Dogs that attack - Is it the dog or the owner?

[Bad Biker]

Now don’t get me wrong. I do believe that any animal that attacks a person without provocation should be put down.

But blaming attacks on specific breeds is wrong. I have owned a number of dogs and been around dogs of all types of breed (including pit bulls) and they have been very good dogs with no worry of attacks.

With the mental attitude that it is the breed would leaves us so call intelligent human beings almost extinct.

Think back to the atrocities that we have committed over the centuries – Romans, Greeks, English, Americans and list can go on through every race and atrocities still happen. Don’t forget WW1, WW2, Korea and Vietnam.

If this is a mentality we wish to follow then be careful you may be euthanised!!!!



Dogs are man’s best friend but like all friends – you treat them like shit the same will come back to you.

Dogs act the way they are treated.

[george formby]

Most of the time I believe it is people at fault, dogs are dogs. Mind you, I have owned a dog which turned out to be inbred, from a line of show dogs, which had to be put down because it was psychotic.

I believe that owners of certain breeds or dogs over a certain size should be licensed, they have to understand dogs & know how to train them properly plus carry the responsibility for the dogs behaviour. Half the owners I meet can't even be bothered to pick up their own dog shit let alone train them.

For the record I have one of those "dangerous" breeds, previously known as the Nanny dog. She loves kids but I only let them approach after a quick "how too" lesson & I never leave her unsupervised. I trust her but not people who may interact with her. At the end of the day regardless of fault I do not want to lose a beautiful dog or see somebody get hurt through ignorance. Simple really.

[JimO]

a dog bit me yesterday, whilst i was working on the owners property, got him back though, gave the cunt a good hosing down

[Brian407]

It's a complex question. Sometimes it is the dog, and sometimes it's the owner. Three personal examples of 'its the dog' come to mind straight away.

My neighbour, single man in his late 40's, has a bull terrier cross something. Had it from a pup and its about 3 years old, loves it to bits, plays with it all the time, doesnt teach it to be a guard dog, not the type that needs one. Very friendly to us, and neighbours on other side. We dont feed it or go out of our way to encourage affection, but feel perfectly safe around it. Problem starts when kids appear. Goes absolutely mental whenever kids walk up the street, barking, snarling, snapping etc. Incredibly frightening, and most of the regular kids in the street cross the road a few houses up to walk past. Dog still goes nuts. Ive lived here for 22 years and have never seen, or had a problem with kids teasing or provoking dogs on the street, and theres plenty of both. This dog just genuinely hates kids, doesnt react that way with other dogs, just kids. To my knowledge it's never touched one, but I wouldnt trust it not too.

Some years back we had a Blue Healer, Hyperactive thing it was, called it the Epilectic Blowfly. Great dog, friendly, obedient (sometimes), no problem with kids or other dogs, didnt wander. Attached itself to my wife and she could get it to do anything. Wife went to pat him one day and he took to her. Sunk one of his canine teeth right through her hand, made quite a mess of her arm. No apparent reason, just went troppo. I shot him that afternoon.

Brothers got a black lab, (gun dog) placcid as they come most of the time. Couple of years ago the police were going to shoot him because he bit the neighbor. Neighbor used to play with him (toss the stick, toss the ball stuff) brother didnt mind, was good training for the dog. Neighbour went to play with him one day and the dog growled him down. The guy should have backed off at this point, but he knew the dog (or so he thought), so he approached with the "whats the matter boy" question. Stuck his hand out to pat him and got bitten for his troubles. Now this dog was/is well known round the neighborhood, people used to bring their toddlers down to play with him, and nobody could understand why he had bitten. Neighbours wife got all panicky and rang the police. They arrived, along with the pound guys and took the dog away. After much debate they agreed to let the dog be checked by a vet to see what might be wrong. Vet examined him and found that his eyelashes were turned in one one eye (right eye) and was annoying the hell out of him. Dog was just having a bad day. Trimmed the offending lashes, went through temperment checks, and brother got him back. He at my place right now, lying at my feet. Great dog.

Three examples of model owners, three reasonably benign dogs, and three very scary situations. Its wrong to single out particular breeds, as all dogs are capable of attack, but some breeds are pre-disposed to it as a result of their breeding. Pit Bulls, for example, wern't bred to be family pets. The fact that they can be bought up as one doesnt negate the built in fighting disposition that they were bred for, and they could, and very often do, revert to the disposition at any time. However the same can be said for many breeds, and many very common family dog breeds. Cant get rid of them all, but you should NEVER completely trust them, period.

[Ronin]

Most of the time I believe it is people at fault, dogs are dogs. Mind you, I have owned a dog which turned out to be inbred, from a line of show dogs, which had to be put down because it was psychotic.

I believe that owners of certain breeds or dogs over a certain size should be licensed, they have to understand dogs & know how to train them properly plus carry the responsibility for the dogs behaviour. Half the owners I meet can't even be bothered to pick up their own dog shit let alone train them.

For the record I have one of those "dangerous" breeds, previously known as the Nanny dog. She loves kids but I only let them approach after a quick "how too" lesson & I never leave her unsupervised. I trust her but not people who may interact with her. At the end of the day regardless of fault I do not want to lose a beautiful dog or see somebody get hurt through ignorance. Simple really.

