Linux vs Windows?

[Drunken Monkey]

I see what you did there, you're talking about piracy, hahaha, you're so funny.

That was a good one.

Considering you can't buy a name brand machine without an OS these days, the OEM is practically free (yes I know, it's just built into the cost, but most times you can't option out). Whilst office is still expensive, there are a lot of free MS products, just check their website.

On top of this there are a myriad of alternative licensing solutions which are considerably cheaper than retail/boxed product, granted some licensing structures are corporate only, but there are plenty of other packages anyone can sign up to if they do the leg work. I subscribed myself to MAP (microsoft action pack), I get 10 licenses of office enterprise, windows 7 ultimate, server, sql, etc... for NZ $450. That's less than the price of 1 office pro in a retail pack.

[Brian d marge]

Considering you can't buy a name brand machine without an OS these days, the OEM is practically free (yes I know, it's just built into the cost, but most times you can't option out). Whilst office is still expensive, there are a lot of free MS products, just check their website.

On top of this there are a myriad of alternative licensing solutions which are considerably cheaper than retail/boxed product, granted some licensing structures are corporate only, but there are plenty of other packages anyone can sign up to if they do the leg work. I subscribed myself to MAP (microsoft action pack), I get 10 licenses of office enterprise, windows 7 ultimate, server, sql, etc... for NZ $450. That's less than the price of 1 office pro in a retail pack.

woa 450 dollars , that's a set of tyres
but ur right about trying to buy a computer without an OS
try it sometime , buying drugs is easier, The net-book I have , MSI wind came with XP ,, of course I dont want it and said so ,,,

big meeting with other sales staff, came back and said but you need xp to make it work
no, says I

but it wont work without Xp says they

oh and i dont want to pay for Xp says I
but you must says they

last seen buying computer ( it was cheap ) and sales staff running out into the car park to inform me the warranty would be void

ho hmm

Stephen

No I cant be bothered trying to claim the xp refund ,

[avgas]

How come everything isn't 64 bit yet.......fucking annoying.
I just had to roll back to 32 bit on a work server.

[Suntoucher]

woa 450 dollars , that's a set of tyres
but ur right about trying to buy a computer without an OS
try it sometime , buying drugs is easier, The net-book I have , MSI wind came with XP ,, of course I dont want it and said so ,,,

big meeting with other sales staff, came back and said but you need xp to make it work
no, says I

but it wont work without Xp says they

oh and i dont want to pay for Xp says I
but you must says they

last seen buying computer ( it was cheap ) and sales staff running out into the car park to inform me the warranty would be void

ho hmm

Stephen

No I cant be bothered trying to claim the xp refund ,

I put them together myself, thus none of my computers have come with an OS.

Regarding the 64 bit above. Windows x64 emulates 32 bit programs, so they should ALL still work. It just doesn't run 16 bit programs and 32 bit drivers.

Unfortunately some 32 bit only programs have 16 bit installers...

[Scuba_Steve]

I put them together myself, thus none of my computers have come with an OS.

Regarding the 64 bit above. Windows x64 emulates 32 bit programs, so they should ALL still work. It just doesn't run 16 bit programs and 32 bit drivers.

Unfortunately some 32 bit only programs have 16 bit installers...

watch that! because its emulated, as you said it wont run 32bit drivers. But it also won't run any app that relies on 32bit drivers to work. So theres quite a few less than "ALL" that actually do work. But yes alot of Apps still will work in emulated mode.

[avgas]

watch that! because its emulated, as you said it wont run 32bit drivers. But it also won't run any app that relies on 32bit drivers to work. So theres quite a few less than "ALL" that actually do work. But yes alot of Apps still will work in emulated mode.

Yeah ya beat me too it.
Had to down grade as SCADA is a temperamental SOB at the best of times. But also due to a few config programs also required on it, use their custom code.......rather than old school API's.
Basically I don't see being able to run SCADA/Base station PC's in 64 bit till at-least 2013. But at least now we are looking at 7 rather than XP. Some guys are running on Linux (and I have had a bit of a play)......but its a good 5 or so years until a 'unified' distro is SCADA friendly.

I got rid of my last adobe product today (acrobat reader).......I was so happy. It has been replaced with pdf xchange viewer as you can edit the pdf with this software.

[SMOKEU]

I don't see the point in buying a brand name desktop anyway, they usually seem to have a rather poor case design. It's better to just build one yourself, or go to a small computer shop and buy a no name brand one from there. Then you don't have to buy the OS with it.

[Brian d marge]

CFD, ( open foam ) , ties my desktop up for well over a day ( i leave it running over night , but I dont like that )

I note the local computer shop has large sticks or Ram , 6 gig each or something like that , quite cheap , now as I run 64 bit , it should see the full ram , but then I wonder what the choke will be further down the line , Quad cores are cheap ,,,,,,,

new OS looming ( because its free take a few mins and I'm bored ) Sooo we need a new Computer

that's it , that's Monday sorted ....... water cooled ,,,,,,,why not

Stephen

ps what did you do to remove adobe flash??? Gnash?? no pron???/

[Gremlin]

I note the local computer shop has large sticks or Ram , 6 gig each or something like that , quite cheap , now as I run 64 bit , it should see the full ram

You'll most likely need a server board for that memory, unusual to see desktop board memory over 2GB, but I think it can be ordered in (well, here in little backwater NZ). Desktop boards with 2GB sticks is a bit pot luck coupled with age, some boards are more sensitive than others.

