My first poll for the NZ public

[mashman]

I understand that, I was pointing out the other way to do it, one with a strong link between work/reward.

No argument there.

How do you determine intent?

So there is both a yardstick on how much a resource is worth, and a record of who uses what; a budget. A budget by mass consensus, where the consensus decides what goods are worth, but also what jobs 'pay'. I can understand that, though it is different from the 'everyone's entitlement is equal' ideal I had thought you were advocating previously. And how does the system deal with supply and demand for jobs?

I still do not understand how the computer manages floating price resources, the consensus determines the internal price, while the world markets determine the external price, what does the computer do?

I understand that. Doing what you have to do in order to live in an R.B.E. is reward enough as far as I can tell. Untrodden ground in innovation etc...



In the same way you determine accident.

The worth of the resource is what it can be used for and it having been consumed is an important detail for projection engines. No need for mass, "I trust you to do right" should be enough. Let computers deal with the how the money moves around in order to meet budget. Not gonna go into jobs, but jobs are voluntary and one can only ask and trust that another will do right. I don't see that as high as risk as you do.

The mass consensus is to let the computer manage the internal value of the economy (it already does) and translate it into $ value for the external economy to gorge on lol. What humans do really doesn't matter so long as we have that consensus. That's A way i see it working. It's only confidence after all.

[bogan]

In the same way you determine accident.

The worth of the resource is what it can be used for and it having been consumed is an important detail for projection engines. No need for mass, "I trust you to do right" should be enough. Let computers deal with the how the money moves around in order to meet budget. Not gonna go into jobs, but jobs are voluntary and one can only ask and trust that another will do right. I don't see that as high as risk as you do.

The mass consensus is to let the computer manage the internal value of the economy (it already does) and translate it into $ value for the external economy to gorge on lol. What humans do really doesn't matter so long as we have that consensus. That's A way i see it working. It's only confidence after all.

Board of inquiry, jury? Is everyone who has a holiday subject to these?

Computer budget, fine; does it supply resources (as measured by the consensus yardstick) based on supplying everyone with equal amounts? or by work done? or by need? Jobs are an integral part of any society, how is supply and demand managed if there is no direct reward for doing jobs that need doing? Pure faith is what I understand your system uses here.

The external economic value cannot be set by that computer, it is set by external market forces. You can price hammers at diamond levels but they will not be purchased, you can print more currency but it will devalue; the external economy can only gorge on production.

[mashman]

Board of inquiry, jury? Is everyone who has a holiday subject to these?

Computer budget, fine; does it supply resources (as measured by the consensus yardstick) based on supplying everyone with equal amounts? or by work done? or by need? Jobs are an integral part of any society, how is supply and demand managed if there is no direct reward for doing jobs that need doing? Pure faith is what I understand your system uses here.

The external economic value cannot be set by that computer, it is set by external market forces. You can price hammers at diamond levels but they will not be purchased, you can print more currency but it will devalue; the external economy can only gorge on production.

Available evidence and using the same people that currently gather such evidence. What do you mean everyone on holiday subjected to what?

Parametised program once an analysis of the current resource usage has been done v's what we really need to be doing. That analysis will likely be led by business leaders and technologists supported by science etc... a la Jacques Fresco. The current financial system is based on pure faith. I see no reason why a money free system couldn't. The reward is having the society we deserve and as you say, we will have to work for it... but it'd be good to be heading towards it at a much more rapid pace that we are, because we have everything we need... except the money that is lol.

The computer takes the value assigned to NZ as a parameter and adjusts internal pricing accordingly in order to hit budget that year. The hammer is an asset. What we choose to value it at is what we choose value it at for whatever reason we choose. Why should that be open to external influence? It's NZ's internal economy, not theirs. Why can't we run it the way we do? We will still be producing though as we know that we have to,

[Brian d marge]

Correct. It's the result of living in the real world.

