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Thread: Crashing

  1. #16
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    From the point of view of Moto Academy NZ we instill in our riders that if you are crashing you are watching, not riding and therefore not learning very much.
    If you crash invariably you end up having to watch the rest of the race, nurse an injury, fix a damaged bike, buy a new helmet etc and by definition you are no longer on the track racing, which is what you came there to do.
    So, the approach is to ride at the level which teaches you the most while achieving the outcome you started out wanting to achieve, like your approach Deano.
    If your original goal turns out to be unrealistic e.g. "I'm going to win every race in my first year" or similar, so that you end up pushing beyond your abilities, then you need to adjust your goals to more accurately reflect the reality of your and your bikes abilities.
    Only by riding can you understand what those abilities are and the goals should be.
    In my experience very few new or inexperienced riders actually understand why they have crashed, unless the cause is very obvious, and hence they learn very little except how much it hurts.
    The Keith Code approach is one of "slow down to go faster" and has so much merit.
    The next step, after you reach a plateau what to do then? Do I need to push and crash or can I push and not crash?
    That is up to each rider of course, but clearly it is possible to push and not crash by putting in place clear strategies to achieve an improvement.
    Such as; get fitter, lose some more weight, understand your tyres and suspension better, study the circuit in more detail, work on each corner in detail, maintain a diary of your work but most of all, get on the track and try different things until you find something that works better than it did before.
    So few riders actually do this in a concerted manner, but instead end up just riding round like they have always done.
    And the last point: "GO AROUND THE CORNER!!" if you think you can't make it, tell yourself that you can and try anyway. You might just be surprised how you can make it round.

    There you go, how 'bout that?
    "Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans." John Ono Lennon.

    "If you have never stared off into the distance then your life is a shame." Counting Crows

    "The girls were in tight dresses, just like sweets in cellophane" Joe Jackson

  2. #17
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    Some very valid points Steveyb, but it think it all depends on how far and fast you want to go. Name one top rider that doesn't crash (or hasn't in the past learning to go that fast) a fair bit?

  3. #18
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    Excellent points Crasher, Steve and Sugilite.

    In my three full seasons of racing I have had a 2nd in PC Jnr, 3rd and 2nd in Pro Twins and always top ten in F3 at the streets on the SV, so I have been pretty happy with my progress, but still a little behind the likes of Geoff Booth, Dan Kempthorne, Ash Payne, Sam Love and now Rob Berryington-Smith in terms of lap times, so I'm wondering what is needed to bridge that gap.......push the bike harder ? Be more aggressive with overtaking and holding out other bikes ? Learn more about set up ? These are all my goals this year, and hopefully achievable without crashing.....but if it happens...shit happens eh ?

    Now with Drew entering the fray on an SV also, we should be able to combine forces (nya aa aaaa) and both make some good gains.

    Thanks for the replies and advice - good discussion !!
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  4. #19
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    Also Deano...if you want to learn to be a 'tad' more agressive when riding in close company...get a cheap moto-x bike and go race some moto-x! Will also teach you more about absolute limits of traction etc.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crasherfromwayback View Post
    Also Deano...if you want to learn to be a 'tad' more agressive when riding in close company...get a cheap moto-x bike and go race some moto-x! Will also teach you more about absolute limits of traction etc.
    I had an RM80 when I was 10 and the power band scared the crap out of me initially. My dad asked if I wanted to race it and I said No. :slap:

    I reckon I could have been a star if I had been courageous enough/pushed into it that young

    I had a KDX200 in my mid twenties and guess what.....I kept crashing it and injuring myself - then I couldn't do Muay Thai training, so the bike went. Same thing with the BMX freestyle bike I had.

    So I think I'll pass on the motocross. Maybe the aggression thing will kick in more if/when Drew goes past me !!
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  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deano View Post
    Now with Drew entering the fray on an SV also, we should be able to combine forces (nya aa aaaa) and both make some good gains.
    How. Is Drew gonna crash in front of your opposition or summit?

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiwi Graham View Post
    I think there is three reasons you crash, your fault, bikes fault and someone else's fault.

    I guess if your trying something new, the way you know it works or not is if you come out the other side still on your bike!

