Free the weed, dope, cannabis, hooch, Fri 4 Feb, outside Auckland District Courts

[onearmedbandit]

Ah always guaranteed an emotional debate when the subject of marijuana comes up. And that's exactly that, it will always be a debate. You're wasting valuable time arguing amongst yourselves, time that could be better used by passing the whip to the vaporiser, bogart.

[Edbear]

Bearing that in mind, do you acknowledge the hypocrisy that tobacco is "legal" and cannabis is not? Surely, if "the only purpose is self harm" then both tobacco and cannabis should be illegal? And given tobacco is NZ's leading cause of preventable death* then you must be campaigning vigorously for it to be made unlawful?


*don't ask me for a source for that: I think i read it on a billboard or saw a TV ad or something.

Anybody who knows me knows my views on smoking in general. I consider the tobacco companies, okay the people running them, promoting smoking and marketing it, to be murderers as they knowingly produce and market a product that will kill half those who use it as intended and make miserable the lives of most of the remaining half. You may have noticed my posts have included tobacco.

[Banditbandit]

heres why: As an undiagnosed autistic the social problems I had from a young age found relief around surfing, the beach and cannabis. Like many 'loners' who find relief in the surf and cannabis, self medicating a reasonably benign substance is popular, and drinking is bad for your surfing..... The Daktory has a few autistics from birth, abused children, that sort of thing. okay Ed?

Fuck this

Bin there .. done that .. got the diseases ... ('cept it was bikes not surfing ...)

[scumdog]

: steal to support your habit, NO,

Drugs arent the problem, people are the problem.

So.. if you DON'T have to steal to support your habit then the drug is ok?

BUT if you DO have to steal to support your habit it's not ok?

So do those that don't have to steal tell the one that do have to steal about that??

And dead-on with the second comment - of course drugs affect people in different ways eh...

[ellipsis]

.....love is a dangerous drug...causes all kinds of shit...BAN IT...

[HenryDorsetCase]

So.. if you DON'T have to steal to support your habit then the drug is ok?

Yep. In my view. Who are you to be able to tell me what I can and can't, should and shouldn't do? If I want to fuck myself up, it should be my choice.

BUT if you DO have to steal to support your habit it's not ok?

yes: beccause at that point, my choices are negatively affecting others. That is the point at which society should sanction that behaviour. A good example, and one with which we're all familiar, is homosexualuality. If I happen to love a big black cock up my bunghole, and provided no-one is forcing it up there, then its nobodies business, consenting adults and like that: enforcing some arbitrary moral view by legal sanction is pointless, and doomed to fail. Another example: William Burroughs was addicted to heroin for years: he had the money to pay for it, didnt have to turn tricks on the street or steal: that should be nobodies business but his as well.

So do those that don't have to steal tell the one that do have to steal about that??

I don't understand. in the utopia I have created, there wont be drama.

And dead-on with the second comment - of course drugs affect people in different ways eh...

I wouldnt know.

[Banditbandit]

i don't understand. In the utopia i have created, there wont be drama.

boring then huh ????

[mashman]

Anybody who knows me knows my views on smoking in general. I consider the tobacco companies, okay the people running them, promoting smoking and marketing it, to be murderers as they knowingly produce and market a product that will kill half those who use it as intended and make miserable the lives of most of the remaining half. You may have noticed my posts have included tobacco.

Hi Ed ... what about alcohol and those who promote it (it can be deadly within a matter of hours)? What about the doctors and pharmaceutical industry that creates "legal treatments" that are highly addictive? Do you hate them with as much vigour?

From personal research over MANY years, I have less side effects from a "smoke" than I do from boozing. The MAIN reason I used to "smoke" (wagon, nearly 2 months and no withdrawals, can't say that with any of the above) is that it costs me by far less for a much more pleasant experience. Cost for me is a huge factor. The end result is the whole purpose of doing it yes. As is bungee jumping, rock climbing and every other adrenaline junky's fix.

Free the weed and generate some cash for the country... not everyone will/can grow it.

[mashman]

the interesting thing about that proposal is that the weed growers in California all* voted against Proposition 19, which would have legalised cannabis, and opened the way for the government to tax it. Why? they were worried about the agribusiness giants i.e. corporate Mrka muscling in on their business. So they voted against legalisation on the basis they didnt want their business model which is quite successful though sort of illegal being screwed with. My understanding is that if you have a prescription, you can buy from "non-profit" marijuana clubs, and that prescriptions are fairly readily available.

