The youth...

[Winston001]

IMO what has gone wrong in our society is we have empowered kids way too much.
Ohh yea man I have the right to this and the right to that. Which indeed they do. But they haven't learned the responsibility that goes with those rights.


I strongly feel this is because of the simple fact that concequences for actions have been removed.
The cane,the ruler etc can't be used by teachers at school. The police cant kick said graffiti artists up the jackseat and drag em by the ear back to dad n mum.

ALL of this despite the greenie leftie view isn't child abuse. its teaching respect.

FFS why not wake up to the fact that to spare the rod really is to spoil the child.

It would be easy to agree Frosty but my own teenage children and their friends disprove this view.

They are polite, rebellious, intelligent, immature - and fun. Their parents are decent people whom you'd be happy to meet. My wife and I did not smack or verbally shout at our children. They haven't been caned or strapped. We taught them manners and respect which has stuck. Truthfully, it wasn't difficult.

I sometimes think its easy to forget many many kids are well behaved, because they get overshadowed by the headline acts of a few.

[FJRider]

They are polite, rebellious, intelligent, immature - and fun. Their parents are decent people whom you'd be happy to meet.

When their parents are around ... many are.

[jazfender]

I'm not saying I want to live in Singapore or that I agree with everything in their justice system, but we can learn a few things from them about criminal justice. If people are unable or unwilling to be a "good" member of society, then they should pay the consequences. I support caning and public shaming for offenders who commit crime time and time again because obviously our justice system isn't working if people are "allowed" to accumulate dozens of convictions.

You support the infliction of grievous bodily harm and associated mental trauma that's likely to result in life-long scarring on people for failing to be a "good" member of society?

That shit's barbaric.

Can you explain to me how life was different for an 18 year old in 1991 compared to now?

I'd be quite interested to know. How has the world changed?, what problems and situations exist now that didn't then?

I think this has been answered pretty well already.

What it says is that harsher penalties work, we have to decide whether it is worth it, or whether there is a happier medium.

I think parents who do not raise their children to be able to cope with the society they live in (and take advantage of), either need to allow society to do some of the raising (no more wet bus ticket punishments), or go live somewhere they will not create a negative impact. Just saying oh its fine, kids will be kids, teenagers will be teenagers, delinquent adults will be delinquents..... doesn't really seem like its working does it?

They may work but at what cost? Would you rather live with Singapore's government and society than New Zealand's?

You kinda say that like it's wrong......?

...

Nothing will make any difference to your argument, because your argument is invalid, and you will never admit it.

When this is pointed out to you, you always duck behind the cover of "it's different for other cultures" or "it's different for special people with xyz syndrome" or "it's different for poor dispossessed lesbian strippers" or some other puerile, pathetic, whiny excuse.

Stop it. It is different for everyone and hence it is not different at all. Everyone struggles in their own unique way, and respect for each others personal space and personal property is fundamental to those differences being respected.

Your response is... stop it? That cracked me up.

If somebody can't respect the property that belongs to individuals, and society collectively, then they have no place in that society.

People can and do go without food regularly, particularly during rates month, just to make the rates payments that contribute to the upkeep of children's play parks and rubbish bins. Fat old white men were often to be seen spending their free time in public spaces working on public seating, gardens, pergolae and play equipment. How does the scribble shit in any way respect their efforts, or improve the appearance of the items?

Rates aren't just for the landed rich either, if you think the cost of rates isn't recovered in rent from tenants, then you're barking.

You, and indeed the scribblers are all wonderful, special people, I'm sure. That doesn't entitle any of you to special treatment.

I haven't seen that many fat old white men out building things for the community in recent years though. I wonder why that might be, don't you?

Hold on, the children using the play parks are also the ones tagging. In fact kids like drawing on shit from a very young age. Is the appearance you're fighting for to please mummy or the kids?

Rubbish bins are rubbish bins, who the fuck cares?

Um...Yeah.... look. Headbanger doesn't need defending. But this is the internet. Our personas get skewed and exaggerated, hot words ensue.

I do know HB. He's a decent guy, lovely wife, great kids, intelligent......and silly enough to ride a bike like the rest of us.

Just sayin

I'm sure he is an absolute peach. To white people.

[unstuck]

My old man used to be a high school teacher in South Africa, and he would beat the students with sticks if they misbehaved. He had "Mr black stick" and "Mr white stick". The students actually respected him as an authoritative figure, rather than just a silly teacher with no power like they do these days.

Respect OR fear.

[idb]

i remember when a stabbing in Auckland made the front page of the local paper here in Dunedin, now you would have to stab a busload of nuns to make page 2

Prove it!!!

