Climate change or global warming and who did it?

[Winston001]

Ain't that the truth... big meteorite, effects of the moon leaving our orbit, sun going supernova... all the human effort in the world isn't going to prevent extinction eventually...

You can relax, mankind won't be extinct any time soon. Consider the above apocalyptic scenarios:

• the last great extinction from a meteorite strike was 63 million years ago. That only wiped out the dinosaurs and left all other living forms to carry on.
• there is no way the Moon is able to break away from the Earth
• the Sun has been burning for 5 billion years and has at least a few hundred million years to go.

In the space of 100 years - a tiny fraction of the Earth's existence, man has gone from discovering electricity to standing on the Moon. In another 100 years man will be standing on Mars and probably the moons of Jupiter. From there Alpha Centauri is only a long flight away and the stars are ours.

We will spread throughout our arm of the Milky Way over the next 1000 years and adapt to become quite different creatures. But we won't go away.

Incidentally...may the Force be with you.

[Berries]

And what planet do you live on ?

[Spearfish]

I have watched a documentary called Star Trek, apparently in the future some dude called Zefram Cochran invents a new engine based on warp drive, I'm not sure what warp drive is but I know is farken fast. Shortly after a few successful flights some pointy eared dudes decide we are advanced enough for "first contact" and there starts the united federation of planets. Shyt hot I say, cheaper bike rego cause ACC communism is out the door!!!

I think the same documentary team filmed something about an "inconvenient truth" as a base for advertising a newly developed currency, carbon. Then subsequent development in a global carbon trading pyramid scheme.

[puddytat]

I read in this book with "Dont Panic" in large friendly letters on the front, that Vogons have a part to play in our demise as well ....



I found as much truth in it as the Bible, but it was a heck of a lot funnier

[Spearfish]

I read in this book with "Dont Panic" in large friendly letters on the front, that Vogons have a part to play in our demise as well ....



I found as much truth in it as the Bible, but it was a heck of a lot funnier

Now thats going back a bit...

[puddytat]

Yeah it is...came out I think in the same year as the Montreal Accord or agreement
Something else from the book that is know commonly used by everyone is the
"Someone elses problem Field" device that if I remember correctly works along the lines that when you are confronted with a problem it automatically engages & that problem you had ,becomes someone elses

[Toaster]

There was a very interesting documentary on this in relation to the formation of our known oil deposits. It focused on the recycling of carbon. From air to creature to dead material to fossil rock to oil, then burned and back into the atmosphere.

In Summary:
Over billions of years the techtonic plates have shifted...

.... billions of creatures died and fell into or were washed into the sea...

... settles on seabed and is buried....

... heat, pressure, time....

... the seabed eventually becones much of the middle east as it is known today...

... hello... oil.

Now for the CO2 bit. As all this material died, the CO2 levels in the atmosphere had increased significantly - all from natural events, like volcanic eruptions etc.

Oxygen levels in the oceans dropped right off creating effectively stagnant oceans.... perfect for the collection of material that eventually becomes oil.

The earth reaches its own tipping point where the warming then ceases and it starts to cool again, the ice comes back etc.

The argument is that we, with all our fossil fuel burning , are merely hurrying the natural process along. How fast that is, is debatable.
Long story made short, but was fascinating nonetheless.

[oneofsix]

I have watched a documentary called Star Trek, apparently in the future some dude called Zefram Cochran invents a new engine based on warp drive, I'm not sure what warp drive is but I know is farken fast. Shortly after a few successful flights some pointy eared dudes decide we are advanced enough for "first contact" and there starts the united federation of planets. Shyt hot I say, cheaper bike rego cause ACC communism is out the door!!!

I think the same documentary team filmed something about an "inconvenient truth" as a base for advertising a newly developed currency, carbon. Then subsequent development in a global carbon trading pyramid scheme.

The original version of that doco had mistakes in it, like the use of interstellar spacecraft in 1997. I didn't notice if the updated version had postponed the launch of the interstellar spacecraft.

They eventually decided currency was a bore and caused wars so did away with it, never worked out how they bought stuff like the latest bikes.

[Spearfish]

The original version of that doco had mistakes in it, like the use of interstellar spacecraft in 1997. I didn't notice if the updated version had postponed the launch of the interstellar spacecraft.

They eventually decided currency was a bore and caused wars so did away with it, never worked out how they bought stuff like the latest bikes.

They used a replicator for any gear they want..imagine the endless fettling!!!

