Silent file RE Maori interest in your house

**owner** · 5th July 2009, 20:20

Seem Maori claims are on debate at the mo

We are looking at buying a house just out of Chch and in the LIM report it says there is a "silent file" stating that the local tribe has interest in the property.
I have never heard of this
Does anyone have any horror stories?
or is this nothing to worry about?

**RantyDave** · 5th July 2009, 20:21

Originally Posted by owner

We are looking at buying a house just out of Chch and in the LIM report it says there is a "silent file" stating that the local tribe has interest in the property.

I'd be running to see my lawyer. At the very least use it to bash another 10k off the price.

Dave

**98tls** · 5th July 2009, 20:25

Originally Posted by owner

Seem Maori claims are on debate at the mo

We are looking at buying a house just out of Chch and in the LIM report it says there is a "silent file" stating that the local tribe has interest in the property.
I have never heard of this
Does anyone have any horror stories?
or is this nothing to worry about?

Possibly the site of another KFC in the future.

Note to self, write a thousand times "dont mention KFC in any thread re Maori,its not funny its racist."

**owner** · 5th July 2009, 20:27

Originally Posted by RantyDave

I'd be running to see my lawyer. At the very least use it to bash another 10k off the price.

Dave

OK thats a point I could use 10K for a new bike

**owner** · 5th July 2009, 20:28

Originally Posted by 98tls

Possibly the site of another KFC in the future.

Out of Chch.

Definetly no K faeces out in the country side

**YellowDog** · 5th July 2009, 20:32

Faaark.

The next time I make an offer on a house, as well as: LIM, Building Inspection and Finance, I will also add a Maori curse get out clause.

**owner** · 5th July 2009, 20:37

Originally Posted by YellowDog

Faaark.

The next time I make an offer on a house, as well as: LIM, Building Inspection and Finance, I will also add a Maori curse get out clause.

I guess it's really a question for a solicitor or the tribe I suppose

**marty** · 5th July 2009, 20:44

from: http://www.mfe.govt.nz/publications/...tml/page5.html

Silent files keep locations safe from the public

A silent file allows a whanau, hapu or iwi to identify the location of a wahi tapu and to keep that information safe from the public [Section 42 of the RMA]. If anyone wanted to use that particular location then the local authority would be under an obligation to contact the guardians of the silent file to make sure that the wahi tapu would not be affected by the proposed use.
You can apply for a silent file

Any person can apply for a silent file. A local authority can make an order where it is satisfied that:

* the order is necessary to avoid serious offence to tikanga Maori
* the order is necessary to make sure that the public does not know where the wahi tapu is [Section 42(1)(a) of the RMA].

The importance of keeping wahi tapu secret must outweigh the public interest in making that information available [Section 42(1) of the RMA].
How a silent file works

The general area of the wahi tapu would be marked in a district plan. This would let the public know that some part of that area has been recorded in a silent file. In this way the specific location of the wahi tapu will not be marked.
The effectiveness of silent files is not guaranteed

This is because:

* the silent file system depends on the co-operation of local authorities
* the local authority decides whether the details of a wahi tapu will be made public by weighing Maori concerns against the public interest.
* if an official information request were made to a local authority about information in a silent file, it is not guaranteed that the information would be kept confidential
* you may not be able to keep the specific location of a wahi tapu confidential if you want it to be protected
* you may need to reveal the location to your local authority if an application for a resource consent to develop land was submitted to the local authority and the land in question involved the wahi tapu.

It would be better for you to make sure that information about the exact location of wahi tapu remained with appointed whanau/hapu/iwi guardians rather than with the local authority.

You should also make sure that a process for communicating this information is in place between the appointed guardians and your local authority.

**marty** · 5th July 2009, 20:48

Ngai Tahu have 100's of these. Looks like the house is in an area where there is an old cemetery or other significant holding. The silent file prevents RMA decisions being made without knowing historical significance, so unless you're going to dig a well, or do anything that may affect the historical nature of the land, you'd be OK.

I wonder if the real estate agent is obliged to tell you, if they knew about it. Any agent that was actually worth their pay would know.

**owner** · 5th July 2009, 20:55

Originally Posted by marty

from: http://www.mfe.govt.nz/publications/...tml/page5.html

Silent files keep locations safe from the public

A silent file allows a whanau, hapu or iwi to identify the location of a wahi tapu and to keep that information safe from the public [Section 42 of the RMA]. If anyone wanted to use that particular location then the local authority would be under an obligation to contact the guardians of the silent file to make sure that the wahi tapu would not be affected by the proposed use.
You can apply for a silent file

Any person can apply for a silent file. A local authority can make an order where it is satisfied that:

* the order is necessary to avoid serious offence to tikanga Maori
* the order is necessary to make sure that the public does not know where the wahi tapu is [Section 42(1)(a) of the RMA].

The importance of keeping wahi tapu secret must outweigh the public interest in making that information available [Section 42(1) of the RMA].
How a silent file works

The general area of the wahi tapu would be marked in a district plan. This would let the public know that some part of that area has been recorded in a silent file. In this way the specific location of the wahi tapu will not be marked.
The effectiveness of silent files is not guaranteed

This is because:

* the silent file system depends on the co-operation of local authorities
* the local authority decides whether the details of a wahi tapu will be made public by weighing Maori concerns against the public interest.
* if an official information request were made to a local authority about information in a silent file, it is not guaranteed that the information would be kept confidential
* you may not be able to keep the specific location of a wahi tapu confidential if you want it to be protected
* you may need to reveal the location to your local authority if an application for a resource consent to develop land was submitted to the local authority and the land in question involved the wahi tapu.

It would be better for you to make sure that information about the exact location of wahi tapu remained with appointed whanau/hapu/iwi guardians rather than with the local authority.

You should also make sure that a process for communicating this information is in place between the appointed guardians and your local authority.

So I get from that, it may only be a problem if I was applying for resource consent for something

thanks for the link Marty

**owner** · 5th July 2009, 20:59

Originally Posted by marty

Ngai Tahu have 100's of these. Looks like the house is in an area where there is an old cemetery or other significant holding. The silent file prevents RMA decisions being made without knowing historical significance, so unless you're going to dig a well, or do anything that may affect the historical nature of the land, you'd be OK.

I wonder if the real estate agent is obliged to tell you, if they knew about it. Any agent that was actually worth their pay would know.

We are just looking at it and the agent gave us the LIM the first time we viewed it
That was the only thing that stood out to me.
I'm not going to be digging a well any time soon maybe a long drop if she puts me in the dog house to often

**Molly** · 5th July 2009, 21:06

Interesting thread. I've never head of a silent file either but it's clearly worth knowing about. I'd be concerned that it wouldn't restrict future development too.

**Hitcher** · 5th July 2009, 21:16

Another racist panic attack averted. Phew!

**Pedrostt500** · 5th July 2009, 21:35

So one could get a silent file taken out on a property, where one may have burried a body or fifty, hypertheticaly speaking of course, and all that money from the bank roberies would be safe to I geuss, hypertheticaly speaking.

Not that one would know of such things.

Damn did I just type that out loud.

**pete376403** · 5th July 2009, 21:37

Originally Posted by Pedrostt500

So one could get a silent file taken out on a property, where one may have burried a body or fifty, hypertheticaly speaking of course, and all that money from the bank roberies would be safe to I geuss, hypertheticaly speaking.

Not that one would know of such things.
Damn did I just type that out loud.

If you are Tangata Whenua, I suppose.