    Two things I know about crashing is.............it's expensive and it takes longer to mend the older you get!
    hahaha....I know a few that ONLY ever crash because of your last reason!

    Funny because I have only ever crashed due to my own doing at National events. I guess its because I was trying harder around faster riders than me.
    I personally would like to think you can push 'close enough' to the limit and learn from it, rather than always having to go over said limit to achieve the same. Of course, it never turns out that way but "I love it when a plan comes together!"

  8. #23
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    Crashing rocks it lets you no you are alive never is not enough and every time you ride is to much. Hope this helps
    Quote Originally Posted by Deano View Post
    What are racer's thoughts about crashing ?

    How often is too little or too much ?

    I know what Drew and Mr Shirriff's thoughts are on the matter......ya carnts !!

    I mean, I try pretty damn hard and get some good results.....better than average anyway.

    But I haven't crashed in the whole time I've been racing (4 years). I've had a few bins riding on the road (no major's - very badly sprained/bruised foot was the worst)

    Oh hang on - I crashed a bucket (AJ's Christine) at the slipway......doing all of about 20kph. Does that count ? "Everyone" crashed Christine.

    I've run off the race track 3 times at high speed. Two of those I could have seriously farked myself up, and I've had a lot of other small moments.

    I never used to buy into the "you need to crash to find the bikes limits", or "if you're not crashing, you're not pushing hard enough".

    I prefered to find the limits at a slightly slower rate and rely on feedback from the bike to let me know when its about to let go. But I have been recently reassessing that philosophy.

    So what are your thoughts ?

    p.s. This is a bit of a larf really so don't take any of it too seriously.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by gixerracer View Post
    Crashing rocks it lets you no you are alive never is not enough and every time you ride is to much. Hope this helps
    Thanks Craig that's great advice - just like the key to going faster - later on the brakes and earlier on the gas eh

    I was actually waiting for some less subtle comments from you......like what you said to Drew about the matter LOL.
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  10. #25
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    Maate,
    I agree with SteveB on this one. If you can improve without crashing, that's the way to do it.

  11. #26
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    Cool thread Deano.

    Tried it...............didn't like it one bit..........cost too much..........found out I'm a soft c*nt when it comes to pain!!

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by gixerracer View Post
    Crashing rocks it lets you no you are alive never is not enough and every time you ride is to much. Hope this helps
    Craig, can you be a bit more......





    vague?
    "Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans." John Ono Lennon.

    "If you have never stared off into the distance then your life is a shame." Counting Crows

    "The girls were in tight dresses, just like sweets in cellophane" Joe Jackson

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tony.OK View Post
    .found out I'm a soft c*nt when it comes to pain!!
    or just soft eh???

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crasherfromwayback View Post
    Some very valid points Steveyb, but it think it all depends on how far and fast you want to go. Name one top rider that doesn't crash (or hasn't in the past learning to go that fast) a fair bit?
    Well that is true of course.
    It is motorbike racing afterall. They do tend to fall over from time to time. Top riders need to push the envelope more so than learner riders, so may come off more often.
    But look at Andrew Stroud. How many times does he crash these days?
    Valentino Rossi? Does not crash so often any more (well not at all for the last two GPs...... hehehe. Poor taste I know).
    The general philosophy of what I was saying is aimed more at the novice/learner type racer that is still learning what to do and suggests that the more you stay on the bike, the more you will learn.
    We have all known new riders who go out and go like stink but come off more often than is otherwise warranted (a bit like me in the early days, though I wasn't tooooo bad).
    Riders like this need to learn to slow down to go faster.
    Part of it is also learning to relax on the bike so that you aren't strangling the life out of it and making it and you all tense. The more relaxed you can be the smoother you'll be able to ride. But I feel that this comes with experience and there is only one way to learn that.
    "Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans." John Ono Lennon.

    "If you have never stared off into the distance then your life is a shame." Counting Crows

    "The girls were in tight dresses, just like sweets in cellophane" Joe Jackson

  15. #30
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    All valid points as I said. I remember when I was starting out...often took me two odd laps to realize I wasn't even breathing! Breath slowly and deeply!

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