The big issue with massive quantites of memory (ie, not 12, more like 100GB) is the errors.

[Brian d marge]

You'll most likely need a server board for that memory, unusual to see desktop board memory over 2GB, but I think it can be ordered in (well, here in little backwater NZ). Desktop boards with 2GB sticks is a bit pot luck coupled with age, some boards are more sensitive than others.

The big issue with massive quantites of memory (ie, not 12, more like 100GB) is the errors.

I have 2 sticks of 4 in at the moment
oh that worked well , but this is what I has Like motorcycles , ya cant beat cubes , ,,,shopping on monday is looking and option


Stephen

Hardware Information
Motherboard name:
DG35EC
Motherboard vendor:
Intel Corporation
BIOS vendor:
Intel Corp.
BIOS version:
ECG3510M.86A.0106.2008.0730.1746
BIOS release date:
07/30/2008
CPU 1 name:
Intel(R) Core(TM)2 CPU 6600 @ 2.40GHz
CPU 1 level 1 cache size:
32K Data cache. 32K Instruction cache.
CPU 1 level 2 cache size:
4096K Unified cache.
CPU 1 Mips:
4775.99
CPU 2 name:
Intel(R) Core(TM)2 CPU 6600 @ 2.40GHz
CPU 2 level 1 cache size:
32K Data cache. 32K Instruction cache.
CPU 2 level 2 cache size:
4096K Unified cache.
CPU 2 Mips:
4884.81
64 bit CPU?
Yes!
Total memory:
7.8 GB
Total swap:
24001 MBytes
Ethernet card:
Intel Corporation 82566DC Gigabit Network Connection (rev 02)
Linux Information
Host name:
s-desktop
Current user:
caelinux (UID: 1000, GID: 1000)
Uptime:
2 hours 29 minutes
Kernel version:
2.6.32-24-generic
Kernel arch:
x86_64
X server version:
X.Org X Server 1.7.6
OpenGL direct rendering:
Yes
OpenGL vendor:
NVIDIA Corporation
OpenGL renderer:
GeForce 7600 GT/PCI/SSE2
OpenGL version:
2.1.2 NVIDIA 195.36.24
GCC version:
4.4.3
Java version:
1.6.0_20
Python version:
2.6.5
GTK version:
2.20.1
PyGTK version:
2.17.0
Firefox version:
Mozilla Firefox 3.6.8
Ubuntu version:
10.04

[SMOKEU]

Something is wrong with my Windows 7 computer. It has performed flawlessly over the past week. Not random restarts, no BSOD, no freezing up.

[Urano]

nice.
now try to switch it on...

[Forest]

Yeah ya beat me too it.
Had to down grade as SCADA is a temperamental SOB at the best of times. But also due to a few config programs also required on it, use their custom code.......rather than old school API's.
Basically I don't see being able to run SCADA/Base station PC's in 64 bit till at-least 2013. But at least now we are looking at 7 rather than XP. Some guys are running on Linux (and I have had a bit of a play)......but its a good 5 or so years until a 'unified' distro is SCADA friendly.

If you're building SCADA systems using PCs, you deserve all the problems you will get.

[avgas]

If you're building SCADA systems using PCs, you deserve all the problems you will get.

Yep - but its easy to convince motorcyclists to pay extra ACC levies than it is to convince customers to pay for servers for SCADA.
And giving SCADA to IT, is like giving teenage girls the morning after pill. Even when it works it feels wrong and immoral.
I just had to upgrade a customer recently, because their 5 year old "PC" running all the telemetry SCADA was dying. They were wondering why they had to spend the money
I mean fuck me thats not a bad record, 5 years, 7 days a week, 24 hours a day..........on a $2000 box.......
The fleet of cars and cellphones at this place would have been upgraded twice in that time.

Tis' a crazy world we live in, but ah fuck it at least it pays the bills.
[This was typed on a 4 year old laptop, which has not been upgraded due to a) Serial port lackness in new ones and b) boss still scared of new windows]

[scracha]

woa 450 dollars , that's a set of tyres
but ur right about trying to buy a computer without an OS
try it sometime , buying drugs is easier, The net-book I have , MSI wind came with XP ,, of

?? Off the top of my head I can buy Acer (yuk), Asus and HP (doesn't Dell do em with Ubuntu too?) without a Win OS. Custom built ones save about $180 by not having a Win 7 pro disk with em. Can still find suppliers who supply them with the XP Pro downgrade already installed too.

Oh....top tip of the day....the Intel i3 is a complete piece of shit IMHO. Pentium/Core 2 Duo/i5/i7 much better.