My first poll for the NZ public

[bogan]

I'm not the one insisting that it won't work.

No, you're the one insisting it will, that it is loads better, that it can work within the current system. Yet you're not living it, why not? I'm always wary of those who promote an idea but refuse to take it up themselves you see.

[mashman]

No, you're the one insisting it will, that it is loads better, that it can work within the current system. Yet you're not living it, why not? I'm always wary of those who promote an idea but refuse to take it up themselves you see.

You seem to know an awful lot about what I am and aren't doing and what I do and don't believe and how I would and wouldn't go about things... I'll let you finish me off.

[bogan]

You seem to know an awful lot about what I am and aren't doing and what I do and don't believe and how I would and wouldn't go about things... I'll let you finish me off.

Well I'm not wrong am I. And it seems like you're about done again...

[mashman]

Well I'm not wrong am I. And it seems like you're about done again...

Yes, you are. Yes, I am.

[bogan]

Yes, you are. Yes, I am.

In what way? Is it not possible, or are you living it?

[Ocean1]

No. The problem they've got is that the cost of living is rising faster than there is money available for those who need it. There are loads of reports around about it... you'd think people might make the rather obvious connection eh... but nah.

Yeah, there's no shortage of carefully crafted reports that the world is ending, based on the price of turnips per starving vegan.

But if you'd bothered to check the real numbers posted above you'd possibly see why most people see them as the bullshit they are.

Which leaves a few various fuckwits bleating about "the system", which in fact is actually working rather well...

[mashman]

Yeah, there's no shortage of carefully crafted reports that the world is ending, based on the price of turnips per starving vegan.

But if you'd bothered to check the real numbers posted above you'd possibly see why most people see them as the bullshit they are.

Which leaves a few various fuckwits bleating about "the system", which in fact is actually working rather well...

bwaaaaaaaa ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha haaaaaaaaaaaa.

[Brian d marge]

Ubuntu, that's software, not a way of life.

Money Free Party is a political movement, again not people actually living as they would under a money free system.

TVP is still in planning stages for such a society, and I don't think they have implemented on even in small scale yet; but I could be wrong as they do seem the furthest along.

Zeitgeist is pretty much the same as TVP.

Money Free Charter is pretty much the same as Money Free Party.

All of those things are pushing ideas and ideals, ie, this could work but we need more people/time/technology. What I want to see examples of are sub-society's in which money is not a thing, of course it must still be a thing to interact with society as a whole, but within the sub society they can share everything, have anything (including requisitions from outside), simply by living happily and exporting their production. If it is both possible, and beneficial as you say, why is it not done?

I mean example to see how viable it is; show me, don't just tell me. That is how you would convert me, and many others (see aforementioned reasons for why converts are needed). And why are you not one of the ones who is getting to it? why simply spread the ideas and ideal when you have a chance to live them?

Well the off grid part of it , I have experience with, completely off grid untill i came to japan
And will return to off grid asap

The financial side . . . Does need thought

I dont think it will happen on mass as the parasites at the top are 3steps ahead

It may happen small scale under the radar eg northland cash crop

[Brian d marge]

No, it wouldn't. The poverty industry measures poverty as the percentage of population with income less than 60% of median income.

Which is bullshit of course, under that definition you could double everyone's net worth and not change poverty. The only way to reduce relative poverty is to reduce "income inequality", the “solution” is to tax people more and hand out more welfare. Classic socialism.

The problem they've got is that both relative AND absolute poverty has taken a very large and sustained drop in the last few decades, so they have to keep re-inventing poverty definitions to make their spiel even vaguely relevant.

Attachment 311843

Old socialist bullshit is getting old.

Your correct
Back when i was a lad our german neighbours printed some money

Everyone was a millionaire

All thatgiving people money does is drive up thecost of goods

Soo

We need a new yardstick to which to judge success and then measure any lack of . .

The current jeudaic christian sham aint working

[Brian d marge]

Yeah, there's no shortage of carefully crafted reports that the world is ending, based on the price of turnips per starving vegan.

But if you'd bothered to check the real numbers posted above you'd possibly see why most people see them as the bullshit they are.

Which leaves a few various fuckwits bleating about "the system", which in fact is actually working rather well...

Stop using the parsley .

[Ocean1]

We need a new yardstick to which to judge success and then measure any lack of . .

The current jeudaic christian sham aint working

Who uses money in judging success? Only people that don't know what money is. Including people who use "jeudaic Christian" in attempting to define it.

If it's a sham then you'll have no problem giving all of yours to me. As a yardstick with which to value things it's working somewhat spectacularly well according to relevant recent history.

[Brian d marge]

Who uses money in judging success? Only people that don't know what money is. Including people who use "jeudaic Christian" in attempting to define it.

If it's a sham then you'll have no problem giving all of yours to me. As a yardstick with which to value things it's working somewhat spectacularly well according to relevant recent history.

If you need it

I would be happy to help

I should have use the term currency rather than money but you seem to have understood

When ya shuffle of this mortal coil i am glad you would feel comfort in clutching colored paper . .

[Ocean1]

If you need it

I would be happy to help

I should have use the term currency rather than money but you seem to have understood

When ya shuffle of this mortal coil i am glad you would feel comfort in clutching colored paper . .

Fuck off, I may not be mercenary enough to wish to die owing as much as possible but I'll certainly not be leaving any of my hard earned cash lying around unspent sunshine, there's moderbikes to be purchased and farkled.

[bogan]

Well the off grid part of it , I have experience with, completely off grid untill i came to japan
And will return to off grid asap

The financial side . . . Does need thought

I dont think it will happen on mass as the parasites at the top are 3steps ahead

It may happen small scale under the radar eg northland cash crop

All I'm looking for is it to happen small scale, under the radar, cos if that if possible; and if that is better (these are claims frequently made by the proponents ofc), then it will grow until it has happened on mass scale. Whinging about it not happening on mass or expecting money free parties to ever do something, or even just blabbing on about how good it would be if money wasn't a thing, is just wasting your time. Be that change. It is possible, but you have to work for it. Personally, I think this is why there is so much whinging and not doing, those who want things money free are largely slackers (or at least aware that voluntary uptake will be largely slackers), so need productive members to carry them, thus the attempts to force widespread change instead of just being it.

Those who be that change, often realise the change is simply in you head and carry on happily using money anyway. Think about it, that is why there are no examples, because the whole thing is the example

[Brian d marge]

All I'm looking for is it to happen small scale, under the radar, cos if that if possible; and if that is better (these are claims frequently made by the proponents ofc), then it will grow until it has happened on mass scale. Whinging about it not happening on mass or expecting money free parties to ever do something, or even just blabbing on about how good it would be if money wasn't a thing, is just wasting your time. Be that change. It is possible, but you have to work for it. Personally, I think this is why there is so much whinging and not doing, those who want things money free are largely slackers (or at least aware that voluntary uptake will be largely slackers), so need productive members to carry them, thus the attempts to force widespread change instead of just being it.

Those who be that change, often realise the change is simply in you head and carry on happily using money anyway. Think about it, that is why there are no examples, because the whole thing is the example

Its happening
Here . . .japan people often grow share gift food . . Help
The stumbling point is
Once you start to . . . . Completely remove yourself from the clutches of city hall
They start to get bent out of shape and start forcing u to comply
IF you can remain undetected you will be fine
But it puts people off investing effort into structures as these will be removed etc
Becauae if one person does it . . .everyone will do it and the whole of society . .will colapse
Ie the banks wont get their money