[Smifffy]

They may work but at what cost? Would you rather live with Singapore's government and society than New Zealand's?

He already said he wanted a happy medium. Does your disability prevent you from understanding the concept of a range, or spectrum? Singapore is considered by some as overly harsh and NZ is considered by many to be too lax. Unfortunately your bias only allows you to see the advocation of pillories & stoning.

Your response is... stop it? That cracked me up.

Yeah stop trolling, and stop making excuses for people who simply don't care enough to make any effort at living harmoniously with their communities.

Hold on, the children using the play parks are also the ones tagging. In fact kids like drawing on shit from a very young age. Is the appearance you're fighting for to please mummy or the kids?

The scribblers are generally older than the children the playparks are designed for, and yes the very young children that draw on shit do so when they don't know, and haven't been told any better. The scribblers are indeed childish, but that doesn't make them children. The playparks were designed as family spaces, and that does include mummy and the kids - another concept anti-social little fucks don't seem to be able to grasp.

Rubbish bins are rubbish bins, who the fuck cares?

So, regarding anything other than one's own selfish desire to 'express oneself' through interfering with and damaging the results of somebody else's hard work, what do you care about? Please explain how random groups of LA thug wannabes contribute to the world that you desire and a society that you would care about.

The poor wee poppets are just sooo unfortunate that they have to grow up in provincial NZ instead of the rough hoods of East LA. I'm sure they would have hard a much easier go of it there. Maybe even be lucky enough to shoot some other dumb kid that had the audacity to tag 'their' wall...

I'm sure they'd be able to reprezent - chur.

[SMOKEU]

You support the infliction of grievous bodily harm and associated mental trauma that's likely to result in life-long scarring on people for failing to be a "good" member of society?

That shit's barbaric.

If people behave themselves properly then they have nothing to fear. I distill my own spirit and get drunk every weekend but I don't go around vandalizing property, I don't assault anyone, I don't steal and I don't run around the streets making a nuisance of myself disturbing the peace. I respect the fact that many people like to go to bed early, so I don't make excessive noise late at night or in the early hours of the morning. I've never been arrested and I've never been convicted of any criminal offence. I still have a lot of fun on the weekends, but I don't make anyone else suffer. Sure, I'm guilty of riding my motorbike a bit faster than I should from time to time, but that's only on quiet countryside roads where I'm not putting anyone else at risk.

Respect OR fear.

A bit of both I suspect.

[jazfender]

He already said he wanted a happy medium. Does your disability prevent you from understanding the concept of a range, or spectrum? Singapore is considered by some as overly harsh and NZ is considered by many to be too lax. Unfortunately your bias only allows you to see the advocation of pillories & stoning.

Happy medium? This is a dude with a fucking swastika as his profile image. This is the same dude that a couple posts up said he was happy he lived in a white neighbourhood. You argue for his "happy medium", endorse the extreme right and then say I am picking and choosing?

Not to mention the twenty odd red reps he's received talking about DAMAGING PROPERTY. That has gotta be the worst person you could have picked to support your argument.

Yeah stop trolling, and stop making excuses for people who simply don't care enough to make any effort at living harmoniously with their communities.

See above regarding living harmoniously within their communities. That is some funny shit.

The scribblers are generally older than the children the playparks are designed for, and yes the very young children that draw on shit do so when they don't know, and haven't been told any better. The scribblers are indeed childish, but that doesn't make them children. The playparks were designed as family spaces, and that does include mummy and the kids - another concept anti-social little fucks don't seem to be able to grasp.

I think you'll find the environment for some of these kids stunts them to a point where they may as well be considered children. Not sure why they would respect a "family space" when they have such a broken view of what that means.

So, regarding anything other than one's own selfish desire to 'express oneself' through interfering with and damaging the results of somebody else's hard work, what do you care about? Please explain how random groups of LA thug wannabes contribute to the world that you desire and a society that you would care about.

The poor wee poppets are just sooo unfortunate that they have to grow up in provincial NZ instead of the rough hoods of East LA. I'm sure they would have hard a much easier go of it there. Maybe even be lucky enough to shoot some other dumb kid that had the audacity to tag 'their' wall...

I'm sure they'd be able to reprezent - chur.

For a kid within a broken family, home and neighbourhood, the only difference between LA and Otara is guns.

[TIBLE_90]

Wow. After reading this whole thread I have come to two conclusions. One, Headbanger is a racist, old, uneducated individual who simply thinks his seniority makes him smart, and two that Jaz knows a thing or two about what he is talking about. Headbanger has misunderstood Jaz's points over and over again, and has replied with vile, ignorant, and silly points of his own. I find it curious that so many people on here have agreed with Headbanger and so few with Jaz. I suppose this is due to the demographic that uses KB. Oh well, posting shit up on forums like this is useless anyways...Nobody is going to change anyone's mind on the subject in the end.

