Benefits

[Banditbandit]

At the end of February 2011, there were 64,308 people throughout New Zealand on unemployment-related benefits.
The majority (70%) were male.
By ethnicity, 36% were Māori and 10% were Pacific peoples.
By age group, 32% were youth aged 18-24 years.
In the three months to March 2011, 41% of people granted an unemployment benefit had either not been recently employed or had never worked.
In the three months to March 2011, only 4% of people granted an unemployment benefit listed their previous occupation as professional or technical workers

SO .. In realty it's men .. Men are the dole bludgers !!!! 70% of the unemployed dole bludgers are Men !!!

Put the lazy bastards on an island somewhere and let them starve ... !!!!

[imdying]

SO .. In realty it's men .. Men are the dole bludgers !!!! 70% of the unemployed dole bludgers are Men !!!

Indeed. However I suspect those figures would even out if men had a coochie they could pop a DPB payment out of.

[Banditbandit]

Indeed. However I suspect those figures would even out if men had a coochie they could pop a DPB payment out of.

You're a man .. how can I take anything you say seriously ???? Just another lazy bludger ...

(Oh, wait .. when I look down ...)

[jonbuoy]

Why blame the "money" system? Back before we had money if you sat on your arse, didn´t get up hunt/grow make shelter you wouldn´t last too long. If you spent all day hunting and gathering for yourself/tribe do you think you would feed the guy that sat under a tree picking his teeth all day because he didn´t feel like doing anything himself day after day week after week?

[racefactory]

Why blame the "money" system? Back before we had money if you sat on your arse, didn´t get up hunt/grow make shelter you wouldn´t last too long. If you spent all day hunting and gathering for yourself/tribe do you think you would feed the guy that sat under a tree picking his teeth all day because he didn´t feel like doing anything himself day after day week after week?

You miss the point. It's because the monetary system is one of fractional reserve banking, where like a child’s game of musical chairs- as long as the music is playing, there are no losers. This is what is actually being blamed. Money is just a very useful means of exchange.

[mashman]

Why blame the "money" system? Back before we had money if you sat on your arse, didn´t get up hunt/grow make shelter you wouldn´t last too long. If you spent all day hunting and gathering for yourself/tribe do you think you would feed the guy that sat under a tree picking his teeth all day because he didn´t feel like doing anything himself day after day week after week?

pics or it never happened.

I get what you mean though (hopefully), and you're right. But we learned how to feed many off of the labor of a few, so I would have thought somewhere along the lines there were people picking their teeth under trees... praps they took turns before someone started to charge for their services...

[jonbuoy]

You miss the point. It's because the monetary system is one of fractional reserve banking, where like a child’s game of musical chairs- as long as the music is playing, there are no losers. This is what is actually being blamed. Money is just a very useful means of exchange.

Can you explain a little more? How is this relevant to some people not pulling their weight but expecting to be looked after? I can see the musical chairs scenario for the debt crisis and banking system some countries are in but trading services for tokens (or money) is something different.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Money

[jonbuoy]

pics or it never happened.

I get what you mean though (hopefully), and you're right. But we learned how to feed many off of the labor of a few, so I would have thought somewhere along the lines there were people picking their teeth under trees... praps they took turns before someone started to charge for their services...

People who managed to get an excess of whatever they were growing/collecting/harvesting would have swapped/bartered with others before "charging" for services. Charging only came after people decided it was easier to use money instead of swapping/bartering numerous times to get what they actually wanted. A doctor gets more "tokens" to buy things than a labourer because his services are rarer and more valuable, just the same as a cow is worth more than a chicken or a bag of rice.

People survived harsh winters in the Northern Hemisphere by stockpiling/preserving and storing in the summer. If you didn´t work you died.

[mashman]

People who managed to get an excess of whatever they were growing/collecting/harvesting would have swapped/bartered with others before "charging" for services. Charging only came after people decided it was easier to use money instead of swapping/bartering numerous times to get what they actually wanted. A doctor gets more "tokens" to buy things than a labourer because his services are rarer and more valuable, just the same as a cow is worth more than a chicken or a bag of rice.

People survived harsh winters in the Northern Hemisphere by stockpiling/preserving and storing in the summer. If you didn´t work you died.

True. Although you only need a doctor when you need one, same as a labourer I guess. Why they're paid differently is beyond me. Tis a shame some smart arse decided that their cow was more valuable than a chicken.

If you didn't work or hunt etc..., then you probably stole or scavenged to keep the reaper from the door, so I doubt that people died because they didn't work... and I also doubt that people where uncaring enough to allow people to just die, especially if they had surplus... unlike today where we have surplus and would rather it rot than give it away to those who might need it.

Time to move on I reckon. We have everything that we need other than the will to change how the system works. I often wonder how many great minds are lost because they choose what is seen as the lazy way to live.

[Oscar]

True. Although you only need a doctor when you need one, same as a labourer I guess. Why they're paid differently is beyond me. Tis a shame some smart arse decided that their cow was more valuable than a chicken.

