How to get junior road racers noticed for MotoGP?

[gav]

Posted this as a reply in another thread, but thought it might be worth a seperate thread to see what people think.

OK, was giving this some thought today. I'm not sure that the Red Bull Rookie is necessarily the best route to take, esp for a kiwi. I wonder if a young Valentino, Marco Sic, Ben Spies or even Kevin Schwantz would make the final selection from the criteria that they are looking for eg another Dani Pedrosa (the smaller the better).
I think the new Moto3 class should be where a Team NZ/Kiwi should be aimed at.
Certainly the first year with NSF250R and maybe a home brewed chassis should be worth exploring. NZ supposedly leads the world in carbon fibre if you listen to some of the yachting waffle. BSL racing tried 500GP and effectively got burned with the change in rules to unleaded fuel. How about a BSL framed Moto 3 bike? Support from the motorcycle community but also how about tapping some of the money that was being spent on Team NZ in the A1GP series? With contacts at all levels of MotoGP such as Peter Clifford, Mike Webb, Simon Crafer, Graham Crosby, Bob Toomey, Shaun Harris etc just to name a few, surely a NZ team could be run on the cheap for Moto3? Even if it just meant running in the Spanish champs and as many Euro GP's as you could get an entry too. Moto2 with level engines, again could be a class that Team NZ could try and run in. Even if it wasnt aimed just for one rider, so that riders like Jake Lewis, Avalon Biddle, the Hoogie boys, Cam Jones, Seth Deveruax, Jaden Hassen etc could be given a taste of racing in Europe even if its just for a race or two? Also the support mechanics etc maybe able to get experience to get noticed by some of the bigger teams and hence get a career or a foot in the door?
I'm sure a team could be run at a fraction of the cost that the America Cup yachties cost to run?
Oh well, it sure would be cool to see an all black bike with a large silver fern racing in GP's huh?

[steveyb]

I have two words:

PureBlack Racing

The model exists.

[Bender]

Cheaply run grand prix team? What do you cut from the budget to get to a fraction of the cost?

The thinking is wrong. You have to start with budget and lots of it or you'll always be chasing money and work-arounds to cobble things together.

Look at Grant Dalton's model for Team NZ. Nothing cheap about it, not a budget operation. It competes as one of the top teams internationally and is always on the podium, more often on the top step. In 2003, when Alinghi defeated NZ to take the America's Cup, we saw a New Zealand team kneecapped by lack of budget. The boat nearly sank and then it broke. Game over.

I'd start by talking to him about how to raise sponsorship - he's a keen motor racer as well and has competed in a Nissan and a TVR (not sure if he still is, but he certainly was).

[CHOPPA]

We could start by raising $60k for me to compete in the Spanish CEV for a bit of research and development........

Seriously though there is already a kiwi running a team in the CEV that is offering Moto 3 rides. 100k would cover everything

[gixerracer]

We could start by raising $60k for me to compete in the Spanish CEV for a bit of research and development........

Seriously though there is already a kiwi running a team in the CEV that is offering Moto 3 rides. 100k would cover everything

Yea but who is it? Most second riders get stitched up in these rides. Number 1 rider gewts all the good stuff and poor old number 2 comes along paying for his ride and gets what ever is left under the bench in the corner.
To get a ride for that money 60k kiwi? seems very very cheap tell them 80k and we will both go lol

[jellywrestler]

tell them 80k and we will both go lol

Who will be the chicken and who will be the rooster then eh?

[CHOPPA]

Yea but who is it? Most second riders get stitched up in these rides. Number 1 rider gewts all the good stuff and poor old number 2 comes along paying for his ride and gets what ever is left under the bench in the corner.
To get a ride for that money 60k kiwi? seems very very cheap tell them 80k and we will both go lol

It is very cheap, im seriously considering it. Cant go to far wrong mate, new bike all new gear I have seen the shopping list and the class spec and its spot on. Includes absolutly everything except getting myself to the track. Accomodation is included, entry fees, mechanic bla bla bla.

The cool thing is that its about a 20k deposit before you start then the rest is devided up per round. 7 rounds. 1st round starts a couple of weeks after our nats finish

[slowpoke]

It's an absolute waste of time and effort unless we can start developing riders here first. At the moment there is no cohesion between clubs, between clubs and MNZ, no defined development path or even half decent competition for promising young racers. There is also very little outside investment/sponsorship as result of the low profile of our sport so Mum/Dad and/or Rider are soon outta money and outta the sport. Until these things change you are pissing in the wind.

Dreaming of a kiwi team or rider on the world stage is all very well, but there needs to be wholesale changes in the sport here, building blocks in place to develop the sport and develop riders to reach the goal. Without a plan and good execution of the plan you are just hoping for the best which isn't going to get you very far. Our national junior competition is barely comparable to club level in Spain/Europe so to pitch an underdeveloped club level racer against the international level racers over there and expect good results is just unrealistic.

