Synthetic fortified oil and older machines

[Grumph]

Ya can't go past the fortified banana skins IMO...

[Quasievil]

Ditto.
Actually Quasi you should find the fact sheet about synthetics and post it - to do with the base grade or something I recall. They are a bit like poos - all poos stink but there are different things in them that make them stink so if you want a really stinky poo you need to start with the high quality base product.

This one?
this is a basic way to view how and from what synthetics are made from, I could ramble about this for hours I already have somewhere here.

[Paul in NZ]

two things
1/ thats on the assumption that they actually have a synthetic oil (not a group III marketed as a synthetic)
2/ 15000kms is nothing, I change my Car 15000kms everytime on Mobil 1 5W-30

guess what, the engine is mint.

Meh! All our cars do big miles, we use good oil every 5k and oil and filter every 10k. It takes me less than 20 mins to change the oil and never had a problem. I still believed (based on observation) that in a vehicle that runs a cam chain or similar (camry balancer shaft) 15K is too long...

[Paul in NZ]

Ya can't go past the fortified banana skins IMO...

Agreed - bananas especially find them very useful.

[Quasievil]

Meh! All our cars do big miles, we use good oil every 5k and oil and filter every 10k. It takes me less than 20 mins to change the oil and never had a problem. I still believed (based on observation) that in a vehicle that runs a cam chain or similar (camry balancer shaft) 15K is too long...

yeah sure we all do big miles these days I agree.
The Fact is, that Synthetic oil does not break down as quickly as a Mineral based oil, the reason for this is the impurities present in a mineral oil help break the oil down very quickly, if compared to a synthetic.
The other point is that a synthetic protects the engine at start up better than a mineral based oil due to is better VI and typical additive package, the majority of engine wear occurs at this critical start up moment.
It surprises alot of people when I tell them that their isnt actually little people and molecules with happy faces having a cleaning party in their engines, the only layer between the surfaces in the engine is oil and thats all that will provide boundry lubrication, synthetics do this better, its not debatable its a true fact.
In saying all this we sell more mineral and semi synthetic products than anything of course, the only reason for this is price.

[STUFF]

hydrocracking base oil is volatile. it's crap.

Arguments on the quality of oil is good. But personally, I'm sure, the regulations on an oil change is not for nothing is targeted by the manufacturer. And the oil filter should be changed too! There were several cases from my practice, after the winter valve sticky into the oil filter. Replace the engine. Without the oil accelerate twice, in the neutral and 12 RPM ... for this engine is not needed more oil .... Even motul 300V ...)). Result of cheap oil and cheap filters.

[Paul in NZ]

yeah sure we all do big miles these days I agree.
The Fact is, that Synthetic oil does not break down as quickly as a Mineral based oil, the reason for this is the impurities present in a mineral oil help break the oil down very quickly, if compared to a synthetic.
The other point is that a synthetic protects the engine at start up better than a mineral based oil due to is better VI and typical additive package, the majority of engine wear occurs at this critical start up moment.
It surprises alot of people when I tell them that their isnt actually little people and molecules with happy faces having a cleaning party in their engines, the only layer between the surfaces in the engine is oil and thats all that will provide boundry lubrication, synthetics do this better, its not debatable its a true fact.
In saying all this we sell more mineral and semi synthetic products than anything of course, the only reason for this is price.

Oh yes - price is king... Never fails to amaze me why people purchase vehicles they have no hope of servicing properly.

Also agree with the service length being longer (although HOW long is a matter for debate).

The reason people used Castrol R in race bikes was that it lasted longer in hotter environments. Synth is similar...

[Quasievil]

Oh yes - price is king... Never fails to amaze me why people purchase vehicles they have no hope of servicing properly.

Also agree with the service length being longer (although HOW long is a matter for debate).

The reason people used Castrol R in race bikes was that it lasted longer in hotter environments. Synth is similar...

Yes it should also be noted here when talking about how long between oil changes that other factors are important to consider, for example, enviromental (dusty for example) as well as quality of fuel and frequency of servicing.

[roadracingoldfart]

YAAAAY KB Bollocks all round bro

im right tho

Ahhh nay sir , nay.
Try using a sy-pathetic oil in a 1980s Honda multi and wringing its neck at a track .
Ill supply the oil and you pay for the engine, lets have some fun.

[Grumph]

Ahhh nay sir , nay.
Try using a sy-pathetic oil in a 1980s Honda multi and wringing its neck at a track .
Ill supply the oil and you pay for the engine, lets have some fun.

Rather a special case there....I heard the pom works team only got them reliable by using castor base...
What do you think would go first, primary chain or big ends ?

[AllanB]

Ahhh nay sir , nay.
Try using a sy-pathetic oil in a 1980s Honda multi and wringing its neck at a track .
Ill supply the oil and you pay for the engine, lets have some fun.

The only issues early on with synthetics were some oil seals weaping. All seals are now designed to cope with synthetics. There was a legal thing about it in the USA and seals had to conform - can't remember from what year.

Other than the posibility of the above oil seal issue I can't not see a reason a synthetic oil would 'harm' your engine as you imply. Care to explain.

[Alecold]

No mention of additives has been made on this thread. I have a good stock of "Bardahl" oil and fuel additive and wonder if advisable to add to mineral oil. I realize Bardahl is a extreme friction substance and there may not be such conditions in a modern engine.

[Quasievil]

No mention of additives has been made on this thread. I have a good stock of "Bardahl" oil and fuel additive and wonder if advisable to add to mineral oil. I realize Bardahl is a extreme friction substance and there may not be such conditions in a modern engine.

the best thing to do with oil additives is to take them down to the local refuse centre for suitable dumping

Reputable oil companies have balanced the additive package through high level chemical engineering and testing if you then go and use a additive "to get the product right", ask yourself what do you think they forgot in the oils engineering ? t and what are you "putting" in your engine.....exactly, and if you do use a additive how are you ensuring the additive is going to keep the correct balance in the engineering of the oil?
I find it interesting that the Bardahl brand also sells oil additives, why?

[Flip]

No mention of additives has been made on this thread. I have a good stock of "Bardahl" oil and fuel additive and wonder if advisable to add to mineral oil. I realize Bardahl is a extreme friction substance and there may not be such conditions in a modern engine.

Hell keep friction modifiers or boundary lubricants far far away from motorcycle oils.

[F5 Dave]

No mention of additives has been made on this thread. . . .

Actually I mentioned Slick 50 a few pages back.

I realize Bardahl is a extreme friction substance and there may not be such conditions in a modern engine.

Or any engine. usually the tests they are so good at are totally inappropriate, but make it look like you should spend money on their product.

As I also said - & I'm not claiming to be an expert here, just outstandingly good at pointing out the blindingly obvious but large oil companies know what is in other manufacturers oils & all the snake oil additives out there. They aren't missing a trick that these additive companies have somehow stumbled upon.