That's some interesting "logic" there, sport.

If a labourer had to spend 10 years training, he'd get the same as a Doctor.

The reason a cow is more valuable than a chicken is 'cause a cow is a little bit bigger than a chicken and costs more to feed (and when I say costs more, that includes the physical effort involved).

Having said that, I have a chicken here that I'd like to swap for a cow - could you facilitate that for me?

[mashman]

That's some interesting "logic" there, sport.

If a labourer had to spend 10 years training, he'd get the same as a Doctor.

The reason a cow is more valuable than a chicken is 'cause a cow is a little bit bigger than a chicken and costs more to feed (and when I say costs more, that includes the physical effort involved).

Having said that, I have a chicken here that I'd like to swap for a cow - could you facilitate that for me?

I know, sense prevails in some small dark corners

Oh I see, it's the time it takes to train that makes them more valuable. In my profession I have to constantly upskill, yet I don't get paid as well as a doctor... yup, your logic is much bettererer.

... good god it's lucky that there have always been human beings around to look after cows, they'd have never been able to breed, feed or anything.

Sure, I just need your address and I'll package up the wife for ya.

[Oscar]

I know, sense prevails in some small dark corners

Oh I see, it's the time it takes to train that makes them more valuable. In my profession I have to constantly upskill, yet I don't get paid as well as a doctor... yup, your logic is much bettererer.

... good god it's lucky that there have always been human beings around to look after cows, they'd have never been able to breed, feed or anything.

Sure, I just need your address and I'll package up the wife for ya.

Of course there is a certain amount of choice invovled (my wife trained as long as a Dentist, but get's two thirds the income), but why would a labourer get paid (in money, economic credits or bales of hay) as much as a Doctor?

Your Cow/Chicken analogy is wandering also.‎ Even in the wild, you get a whole lot more benefit from catching a cow than a chicken, and the effort involved is different. So, I repeat, why would you value a chicken the same as a cow?

[mashman]

Of course there is a certain amount of choice invovled (my wife trained as long as a Dentist, but get's two thirds the income), but why would a labourer get paid (in money, economic credits or bales of hay) as much as a Doctor?

Your Cow/Chicken analogy is wandering also.‎ Even in the wild, you get a whole lot more benefit from catching a cow than a chicken, and the effort involved is different. So, I repeat, why would you value a chicken the same as a cow?

The labourer should get paid the same as the Doctor, because the Doctor isn't a labourer. They both do 1 job... you can't have 1 without the other. The Doctor cannot train if the University, Doctors House, Local Infrastructure etc... hasn't been built by the labourer. Why pay them differently?

Ahhh of course, I should have seen it a mile off. I forgot that you prefer to play the short game. In the short term the chicken will only give me eggs and the cow will give me milk (I can make cheese, butter etc... if I can be arsed). So they can both feed me in the short term. Over the longer term, the cow will give me 1 calf per year. The chicken could give me 100+ chickens per year. I may well get bird flu, but you'll always be a mad cow. I'll keep my chickens as they'd be more valuable.

[Oscar]

The labourer should get paid the same as the Doctor, because the Doctor isn't a labourer. They both do 1 job... you can't have 1 without the other. The Doctor cannot train if the University, Doctors House, Local Infrastructure etc... hasn't been built by the labourer. Why pay them differently?

Ahhh of course, I should have seen it a mile off. I forgot that you prefer to play the short game. In the short term the chicken will only give me eggs and the cow will give me milk (I can make cheese, butter etc... if I can be arsed). So they can both feed me in the short term. Over the longer term, the cow will give me 1 calf per year. The chicken could give me 100+ chickens per year. I may well get bird flu, but you'll always be a mad cow. I'll keep my chickens as they'd be more valuable.

So if the Labourer gets paid the same as the Doctor, why would I bother taking ten years to learn medicine? And being as how you have to be fairly smart to be a Doctor, there's always going to be a shitload more labourers around, and scarcity means value otherwise we'd all be giving our girls engagement rings with coal instead of diamonds..

The short game?
What's the average life span of a chicken?
And a hundred chicks a year? Your Rooster will be dead inside six months.

Besides, you said "a chicken", and I don't care what wacko economic system you're in, one cow will always be worth more than one chicken.

[Banditbandit]

So ...from the Government's own website ...

http://www.parliament.nz/NR/rdonlyre...3Benefits1.pdf

Benefit payouts go to people in this percentage

Superannuation 52.3%
DPB 16.1%
Unemployment 16.2%
Invalids 6.6%
Sickness 4.0%
Others 4.7%

So .. it's not the Unemployed or the Solo Parents .. it's the superannuatents - they cost us 52.3% of our Social Welfare payouts ... more than half our welfare support goes to Old People ... they suck out more than the unemployed and the solo parents combined .. in fact all other benfits combined ...

So all you Bastards STOP GETTING OLD !!!