread HAS gone off topic somewhat. However, I refuse to allow bogus political speak go unchallenged and when it is so evident as in the posts of those supporting authoritarianism; i'll attack it every time i see it.

To those positing that authoritarianism is somehow good for all; you'll always be my target

Now who is being authoritarian???????!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[idleidolidyll]

Now who is being authoritarian???????!!!!!!!!!!!!!

it seems we have found another word Mr Taylor doesn't understand.

FYI: To advise that one will attack propaganda is not authoritarianism