Court - What to expect

[paddy]

Hi guys,

I will be defending a charge under the Summary Proceedings Act in court on October 13th. The charge is exceeding 70 km/h as leaner motorcyclist. I know there is mixed opinion as to whether I should attempt to defend this charge - but I ask that we don't get into that fight again here (it's been had over and over and over).

I am hoping that someone might be able to elighten me as to the process. I will not have legal counsel so I will be defending myself. I have some questions:

Will it be a judge or a JP? How do I address them? What format will the proceeding take? I had intended on preparing a written statement that I hoped to just read. Is this likely to be a sensible approach?

Thanks,
Patrick

[Katman]

It will most likely be heard by a JP. They are addressed as "Your Worship".

The couple of dealings that I've had with JPs have shown me just how pathetic our lower legal system can be.

(On a similar note, can any legal minds on here tell me whether the Judicial Conduct Commission handles complaints about JPs - or only Judges).

[Hazza]

Good on you, best of luck hope you get a good outcome

[klingon]

Hi guys,

I will be defending a charge under the Summary Proceedings Act in court on October 13th. The charge is exceeding 70 km/h as leaner motorcyclist. I know there is mixed opinion as to whether I should attempt to defend this charge - but I ask that we don't get into that fight again here (it's been had over and over and over).

I am hoping that someone might be able to elighten me as to the process. I will not have legal counsel so I will be defending myself. I have some questions:

Will it be a judge or a JP? How do I address them? What format will the proceeding take? I had intended on preparing a written statement that I hoped to just read. Is this likely to be a sensible approach?

Thanks,
Patrick

Which court will it be heard at? It might pay to call the court and ask some of those questions directly so you are clear on the procedure.

At the Waitakere District Court they call everyone to be there at 10am, then you arrive and look at the list on the wall to see which courtroom you're in. Unfortunately there is no way of knowing what order you will be called in, so you are likely to wait for several hours before your name is called. Set aside the whole day for this (apparently people accused of a misdemeanor have nothing better to do with their time than sit in a waiting room.)

Eventually you will be called in and asked to plead. If this is your first appearance you will say "not guilty" and you will probably be sent away again and you will revceive another date in the mail when your case will be heard... and again you will have to wait all day!

I would suggest you take a friend to be your support person - someone who can pop out and get you a coffee or a paper, or wait while you dash to the loo, without worrying about missing your name being called.

[Sheba]

Best of luck with this, hope there's a favorable outcome.

[Jonno.]

I'm curious as to what you're defending? Are you disputing that it occured or the law. Interesting to see how it goes.

[Toot Toot]

Is this your first appearance?? I have a feeling it is so you will not be defending it that day (October 13).
You will only enter a plea, at which point you may plead guilty, not guilty, or enter 'no plea', which is essentially the same as not guilty.
As mentioned above you will go to the court on the day at 10am (this is normal time for court). There are several courtrooms. There are lists posted outside each one. Yours will be in the minor traffic court, so find a list with that heading on it and your name should be on it.
It will be heard by two JP's, not a Judge.
Now you can either wait outside in the lobby for your name to be called over the P.A. or you can opt to "sit in" the court room at the back in the public gallery and watch the proceedings go on before you. I suggest this to be a good idea as you will get a feel for what goes on and what to do/say etc.

Over the PA you will hear "John Smith, followed by George Citizen (you), courtroom 3. Which means it is John Smiths turn and you are next.
Then you will hear "George Citizen (you), followed by Sam Brown, courtroom 3". his means it is your turn to go inside.
You do not need to bow to the JP, this is only for counsel (lawyers) to do.
You may address the JP as "Your Worship" but "Sir" or "Maa'm" is perfectly acceptable.
You will enter the courtroom, pass the public gallery seating, beyond some railings that seperate them from the rest of the court and stand over to one side. You will be directed where to stand by one of the JP's, they are very accomodating to first timers.

The JP will ask the Police prosecuter (usually a crusty old sergent) what the charge is. He will tell the court that you are charged with operating a vehicle at a speed over 70kph whilst on a learners licence.

The JP then looks over to you and asks how you plead to that charge. This is where you say, not guilty Sir. The court then sets a date for a defended hearing (usually a month or so away depending on court time etc). If the date does not suit you (need a pretty good reason tho) you may request an alternate date at this point in time.
A date will be set and you will be excused from the court... day one over.


Defended hearing...

Same as above up untill the where you stand bit. As you are representing yourself, you go and sit at the tables normally assigned for your legal representation. The police prosecutor will read the charge to the court.
After this the police officer that gave you the ticket will stand in the witness box and state his full name and job title, then swear on the bible that he will tell the truth etc.
The prosecutor will ask him a series of questions relating to the day you were stopped. These will include things like were the radar equipment checked etc before shift, which of course they answer yes too. They will normally produce the certification papers for the speed device in question and the JP will offer to show you these.
Once the prosecutor has finished asking questions the JP will give you the opportunity to cross examine the police officer.
This is where you STAND UP and ask questions. You may have paper with the questions on if you want. It is a good idea to scribble some notes while the prosecutor was asking questions to the police officer. This is your chance to get any information from the police officer which may help your case.

