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[Winston001]

If the internet voting was non-binding that would overcome the danger of special interest groups dominating an issue.

Parliamentary referenda are already non-binding for good reason, but they do serve a purpose in letting the politicians know what people are bothered about.

[Hitcher]

Parliamentary referenda are already non-binding for good reason, but they do serve a purpose in letting the politicians know what people are bothered about.

Politicians only allow referendums if they can dictate the outcome. Remember the smacking referendum? Who the fuck wrote that question?

[Winston001]

Remember the smacking referendum? Who the fuck wrote that question?

Yeaahhh. Bit of a giveaway about the organisers.

[Marmoot]

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[xen]

Cool idea man, I had a similar one awhile ago, but has been said, it would need massive support to go anywhere.

I was thinking of having a blank slate and asking what would we like in a political-economic system if we started from scratch. Build it with a solid foundation like the USA's republic with a constituation & bill of rights, but also taking into account our human traits such as self interest & greed - we are corruptable lets make the system not able to be.

Non-binding referendums, don't think politicans would give it any value, wasn't about 80% of the country against GST when it was first bought in? Might work to show how out of touch they are with the public though, if they kept voting against what the new system's voters were proposing.

[-df-]

I've been contemplating something like this for a long time now ( http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/sh...olitical-party... ) but never found time to go any further with it.

Let me know if you are serious about something like this, I'd be very interested in it.

[Big Dave]

All the OP is describing now is an opinion poll. TV stations and newspapers already run them.

[Winston001]

True Dave, as far as it goes. But newspaper and television polls are not conducted on well-considered questions. They tend to be far more of the vox pop variety, asking for knee-jerk reactions to simplistic issues.

[Big Dave]

True Dave, as far as it goes. But newspaper and television polls are not conducted on well-considered questions. They tend to be far more of the vox pop variety, asking for knee-jerk reactions to simplistic issues.

True too - but that's also how Politics works - all sizzle - no sausage.

[Spyke]

Why did i start this thread? To see if their were people not happy with how we get a say in what is happening, as one person we get one vote if we want to make a difference. We have to basically change our whole career to go into politics to get anywhere then you will get pumped full of so much paper work you wonder if it will be all worth it?

Most people don't want a lifestyle like that so if all the ants work together so to speak, our voices can be heard by the queen key. if said queen doesn't like what he hears the ants kick out the queen and elect a new one.

I personally believe nz needs a kick up the butt, we have over 4 million people and so few actually get their voices heard. At this point in time in my life I get to vote in the elections and make submissions that most likely won't be heard.
I'm all for making a system where instead of 1000 people getting polled for the view of the nation we have the nation connected and the whole nation has the chance to put their hand up for all decisions. If it gets to a point where this can happen most people won't abuse the system as it will benefit them. why snap the wooden spoon you get fed with?

I wouldn't mind seeing whether the country agrees with off shore oil/ gas drilling, solar/wind power, more cycle ways, work and income, retirement age, what the average working week should be, minimum wages, whether the govt is doing its best with social infustructure and the list goes on. We could revolusionise nz by letting the majority speak as we know what we want.

Compromises can be made by giant surveys that actually mean something. the govt can't turn a blind eye to even half the population voting on a subject.

I bet you could even have a cellphone app that lets you vote on the move.

I don't have the money to fund this but i can sure try drum up support, give ideas and give our nation hope that we can become a better country!

How can the govt refuse an idea like this? turn a blind eye? get enough support and nz could make a holiday that isn't on the map. NZ freedom day then they may listen. I'd sugest doing something with friends or family on a day like this.

[slowpoke]

Why did i start this thread? To see if their were people not happy with how we get a say in what is happening, as one person we get one vote if we want to make a difference. We have to basically change our whole career to go into politics to get anywhere then you will get pumped full of so much paper work you wonder if it will be all worth it?

Most people don't want a lifestyle like that so if all the ants work together so to speak, our voices can be heard by the queen key. if said queen doesn't like what he hears the ants kick out the queen and elect a new one.

I personally believe nz needs a kick up the butt, we have over 4 million people and so few actually get their voices heard. At this point in time in my life I get to vote in the elections and make submissions that most likely won't be heard.
I'm all for making a system where instead of 1000 people getting polled for the view of the nation we have the nation connected and the whole nation has the chance to put their hand up for all decisions. If it gets to a point where this can happen most people won't abuse the system as it will benefit them. why snap the wooden spoon you get fed with?

I wouldn't mind seeing whether the country agrees with off shore oil/ gas drilling, solar/wind power, more cycle ways, work and income, retirement age, what the average working week should be, minimum wages, whether the govt is doing its best with social infustructure and the list goes on. We could revolusionise nz by letting the majority speak as we know what we want.

Compromises can be made by giant surveys that actually mean something. the govt can't turn a blind eye to even half the population voting on a subject.

I bet you could even have a cellphone app that lets you vote on the move.