^^ This. I cannot say THIS enough. Our dog is the most well behaved, patient good natured dog you will ever meet. When kids visit we train the kids...

[ellipsis]

...after all the years of training I have had, I still bite...even though I get fed well and treated nicely...

[Virago]

Now don’t get me wrong. I do believe that any animal that attacks a person without provocation should be put down.

But blaming attacks on specific breeds is wrong. I have owned a number of dogs and been around dogs of all types of breed (including pit bulls) and they have been very good dogs with no worry of attacks.

With the mental attitude that it is the breed would leaves us so call intelligent human beings almost extinct.

Think back to the atrocities that we have committed over the centuries – Romans, Greeks, English, Americans and list can go on through every race and atrocities still happen. Don’t forget WW1, WW2, Korea and Vietnam.

If this is a mentality we wish to follow then be careful you may be euthanised!!!!

Dogs are man’s best friend but like all friends – you treat them like shit the same will come back to you.

Dogs act the way they are treated.

I certainly think that it's that kind of mindless defence and pointless comparisons that contributes to the problem - but then again you lack the intelligence to post this thread in the right forum...

The problem lies with people and the dogs. No matter how well dogs are treated and trained, there is no guarantee that they will not carry out an unprovoked attack. They are effectively a weapon - which has a mind of its own.

The biggest problem is that dog owners can't get their heads around that fact, and instead obsess about defending and justifying any agression or attacks carried out by dogs.

[george formby]

Good example Brian407 of an alleged "unprovoked" attack, the gun dog was in pain. We perceive "unprovoked" attacks because we do not think like a dog nor consider any motive. Apart from the nutter I briefly owned I have never seen a dog show aggression without reason. That's my whole point about licensing & training owners with the aim of preventing aggression through education & responsibility.

Another example of skewed thinking is the myth that Pitbulls, APBT's were bred to be aggressive generally, not the case, dogs bred to fight had to be handled by anybody even when they were injured. Any dog that showed human aggression was culled. That's why they were the most popular family dog in the US for 100 years or so, hence the "nanny dog" nickname. In recent years backyard breeders cross Bull terriers with anything that will make them look scarier, Mastiffs & Rottweilers for example which are both specifically bred to be human aggressive. These morons are breeding monsters. The lady jogger who was mauled terribly by a pack of pig dogs is an example, Greyhound / Pitbull X. Sight hounds instinctively chase down anything that runs, terriers are unbelievably tenacious when they get onto quarrie. No doubt great pig dogs but a horrific liability if not restrained.

I put the onus firmly & categorically on owners. Like riding a bike, you manage your own risk.

[ellipsis]

I certainly think that it's that kind of mindless defence and pointless comparisons that contributes to the problem - but then again you lack the intelligence to post this thread in the right forum...

The problem lies with people and the dogs. No matter how well dogs are treated and trained, there is no guarantee that they will not carry out an unprovoked attack. They are effectively a weapon - which has a mind of its own.

The biggest problem is that dog owners can't get their heads around that fact, and instead obsess about defending and justifying any agression or attacks carried out by dogs.

...and most really friendly well treated and loved family dogs are just that, friendly ...whereas so many of the dogs that seem to be the badly behaved ones often belong to paranoic, weaselly, macho, scared type boys in mens underpants...no wonder their dogs are schizo...

[scumdog]

ALL breeds can have an 'off day' and attack, more so if improperly raised and trained.

It's just that nobody ever gets dragged down by a Maltese Terrier/Chihuahua etc.

So those big breed are more likely to do damage, ergo they have the high-profile negative rep.

[TrentNz]

I believe it is mostly the owner, although even the most trained, loved dog may still attack.

[Virago]

...I put the onus firmly & categorically on owners. Like riding a bike, you manage your own risk.

That illustrates my point. A dog is not a machine, it cannot be controlled absolutely - you can only manage it as best you can and hope for the best. There will always be risk - but whose risk is it - the dog owner's, or the public at large?

[george formby]

That illustrates my point. A dog is not a machine, it cannot be controlled - you can only manage it as best you can and hope for the best. There will always be risk - but whose risk is it - the dog owner's, or the public at large?

The owner, all it takes is a leash to control a dog & honest forethought. A dog does not wake up in the morning & think "I'm going to bite someone today" the same as a bike does not sit in the garage thinking " I fancy a hide side next time out."

Either way the person has to take responsibility, right from the point of deciding ownership. If somebody is thinking I will do the best I can & hope for the best they should not have a dog or a bike. Shit happens but it can be minimised hugely.

[TrentNz]

The owner, all it takes is a leash to control a dog & honest forethought. A dog does not wake up in the morning & think "I'm going to bite someone today" the same as a bike does not sit in the garage thinking " I fancy a hide side next time out."

Either way the person has to take responsibility, right from the point of deciding ownership. If somebody is thinking I will do the best I can & hope for the best they should not have a dog or a bike. Shit happens but it can be minimised hugely.

Try holding back a 150kg bull mastiff with a leash.
its not going to work.

[RDJ]

A working party from ACC chaired by Katman would undoubtedly conclude these attacks are the fault of the toddlers savaged, because they failed to avoid the dogs and were not wearing Hi-Viz...