New Yellow Flag Rules?

[CHOPPA]

Im sure you guys have your eyes closed because everyone passes everyone on the first lap of practice under yellow and all the fast riders pass lappers under yellow. Except me...

I think passing lapped riders under yellow is perfectly safe though because the speed differential is so much diff its actually more dangerous to slow down that much and its the perfect chance for them to get out of the way they should get a yellow and blue.

I dont really care for your opinion unless your a racer that actually laps riders because you wont understand

[Gremlin]

The yellows are held out on the first lap as an indication to riders of where the points are, so there can be no excuses later in the day. To be honest, I've never really thought about passing on the first lap of practise under yellows. We're holding them out to indicate points, and I guess its sorta given you guys pass, getting into space etc. I've certainly never heard any radio chatter about passing under yellows during practise, unless its an actual crash... as a racer tho, best you clarify with officials.

Passing during racing, or middle of practise, under yellow, citing the speed difference is simply not valid. It is more dangerous to pass a bike with a massive speed difference, and you should have slowed down similar to the others around you. There could be any sort of hazard on the track (for which the yellow is out) and in concentrating on a pass, you are reducing the chances of you or the passed rider being able to avoid any potential hazards.

A stationary yellow is, be prepared to slow down, waved yellow is, be prepared to stop. We all know what happened on Pukekohe's back straight a while ago, when a slow rider (run out of gas) did not pull off the track like he should have. Big speed differentials are dangerous, simple as that, and I will even report slow or fast riders in groups on ART days, to try to keep the whole group at a reasonably similar pace.

[FROSTY:Me]

Im sure you guys have your eyes closed because everyone passes everyone on the first lap of practice under yellow and all the fast riders pass lappers under yellow. Except me...

I think passing lapped riders under yellow is perfectly safe though because the speed differential is so much diff its actually more dangerous to slow down that much and its the perfect chance for them to get out of the way they should get a yellow and blue.

I dont really care for your opinion unless your a racer that actually laps riders because you wont understand

Ok then Choppa Then take my opinion --I raced/will race again very soon and I pass lapped riders.
The rule is there for the safety of ALL competitors. The yellow flag isn't waved for fun its waved because an incident has happened on that corner. The natureof that incident you don't know but its sufficient for the marshal to ask you to slow and cease racing/ no overtaking AT THAT POINT.
As for the yellows waved first lap. Mate surely you jest --please please tell me you jest.

[FROSTY:Me]

Chopper even if you don't gettit re safety then think the logistics of the situation through.
Ok out in front in a freight train are mr S,B,and F --Ol frosty has crashed on T4
On T2 the freighttrain passes J who is scarey fast though 3 4 and 5 but slow elsewhere -so J tucks into the middle of the freightrain. Into T3 they catch Bill who is doing ok andis in front of J -the freightrain has the way you want it the RIGHT to charge on past bill.
Or how about if you'd had a big moment but recovered -got back on track but had to yeald to guys lapping you.
The tactical advantage and the logistics of sorting out who could pass would be the thing of nightmares.

[roadracingoldfart]

Im sure you guys have your eyes closed because everyone passes everyone on the first lap of practice under yellow and all the fast riders pass lappers under yellow. Except me...

I think passing lapped riders under yellow is perfectly safe though because the speed differential is so much diff its actually more dangerous to slow down that much and its the perfect chance for them to get out of the way they should get a yellow and blue.

I dont really care for your opinion unless your a racer that actually laps riders because you wont understand

Gotta dissagree with you Choppa (and you know ive been at the front a wee bit for some time ) . The rule must be for all riders of all levels and all speeds attainable. The fact is if you pass a slower rider under the yellow by your theory then that rider is going to get one less lap as well.
If you witness a rider passing under the yellow for the safety of all concerned you should inform race control. Not to get one place further up the placings but to make sure that rider pulls his / her head in and remebers there is only one level of rider when it comes to rules.

Paul.

[CHOPPA]

Ok then Choppa Then take my opinion --I raced/will race again very soon and I pass lapped riders.
The rule is there for the safety of ALL competitors. The yellow flag isn't waved for fun its waved because an incident has happened on that corner. The natureof that incident you don't know but its sufficient for the marshal to ask you to slow and cease racing/ no overtaking AT THAT POINT.
As for the yellows waved first lap. Mate surely you jest --please please tell me you jest.