When you are finished asking questions, the policeman will sit down and it is your turn to get up in the witness box, state your full name and swear on the bible. You may not read from notes in the witness box, some JP's allow them as a reference only.
You will then proceed to tell your "version" of events. You can support this with diagrams or photos of the roadway or whatever you want.
Once you are finished the prosecutor will cross examine YOU. This part is very tricky and you need to pause and think very carefully how you answer each question. They are designed to trap you into an admission of guilt basiclly. Answer slowly (the JP's are recording in long hand). Even seemingly benign questions have a reason for being asked. They may ask what colour the car was behind you... you wont know.. they move on and later ask if there was a truck not far in front of you... this you wont know either.... then they tell the JP that clearly you were not concentrating on riding because you will have known these things so you clearly were not concentrating on your speed and are a menace to society. From here you feel the colour drain from your face and you feel giddy as you realise this prosecutor has sucked you in and your fucked.
He will also ask you directly if you were speeding....think very carefully how you answer this. If you say no, he will say "I put it to you that you are not being truthful in this court today" think how you will answer this as well. He will then leave you alone and sit down with a smirk on his face.
At this point the JP may or may not ask you a breif question or two, or to clarify a point.
It is now that if you have a witness they will be brought in and it is as above.
It is at this point also that if you have researched any previous similar cases (on the internet or whatever) that have similar circumstances to yours and were let off you may bring this to the courts attention. You need to be very specific about exactly which case it was, where it was heard and what the outcome was (edit... obviously this needs to be a NZ case, not necassarily recent tho).

If not, you go sit down again and the JP's will bugger off and have a cup of tea, giving you the impression they are thinking about your case.
A little while later they return (you stand on entering).
They sit there and very breifly re-cap the case and tell you that in this instance they have found the police case to be proved.
You then still pay the fine and $30 court costs.

JP's nearly always side with the police, where as a Judge will make a cop work for his money and actually prove his case properly.

Good luck. any questions just ask.

I see you live in HBC, so will be North Shore District Court. If you were stopped in Rodney, then welcome to the Hazzard County police state where motorcylces are seen as child molestering murderous machines of death.

[phill-k]

Hi guys,

I will be defending a charge under the Summary Proceedings Act in court on October 13th. The charge is exceeding 70 km/h as leaner motorcyclist.
Thanks,
Patrick

how about giving us the background behind you deciding to defend this charge

thanks

[Reckless]

Is this your first appearance??

That was a good read! Thanks for taking the time.

[scumdog]

You then still pay the fine and $30 court costs.

Is that a special rate for JP Court?

Cos mostly it's $130 in costs.

[crazyhorse]

All the best - but do allow to be there for most of the day - you have to just wait until it is your turn - very boring and long winded. And then they stop for morning tea too!

Good Luck

[James Deuce]

"Mixed Opinions"?

A definitive opinion would be - "You're screwed".

Talk about picking the wrong battle.

Pay the fine and forget court. It's going to cost you the fine, court costs, and at least 4 random days off work.

There is no principle to fight. You broke a long standing, well-understood law, now man up.

Sheesh.

[scumdog]

"Mixed Opinions"?

A definitive opinion would be - "You're screwed".

Talk about picking the wrong battle.

Pay the fine and forget court. It's going to cost you the fine, court costs, and at least 4 random days off work.

There is no principle to fight. You broke a long standing, well-understood law, now man up.

Sheesh.

Shutup.

You're going to ruin the fun.

[SixPackBack]

Hi guys,

I will be defending a charge under the Summary Proceedings Act in court on October 13th. The charge is exceeding 70 km/h as leaner motorcyclist. I know there is mixed opinion as to whether I should attempt to defend this charge - but I ask that we don't get into that fight again here (it's been had over and over and over).

I am hoping that someone might be able to elighten me as to the process. I will not have legal counsel so I will be defending myself. I have some questions:

Will it be a judge or a JP? How do I address them? What format will the proceeding take? I had intended on preparing a written statement that I hoped to just read. Is this likely to be a sensible approach?

Thanks,
Patrick

Toot toot has wrapped it up nicely. A few other points:

• The JP's could not give a flying fuck about you or your ticket.
• The coppers have ticketing targets to meet-you're easy meat.
• Hiring a lawyer [The only hope of getting of the ticket] will cost more than the fine.
• Lawyers are motivated by money, it may be in their best interest to string you out. Your guilt or innocence is of no consequence to them.
• Minor traffic offences are tax-plain and simple.
• Coppers will lie to get a conviction.
• The court system may change appearance date/s without informing you. This will result in a guilty finding.
• The copper may not turn up. This can happen multiple times with no visible impact on said dodgy copper. It can waste days of your time.
• Conversely if you cannot turn up a guilty result will be recorded.

Address the JP and copper as lying scum. By supporting a system that contains no effective real justice, both the coppers and JP's are lying to themselves and those they jokingly represent.

[Madness]

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/at...5&d=1252565786

I'm with SPB on the lying thing.