What would happen if there is a real world correction

Then what

[Brian d marge]

I'm aware of that 'flaw', I even have a theory about weighting a person's vote on past performance to combat it, but creating a yardstick or means of weighting the votes is beyond our current ability. That flaw is an unavoidable one in any democracy; it is one of the great advantages to a monarchy, but of course they have their own downsides. I think by giving more power to the people as I have outlined would still offer benefits over the current system.

But in your case it is question after question after question, I mean you still haven't explained the airports and windmills thing have you?

How do you know they fly in and out of heathrow? At this point I'll settle for those facts...

How bout just decentralize the power ya donthave to reinvent the wheel

P2
I cant do this for every post but i will when i get home

P3
See previous post . . .but im pretty sure they didnt fly out of edinburgh

[Ocean1]

What would happen if there is a real world correction

Then what

I'm good, it's still the real world.

See, I don't like banks or artificial markets either, but rather than whine about them I just minimise my exposure to them and keep right on working.

[Gadget1]

I do. When you realise that you can value anything you like at any value you like (because that already happens e.g. diamonds worth more than bread), there are no more hurdles and the money becomes irrelevant. But by all means carry on saying that you don't have enough information, because all you are doing is setting your own limits... and "blaming" me for your shortcomings leaves me laughing needing to go wee wee.

In that paragraph above there is every single piece of information you need in order to accept that an R.B.E. is not only possible, but is completely achievable.

Of course a R.B.E is possible, that's what Jacque Fresco's system is about.

As bogan, Zedder and I have pointed out though, you have simply plagiarised his work and gone on and on about it for the last 4 or so years. Fresco's system and other changes are happening anyway without you and all those years of typing.

Ffs, you probably would have plagiarised the Nordic model if it had suited you.

[mashman]

Of course a R.B.E is possible, that's what Jacque Fresco's system is about.

As bogan, Zedder and I have pointed out though, you have simply plagiarised his work and gone on and on about it for the last 4 or so years. Fresco's system and other changes are happening anyway without you and all those years of typing.

Ffs, you probably would have plagiarised the Nordic model if it had suited you.

Indeed it is.

Plagiarised? ... Is that all you have. You're a copycat therefore you're a copycat . I think you'll find that bogan sees differences between "my" and Mr Fresco's methodologies for attaining R.B.E. in the shortest time possible. Sounds like you're plagiarising me now:

It's happening without me lol.

You're pretty fuckin slow eh...

What for? It uses money

[Gadget1]

Indeed it is.

Plagiarised? ... Is that all you have. You're a copycat therefore you're a copycat . I think you'll find that bogan sees differences between "my" and Mr Fresco's methodologies for attaining R.B.E. in the shortest time possible. Sounds like you're plagiarising me now:



You're pretty fuckin slow eh...

What for? It uses money

Actually bogan used the word bastardised for your use of Fresco's work. I was being polite.

I posted the words "if it suited you". But since you've chosen to vent your hatred of the money system Fresco is it. In a huge rut are you? Need something to blame except yourself?

[mashman]

Actually bogan used the word bastardised for your use of Fresco's work. I was being polite.

I posted the words "if it suited you". But since you've chosen to vent your hatred of the money system Fresco is it. In a huge rut are you? Need something to blame except yourself?

In which case, stop being polite, it doesn't suit you. Pussy!

You did say if it suited and I explained why it doesn't suit. Getting yer knickers in a twist, whilst amusing, really ain't helping your clarity of thought. I've chosen to vent my "hatred" of the money system for very good reasons. That someone else does too i.e. TVP, TZM, MFP, Ubuntu, FWC etc... has fuck all to do with it. Again though, that you're ignorant enough to state such things is highly amusing. I have stated openly that I accept plenty of the blame for the state of society myself... kinda funny watching KB deny that they have any responsibility along similar lines.

Ignorant pussy amuse chief mash... dance more jester.

[mashman]

I'm good, it's still the real world.

See, I don't like banks or artificial markets either, but rather than whine about them I just minimise my exposure to them and keep right on working.

Shame you don't take it upon yourself to make similar available to the rest of society... but that's ok, coz it means you can also ignore your responsibility for the debt that you've created over the years to get where you are, or indeed the debt that someone has created in order to be able to afford your services.