Money alone is not going to fix the problem. Even if you come up with a $1million it does nothing to address the development and competion gap between Europe and here. They have large high quality fields racing each other week in week out while we are struggling to come up with double figures on a GP125 grid at our 5 national rounds.

I'm not being negative or pessimistic, I'm just being realistic and pointing out what you're up against. We need to fix things here before we go looking further afield. You may just find 1 freak who can jump in the deep end and start swimming but surely the goal needs to be to raise the standard of the sport and riders as a whole so we can produce world class riders on a regular basis?

[ellipsis]

It's an absolute waste of time and effort unless we can start developing riders here first. At the moment there is no cohesion between clubs, between clubs and MNZ, no defined development path or even half decent competition for promising young racers. There is also very little outside investment/sponsorship as result of the low profile of our sport so Mum/Dad and/or Rider are soon outta money and outta the sport. Until these things change you are pissing in the wind.

Dreaming of a kiwi team or rider on the world stage is all very well, but there needs to be wholesale changes in the sport here, building blocks in place to develop the sport and develop riders to reach the goal. Without a plan and good execution of the plan you are just hoping for the best which isn't going to get you very far. Our national junior competition is barely comparable to club level in Spain/Europe so to pitch an underdeveloped club level racer against the international level racers over there and expect good results is just unrealistic.

Money alone is not going to fix the problem. Even if you come up with a $1million it does nothing to address the development and competion gap between Europe and here. They have large high quality fields racing each other week in week out while we are struggling to come up with double figures on a GP125 grid at our 5 national rounds.

I'm not being negative or pessimistic, I'm just being realistic and pointing out what you're up against. We need to fix things here before we go looking further afield. You may just find 1 freak who can jump in the deep end and start swimming but surely the goal needs to be to raise the standard of the sport and riders as a whole so we can produce world class riders on a regular basis?

...true...which takes us back to the old story of our sport being looked at as a whole...not the nationals being the be all and end all of our sport...inter club and inter island co-operation and communication...which i have alluded to before as the stopper of our progress...a big ask, somewhat like herding cats...when and only when that happens will we even know what we have...just the polarity of the three or four clubs in Chch aligning their energies to work together seems like a big ask...even tho at times it seems like we are...an inter club competion leading onto regional and inter island stuff, much like the other sports that thrive is one option...getting joe public to be involved and following their team...it could be done...

[CHOPPA]

...true...which takes us back to the old story of our sport being looked at as a whole...not the nationals being the be all and end all of our sport...inter club and inter island co-operation and communication...which i have alluded to before as the stopper of our progress...a big ask, somewhat like herding cats...when and only when that happens will we even know what we have...just the polarity of the three or four clubs in Chch aligning their energies to work together seems like a big ask...even tho at times it seems like we are...an inter club competion leading onto regional and inter island stuff, much like the other sports that thrive is one option...getting joe public to be involved and following their team...it could be done...

Interclub teams would be fun

[Shaun]

It's an absolute waste of time and effort unless we can start developing riders here first. At the moment there is no cohesion between clubs, between clubs and MNZ, no defined development path or even half decent competition for promising young racers. There is also very little outside investment/sponsorship as result of the low profile of our sport so Mum/Dad and/or Rider are soon outta money and outta the sport. Until these things change you are pissing in the wind.

Dreaming of a kiwi team or rider on the world stage is all very well, but there needs to be wholesale changes in the sport here, building blocks in place to develop the sport and develop riders to reach the goal. Without a plan and good execution of the plan you are just hoping for the best which isn't going to get you very far. Our national junior competition is barely comparable to club level in Spain/Europe so to pitch an underdeveloped club level racer against the international level racers over there and expect good results is just unrealistic.

Money alone is not going to fix the problem. Even if you come up with a $1million it does nothing to address the development and competion gap between Europe and here. They have large high quality fields racing each other week in week out while we are struggling to come up with double figures on a GP125 grid at our 5 national rounds.

I'm not being negative or pessimistic, I'm just being realistic and pointing out what you're up against. We need to fix things here before we go looking further afield. You may just find 1 freak who can jump in the deep end and start swimming but surely the goal needs to be to raise the standard of the sport and riders as a whole so we can produce world class riders on a regular basis?

Come up with an intelligent plan then Slowpoke, you are very good at high lighing the so called problems within our sport, BUT where is your intelligent plan of how to fix the problem

It is to easy o just sit back and knock everything Mt

[Shaun]

MY PLAN TO AID THIS PATH


A consortium needs putting together ASAP similar to what was done for Scott Dixon

10 investors, $10K each with a BUY out clause for the rider

My choice of rider would be Glen Skatchill, WHY, He is bloody talented and can ride a bike side ways if need be

Now go get the investers Slowpoke Plase mate!!!!


