Can we learn from all the bike fatalities?

[Blackbird]

I just think the police should make people fully aware of the reasons these accidents are happening.

As others have said, the major causes of motorcycle accidents are pretty well known and whilst you're clearly concerned, getting more detail probably isn't going to help you much at a personal level.

Have you taken any formal advanced roadcraft training in (say) the last 2 or 3 years? I'm not trying to be a smartarse or sounding like a cracked record but that's going to have a far bigger payoff for your personal safety than reading about accident causes.

[Berries]

but if this had have had a different ending... would the news have reported it as simply as "Motorcyclist loses control:...?

In a word, yes. And so would the crash report, although it would also say what contributed to that loss of control, like the mudguard.

The SCU reports can take several months to come out. I'm not sure what the status is of those reports but there are certainly some privacy issues that would need resolving. I don't see why someone cannot get hold of the summary/conclusion details though, they go way beyond the relatively simple TCR's. Would it help 'us' learn? I doubt it. There is rarely a single factor. It is usually a number of them that you'd normally get away with until they all combine at that critical moment. Shit happens, most of the time we get away with it, sometimes we don't.

[Motu]

you have been on here long enough to know the rules:

In my demise by motorcycle I want the case discussed in depth,and forbid RIP bullshit from those who haven't even met me.I want all facts,rumour and slander to be bandied about.The cause of my death will be entirely my own fault,and I own up to it now,but the how and why will need to be discussed - I hope there will be a lot to be learned.

My family never come to this site or even read or listen to news broadcasts - I doubt if faceless people on the internet slandering me will be of interest to them.

[James Deuce]

I know what I've learnt. That those who genuinely try to share their unpleasant experiences can expect to become objects of derision and scorn, subject to abuse from those they've never met and are never likely to.

You can also expect to become a pariah, unapproachable by the vast majority of those who once called themselves friend. In fact some friends can use your inability to socialise, drive, travel, concentrate for more than 10 minutes at a time that you're in fact unfit to be called friend.

Rather than congratulating you on getting your license back and being able to walk and relearning how to read and write, some "friends" just call you fat when they see you for the first time in a few years.

The most poignant lesson is that if you can't ride a bike due to physical and economic limitations you can expect to be largely ignored by the Kiwibiker "community".

There are always exceptions to be treasured, but they're generally people who don't stand on mountain tops waving their own flags. They just mow your lawn for you and ring to make sure you're OK. Thank goodness for those people.

[pete376403]

... it's easier for the news to villainies motor cyclists by not reporting on what actually happened.

The police will more often than not give a "...we suspect speed and alcohol were a factor" soundbite, so that gets accepted by the viewers as the cause, even if it wasn't. (and not just motorcyclists, this seems to be the standard for all crashes), except maybe this one http://tvnz.co.nz/national-news/offi...-crash-4130431

[Spearfish]

Pilots have to be type rated for the planes they fly, they know the basics but still get trained in the idiosyncrasies of the new type.

A 125 AUTO scooter will see you pass a 6f test to prove you fit and capable to ride a R1 or faster.... kewl aye?

[Urano]

Why cannot we do the same for motorcyclist.

why, cannot we? (and with this ends my today's punctuation lesson )

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2864802/MAID...ber%202004.pdf

maids report from my dropbox.
it's one of the sources i'm using to develop a little safety project which has been in my mind for a while...

There are those who will learn without being taught
There are those who are taught but will not learn

[...]

Should crash information be made available? yeah why not, it cant hurt
Will it change some peoples attitude?
Will it change the attitude of those that need to? Nah probably not

huge truths.

Most ain't 'accidents' for what it's worth.

right.
"impacts" is much more convenient...

Pilots have to be type rated for the planes they fly, they know the basics but still get trained in the idiosyncrasies of the new type.
A 125 AUTO scooter will see you pass a 6f test to prove you fit and capable to ride a R1 or faster.... kewl aye?

the issues about how to obtain a driving licenses are known and a major problem, at least here in italy.
but they overwhelm our single's possibilities...

[Nasty]

In my demise by motorcycle I want the case discussed in depth,and forbid RIP bullshit from those who haven't even met me.I want all facts,rumour and slander to be bandied about.The cause of my death will be entirely my own fault,and I own up to it now,but the how and why will need to be discussed - I hope there will be a lot to be learned.

My family never come to this site or even read or listen to news broadcasts - I doubt if faceless people on the internet slandering me will be of interest to them.

That is exactly the options that you haave choosen ... so I don't see the problem.

[YellowDog]

Perhaps he can publish his 'ride plan' ahead of each ride so as to aid the accuracy of our KB speculative post mortem.

Maybe a few notes about his mood might help too

[marty]

It is so sad to hear once again of a couple of biker deaths over the weekend. My sympathies go out to friends and families.
This got me thinking, we read of these accidents, but very rarely do we ever get told the reason for the accident.(just motorbike vs car etc etc)
So someone has died and know one has learned anything from it.
So its all likely to happen again, and again.

In the aircraft industry a full report is done into any air crash. Full details of everything, eventually, you can read these reports along with others to the betterment of all other aviators. ie Learn from their mistakes, sounds sad but its true.
Why cannot we do the same for motorcyclist.

I'm not into reading all the gory stuff , don't get me wrong I just think the police should make people fully aware of the reasons these accidents are happening.

The difference with investigating air crashes is that information about every part of the aeroplane, crew, training, maintenance, where parts came from, millions of $$$ of behind the scene compliance costs and licensing costs etc etc.

in an investigation, the historical nature of any and all of these things are taken into account.

it is the reason that a light aircraft engine starts at around $40000 to overhaul, and bits for planes are so expensive. It will never happen for the car industry - compliance costs are simply too high.

[Spearfish]

Perhaps he can publish his 'ride plan' ahead of each ride so as to aid the accuracy of our KB speculative post mortem.

Maybe a few notes about his mood might help too

You could be onto something there,
compulsory EPIRB or ELT to go with a high vis vest,
Log books should be filled in for hour based maintenance (WoF checks just don't go deep enough)
Min hours should have to be completed every month to keep your type rating.

I'll send the email with these recommendations off now....... we not only need a sarcastic smiley but an entering the realms of fantasy one as well, or is that the long on button?

[rocketman1]

What the fuck does it take for people to stop posting this shit upIn one post you have compared motorcyclists and accidents/air crashes/police should make people "aware of the reasons for these accidents". Your a cock,.if indeed you have a motorcycle step away from it.

What a f-----d up attitude to life you have.
Try getting out the right side of the bed for once Cock

[Nasty]

It is so sad to hear once again of a couple of biker deaths over the weekend. My sympathies go out to friends and families.
This got me thinking, we read of these accidents, but very rarely do we ever get told the reason for the accident.(just motorbike vs car etc etc)
So someone has died and know one has learned anything from it.
So its all likely to happen again, and again.

In the aircraft industry a full report is done into any air crash. Full details of everything, eventually, you can read these reports along with others to the betterment of all other aviators. ie Learn from their mistakes, sounds sad but its true.
Why cannot we do the same for motorcyclist.

I'm not into reading all the gory stuff , don't get me wrong I just think the police should make people fully aware of the reasons these accidents are happening.

I am pretty sure that you can get coroners reports ... that is the sort of thing that happens in NZ with deaths in accidents etc ... bloody hard reading ...