What happens when someone crashes on the first lap? How do you know theres a crash and not just showing you the flag points?

[Bykmad]

Quite simply, because the yellow flags are being waved, you should be travelling at a slow enough speed to avoid a rider/debris/slippery substance/track worker trying to assist fallen rider. BUT, one must ask, WHY, did a rider fall off on a sighting lap, which is what the first lap of practice on the first day of a National Championship meeting. Machinery fault is possibly the ONLY reasonable excuse.
Leave the rule as it is. It shows riders where the flag points are and only takes one lap, and on the first lap tyres are being warmed up any way.

[Peter Smith]

BUT, one must ask, WHY, did a rider fall off on a sighting lap, which is what the first lap of practice on the first day of a National Championship meeting. Machinery fault is possibly the ONLY reasonable excuse.

If Casey Stoner and Lorenzo can do it, I'm sure we can. (If we try really really hard)

[roadracingoldfart]

BUT, one must ask, WHY, did a rider fall off on a sighting lap, which is what the first lap of practice on the first day of a National Championship meeting. Machinery fault is possibly the ONLY reasonable excuse.

Well i did it once , and then i fell off 3 laps later . I was annoyed at myself but i still won the race in F1 .

If Casey Stoner and Lorenzo can do it, I'm sure we can. (If we try really really hard)

So im in good company then lmfao. I did it on a Honda though.


Paul.

[roadracingoldfart]

What happens when someone crashes on the first lap? How do you know theres a crash and not just showing you the flag points?

But Sloan .................
the flags are only out on the FIRST lap (of racing) if there is an accident so thats how you will know there has been an incident.
They are only out in static (unwaved) mode during the sighting lap but i think we have to rely on race control having sufficiant comms to the marshall points to wave the bloody thing if its required,
also the race will not start if there is an incident on the sighting lap (its not a warm up lap at all) that cant be cleared before the race is officially started , untill then you are under starters orders and the clerk of the course will not let the starter fire you off if there is a danger to either riders or marshalls.

Paul.

[FROSTY:Me]

First lap of first practice. as in the sighting lap.

[pipson]

If you want to see how flags should be done properly come to manfeild this weekend.
The best in the business are on the the points
No I'm not biased
And I will happily discus any issues with you on Saturday night

Nigel here is a photo of the best in the business. Andrew Stroud ask if he could have a photos taken as he was so impressed with the marshals.

[MSTRS:Me]

What happens when someone crashes on the first lap? How do you know theres a crash and not just showing you the flag points?

Good point. I thought I'd come back in here, because we've always just held the yellow for the first lap in each class for the fisrt practise session only. At Manfield this weekend, we were told to wave the yellow by race control. Maybe the Nationals are run slightly different to club racing, but in other years of Nationals, we've only held as usual. Perhaps it's a new rule? Whatever, sighting lap or racing, the no-passing thing still applies, and bikes that did whose number could be seen, were reported to control.
Under racing conditions, the no passing under yellow is a little more difficult to make a call on, at times, As marshals, we understand that a significantly faster bike coming up on a tailender, may not have time to slow enough when a yellow comes out. Depending on the gap that existed just prior to the flag coming out, we will make a judgement call on the overtaking rider, before reporting or not.
Remember, rules are there for the safety of all and riders do not call the shots and if they break a rule, then race control decides if there is to be a penalty.

[Gremlin]

MSTRS, I've certainly never waved the yellow for the sighting lap, stationary only, as have you... I'll have an update on that come end of March, as its the Hampton Downs Nats... Depends who the clerk is, they each have slightly different nuances on how to do things, and as marshals, we have to follow their orders...

Re crashing on warmup lap... it happens, happened on the weekend, hence why one race was delayed. Bikes had to wait on the grid as it took a while to clear a bike from the dip (nowhere safe to put the damn thing either). On sunday, we weren't told when the 2nd round of practise had started (hard to tell with so many bikes cross-entered), so ended up holding out the yellow for first lap of all practise sessions.

woodyracer... funny red rep, I have been "out there" for roughly 5 seasons and marshalled 3 different racetracks. How long have you?

[MSTRS:Me]

MSTRS, I've certainly never waved the yellow for the sighting lap, stationary only, as have you... as marshals, we have to follow their orders...

Which is what I was saying. First time ever we had to wave the yellow for that first lap. It didn't bother me, just a bit surprised.