Trying to work out a previous owner's wiring (or my own stupidity!)

[magicmonkey]

it all started when I got a replacement throttle cable for my GN (old one is held together with insulating tape, not a good look!) and found out that the throttle switches aren't from a GN, therefore the throttle cable wouldn't marry up to the fitting. So, long story short, there's an additional light switch on the controls which shouldn't be there and the previous owner has wired it up somehow. When I took off the throttle assembly to replace it I found that the one I got from the wreckers was fubar and couldn't be used so went to replace the first assembly, that's where I started having real problems!

I can get the lights to operate from the light switch and I can get the engine to turn over, but not start, if I wire the starter to the light switch (It was trial and error but I managed to work out what everything does ) I've done continuity tests so I know that the switches all function and the connections are made properly but the start button just refuses to work at all, there's not even a hint of the engine turning over.

Yesterday I decided to leave it over night and see if I had any bright ideas but nothing really struck me, other than to check the earth (which seems to be fine) Has anyone got any handy hints as I'm completely baffled!!

[CookMySock]

Geez you're doing pretty well taking on these tasks. If it doesn't make sense, leave it for a day and come back to it. Follow the wiring and developa theory. Look at the old switches and see how they were hooked up - use a meter to check their switching operation to check your theory.

If you start to feel frustrated, take a break.

Steve

[magicmonkey]

Geez you're doing pretty well taking on these tasks. If it doesn't make sense, leave it for a day and come back to it. Follow the wiring and developa theory. Look at the old switches and see how they were hooked up - use a meter to check their switching operation to check your theory.

If you start to feel frustrated, take a break.

Steve

Have left it overnight already, usually that helps me with most problems but not this one! I just seem to be going round in circles :s

Anyway, the theory I'm working on is a complete lack of power to the ignition (seeing as I've proven that there is connectivity) but I have no idea how to test that. I do have a multimeter though ...

As far as following the wiring goes, I could take the bike completely to bits and track it all over the place but the only place I've moved anything is behind the headlight so I don't really see much point in checking elsewhere

[neels]

Keep doing what you're doing, so far it sounds pretty good and it's the best way to learn how it all works for next time there's a problem.

Check for blown fuses, or check if there is 12V getting to the starter button, the ignition circuit fuse could be blown hence no starting/running but starter working when fed from the light circuit.

Draw yourself some diagrams of how it's put together, drawing it out on paper may highlight something you are missing.

[steve_t]

So, if u wire the starter to the light switch it goes, but if u wire it to the start button it won't? Is this right?

[magicmonkey]

So, if u wire the starter to the light switch it goes, but if u wire it to the start button it won't? Is this right?

Yup, spot on. There's power to the lights although I'm unsure of how to prove if there's power to the start button (I think maybe I should be checking the wires at the connecting block with the multimeter set to check for 20v, is that right or am I being overly simplistic?)

[magicmonkey]

Keep doing what you're doing, so far it sounds pretty good and it's the best way to learn how it all works for next time there's a problem.

Check for blown fuses, or check if there is 12V getting to the starter button, the ignition circuit fuse could be blown hence no starting/running but starter working when fed from the light circuit.

Draw yourself some diagrams of how it's put together, drawing it out on paper may highlight something you are missing.

I drew out the throttle assembly side of things last night and that's all fine, after drawing everything out I tested the switches at both the switch ends and the connecting block. It's where it goes into the bike that it gets confusing, especially as my wiring diagram is very poor resolution and I can't see the cable colours on it; and all the cables on the bike seem to be orange :s

As for fuses, I'm pretty sure there's only the main fuse on a GN which I checked earlier and is fine. If there are other fuses I'd be very happy, it'd probably make my life 100 times easier!

[steve_t]

I'm gonna guess that there isn't power to the start button so the question is why. Is there anything between it and the battery that could cause an open circuit that u haven't checked? Fuse? Kill switch?

[magicmonkey]

The kill switch is fine (it's on the same set of switches so has been tested) I can't see anything causing an open curcuit in the headlight or the switch assembly and I've checked the main fuse, not sure if there are others though! In fact, I think I might just replace the main fuse now in case it is causing the problems and I can't see the break in it (there's a spare one in the tool it)

[magicmonkey]

nope, the fuse is fine, damn!!

Had a look around for anything which could be causing an open circuit but no joy, everything seems to be well insulated as far as I can tell ...

[awayatc]

kill switch will make an earth with one of the ignition wires...........which will kill engine.(so make sure this wire doesnt accidently earth.....)
i.e . starter will still turn over but engine wont fire up.
On your starter is one thick live wire comming directly from the battery, and one thin live wire coming to the solenoid from the starter button....
so all you have to do is make sure you have a live wire going to that solenoid from your starterswitch.....
find your live wire,....one that only goes live when ignition switch is on......
If that one shorts..or shorted, it most likely did burn an( inline..?) fuse somewhere....near battery/under seat are good places to look for one....

[steve_t]

When u hooked up the starter to the light switch, did u hook up the light to the start button? And if so, did pushing the start button make the light turn on? Did u say u had already tested the start button and it works fine?

Might be a good idea to download the service manual and check wiring diagrams in there

[magicmonkey]

When u hooked up the starter to the light switch, did u hook up the light to the start button? And if so, did pushing the start button make the light turn on? Did u say u had already tested the start button and it works fine?

Might be a good idea to download the service manual and check wiring diagrams in there

yeah, I did try the lights using the starter button but no joy there. I have tested the starter button by doing a continuity test at the connection block and at the solder joints on the back of the switch, it makes and breaks the circuit without any problems at both ends.

I've downloaded the service manual already, the wiring diagrams in there are great for telling you which wires go where but I can't read the colours as the resolution is too low, I'm trying to find a decent copy of the wiring diagram at the moment though.

[magicmonkey]

kill switch will make an earth with one of the ignition wires...........which will kill engine.(so make sure this wire doesnt accidently earth.....)
i.e . starter will still turn over but engine wont fire up.
On your starter is one thick live wire comming directly from the battery, and one thin live wire coming to the solenoid from the starter button....
so all you have to do is make sure you have a live wire going to that solenoid from your starterswitch.....
find your live wire,....one that only goes live when ignition switch is on......
If that one shorts..or shorted, it most likely did burn an( inline..?) fuse somewhere....near battery/under seat are good places to look for one....

This seems to be a problem with bikes, if I want to get at the starter I have to take the tank off!!

I've changed the main fuse and according to the wiring diagram that's the only one that should be in there (it is still possible that a previous owner thought another one would be a good idea though)

I've checked the voltage going from the starter switch to what I believe to be the starter wires and it showed me 11.92v (guess it's time to charge the battery). Am I right in thinking that I must have got the right wires, hence the voltage reading, or could I still be barking up the wrong tree?

I'm thinking it might be a good idea to remove the throttle assembly and check for voltage in there as it would seem to be the easiest place to test...

[steve_t]

Hmmm.... is there a clutch switch for in gear? Guess you'll have it in 'N' anyway. How about the side stand switch? I'm not even sure there is one but good to check. I'm starting to feel your frustration now