Rodney Hide resigns

[trustme]

I reckon the worst thing about that period was interest running at 18-23% which fostered a high risk, short-term investment mentality leading people to squander their life savings when the share market went *poof* overnight in '87. The interest rates stayed the same but people lost everything and were then stuck with rapidly increasing mortgage repayments.

It's summed up in one word ' GREED '
The greedy got caught by the share crash , nobody they can blame but themselves.

At that time I had a young family & a mortgage , wife did not work, I would have liked to have a spare dollar to invest any where. My investment of choice would have been to reduce my mortgage.

[Berries]

wife did not work

Me too. Want to swap ?

[BoristheBiter]

Option 3: Pool your cumulative resources so that everyone "wins" (i know, too hard box)

Option 4. stop welfare payments savings 2.4 billion.

[trustme]

I reckon the worst thing about that period was interest running at 18-23% which fostered a high risk, short-term investment mentality leading people to squander their life savings when the share market went *poof* overnight in '87. The interest rates stayed the same but people lost everything and were then stuck with rapidly increasing mortgage repayments.

If asked my opinion of the 2 worst things from that era

1/ The manner in which the SOE's were sold, the tax payer certainly did not get the true value of the assets sold. The Govt Printing Office was virtually given away. Telecom had invested big time to update, it was sold before the benefits of that investment came on stream, we funded the upgrade & the buyer profited, not us.Fay Richwhite did us no favours.
2/ Our manufacturing industry was decimated & remains a shell of what it once was. Our manufacturing was based around an extremely protected environment due to import licensing & other govt controls. Deregulation meant that manufacturers who had not invested in technology , who were not efficient found it impossible to compete in an open market & many are no longer around.When they went jobs went. Unfortunately nothing has replaced them we are far too dependant on the primary sector.
We need to invest in high tech low volume manufacturing that attracts a premium price, we need lots more of these guys
Alloy yachts, Scott Technology, Glidepath, Buckley Systems,. There are plenty more out there but nowhere near enough.

[scott411]

That's the point and stop pointing the commy finger unless that's as far as your imagination is willing take you . It has never been tried before (not in the current western context anyway)... Calling it a Resource Based Economy is about the only safe haven for labelling purposes. Communism/Socialism/Collectivism/GoFuckYourselfism it is not.

So far every economic strategy has failed. Every single one. This has been proven time and time again, a millenia or 2/3/4/5 of gradually getting worse... and it isn't getting any better is it? and it doesn't look like it ever get better using the current systems does it? It isn't just the last term, or 2 terms, or 3 terms etc... that's to blame, but in NZ, pretty much since the West took over NZ from the Maori. Oddly enough a peaceful people who have had their way of life shattered in the pursuit of land, power, resources and money. No more, no less.

Yet society persists with these systems because they work? or can't think of anything better? Or do some just like it this way? Either way, I think they're all fucked in the head, in fact way beyond being fucked in the head.

What do YOU want for NZ? because the current/previous systems bring you escalating crime, massive overpopulation, societal divides, environmental devistation and turns people against each other for no real reason other than some smart cunt knows what button to push... not to mention it brings the obliteration of true innovation.

So when I say pooling resources. I mean the lot. Everything everyone living in NZ has. But it's unthinkable that someone else can have a share of what I currently have . That's the only thing stopping NZ. The politics of getting things done are just a pretty side-show for voters these days... and the flashing lights really aren't that bright any more.

Irony... Adults spending years teaching children the virtues of respect and sharing

Option 3 is filed, as best as I can tell, under Resource Based Economy.

has this ever worked anywhere before?? i think basic human greed would kill this, the way it has killed everything else, we the human race tend to think of ourselves way to much, and want shiny new things that our neighbour does not have

[phill-k]

NZ Post and Telegraph: took 6 weeks to get a new phone connection. Telecom - same day connect.

Agree but that was the same the world over, the profits Telecom have exported overseas to their owners since have been way in excess of what was originally paid for it, advances in technology would have come to telecom regardless of who owned it. Today we face a bill of some $2billion dollars to upgrade our broadband, if we still owned Telecom it would be funded by them - fail

NZ Rail - people earning $20k paid tax so a track guy could earn $40k. Ditto for the coal mines, although they weren't sold.

