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Thread: Ducati 1199 Panigale - another Italian beauty!

  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by imdying View Post
    I'm not sure either. But, I'm picking it's due to the length of time required to push a product to market, and not knowing just how badly the frameless concept was going to do in the MotoGP. I'd wager that if they could have put a trellis frame in before launch they would've. But on the other hand, boy does it give them a point of differentiation to the Jap bikes.
    Yeah, I figured the same thing to be honest.

  2. #62
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    I dunno, I'm not a fan of the looks of the new bike, but I like the concept. Looks-wise it's a bit of nothing-ness really, not pretty, not ugly just..........I dunno, it just doesn't inspire anything at all really.

    But I reckon the concept is awesome. When I look at the Panigale in the nuddies for some reason I think of the Britten, and how John Britten would have applied a conventional front end to his frame-less creation.

    Flawed concept? I don't thinks so, more like flawed application, and then at a level only a handful of riders could ever experience, and on a completely different bike. Change the engine layout, weight, weight distribution, tyres, construction methods yada yada and there's bugger all to compare. Remember when the 999 came out and everyone in WSB intitially struggled? Chili leading the championship on his 998.5 after kicking the 999 to the kerb because of no front end feel? Yet the 999 went on to become the winningest Ducati Superbike ever once they figured out which brace to leave out of the frame.

    So why ditch the trellis frame? Amongst other things for that 20hp hike! Apparently the trellis frame restricts the airbox options and costs mumbo.

    To me the ally beam frame seems a lil' defeatist; if you wanna go as fast as everyone else do exactly what they are doing. If you wanna go faster you have to do things a lil' different. I'm hoping they use the production based racers (if/when they return to WSB) to get a better handle on the frameless concept and it get's another guernsey down the track (in an alternate reality where GFC's don't exists and MotoGP continues, lol). Or they pulled out of WSB because they know they're new bike is porked...........but I hope not.

  3. #63
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    Good thoughts, cheers for sharing.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by imdying View Post
    Totally agree. I have a mate who is well in love with his old sportsbike... as far as he's concerned it has more ability than him, so it's all he needs and thus has no interest in trying a later model bike. One day he'll get on a new model and realise just how much new chassis goodness he's missing out on.
    It ain't that old, ok coming up on 10yrs. And I'm in no doubt that new chassis goodness would be impressive. However, if what I've got (remember it isn't quite standard, ohlins rear, racetech front, brembo calipers/rotors) can provide more than I need on the road and keep up with ease with the pace that other riders ride at on the road then that's fine and dandy for me.

    It's not like the K1/2 was a dog when it arrived on the scene. And I've since improved on the original recipe. I'd need to spend $17k plus my bike to get onto a new thou, and I don't see that $17k really improving my riding experience that much. Remember I'm not out there to be the quickest, my bike represents to me more than just a collection of plastic and metal, it's a piece of me. On that issue we are indeed different.

    Now if I was to spend that $17k on my bike...........I'm sure you can understand that.
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  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by onearmedbandit View Post
    I don't see that $17k really improving my riding experience that much.
    1) Of course you don't; without trying others you've no reference point inside of the last 10 years to make the comparison with.
    2) $17k? The number best sports bike of the last 4 years (lets face it, nothing of note has changed on it since 08) starts at $12000 on trademe, less your own bike assuming you were to sell it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by imdying View Post
    1) Of course you don't; without trying others you've no reference point inside of the last 10 years to make the comparison with.
    And for that matter neither have you, no disrespect intended. You haven't ridden my bike any further than 10km, and when I first got it. Where is your reference point?

    Quote Originally Posted by imdying View Post
    2) $17k? The number best sports bike of the last 4 years (lets face it, nothing of note has changed on it since 08) starts at $12000 on trademe, less your own bike assuming you were to sell it.
    Granted, I could go second hand and save a lot more money, a very fair point. But once again, it's not something I need right now. I love the way my bike looks, both you and I have invested a lot of time into it, I've dropped a fair chunk of money into it (not quite like your RGV), it handles superbly, it brakes well enough to lift the back wheel, and it's got more than enough power for my needs. Once again I'd rather drop the extra money into my bike.
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  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by onearmedbandit View Post
    And for that matter neither have you, no disrespect intended. You haven't ridden my bike any further than 10km, and when I first got it. Where is your reference point?
    I've ridden bikes of varying ages, and, in general, every aspect has improved relative to their age.

