Does drug prohibition put the police in danger and harm the public?

[Edbear]

Good...because that is all I meant.

Re prescription drugs...unfortunately I've had a lot more experience than most with those.
I am still supposed to be on a gratuitous amount of HEAVY painkillers yet choose not to be due to the side effects.
Should I take Valium or Imovane to sleep tonight?
Nah...think I'll stick to a cone

I was heavily addicted to prescription painkillers and it was a living hell! Getting off them was a nightmare and has left me wary of taking drugs ever since.

I was given sleeping pills once and hated them so stopped taking them and have never used them since! I am on painkillers now for my back, but only Panadol and 1 x twice daily Tramadol which I'm tolerating well. I'm hopeful of stopping the Tramadol this week and making do with just the Panadol.

[DMNTD:Me]

I was heavily addicted to prescription painkillers and it was a living hell! Getting off them was a nightmare and has left me wary of taking drugs ever since.

I was given sleeping pills once and hated them so stopped taking them and have never used them since! I am on painkillers now for my back, but only Panadol and 1 x twice daily Tramadol which I'm tolerating well. I'm hopeful of stopping the Tramadol this week and making do with just the Panadol.

Heh! Good ol' Tramadol! Used to be on 12+ per day, PLUS Morphine,Synflex, ++++++++++ .
IMO....Synflex is the better prescription drug I have ever used. Didn't/doesn't muck with me in any way.

IMHO...70% of pain can be 'managed' mentally which unfortunately is extremely tiring and stressful.
A small cone at the end of the night helps release the stress.
BTW...no, pot does NOT help with physical pain, just the perception of it.

[Hinny]

Rubbish, this is typical conspiracy theory crap. Anyone can do their own independent study and publicise the results.

Just because you do not have knowledge of such things does not make them rubbish. That is to say your ignorance is not a defining parameter.
Each of my statements is totally valid.
Q. Where did you refute the prohibition tag for the legal status of drugs and drug use? A. Post 2.
'Ummm, no. Prohibition was a different situation...'

I have yet to see any research results that cast Cannabis use in a negative light that have not been convincingly debunked by the scientific community.
Apart from one conducted by the University of Auckland.
The brains from a dozen healthy rats were placed in a 3.2 molar solution of Hydrochloric acid for 12 minutes.
They were then placed in a blender with a tincture of Tetrahydrocannabinol
also known as delta-9-tetrahydrocannabinol or THC the active ingredient in cannabis.
After blending for no more than five minutes they were rinsed in common household bleach. Examination under an electron microscope revealed definite brain damage - there is no doubt that this was from the exposure to the THC.


The really bad part about prohibition is the counter-intuitive outcomes than are undeniable. That is, prohibition leads to increased drug use. This is a self evident truth.

[davereid]

The really bad part about prohibition is the counter-intuitive outcomes than are undeniable. That is, prohibition leads to increased drug use. This is a self evident truth.

I don't think that is counter intuitive, it makes complete sense..

It seems entirely natural that the more we try to stop drug use, the harder and more dangerous drugs will become.

If alcohol were illegal, its unlikely I would just brew beer, it would not be worth the risk, I'd just make spirits.

Why smuggle in a container of beer (as it were) when you could smuggle in a container of ethanol. Which once watered down gives you 3 containers of vodka, each with 3 times the potential profit of the beer ?

The same must apply to the illegal drug trade.

And I think its a gimme that prohibition does not reduce demand, so
even if the police were to be able to reduce supply, the profit per unit goes up.

Its actually almost the perfect business.. you have a product people want, the government works to reduce supply for you, thus ensuring your profit margin.

[Edbear]

Just because you do not have knowledge of such things does not make them rubbish. That is to say your ignorance is not a defining parameter.
Each of my statements is totally valid.
Q. Where did you refute the prohibition tag for the legal status of drugs and drug use? A. Post 2.
'Ummm, no. Prohibition was a different situation...'

I have yet to see any research results that cast Cannabis use in a negative light that have not been convincingly debunked by the scientific community.
Apart from one conducted by the University of Auckland.
The brains from a dozen healthy rats were placed in a 3.2 molar solution of Hydrochloric acid for 12 minutes.
They were then placed in a blender with a tincture of Tetrahydrocannabinol
also known as delta-9-tetrahydrocannabinol or THC the active ingredient in cannabis.
After blending for no more than five minutes they were rinsed in common household bleach. Examination under an electron microscope revealed definite brain damage - there is no doubt that this was from the exposure to the THC.