Sold off to Toll who ran it into the ground after stripping profit and assets from it, as a low populous country with many km's of roads to fund and support, subsidising the railways would have kept the need for the heavy truck fleet we now have who monopolise and damage our roads but who are subsidised by other users to maintain them - fail

One stark fact: after the 1984 election the $NZ fell 20% overnight on foreign markets when our financial position became clear. It bottomed at US$0.39.

Today NZ is regarded as a safe, stable economy and the exchange rate is US$0.80.

agree thankfully we saw the light and got rid of the likes of Douglus, have a look at the on line polls about Brash, overwhelmingly he is not wanted but because we have MMP we will be stuck with him. His latest demand is that he be finance minister in the next government tail wagging and all that. On his tombstone will be I failed at politics not once not twice but three times, I hope Key if he is returned has the Balls to not allow that, in fact I would like Key to come out now and state just exactly what role he will give Brash in any new government, that will certainly influence my vote and I'd guess many others.

............

[The Everlasting]

For some reason I just cannot stand Don brash,he just pisses me off.

I prefer Rodney Hide,even though he didn't have the support anymore.

[sinned]

I reckon the worst thing about that period was interest running at 18-23% which fostered a high risk, short-term investment mentality leading people to squander their life savings when the share market went *poof* overnight in '87. The interest rates stayed the same but people lost everything and were then stuck with rapidly increasing mortgage repayments.

I had one of those mortgages and little money to invest. I worked with people who borrowed to invest in the share market - some got out in time some didn't.

If you have the time to read opinion that is more in-depth than on KB start with this one: http://asianinvasion2006.blogspot.co...ct-sequel.html

[trustme]

Phill. You have to remember we had exhausted our lines of credit we were on the verge of defaulting on our financial obligations.

If I was about to default on my mortgage , if my overdraft was maxxed out & I had no where left to go I would be selling my bike, my boat [ dont have one ] my bach [ sold to get rid of debt ] the wifes car. I would do what ever I had to to avoid the bank selling my house. The Lange govt were in that position, it would have been nice to keep the family silver but no one has every come up with a credible, sensible, viable alternative to what happened
We are probably in total agreement that they were undersold
Then we buy rail back & pay an absolute premium

[oneofsix]

Phill. You have to remember we had exhausted our lines of credit we were on the verge of defaulting on our financial obligations.

If I was about to default on my mortgage , if my overdraft was maxxed out & I had no where left to go I would be selling my bike, my boat [ dont have one ] my bach [ sold to get rid of debt ] the wifes car. I would do what ever I had to to avoid the bank selling my house. The Lange govt were in that position, it would have been nice to keep the family silver but no one has every come up with a credible, sensible, viable alternative to what happened
We are probably in total agreement that they were undersold
Then we buy rail back & pay an absolute premium

By that logic then a builder would sell his tools and vehicle to pay his debts

[trustme]

By that logic then a builder would sell his tools and vehicle to pay his debts

Absolute garbage.
It will be the bank who sells the builders tools & vehicle when he defaults on his debts. That is the thing you have to avoid at all costs because you no longer control your destiny.

[oneofsix]

Absolute garbage.
It will be the bank who sells the builders tools & vehicle when he defaults on his debts. That is the thing you have to avoid at all costs because you no longer control your destiny.

Are you saying then that the builder wont sell his tools? If you can't make money then the bank will foreclose but you don't sell off that which is making you money. You sell your loss makers. Our pollies let the OCED and business round table etc lead them around by the nose hence why traitors like Faye and Ritchway do so will out of them.
Of course the other way the business similarly fails apart is that Govt. isn't business. Like the NZPO used to make a loss on postal but when separate it was turned in to a profit maker, now a lot of people take credit for fat trimming and redirection and ignore what was also lost was a training and apprenticeship system and an employment scheme (a hiden work for the dole if you like)

[mashman]

Lovely, utopia, lets all have a cocoa & a group hug. The real world is full of people all of whom have differing wants, needs & ambitions. The human race does not do sharing, never has, never will. We are what we are, we are not about to change, there will always be leaders & followers, people who acquire & those who don't, people who aquiesse to the common good & those who protect their own interests .
The brotherhood of the human race is a crock, the Maori were a peaceful people , let me canvas a few maoiori for their opinion, or maybe a few of the slaves captured by raiding parties
Cheap shot I guess, I think your proposal is nice but naive.