    Quote Originally Posted by onearmedbandit View Post
    Granted, I could go second hand and save a lot more money, a very fair point. But once again, it's not something I need right now. I love the way my bike looks, both you and I have invested a lot of time into it, I've dropped a fair chunk of money into it (not quite like your RGV), it handles superbly, it brakes well enough to lift the back wheel, and it's got more than enough power for my needs. Once again I'd rather drop the extra money into my bike.
    You need to go back to my original post and reread it. The only person talking about spending money, is you.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by imdying View Post
    I've ridden bikes of varying ages, and, in general, every aspect has improved relative to their age.
    I'm not arguing that at all. What I'm arguing is that there is only so much we can utilise. And my bike allows me to utilise as much on the road as any other rider that I'm interested in riding with.

    Quote Originally Posted by imdying View Post
    You need to go back to my original post and reread it. The only person talking about spending money, is you.
    For sure, you only said that I would need to ride one to appreciate the improvements, however that leads to me updating my bike (surely if it was that much of an improvement I would not want to go back to my K2) with a newer model, like you yourself suggested I could do for $12k excluding selling my bike (see even you were talking about spending money ). All I'm saying is instead of spending that $12k on a newer bike I could get more enjoyment from spending $12k on my bike.

    Do you understand my point yet? I'll make it clear. My bike does everything for me that I need.
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  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by onearmedbandit View Post
    I'm not arguing that at all. What I'm arguing is that there is only so much we can utilise. And my bike allows me to utilise as much on the road as any other rider that I'm interested in riding with.
    The speed limit isn't going to change any more, so max utilisation isn't the key, it's the delivery.

    Quote Originally Posted by onearmedbandit View Post
    All I'm saying is instead of spending that $12k on a newer bike I could get more enjoyment from spending $12k on my bike.
    And all I'm saying is that is a baseless assumption.

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    Quote Originally Posted by imdying View Post

    And all I'm saying is that is a baseless assumption.
    Nope. I could go buy another cookie-cutter thou, or one that maybe has had similar work done to it as mine. But neither would give me the satisfaction I'd get from having gone through the journey I have with this bike, nor the fun I'd have spending more time and money on it.

    Why do you have an RGV that owes you over $20k? Why do you have an SV1000 that owes you similar? Don't answer, I already know why.

    Don't get me wrong, I'll buy a new(er) bike at some stage, but not for riding faster or easier on the road. I'll buy it because I'll retire the K2.

    Quote Originally Posted by imdying View Post
    The speed limit isn't going to change any more, so max utilisation isn't the key, it's the delivery.
    So please tell me what is wrong with my bike in the 'delivery'? I'm very interested. Also, regarding the speed limit, come on. We both know how we ride. So you can hop out from under the bridge.
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  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by onearmedbandit View Post
    So please tell me what is wrong with my bike in the 'delivery'?
    You're stuck in absolutes still.

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    Quote Originally Posted by imdying View Post
    You're stuck in absolutes still.
    No, I'm stuck dealing with a troll. I've said my piece, that's all folks.
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  13. #73
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    Fair enough. I still maintain that there are shades of gray; there doesn't need to be anything at all wrong with somebodies current bike for them to enjoy trying the new ones. Decisions are based on the wisdom born of experiences.

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by imdying View Post
    1) Of course you don't; without trying others you've no reference point inside of the last 10 years to make the comparison with.
    2) $17k? The number best sports bike of the last 4 years (lets face it, nothing of note has changed on it since 08) starts at $12000 on trademe, less your own bike assuming you were to sell it.
    Bwahahaha, the "old bike" you're referring to is a K1/2 gixxer thou.

    Perhaps one of the best road bikes made...TO DATE!

    I have ridden one, think I clocked up about ten thousand k's on the one I owned. I've also spent a considerable amount of time on later models including the k6 superbike I raced. There is NO lack of feel from that front end, nor has there been any remarkable geometry changes to the front end since it came out.

    I can tell you without a shadow of a doubt, and qualified to do so, that there is little point in upgrading from a K2 at the moment. That said, there isn't a motor on the market that compares to a K5/6 gixxer thou, but the ride isn't as good, and the bike is harder to punt.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drew View Post
    I can tell you without a shadow of a doubt, and qualified to do so
    You probably would know, you've tried others to give you a basis for comparison, and that's the point... nothing to do with the actual capabilities themselves

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