I thnk its fascinating. Its also another example why prohibition in any form just does not work. It can be as legal as you like, it won't increase my consumption by one iota.


*apparently

So contract the growers for 10 years at a time and keep the agribusiness doing what they're already doing anyway. Set a price and leave it that way... just leave the current Cannabis production-consumption system alone. Why change what is obviously working? other than adding GST of course

Prohibition is just another case of, well we can't do it, why should you. I don't see it any deeper than that. Otherwise common sense would prevail and the govt would have extra taxation... where's the down side? Paranoia .

[Edbear]

Hi Ed ... what about alcohol and those who promote it (it can be deadly within a matter of hours)? What about the doctors and pharmaceutical industry that creates "legal treatments" that are highly addictive? Do you hate them with as much vigour?

From personal research over MANY years, I have less side effects from a "smoke" than I do from boozing. The MAIN reason I used to "smoke" (wagon, nearly 2 months and no withdrawals, can't say that with any of the above) is that it costs me by far less for a much more pleasant experience. Cost for me is a huge factor. The end result is the whole purpose of doing it yes. As is bungee jumping, rock climbing and every other adrenaline junky's fix.

Free the weed and generate some cash for the country... not everyone will/can grow it.

You're missing the point, mate. Smoking, whether tobacco or cannabis, has no benign level. Smoking is automatically bad for the health and no-one can argue that. I've made the point that there are properties in cannabis that can be extracted for health benefits. There may be properties as yet unheard of in tobacco that can be extracted and used in a benign way as well.

To save repeating myself ad infinitum, go back and read my posts as I have addressed alcohol, motorcycling, the legal and societal issues. The key is in the purpose, and people smole cannabis to get high, end of story. I've said if anyone is genuinely serious about any possible health benefits, get off your backsides and do something about it, however, as I pointed out, for most, that's not attractive as that will still leave the smoking of it out of the picture.

Cannabis users just want to be able to smoke it without consequence and it's as simple as that. They are not interested in health, or the effects on others or anything else. It's called rationalising one's own preferences from a selfish viewpoint.

[HenryDorsetCase]

The key is in the purpose, and people smole cannabis to get high, end of story.

Cannabis users just want to be able to smoke it without consequence and it's as simple as that. They are not interested in health, or the effects on others or anything else. It's called rationalising one's own preferences from a selfish viewpoint.

I get your point. You appear not to get mine: which comes down to primate preference, the hypocrisy of prohibition, and its pointlessness.

I do agree with you that arguing health benefits is a smokescreen.

People want to get off their tits. Its what people do.

taking your argument, you presumably have no objection to non-smoked forms of cannabis use (of which there are many)?.

[HenryDorsetCase]

boring then huh ????

Nah, everybody will be too stoned to care......

[onearmedbandit]

Cannabis users just want to be able to smoke it without consequence and it's as simple as that. They are not interested in health, or the effects on others or anything else. It's called rationalising one's own preferences from a selfish viewpoint.

Don't we all already do this in some form or other?

And too right I want to smoke it without legal consequence. Just like people who drink in their own home or smoke cigarettes.

[HenryDorsetCase]

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[Edbear]

I get your point. You appear not to get mine: which comes down to primate preference, the hypocrisy of prohibition, and its pointlessness.

I do agree with you that arguing health benefits is a smokescreen.

People want to get off their tits. Its what people do.

taking your argument, you presumably have no objection to non-smoked forms of cannabis use (of which there are many)?.

I have no objection to seeking the health benefits of anything but my personal view is that I prefer to keep my senses and avoid doing anything that makes my mind less than alert and sober. I drink a bit, but not enough to get drunk or even tipsy and I won't take mind-altering drugs without reason to, such as painkillers, anaesthetics etc. I don't enjoy, or see the point in getting drunk or stoned by whatever means, "for fun" as it's no fun for me to either be that way or watch others make fools of themselves. I have much more fun being sober...

Bear in mind this is my personal opinion and you know what they say about opinions...

Don't we all already do this in some form or other?

Yup! But hopefully we can at least be honest with ourselves...