I'd prefer a beer and an orgy , and you're right to a point. But I think you're wrong about the human race.

The real world is full of people that haven't been offered a viable, yes viable, alternative. They have to make do within the confines of the current systems in place. I've lived in the real world for 40 years and for all of the posturing I have yet to see a party tackle any of the main issues. Issues that have been around since the day of man. So I can see why you, and others would say that man can't change, but I think you're wrong . Change the systems and you'll have a drastically different place to live, love, work etc... and the human race does, and always has done sharing... importing and exporting etc... when there are disasters, people from around the globe flock to help. We share ideas constantly. Why would we do these things if the human race was not a brotherhood? You sell the human race short by a huge margin... It's a debate that will never happen whilst people decry the possibility and whilst people believe that others are only capable of being self serving. It's naive to think that human beings are incapable of change for the benefit of their country. After all, isn't that the basic tennet of Politics? For the benefit of the country?

Obviously the Maoiori didn't want to share and would defend with menances (who can blame them). The Maori did share and look at the state of the place. That says to me that the Maori weren't weak, but were inherently peaceful. But I don't know my history and my naivety knows no bounds.

Why do politicians fuck with the taxation system? What was Roger and his nomics trying to achieve? I'm sorry. Everything that I have said has been attempted using drastically outdated systems and we see what that has produced, yet refuse to think of a way of doing things to actually make things "better". The politicians aren't making ANYTHING "better".

has this ever worked anywhere before?? i think basic human greed would kill this, the way it has killed everything else, we the human race tend to think of ourselves way to much, and want shiny new things that our neighbour does not have

I'm sure it's still practiced by some rain forest dwelling civilisations, and it must be working as they've been living for millenia... but to my knowledge it hasn't been tried by a "civilised" western culture. We are inherently greedy, BULLSHIT. We're anything but. Yes we can be, but it's not our overriding characteristic.

If your community can grow enough food to feed the community, do you take more than you need, greed, knowing that it means that someone else is going to starve? Why?

Look there is no denying the FACTS that there are bigger issues in New Zealand than Hide living up to his name and Brash living up to his . There are ways to solve pretty much 90% of those issues. But that's your choice. Would you rather have a more secure society, or allow the personal gain game destroy the country? You can educate your population either way ... shame we do it the wrong way.

And before anyone tries to throw the real world at me again. The real world are trying to do EXACTLY the same thing, but they're using a set of systems that is doomed to fail and has been proven to fail. Do you want to change it or not? Your choice does not affect just you, but everyone... like it or not, that is a FACT.

[oneofsix]

I'd prefer a beer and an orgy , and you're right to a point. But I think you're wrong about the human race.

+1

Obviously the Maoiori didn't want to share and would defend with menances (who can blame them). The Maori did share and look at the state of the place. That says to me that the Maori weren't weak, but were inherently peaceful. But I don't know my history and my naivety knows no bounds.

I thought this was more the other way round, the Maoiori bing peaceful and sharing and the Maori being the more aggressive invaders. But now rumour has it they are all one peoples, just different tribes.

Why do politicians fuck with the taxation system? What was Roger and his nomics trying to achieve? I'm sorry. Everything that I have said has been attempted using drastically outdated systems and we see what that has produced, yet refuse to think of a way of doing things to actually make things "better". The politicians aren't making ANYTHING "better".

He was trying to reinvent the trickle down system. I say reinvent because in basics it goes back to the old feudal system and this iswhat I think all pollies and power brokers are trying to enforce because it gives the best control over the population


The reason we are sold the "humans are basically greedy" line is because it supports the capitalist system. It is not true. Recently there was an experiment in Welly where they opened a free shop, people went in intending to take whatever they could but came out with just what they required, abit like the Hamiltonians paying for their goods at the PnS whilst the self checkout worked and even coming back and paying the next days when the store was meant to be open.

[Okey Dokey]

Never mind about NZ Rail and the phone system.

I regret the subsequent loss of the manufacturer Crown Lynn. Great stuff, that

Built to last, but couldn't compete on a "level" playing field with imported china. Sadly missed.