Cruser meets Van

[retro asian]

NEERRDS!!!!

[Danae]

As I was leaving the computer room, I spotted an asian dude on KB...retro asian, could it have been you?

In any case i lold

[Squiggles]

My GN pwns you all.

[shingo]

dushy clearly missed my point...

Wait ital916 is Dushy?

It all makes sense now...

[Danae]

Wait ital916 is Dushy?

It all makes sense now...

lol took you a while

[Squiggles]

Wait ital916 is Dushy?

It all makes sense now...

lol, Aussies really are dumb

[Real_Wolf]

see, the problem is that your saying it can't be brought down to fundamentals, and for the very precise things that is true, however for a basic observation, the entire point of physics is simplifying something so that you can use it to understand more complex things, such as assuming that a wire is of infinite length so you don't have to deal with an unusual field coming off the end of it.

Or assuming that the molecules in a gas do not interact, so that PV = nRT is still fairly accurate.

Or assuming that the torque produced by the force on the fairing is roughly perpindicular.

Also, the amount that the wind is diverted is essentially a force being applied on the wind, and as such newtons third law of physics (which hasn't been proven wrong on anything non-relative or quantum mechanical) clearly states that for each action there is an equal and opposite reaction, thus the force exerted upon the wind to change its directory, simple F*t = change in momentum, would have an equal force being exerted upon said motorcycle fairings

[Ragingrob]

lol, Aussies really are dumb

Laugh Out Loud!

[skidMark]

Laugh Out Loud!

ROR...


http://pix.motivatedphotos.com/2008/...f-out-roud.jpg

[motorbyclist]

It has its place. My problem is more the mechatronics guys who pass themselves off as people who can do the job of either. They can't.

Maybe the course has got better since I graduated, but the mechatronics guys I knew and helped with EEE stuff were pretty hopeless...

yeah they've made a biiiig shift away from mechanical towards electrical. As students we've started taking 5th papers also to try and reach further back towards mechanical and/or open up more slots for electives in 4th year. Myself i'll be back for a 5th year of extra electives and to pick up some languages and maybe a bit of commerce.

we're mechatronics, not mechanical, not electrical. Contrary to the theory that it's a general specialisation, turns out we're real good at what we do, but a waste of time as pure electrical/mechanical/software engineers because we've made a compromise and simply aren't as good. What we are good at is mechatronics systems; where otherwise the three traditional engineers are desperately struggling to convey ideas between each other and are unaware of the abilities/limitations of what their colleague can engineer. This is where the job market suddenly looks good, otherwise it's a bit depressing going around being turned down cause we're not pure electrical/mechanical.


honestly, as it is we need to be taking 5 papers per semester or more to get a proper mix, but that stuffs up the conjoint and AP students. I tried to explain to the powers that be that 2nd year dropping machines and mechanisms on favour of basic electrics which we relearn in 3rd year anyway is denying most the "kids" any semblance of what could be an understanding of the real world.

ie, it's full of nerds that are book smart, but come up with some retarded ideas that might work in theory but either aren't viable or just don't work in practice, OR is a less effective system for something that's been around for 50 years, because their real-world experience is nil. Talking with some managers recently (job interviews etc) they had much the same to say, and apparently even professional engineers are prone to it across all specialisations (but moreso software, you can guess why).

yet more statements without references...we are talking engineering here. Otherwise you have to go, "I believe comapnies worldwide..."

right, i can either dig up all the articles and columns i've read supporting the matter, or reference the managers/HR people we talk to from companies that started taking graduate mechatronics a few years ago and now won't take anyone else (within reason). or you can take my word for it, with the concession that obviously it only suits certain industries/businesses. your choice.

I find it is the mentality that mechatronics engineers believe themselves superior to either profession. I have friends in mechatronics who are extremely clever but they dont try and fool themselves into thinking they are the equivalent of both a mechanical and electrical engineer.

Same experience here, pissed me off greatly.

but it's half the fun! (lol that engineers, usually considered arrogant, are calling the superior engineer arrogant too )


seriously though, i think a major problem is we keep bumping into the compsys guys; pants-on-head retarded.

classic example - asked for help from fellow 3rd year student using an AVR. he wanted to know why he wasn't getting a display on the screen from his running code. I ended up painfully explaining that if he doesn't have any connection from AVR to PC that it isn't going to magically appear on-screen. Then explained what an LDR is, suggested the use of a photodiode, and mocked the use of some sort of photovoltaic effect on the capacitance of an LED to detect light/dark. My wingmen also mocked; mechatonics ftw!

Told him to get back to me if he got it working however, because if it did work i'd be impressed and curious. (and didn't want to plant my foot too firmly in my mouth)

sure enough, next time i saw him he had got it working, while he didn't go into any detail, apparently he came up with a clever solution where i had advised that what he was measuring was probably outside the accuracy of his ADC.