Ride hard and have fun

[Smifffy]

Happy medium? This is a dude with a fucking swastika as his profile image. This is the same dude that a couple posts up said he was happy he lived in a white neighbourhood. You argue for his "happy medium", endorse the extreme right and then say I am picking and choosing?

Not to mention the twenty odd red reps he's received talking about DAMAGING PROPERTY. That has gotta be the worst person you could have picked to support your argument.

It was Bogan that you quoted and replied to that suggested the happy medium. Not seen a swastika on his page. Please try to keep up, but I guess that's what happens when you jumble up a whole bunch of different posts into one. I found it a little confusing, but thought you must be able keep up with it all. I guess not.

See above regarding living harmoniously within their communities. That is some funny shit.

Keep laughing, and keep avoiding the question then. You are wrong.

I think you'll find the environment for some of these kids stunts them to a point where they may as well be considered children. Not sure why they would respect a "family space" when they have such a broken view of what that means.

Keep making excuses for them. Poor little Wiremu - never picked for the under 14's. They don't have to respect anything, just don't scribble on shit. What do they think would happen if they scribbled their shit on something their mother valued?

For a kid within a broken family, home and neighbourhood, the only difference between LA and Otara is guns.

Last I checked, Otara wasn't in the 'Naki. I understand why their family & home might be broken, but why is their neighbourhood broken? Probably because of dirty little shits roaming around in groups vandalising and littering the place up.

They do have the potential to make Otara different to LA, but they just keep striving to make it the same. Find a clean area and turn it into a filthy cess pit. Great job! Good on ya mate.

[bogan]

Happy medium? This is a dude with a fucking swastika as his profile image.

Ahem, this is the dude who wanted the happy medium, and my avatar is a cylonbros back end. Some might say the cylons have a tendency to go for overkill with their population control methods, but that is all history now, and I'm sure they have learnt some compassion since then.


speaking of mediums, what do you call a psychic midget on the run from the cops?

A small medium at large

[Bikemad]

Put simply I reckon it starts at home.

you got that right mate
when i was about 13-14 or so me and the other loud local louts used to hang around Risingholme park in chch and had a bit of grief with an old geezer off and on who lived on the other side of the fence and took exception to us hangin round makin noise etc..........we did some "cultural artwork" one day on the park side of the fence with huge sticks of chalk..........had more grief with the fella................few days later the police cruised through the park and caught us in the act.......made us remove our t shirts .....soak them in water from the drinking fountain and start cleaning the fence.........suddenly the old geezer appears over the fence with sluggun in hand ......lets of a shot and hits cop in the leg........i ended up as a witness for the police.......old geezer lost his guns and was fined .............he thought the sound of us scrubbing the fence was us cutting the posts or something like that................when my old man heard the facts and what happened to the old geezer he marched me round there......made me look the geezer in the eye and apologise...........also got to mow the old geezers lawns for a couple of months................at the time i thought my old man was a right cunt..........40 odd years later i see it a bit differently

[Bikemad]

If people behave themselves properly then they have nothing to fear. I distill my own spirit and get drunk every weekend but I don't go around vandalizing property, I don't assault anyone, I don't steal and I don't run around the streets making a nuisance of myself disturbing the peace. I respect the fact that many people like to go to bed early, so I don't make excessive noise late at night or in the early hours of the morning. I've never been arrested and I've never been convicted of any criminal offence. I still have a lot of fun on the weekends, but I don't make anyone else suffer. Sure, I'm guilty of riding my motorbike a bit faster than I should from time to time, but that's only on quiet countryside roads where I'm not putting anyone else at risk.

now cut that out.............or im gonna have to rethink my opinion of you dude

[ellipsis]

...human history is repetitive, goes round and round and round...epochs rise and fall, civilisations stutter and implode...nothing changes and nothing will...the base human instinct will always be the constant...only one quarter of a millennium ago a lot who post on here would be of an older age, scummy and me would be fucking ancient old men and the young bucks who wanna wheelstand their nuts dry and be anarchic/make their mark/be staunch etc, would be at war or work and making babies with girls old enough to bleed...countries were ruled or terrorised by young blokes not long out of their teens...I reckon the problem these days is that there's too many old cunts and that we just wont, go away...

[FROSTY:Me]

In SOME homes ... they're lucky just to get fed ...

And to that I ask thw question --WHY??