Remind me where Downer are from..Originally Posted by idleidolidyll
Irritant
Remind me where Downer are from..
has made a bo-bo in his nappies
sure, i never said the business roundtable and its adherents hadn't already sold out half+ of NZ
so does that mean you support even more kiwi cash being sent offshore for nothing but more fat profits for foreign companies?
do you know what dependent contracting is and why its just plain criminal?
Psyclepath
Perhaps you could explain the difference here between the owner-operator model for a telco tech versus, say, a courier or a taxi driver?
As I said before, given the supply/demand equation for the skills these guys have, I don't see anyone in the position to shaft them. The (pretty well qualified) opinion I heard from reasonably high up in one of the two incumbent service companies, is that a young go-ahead bloke could do very well, someone looking at sub-ten years to retirement, not so much.
Only a homo puts an engine back together WITHOUT making it go faster.
Just faidin away!
Government utilities "honest", run for the benefit of the end user, do you really believe that bullshit?
Power companies "nationalised again", tell us which ones are not owned by the government now!
Transpower, Genesis, Mighty River, Meridian, all still owned by the government!
Since deregulation, they have extended their operations into retail by buying up the old power boards!
Same government owned utilities (SOE's) but even bigger than before!
Power (electricity) was deregulated, not privatised!
The government now own more of the electricity supply than they did before deregulation!
They sold a few stations to help set up Contact as a private company to create the illusion of competition to drive prices down, big deal!
Are you and the rest of NZ consumers benefiting from this "competitive" market??? NO, because it is controlled by government monopoly!
Who is screwing who and why do you think nothing ever really gets done about it? State controlled socialist cunts!.....
has made a bo-bo in his nappies
Easy; dependant contracts like that offered to the Downer guys and gals is an exclusive contract to only one company. The staff have been told they must be available 12 hours per day 6 days per week so there is no way they can work for any other business under the contract and the contract holder has the power, through a monopoly on their hours, to force them to accept lower or higher hours and conditions without the ability to go elsewhere.
A taxi driver is a free enterprise and can sell their services to anyone on the street.
Psyclepath
Apparently not, there's a legal opinion for the EPMU linked on the Stranded...
Only a homo puts an engine back together WITHOUT making it go faster.
has made a bo-bo in his nappies
When the contract they ask you to sign calls for 12 hour a day, 6 days a week availability, that pretty much excludes all ability to offer services to other companies.
Under the ERA, that kind of dependent contracting is effectively nothing more than an employment contract to a sole company and therefore constitutes employment under that company with all standard rules of employment applying. The ability for the contract holder to abuse their monopoly over the contracted worker is recognised as an abuse of employer worker relationship and can be prosecuted under the ERA.
I don't have the specific clauses but this was something I studied in 2005 while sitting my Comms Degree. Yes, of course it can be challenged by a lawyer as can any law or statute but effectively it is in breach of the ERA as it stands and that's not good for Kiwis at all.
That said, the last Nat govt introduced the odious Employment Contracts Act: a document that robbed most workers of their rights and transferred them to the employer. I fully expect that to happen again with changes to the ERA allowing abuse of workers under National.
Nationals Hollow Men are taking control again. The latest is the proposed shift to taxation.
To reduce income tax and increase gst is nothing less than a faster transfer of wealth to the wealthy in a system where that is already happening.
The tax cuts promise will be totally eroded for most Kiwis in favour of tax cuts for the wealthy at the expense of the less fortunate.
has made a bo-bo in his nappies
That said,
the company could reduce the demanded availability of the contracters allowing them to work for other companies during the same hours. This would of course mean that a call out could take many more hours to be attended to and the standard of service will become merkedly worse.
the real issue though is that we are allowing foreign companies to drive down Kiwi wages so they can ship more of our money offshore with less comeback on them
Irritant
Define 'less fortunate', if you wouldn't mind..
Would it happen to be those of us that:
Don't drink. Don't smoke. Don't have children. Don't have cars on HP. Don't have PS3s/Xboxes/etc. Don't have takeaway food. Don't have credit cards. Don't have a whole heap of other shit they don't need. Don't appear on the TV whining they don't get a hand out for some shit they've caused themselves.
But DO have a mortgage on a nice house. DO save up for things BEFORE buying them.
Are they the less fortunate you have in mind?
has made a bo-bo in his nappies
oh please
don't pretend you're some kind of angel and do stick to the point
capitalism is a contract and part of that contract is the understanding that capitalists need the unemployed to help drive wages down.
if a certain percentage of jobs are bot available then the contract is moot.
likewise, if capitalists whine when governments try to find work for people to do while on the dole because it "takes away a legitimate and profiable business"; they should NOT whine when the government pay people to sit on their arses.
Fact: wealth has been trending away from mid and lower classes
Fact: National policies will increase that trend and the bulk of ordinary Kiwis will lose from the changes
Fact: I stand to gain considerably from National policies and so does my wife as we are both very well paid
Fact: I'd rather see the money go to the lower and middle classes and have NZ stay the relatively class free nation it is with top rankings in all the things that really count like quality of life and access to health care
Fact: Nationals cronies dont give a rats arse about ordinary Kiwis and those ordinary youths who had never experienced Nationals abuse are about to learn a hard lesson
Irritant
I'm quite sure they'd be happy to take it off you. Do you need the government to force you to hand your money over, or are you willing to do it off your own back?
Personally, I'd rather keep the money I earn, and let those of us that choose to squander their unearned cash on shit rot in the squallor of their own making.
has made a bo-bo in his nappies
Slippery Slope, Divide and Conquer; call it what you will..............
"First they came for the Communists, and I didn’t speak up, because I wasn’t a Communist. Then they came for the Jews, and I didn’t speak up, because I wasn’t a Jew. Then they came for the Catholics, and I didn’t speak up, because I was a Protestant. Then they came for me, and by that time there was no one left to speak up for me." Pastor Martin Niemoller
The National Party version:
First they came for the unemployed but I didn't care because I had a job I thought I could keep,
Then they came for the telco workers but those lazy bastards deserved it, then they came for the bank staff and they've always pissed me off so I said nothing, then they came for the engineers and those guys are so smug i didn't give a damn.......then they came for me but by that time the gap between the have and have nots was so huge and I'd been such a bastard to all the others I had no support or power and I too was driven into wage slavery along with all the rest.
If you don't see the danger behind this you're either blind or don't give a damn about Kiwi society
has made a bo-bo in his nappies
yep, we need the govt to force it to happen because power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely: those with power (money in todays' language) won't offer it freely; all they will offer is crumbs from the masters table.
the real joke is that those with a few grand, tens of k, even hundreds of thou are not the power brokers, they are merely the apologists for what will eventually happen to them too
capitalism is about cornering power for a tiny minority not about freedom, democracy or egalitarianism; those are socialist tenants
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