Hampton Downs: is there an issue?

[suzuki21]

shut up robert your a dick

A few people are saying odd stuff. "It was the hump" "it was the wall" "it was suspension"
Here is something really out there................ maybe he had cold tires, maybe he turned in to soon, went wide, and :-(

[Quasievil]

Well, all of the comments are in a thread discussing perceived design flaws with a race track, revisited following Tims untimely demise. I think there's a tie in yeah.

And I've never known you to be one to stand down mate.

True

To sum up then give me 5 minutes with a pen and paper and I could design a better track than Hampton, and so could my Lakeland terrier

Oh, and fix the fucking wall and the stupid pit lane entry cock up.

[gixerracer]

A few people are saying odd stuff. "It was the hump" "it was the wall" "it was suspension"
Here is something really out there................ maybe he had cold tires, maybe he turned in to soon, went wide, and :-(

I doubt there was any thing specifc other than the fact the poor bugger got out of shape and there was no where for him to go which is a very very sad thing indeed.
I didnt seem to think the track was that bad the first time I rode there on my superbike but having watched the first round of the AMCC recently in the rain I think the whole main straight is very unsafe with the painted lines etc and if you have a group going in there and one spins up and gets a bit out of shape this is going to end again in tears

[Pussy]

Here is something really out there................ maybe he had cold tires, maybe he turned in to soon, went wide, and :-(

..... which wouldn't have been an issue with a safer run-off area

the wall isn't very well placed

[Brett]

That is correct John and I have been at pains to point out that I too have issue with the proximity of that wall. But great suspension and overall bike setup may just preclude veering off line and making contact with that wall. Or any immovable object, on track or on road for that matter.
Im merely highlighting that badly maladjusted suspension often sets up the start of a crash, yes the end of that crash was tragic because it was a solid object in close proximity. And that issue needs attention.

I think that the immediate issue to be addressed is the safety issue of the wall. In a risk assessment, that is the surely the blaring safety issue and I think that HD management need to review this fairly urgently. I would be very surprised if WSBK or the likes would attend HD in its present state.

However I absolutely agree with your statements about riders needing to have a better understanding of how their machines work. Personally it is something that I take very seriously because I want to understand how my bike works and thus how to set it up best for me and my riding style. Not all track day riders will be the same though.

However, this is not an overnight fix. Many riders at trackdays are new to the track and probably wouldn't know what rebound or suspension travel is. Robert, the likes of yourself and Shaun have years and years of experience that cannot be replicated in others in days, weeks or months.

Because of this, bike setup will continue to be a cause of some crashes. A new rider who has just upgraded to their shiny new 600cc SS can't be expected to know how best to set the thing up and so any race track needs to be designed with people crashing in mind.

I think the idea of a chicane is a great temporary (or possibly longterm) fix.

[Robert Taylor]

A few people are saying odd stuff. "It was the hump" "it was the wall" "it was suspension"
Here is something really out there................ maybe he had cold tires, maybe he turned in to soon, went wide, and :-(

For once you make sense Steve Sangster, there are possibly a whole cocktail of reasons for Tim getting into a situation that sent him on a trajectory towards the wall.

[Tony.OK]

Man this thread is just going in circles............

People can blame all the bike issues in the world, tyre, suspension, green rider...........what if a bike had a mechanical prob at that point? No drama, may crash because of it. BUT that crash should not result in a tragedy because of a design fault of the track. Shit tracks and crashing go hand in hand almost.

Ok there are tragedies that occur from freak mishaps at tracks, but simply put a rider shouldn't be on that list just because of a setup problem or bad line etc. FACT!!

[Kickaha]

To sum up then give me 5 minutes with a pen and paper and I could design a better track than Hampton, and so could my Lakeland terrier

I'd put my money on the dog designing the better one of the two

[Robert Taylor]

I think that the immediate issue to be addressed is the safety issue of the wall. In a risk assessment, that is the surely the blaring safety issue and I think that HD management need to review this fairly urgently. I would be very surprised if WSBK or the likes would attend HD in its present state.

However I absolutely agree with your statements about riders needing to have a better understanding of how their machines work. Personally it is something that I take very seriously because I want to understand how my bike works and thus how to set it up best for me and my riding style. Not all track day riders will be the same though.

However, this is not an overnight fix. Many riders at trackdays are new to the track and probably wouldn't know what rebound or suspension travel is. Robert, the likes of yourself and Shaun have years and years of experience that cannot be replicated in others in days, weeks or months.

Because of this, bike setup will continue to be a cause of some crashes. A new rider who has just upgraded to their shiny new 600cc SS can't be expected to know how best to set the thing up and so any race track needs to be designed with people crashing in mind.

I think the idea of a chicane is a great temporary (or possibly longterm) fix.

In that light I think there is a very real responsibility for the industry at large to themselves have much better understanding of overall bike setup and a few very emphatic donts such as my pet hate of screwing the rebound down too far. That alone is a big cause of crashing.

In this light the industry at large is a little wanting and in the end event the end users ( riders ) should be better informed before they venture out onto road or track

[ellipsis]

.....dunno if im being a little cynical but...will anyone who should take notice , take notice, or do we have to wait til a car driver buys the farm, before a 'serious issue is evident'....after all , we're only motorcycles.....or is their not an issue....so many tracks in so many places have ridiculously dangerous bits that are part of the deal, mainly older tracks that have kept up with what japan threw at them over the last three decades....pretty sad state of affairs that a new track should have an issue built into it....total cynicism coming up....if the car clubs dont like it , problem solved...

[CHOPPA]

.....dunno if im being a little cynical but...will anyone who should take notice , take notice, or do we have to wait til a car driver buys the farm, before a 'serious issue is evident'....after all , we're only motorcycles.....or is their not an issue....so many tracks in so many places have ridiculously dangerous bits that are part of the deal, mainly older tracks that have kept up with what japan threw at them over the last three decades....pretty sad state of affairs that a new track should have an issue built into it....total cynicism coming up....if the car clubs dont like it , problem solved...

Cars are not fast enough and the wall is not enough of an angle to be that bad, well hopefully not

[Maido]

Out of all the people who think that the track design is dangerous, who would be prepared to boycott riding there at the next series/national event due to this and possibly present the track owners with a reason why they aren't going?
Noone, amirite?

[merv]

At least all the girls afford me that courtesy! Luckily Craigs only association with me is twiddling with his suspenders!

Does he wear his stiletto heels too when you are doing this?

[Kickaha]

Cars are not fast enough and the wall is not enough of an angle to be that bad, well hopefully not

You sure about that?, the fastest cars (single seaters) are close to 260kmh thats down on the Superbikes but it'd have to be close to 600 speed

"The lap record has been broken again by Mitch Evans during the NZ Motor Cup weekend.

Evans clocked in at 1:01.846, set on lap 12 of the second race with a best speed of 153.090 km/h"


"The lap record for Motorbikes was recorded on a Prod Superbike ridden by Andrew Stroud during the NZ Superbike Championship 2010 at 1:04.693

Top recorded speed is 287 kph by Andrew Stroud on his Suzuki!"

[merv]

In support of Kick's comment the point is the cars to make those lap times carry way more corner speed so any off at a corner could be at a far higher speed than a bike is doing. One key difference then is the person in the car has a cage around them for protection when the car slams the wall.