[skidMark]

yeah they've made a biiiig shift away from mechanical towards electrical. As students we've started taking 5th papers also to try and reach further back towards mechanical and/or open up more slots for electives in 4th year. Myself i'll be back for a 5th year of extra electives and to pick up some languages and maybe a bit of commerce.

we're mechatronics, not mechanical, not electrical. Contrary to the theory that it's a general specialisation, turns out we're real good at what we do, but a waste of time as pure electrical/mechanical/software engineers because we've made a compromise and simply aren't as good. What we are good at is mechatronics systems; where otherwise the three traditional engineers are desperately struggling to convey ideas between each other and are unaware of the abilities/limitations of what their colleague can engineer. This is where the job market suddenly looks good, otherwise it's a bit depressing going around being turned down cause we're not pure electrical/mechanical.


honestly, as it is we need to be taking 5 papers per semester or more to get a proper mix, but that stuffs up the conjoint and AP students. I tried to explain to the powers that be that 2nd year dropping machines and mechanisms on favour of basic electrics which we relearn in 3rd year anyway is denying most the "kids" any semblance of what could be an understanding of the real world.

ie, it's full of nerds that are book smart, but come up with some retarded ideas that might work in theory but either aren't viable or just don't work in practice, OR is a less effective system for something that's been around for 50 years, because their real-world experience is nil. Talking with some managers recently (job interviews etc) they had much the same to say, and apparently even professional engineers are prone to it across all specialisations (but moreso software, you can guess why).



right, i can either dig up all the articles and columns i've read supporting the matter, or reference the managers/HR people we talk to from companies that started taking graduate mechatronics a few years ago and now won't take anyone else (within reason). or you can take my word for it, with the concession that obviously it only suits certain industries/businesses. your choice.




but it's half the fun! (lol that engineers, usually considered arrogant, are calling the superior engineer arrogant too )


seriously though, i think a major problem is we keep bumping into the compsys guys; pants-on-head retarded.

classic example - asked for help from fellow 3rd year student using an AVR. he wanted to know why he wasn't getting a display on the screen from his running code. I ended up painfully explaining that if he doesn't have any connection from AVR to PC that it isn't going to magically appear on-screen. Then explained what an LDR is, suggested the use of a photodiode, and mocked the use of some sort of photovoltaic effect on the capacitance of an LED to detect light/dark. My wingmen also mocked; mechatonics ftw!

Told him to get back to me if he got it working however, because if it did work i'd be impressed and curious. (and didn't want to plant my foot too firmly in my mouth)

sure enough, next time i saw him he had got it working, while he didn't go into any detail, apparently he came up with a clever solution where i had advised that what he was measuring was probably outside the accuracy of his ADC.

What the flying fuck, what is wrong with the uni students today, having discussions directly read from your uni books on the internet. Why arn't you getting pissed slurrily argueing this in person while doing shots off uni sluts and loose old library ladies?

[motorbyclist]

I find it is the mentality that mechatronics engineers believe themselves superior to either profession.

Same experience here, pissed me off greatly.

lol you should've seen the submissions for the 3rd year shirt! We actually weren't allowed to print them

apparently slogans such as, "Mechatronics: putting you out of a job since 2003", and, "Bow to your future overlords" could be considered offensive

[motorbyclist]

What the flying fuck, what is wrong with the uni students today, having discussions directly read from your uni books on the internet. Why arn't you getting pissed slurrily argueing this in person while doing shots off uni sluts and loose old library ladies?

shit, you must've missed the warning i added.....


We don't need sex; we get fucked by the school of engineering all the time!

[jono035]

Contrary to the theory that it's a general specialisation, turns out we're real good at what we do, but a waste of time as pure electrical/mechanical/software engineers because we've made a compromise and simply aren't as good.

And there we go. Bravado bullshit about being 'superior' aside, mechatronics guys should be able to easily do something that it would take a mechanical or electrical engineer with a very specific (and rare) set of extra skills to do, or require 2 engineers, so of course companies would be hiring mechatronics guys to do the jobs that are appropriate.

I'm glad you guys are learning more electrical stuff, it was pretty damn sparse a few years ago. Teaching 4th years why a comparator and op-amp are different pissed me off.

Edit: You mention the fact that most engineers come out of the degree basically unemployable due to only being book smart, bear in mind that this was the complaint of the guy that I worked for, the complaint of the guys in the years above me, and my complaint as well. It has been a common theme for a very long time and is an understood point by anyone with any practical skills.

seriously though, i think a major problem is we keep bumping into the compsys guys; pants-on-head retarded.

Yeah, there are a few *facepalm* moments there, same with the software engineers.

btw - the thing with the LED as a light detector can actually be elegant, under reverse bias the avalanche current changes according to incident light, same as a photodiode just weaker. Never used the effect myself but using an indicator LED to do ambient light measurement has some amount of appeal.

[ital916]

see, the problem is that your saying it can't be brought down to fundamentals, and for the very precise things that is true, however for a basic observation, the entire point of physics is simplifying something so that you can use it to understand more complex things, such as assuming that a wire is of infinite length so you don't have to deal with an unusual field coming off the end of it.

Or assuming that the molecules in a gas do not interact, so that PV = nRT is still fairly accurate.

Or assuming that the torque produced by the force on the fairing is roughly perpindicular.

Also, the amount that the wind is diverted is essentially a force being applied on the wind, and as such newtons third law of physics (which hasn't been proven wrong on anything non-relative or quantum mechanical) clearly states that for each action there is an equal and opposite reaction, thus the force exerted upon the wind to change its directory, simple F*t = change in momentum, would have an equal force being exerted upon said motorcycle fairings

I think andrew and jono that we should stop debating among ourselves and unify on the point that realwolf must stop writing.....agreed?