I don't have the money to fund this but i can sure try drum up support, give ideas and give our nation hope that we can become a better country!

How can the govt refuse an idea like this? turn a blind eye? get enough support and nz could make a holiday that isn't on the map. NZ freedom day then they may listen. I'd sugest doing something with friends or family on a day like this.

So what you are actually saying is that you are tired (after how many elections exactly?) of nobody doing what you want to do. What's to say this will change under your "everybody works less, gets paid more, imports everything, gimme more facilites without paying for it" utopian society?

For the record:
Yes to oil/gas/mineral exporation everywhere including National Parks. If we're gonna use it we should be prepared to produce it. Set stringent standards and lead the way in clean oil/gas/mineral recovery, the tech can then be exported around the world.
No to cycleways unless cyclists are prepared to pay for them. ACC levies should be applied to cyclists.
I'm currently in the middle of 28 straight 12 hour nightshifts. 9-5 5 days a weeks sounds pretty damn good right about now.
No idea what "social infrastructure" is..........pub's? You want the government to build pub's? WTF?
Minimum wage I'm not sure about: more people off the dole but working for less, or equal minimum standard for all. Convince me.......
Solar power should be encouraged, but wind power is fucking over some small communites and needs to be handled better.
Retirement age? The way I piss my missus off I doubt I'll live that long....combined with the fact I'm worth more dead than alive, the odds aren't good.

So all in all pretty much what you're happy to go along with? Good, glad we got that sorted.

[Spyke]

So what you are actually saying is that you are tired (after how many elections exactly?) of nobody doing what you want to do. What's to say this will change under your "everybody works less, gets paid more, imports everything, gimme more facilites without paying for it" utopian society?

For the record:
Yes to oil/gas/mineral exporation everywhere including National Parks. If we're gonna use it we should be prepared to produce it. Set stringent standards and lead the way in clean oil/gas/mineral recovery, the tech can then be exported around the world.
No to cycleways unless cyclists are prepared to pay for them. ACC levies should be applied to cyclists.
I'm currently in the middle of 28 straight 12 hour nightshifts. 9-5 5 days a weeks sounds pretty damn good right about now.
No idea what "social infrastructure" is..........pub's? You want the government to build pub's? WTF?
Minimum wage I'm not sure about: more people off the dole but working for less, or equal minimum standard for all. Convince me.......
Solar power should be encouraged, but wind power is fucking over some small communites and needs to be handled better.
Retirement age? The way I piss my missus off I doubt I'll live that long....combined with the fact I'm worth more dead than alive, the odds aren't good.

So all in all pretty much what you're happy to go along with? Good, glad we got that sorted.

i'm happy to go along with what ever new zealand decides is right, I have strong beliefs and i think that is fine to have. If this idea ever takes off I wouldn't want to be the one to ask the questions as i am not qualified to make those decisions. All i want to do is give more people as a whole, more opportunity to make a decision for the country. if people don't like that it won't go anywhere as it is only an idea.

thank you for sharing your views on my post, that is why i wrote it cruedly so if people wanted to add they could.
I don't want a utopia, i want a place that people can live more and work less. money spent more wisely in places that everyone wants. money spent where it is needed? money isn't everything but using it wisely helps. education not qualification?

No one in this world is worth more dead than alive, everyone can turn their lives around even if they are convicted criminals (if they change their ways some take longer than others).

social infastructure like more youth centres where teens can get off the streets and have a place that is safe and a friendly environment. more community centres where people can do night courses and programes that get more people invovled in the community?

the pub, drinking isn't the end of the world is it? life don't revolve around it. Well my experience is it degrades life as it is easy to over indulge, but being a responsible drinker and going to the pub with a few mates or family is nice.

[Woodman]

Have you ever watched parliament TV?? The amount of reading of submissions and all that kind of shit just to get a law passed is phenomonal. It seems every decision is drilled right down to its core and any objections are worked through/debated etc before any votes are cast.
Admittedly I don't fully understand how it all works, but can you imagine every NZer reading the fine print and becoming fully informed before they vote?? Not on your life would that happen. Some would of course and would object or ask for more info or get on a soapbox and have the whole decision looked into again for a vote later on. These people would form lobby groups and would affiliate themselves with certain ways of thinking and try to influence others to think like they do so the individual voters just have to log on and vote like their favourite lobby group. Pretty much what we have now.

The rest would watch campbell live and moan like fuck about non-issues and not vote at all.

[Big Dave]

"Some modern representative democracies very heavily rely upon forms of political action that are directly democratic. Examples include Switzerland and some U.S. states, where frequent use is made of referendums and initiatives. Although managed by a representative legislative body, Switzerland allows for initiatives and referendums at both the local and federal levels. In the past 120 years more than 240 initiatives have been put to referendum. The populace has been conservative, approving only about 10% of the initiatives put before them; in addition, they have often opted for a version of the initiative rewritten by government" - Wiki.

Remember that almost 50% of the population are below Mr J Average.