Countersteering vs body leaning?

[NZsarge]

THe discuss the mechanics of counter steering vs Body leaning.

My question is: They talk about weighting the footpegs to influence the chassis. I can sort of see what they are getting at but wind myself into knots experimenting on the (empty) road.

Can someone please explain in detail the hows/whats/Whyfors of this?
Esp the appropriate timing and sequence of the rider inputs

Have a search around on the intarwebs for Keith Code's experiments with the "No BS" bike (BS = Body Steering = Bullshit) - a bike with a second set of bars that are fixed to the chassis so you can't countersteer it. He found that even the best riders can only initiate a really lazy wide turn, and it was really hard to control. When people say "I don't use countersteering" or "I use weight shifts to steer the bike" what they mean is "I don't know that I'm using countersteering" but they still are.

This video shows the "No BS" bike in action..

I agree with Crash Harry, find yourself some Keith Code literature or better still one of his 3 (I think) videos.

[bogan]

Strange. Impossible to countersteer and yet it can be steered.

Anyone care to revise their strongly held opinions?

steered is pretty generous, more corners than not he had to scuff his feet along the ground, so i'll stick with my previous opinions thanks!

but it is pretty cool though, not really useful for anything, but cool nonetheless

[dynamite9585]

personal experience on this topic = zero.
basic understanding of the physics behind it, pretty good.

when riding your wheel is basicaly a gyroscope.
gyro's have an interesting property called presession, what it means is that when a force is applied to the gyro that foce is acted out 90º in the direction of rotation.
how this relates is (example given for a right and swerve)
you want to go right, when you turn your bars left, this is in effect applying a sideways force to the back of the front wheel from left to right (as your seated).
when this force is presessed 90º it acts at the top of the wheel attempting, thus starting to lean the bike to the right, causing the bike to turn right.

now as i said at the top this is my understanding of the theroy behind it all from what i have read about countersteering and my knowledge of gyro's.

my understanding is that body leaning is still required, the counter steer simply makes everything happen faster.


i didn't ready the whole post so my aplogies if this was already mentioned. if you youtube presession you should come up with some good explanation videos.