[bogan]

Available evidence and using the same people that currently gather such evidence. What do you mean everyone on holiday subjected to what?

Parametised program once an analysis of the current resource usage has been done v's what we really need to be doing. That analysis will likely be led by business leaders and technologists supported by science etc... a la Jacques Fresco. The current financial system is based on pure faith. I see no reason why a money free system couldn't. The reward is having the society we deserve and as you say, we will have to work for it... but it'd be good to be heading towards it at a much more rapid pace that we are, because we have everything we need... except the money that is lol.

The computer takes the value assigned to NZ as a parameter and adjusts internal pricing accordingly in order to hit budget that year. The hammer is an asset. What we choose to value it at is what we choose value it at for whatever reason we choose. Why should that be open to external influence? It's NZ's internal economy, not theirs. Why can't we run it the way we do? We will still be producing though as we know that we have to,

Evidence gathering to see if they were spending firvolously.

The financial system does not run on pure faith for job suuply and demand, market forces adjust the pay for jobs as more or less people do them. Does you program allocate resources based on supplying everyone with equal amounts? or by work done? or by need?

There is no need for an internal budget where prices are adjusted to make it work in an RBE. The only 'budget' is the one based on a resources actual worth, as set by the parametised program and mass consensus.

How bout just decentralize the power ya donthave to reinvent the wheel

P2
I cant do this for every post but i will when i get home

P3
See previous post . . .but im pretty sure they didnt fly out of edinburgh

Because decentralising the power does not serve the same purpose.

Why are you so convinced they (same apples) flew in and out of anywhere at all? Because you have read the same story many times?

[Gadget1]

In which case, stop being polite, it doesn't suit you. Pussy!

You did say if it suited and I explained why it doesn't suit. Getting yer knickers in a twist, whilst amusing, really ain't helping your clarity of thought. I've chosen to vent my "hatred" of the money system for very good reasons. That someone else does too i.e. TVP, TZM, MFP, Ubuntu, FWC etc... has fuck all to do with it. Again though, that you're ignorant enough to state such things is highly amusing. I have stated openly that I accept plenty of the blame for the state of society myself... kinda funny watching KB deny that they have any responsibility along similar lines.

Ignorant pussy amuse chief mash... dance more jester.

Lol, you're so entertaining. After seeing your post and Zedders about your wife not working etc, I was intrigued and mentioned you to a psychologist friend. Although he was surprised at the vehemence and length of your rantings he (paraphrasing) reckoned it's nearly a textbook case of anger and frustration with associated displacement activity.

[mashman]

Evidence gathering to see if they were spending firvolously.

The financial system does not run on pure faith for job suuply and demand, market forces adjust the pay for jobs as more or less people do them. Does you program allocate resources based on supplying everyone with equal amounts? or by work done? or by need?

There is no need for an internal budget where prices are adjusted to make it work in an RBE. The only 'budget' is the one based on a resources actual worth, as set by the parametised program and mass consensus.

No doubt that will be a measure in the quest to ensure that there is enough to keep our economy going.

of course it runs of faith. Do you get paid before you do a job? No, you have faith that the person will pay you once the job is complete to their satisfaction. The program will have just about every single variable that can be thought up, but it won't be responsible for allocation, that'll be a job for the community to organise with the govt wrt resource logistics/availability.

There is every need for an internal budget if external country's are still running financial economy's, as they will want us to prove that we have produced what we say we have and haven't just printed more money without anything to back it.

[mashman]

Lol, you're so entertaining. After seeing your post and Zedders about your wife not working etc, I was intrigued and mentioned you to a psychologist friend. Although he was surprised at the vehemence and length of your rantings he (paraphrasing) reckoned it's nearly a textbook case of anger and frustration with associated displacement activity.

Glad I can oblige. Ugh my wife does work. Perhaps getting your facts right before having your friend prescribe an internet diagnosis jesus that's really really really very fuckin funny, might be a better idea if you're going to use that opinion to base some judgement on. I almost have tears in my eyes. Chur.