The really bad part about prohibition is the counter-intuitive outcomes than are undeniable. That is, prohibition leads to increased drug use. This is a self evident truth.

Sigh... The Prohibition you were referring to and that I referred to was the Prohibition everyone thinks of when that word is mentioned, ie: the US booze ban. The word "prohibition" means to prohibit something, and I never argued any different.

As for ignorance, I could flood you with research and your post is so biased and ridiculous I can't even be bothered with a response to it.

[FJRider]

The really bad part about prohibition is the counter-intuitive outcomes than are undeniable. That is, prohibition leads to increased drug use. This is a self evident truth.

Sooooooo .... we make it legal ... and drug use will slow down/stop ???????

[scumdog]

Sooooooo .... we make it l,egal ... and drug use will slow down/stop ???????

Yup, works with alcohol eh!

[davereid]

Sooooooo .... we make it l,egal ... and drug use will slow down/stop ???????

I think the momentum for the manufacture and supply of harder and harder drugs would reduce.

For what ever reason, people seek a "buzz". Thats the "demand" part of the chain.

If that demand can be met with drugs that are (relatively) safe, the reason for the manufacture of (relatively) unsafe drugs is reduced.

There will always be those who seek the hardest, and most damaging.

But for most people, if they could get the buzz they seek legally, demand for the more damaging drugs would simply fade away.

Its my opinion that those who manufacture drugs, look to ship the most kick per unit of profit they can, without regard to the effects on the consumer.

Prohibition of drugs, without removal of demand is unlikely to do a bloody thing !

[Edbear]

Sooooooo .... we make it l,egal ... and drug use will slow down/stop ???????

Yup, works with alcohol eh!

Some people just can't see the bleedin' obvious...

[scissorhands]

Some people just can't see the bleedin' obvious...

The bleeding obvious is obviously different for different people....why not listen to experts instead of emotionally charged opinions either by drug users or religion users.

Reminds me of when a kebab shop guy wanted to tell me about the one true god, then refused to serve me when i said i wasnt a believer. What was bleeding obvious to him, was a crock of shit to me....

heres a couple of expert opinions, a judge too

[FJRider]

I think the momentum for the manufacture and supply of harder and harder drugs would reduce.

For what ever reason, people seek a "buzz". Thats the "demand" part of the chain.

If that demand can be met with drugs that are (relatively) safe, the reason for the manufacture of (relatively) unsafe drugs is reduced.

There will always be those who seek the hardest, and most damaging.

But for most people, if they could get the buzz they seek legally, demand for the more damaging drugs would simply fade away.

Its my opinion that those who manufacture drugs, look to ship the most kick per unit of profit they can, without regard to the effects on the consumer.

Prohibition of drugs, without removal of demand is unlikely to do a bloody thing !

The way people get their "kicks" varies .... some get it through speed (NOT THAT DRUG) and although speed can be achieved legally ... on race tracks or closed roads/private property ... many won't.

Thus it would seem, it it not the drugs (or the speed) that they get the bigger kick out of ... but the breaking the law ... doing what they are not allowed to do.

[Edbear]

The bleeding obvious is obviously different for different people....why not listen to experts instead of emotionally charged opinions either by drug users or religion users.

Reminds me of when a kebab shop guy wanted to tell me about the one true god, then refused to serve me when i said i wasnt a believer. What was bleeding obvious to him, was a crock of shit to me....

heres a couple of expert opinions, a judge too

You know what they say about opinions... A recent post of mine acknowledged the potential medical benefits of many drugs including Cannabis and obviously Magic Mushrooms have an ingredient that could be explored medically as well.

The point you are missing, is that for most people, they take these drugs to get a high, to get senseless as do people abuse alcohol, not for medicinal purposes. As others have also opined similarly, alcohol os a legal drug and we have a major alcohol abuse problem in this and most other countries. So legal or not, abuse of drugs and alcohol will continue to be major problem world wide, and you only have to ask those on the front line, ie: Police, Paramedics and hospitals as well as social services as to the effects of substance abuse.