[Spearfish]

Yeah it is...came out I think in the same year as the Montreal Accord or agreement
Something else from the book that is know commonly used by everyone is the
"Someone elses problem Field" device that if I remember correctly works along the lines that when you are confronted with a problem it automatically engages & that problem you had ,becomes someone elses

Art imitating life or the tuther way round?

Wasn't there an probability drive as well?

[shrub]

Are we? And even if we are, why should we?

If we can't accurately determine the cause of a change, how can we claim to be intelligent enough to do anything about it?]

*Sighs* I don't think anyone with any expertise in the subject and who is not in the employment of an interested party (read that oil, right wing conservatives etc) has any doubt that the unexpected rise in temperature is cause by human activity, specifically dumping billions of tonnes of greenhouse gases into the atmosphere. Every new piece of research that comes out strengthens that argument and NOTHING credible has been produced to challenge it. Nothing. Zip. Not a sausage.

Then when it comes to climate change, the majority of recent resesrch shows that a warmer climate is good for the planet, while a cooler climate is detrimental. Have a look at [url]http://www.worldclimatereport.com/index.php/2011/03/23/global-greening-continues-did-we-cause-it/[/url

Oh? What research? A blog? with only two references? How the hell is that the majority of recent research?

I can find blogs that claim that Elvis is still alive, that space aliens regularly visit earth and that the world will end in 2012. If you're going to make claims like that use quality, independently verified research conducted by world leading experts. I might even put up a blog that says middle aged Triumph owners are sexually irresistable to women, especially 22 year old blonde Norwegian lingerie models. Will that make it true?

[oneofsix]

*Sighs* I don't think anyone with any expertise in the subject and who is not in the employment of an interested party (read that oil, right wing conservatives etc) has any doubt that the unexpected rise in temperature is cause by human activity, specifically dumping billions of tonnes of greenhouse gases into the atmosphere. Every new piece of research that comes out strengthens that argument and NOTHING credible has been produced to challenge it. Nothing. Zip. Not a sausage.




Oh? What research? A blog? I can find blogs that claim that Elvis is still alive, that space aliens regularly visit earth and that the world will end in 2012. If you're going to make claims like that use quality, independently verified research conducted by world leading experts. I might even put up a blog that says middle aged Triumph owners are sexually irresistable to women, especially 22 year old blonde Norwegian lingerie models. Will that make it true?

Primary greenhouse gases being carbon, you know the stuff life on earth is made from, and methane, exhaust and decomposition gases. Humans, even in the pro argument, only produce around 1% of these things. The rest comes from natural sources like trees dieing and then decomposing as opposed to being milled and turned into furniture and house or volcanoes.
Earths temp has always had its ups and down, Brittan has very cold in the stone age, then grew grapes in the Roman times and then had the Thames freezing over, I think this was around the industrial revolution but within modern history, and is now warming again.
Climate science is relatively new, and who do you think makes the most $$$ directly from it?? Not the oil industry, they know we will keep buying their stuff until they decided to provide an alternative. Guess who is paying for shit loads of research into alternatives they can sell when the wells run dry, BP and Shell even advertise this fact.

[schrodingers cat]

Human activity is certainly accelerating a natural cycle. The fear is that natural cycle may extinguish us as a species.

The problem as I see it is that there is the idea that humans can stop or even reverse this natural cycle. Rather arrogant I would have thought but politically easier to sell to the masses than a total change in societal behaviour - which ultimately IS required

Human behaviour isn't particulary co-operative. We are a hunter/gatherer by nature and only co-operate in small clans

Do humans deserve to survive as a species? In the big scheme the universe doesn't even care.

[shrub]

[QUOTE=oneofsix;1130022667] The rest comes from natural sources like trees dieing and then decomposing as opposed to being milled and turned into furniture and house or volcanoes. QUOTE]

interesting, I had no idea volcanoes were made out of trees.

Earths temp has always had its ups and down, Brittan has very cold in the stone age, then grew grapes in the Roman times and then had the Thames freezing over, I think this was around the industrial revolution but within modern history, and is now warming again.

The difference is that those periods of climate change can be explained by natural phenomena.

Climate science is relatively new, and who do you think makes the most $$$ directly from it?? Not the oil industry, they know we will keep buying their stuff until they decided to provide an alternative. Guess who is paying for shit loads of research into alternatives they can sell when the wells run dry, BP and Shell even advertise this fact

Actually climate science has been around for centuries and nobody makes money from it. In fact it actually costs a bloody fortune. And I guess if BP and Shell say something then we need to listen and agree, for they are our masters.

[shrub]

Human activity is certainly accelerating a natural cycle.

Without human activity we'd be in a cooling phase right now.