Glen would show the world that there are still fast KIWI riders here, and that will open doors in he future for up coming young riders.

We are NEVER going to be able to pretend to be Spain or Italy or Europe when it comes to the support for the young riders

[SWERVE]

It's an absolute waste of time and effort unless we can start developing riders here first. At the moment there is no cohesion between clubs, between clubs and MNZ, no defined development path or even half decent competition for promising young racers. There is also very little outside investment/sponsorship as result of the low profile of our sport so Mum/Dad and/or Rider are soon outta money and outta the sport. Until these things change you are pissing in the wind.

Not a complete waste of time (as some have proven) however there does need to be a more defined career path within the sport as a whole. not only would this make it more attractive to begin with but would also help when approaching organisations /etc for funding.

Dreaming of a kiwi team or rider on the world stage is all very well, but there needs to be wholesale changes in the sport here, building blocks in place to develop the sport and develop riders to reach the goal. Without a plan and good execution of the plan you are just hoping for the best which isn't going to get you very far. Our national junior competition is barely comparable to club level in Spain/Europe so to pitch an underdeveloped club level racer against the international level racers over there and expect good results is just unrealistic.

No need to re-invent the wheel in NZ..... the EJC has got all these bases covered already. We just gotta get riders there........ Jake & Dan have proven that talent (which nz has plenty) will succeed in this series. Yes it costs money to get there but thats were the money side stops. Its then down to tiny set-up changes to the bike and LOTS of rider ability.
The organisers have really got their shit together with this and have made it a must see it its first year. It will be "The series to be in". And its not a step backwards if the rider has already made a jump up to bigger bikes.......... 2011 champ Matt Davies (Aus) has been racing CEV / BSB/ UK 125 for 3 yrs with some good results.... but winning the EJC has catapaulted him into the limelight beyond the teams/parents belief.The package for a race series includes training camps / one on one tuition & advice /bikes / hospitality / equipment and above all access and showcasing to the race world and those who watch. And at Eu 18.950 (approx $40,000nz) it is far less than the $700,000 quoted on here for a european race series.

Money alone is not going to fix the problem. Even if you come up with a $1million it does nothing to address the development and competion gap between Europe and here. They have large high quality fields racing each other week in week out while we are struggling to come up with double figures on a GP125 grid at our 5 national rounds.

Correct! Money wont magically fix it.... but will help a lot Best proving/finishing ground for up-coming youngsters is buckets/streetsock........ low/even powered bikes and huge grids means only talant & determination will get you to the front. And with a one make series with all bikes prepared by the organising body its racecraft an ability that is being sought not big budgets or egos.

I'm not being negative or pessimistic, I'm just being realistic and pointing out what you're up against. We need to fix things here before we go looking further afield. You may just find 1 freak who can jump in the deep end and start swimming but surely the goal needs to be to raise the standard of the sport and riders as a whole so we can produce world class riders on a regular basis?

Correct we do need to get our own house in order. So we can continue to send young talant across the globe. But there are opprtunites out there already run by people with no hidden agendas ..... only to bring young talant into world class racing. (another thing this country needs to improve on)

After having spent some time talking to the EJC organisers and witnessing the fantastic show they have created, i am trying to call in a few favours from over the years to help facilitate sending some more youngsters on this journey. Getting pretty used to getting turned down now .............. but aint gonna stop trying no time soon.

Generally agree with your post mate.

[SWERVE]

Interclub teams would be fun

+1 have always thought this

[CHOPPA]

Correct we do need to get our own house in order. So we can continue to send young talant across the globe. But there are opprtunites out there already run by people with no hidden agendas ..... only to bring young talant into world class racing. (another thing this country needs to improve on)

After having spent some time talking to the EJC organisers and witnessing the fantastic show they have created, i am trying to call in a few favours from over the years to help facilitate sending some more youngsters on this journey. Getting pretty used to getting turned down now .............. but aint gonna stop trying no time soon.

Generally agree with your post mate.

I could be wrong but im not sure if I was a parent spending big $$$ that id pay for my kid to do the EJC. You have been there so you will tell me different. I know its putting there names out there in a big way that is good but if I were a team owner I dont think id recruit from that series. IMO the ninja is a great start out class because its easy to ride them at there maximum potential so the riders are not really challenging there limits. Once they start getting onto proper race bikes like Moto 2, 3 Supersport and Superbike then show they can ride those bikes to the limit thats when I see the offers to come in.

I hope im wrong because it would be fantastic if Daniel and Jake got some good rides! I would think that the money would be better spent getting them on a 600 in NZ at 16 then buying a ride?

There is never a right way or a wrong way though, just get on to it asap!! 15 to 18 year olds is where its at. Thats why I keep bleating on about MX kids is because they already have advanced bike skills way before there old enough to even start racing streetstock. Bucket racing and MX is where I would be training my young fella if he wants to ride