Even so-called expert opinion has to be backed by solid scientific evidence and there is plenty around that analyses the physical and psychological effects of drugs and alcohol. People who bleat that they should be allowed to take drugs and alcohol as they please without breaking the law are in the minority and rarely are among the leaders of the world making a positive contribution to society. Think of all the great men and women of the world who work hard for the betterment of society and mankind and how many are drug and alcohol abusers?

As I said, dugs and alcohol always impair the body's functions and mental lucidity and prolonged use only makes it worse. But you don't need to take my word for it, I'm merely telling you what the scientific and medical studies prove. You can easily verify this for yourself by doing your own research into the topic.

[scissorhands]

You know what they say about opinions... A recent post of mine acknowledged the potential medical benefits of many drugs including Cannabis and obviously Magic Mushrooms have an ingredient that could be explored medically as well.

The point you are missing, is that for most people, they take these drugs to get a high, to get senseless as do people abuse alcohol, not for medicinal purposes. As others have also opined similarly, alcohol os a legal drug and we have a major alcohol abuse problem in this and most other countries. So legal or not, abuse of drugs and alcohol will continue to be major problem world wide, and you only have to ask those on the front line, ie: Police, Paramedics and hospitals as well as social services as to the effects of substance abuse.



Even so-called expert opinion has to be backed by solid scientific evidence and there is plenty around that analyses the physical and psychological effects of drugs and alcohol. People who bleat that they should be allowed to take drugs and alcohol as they please without breaking the law are in the minority and rarely are among the leaders of the world making a positive contribution to society. Think of all the great men and women of the world who work hard for the betterment of society and mankind and how many are drug and alcohol abusers?

As I said, dugs and alcohol always impair the body's functions and mental lucidity and prolonged use only makes it worse. But you don't need to take my word for it, I'm merely telling you what the scientific and medical studies prove. You can easily verify this for yourself by doing your own research into the topic.

I respect your right to an opinion but strongly disagree and cant be bothered countering your points. I think your an idealist rather the a realist regarding the worlds drug problem. As much as you see dyed in the wool drug users as wrong for harming themselves, I see your view as puritanical and morose regarding ritualistic or recreational inebriation, sort the world over by all peoples of all races.... Sort of at the other end of the scale of excess,

PROHIBITION IS JUST AS WRONG

I can understand your wishing to balance a world of excess with prohibtion, but the middle balanced view is intelligent and harmony involves give and take.....

I'm here and now promoting the idea that prohibition is harmful to police and the public, and at the end of the day, we are better off without it.

Albert Einstein, Judge Gray and many/most intellectuals and scientists agree with this.

Religious people and wowsers agree with you.

I am firmly of the mind that if NZ was to decriminalise drug use, many positive things will happen to our country, including acceptance and love, rather than the habit of labelling 'users' as 'abusers'.

What about the financial cost of food abusers to our society? Its fecking huge!! I pay for that!!! And if I smoke 1 gram of weed in a week I'm a drug abuser? Its wrong!

[scumdog]

I can understand your wishing to balance a world of excess with prohibtion, but the middle balanced view is intelligent and harmony involves give and take.....

I'm here and now promoting the idea that prohibition is harmful to police and the public, and at the end of the day, we are better off without it.

I am firmly of the mind that if NZ was to decriminalise drug use, many positive things will happen to our country, including acceptance and love, rather than the habit of labelling 'users' as 'abusers'.

What about the financial cost of food abusers to our society? Its fecking huge!! I pay for that!!! And if I smoke 1 gram of weed in a week I'm a drug abuser? Its wrong!

Hmmm, the joys of legalising dak and similar stuff:

The 'joy' of going on a flight in a chopper piloted by a toked-out dude - full of acceptance and love too no doubt.

Or be operated on by a zoned-out surgeon equally so.

[scissorhands]

Hmmm, the joys of legalising dak and similar stuff:

The 'joy' of going on a flight in a chopper piloted by a toked-out dude - full of acceptance and love too no doubt.

Or be operated on by a zoned-out surgeon equally so.

Alcohol is much worse in these scenarios than someone on stimulating drugs like the ones those crusty demon guys take.

The German doctor in Bali who stitches up the surfers is usually boozing or on something from the pharmacy, but hes always a better bet than the tea total Balo doctors

So meh meh meh