World lacks enough food, fuel as population soars

[george formby]

Remember Rwanda? Same Deal.

Wish I didn't. The Hutu's & Tutsis were/are tribes of agricultralists & cattle herders. Until the Belgians colonised the country & made one tribe overseers of the other they lived fairly harmoniously. The attempted genocide stemmed from the cruelties inflicted during that era. I can't remember what roles the tribes had though.
Same shit, oppression for advantage.

[puddytat]

In regard to Bees, seeing as Ive a few hives .....the blimmin' beekeepers have been saying for years that chemicals are a problem but no one listened....at least we can say" we told you so".
For years we have said that biosecurity should be of utmost importance.....& all it took was one "Dick" to import illegally, Queens from Overseas....what next?
Also their is evidence that Bee Colony collapse may also be related to the widespread expansion of Wirelss technology & the Towers associated with them......
Also...it has been shown thast high energy cables undersea & no doudt on land may be detremental to Bird & sealife navigation....


In regards to why half the Countries in Africa & the Middle East are rooted, well the Oil companies especially can take the blame for that.
Its a fact.
Dont believe me? Then i suggest you go to good ole TVNZ7 on demand & download or whatever,the
documentary "THE SEVEN SISTERS" & youll see that this planet was been divided up since ages ago. By the Cartel of the Seven largest oil companies.
Some of the worst atrocities & civil unrest in the last century has been "made " for their direct advantage.And still is. By people we elected.Who either have worked for them directly (Rumsfeld, Cheney, Rice etc etc).Or indirectly

Now Im not suggesting that we dont need either chemicals/oil...its all oil init, but that there is a huge cost to these technologies & anyone who points these things out is then promptly labeled such & such by the media & that is all it takes to make anyone who advocates these causes to be discredited, & before they can even get to the point they have to endlessly quantify & defend their position....
Honestly I dont think these problems are that big....& with seven billion people working on it,I dont think it'd take long if we all chip in.
I really think we need to rethink the concept of Democracy & we need to come up with a new rule book pretty fuckin quick.

[mashman]

"THE SEVEN SISTERS"

Do you mean Secret of The Seven Sisters? (couldn't find it onDemand) Am 20 mins into Part 1 and feel like I don't need to watch any more as the rest is probably pretty predictable... but I will watch the rest of them over the weekend.

The guy in Iraq sort of sums it up towards the end of the first part. Saddam oppressed them for 36 years and the Americans came in to finish them off

[carbonhed]

The three main staple grains cultivated in the world (rice, maize and wheat) are all pollinated by the wind. So you're not going to run out of buns to hold your burgers in anytime soon.

There's been lots of theories around Colony Collapse Disorder of the honeybee. The stupidest one of all was microwave radiation from cell phones. Even for you dumb motherfuckers this is just biblically retarded but obviously that's not going to slow you down for a millisecond.

Insecticides would certainly do the job if we were trying to kill them but actually horticlturalists don't want to kill honeybees so we try to avoid that.

That leaves us with pests and diseases. If you'd been looking you'll have noticed what Varroa did to the local population of honeybees. Devastating, inexorable, entirely natural. Exported from the Phillipines and brought here by some dumb little cocksucker who thought he knew better. There's a global surplus of dumb little cocksuckers who think they know better... many of them feature on this thread. Ironically a primary defence against Varroa is the insecticide tau fluvalinate AKA Apistan. Yep that's right an insecticide right in the hive. Who the fuck woulda thought?

Varroa's not the only pest attacking them. Recently in the USA they've found a parasitic fly that's also killing them off.

http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/...ing-honeybees/

There's also many fungal and viral diseases that could be implicated.

Doesn't that sound more reasonable? I know it won't appeal as much because it's not an evil conspiracy by shadowy capitalist corporations trying to achieve world domination in...... errr.... something... but really if you step outside and look at the plum trees groaning under the weight of fruit, the apple trees laden... just look the fuck around you and lighten the fuck up.

[mashman]

So pesticides and insecticides have been killing off the insects that the fly used to use as a host and because they've killed them off and bees are about the only thing still living, they've moved on to bees. I'm plenty light, just gotta laugh at those experts who know what the problem is even when they don't know what the problems is.

[SPman]

Environmentalist have found a link to a particular pesticide in the US. Clothianidin - it's one that is used to coat seeds - GM corn, in particular..........http://readersupportednews.org/off-s...critical-point

[mashman]

this fulla believes that protein deficiency is the problem.

[mashman]

Environmentalist have found a link to a particular pesticide in the US. Clothianidin - it's one that is used to coat seeds - GM corn, in particular..........http://readersupportednews.org/off-s...critical-point

"Ellis, for his part, thinks that figuring out a way to solve the bee crisis could be a catalyst for larger reform within our agriculture system. “If we can protect that pollinator base, it’s going to have ripple effects … for wildlife, for human health,” he said. “It will bring up subjects that need to be looked at, of groundwater and surface water — all the connected subjects associated [with] chemical use and agriculture.”"

I wish.

[Oblivion]

Informative post by puddytat

The Seven sisters have ruled the market for a long time. If you look at the profits made by these companies, There is a trend between the cost of selling the Oil, and the cost of getting it out of the ground.

Ever since the 50's the cost of getting oil out of the ground and processing it, has decreased, Due to a variety of factors, increase in the availability of suitable technology and so on. However the cost of the Oil has been on a sneaky upwards curve ever since they started having a monopoly. The great oil crisis was caused by the of oil being to high for regular people to purchase. There was no shortage of oil, no where near a shortage. The companies just got greedy. It wasn't until OPEC came along that the prices went down, because it ruined the monopoly that the Seven sisters had. If these companies had continued uninterrupted, we could of expected of paying 300$ a barrel.

If NZ actually could keep the Oil that we drill within the country, we could reduce the dependency we have on foreign Oil imports. But people in charge are too stupid to think of that

[mashman]

If NZ actually could keep the Oil that we drill within the country, we could reduce the dependency we have on foreign Oil imports. But people in charge are too stupid to think of that

In the "Am 20 mins in to Part 1" link above it would seem that when anyone tried to keep their oil they faced repercussions from the rest of the world... primarily the Americans. Go figure eh. This link was posted by rainman in another thread and gave an interesting look into the peaks and troughs of oil prices. Interestingish, but I only made it to page 20 before I gave up.

[Brian d marge]

sandals every one come and get your sandal.....

trouble is we need oil ... try to look around and eliminate oil...same near if not impossible
oil from plastic looks good as has been discussed.... but I m trying not to use the stuff, but its virtually impossible.....
stephen

[mashman]

sandals every one come and get your sandal.....

trouble is we need oil ... try to look around and eliminate oil...same near if not impossible
oil from plastic looks good as has been discussed.... but I m trying not to use the stuff, but its virtually impossible.....
stephen

Very true... similar to medicine. What else is an essential import?

However I'd rather be bare footed.

[Brian d marge]

Very true... similar to medicine. What else is an essential import?

However I'd rather be bare footed.

here ya go

Stephen

[mashman]

here ya go

Stephen

.... ....

[rainman]

And I have no problems with Buddhists, it's a very peaceful religion which doesn't breed hate like Islam. ... They even embrace the swastika symbol.

For one thing, the Buddhist svastika is almost always clockwise, and the Nazi one is counter-clockwise, so they're not the same symbol visually. More important is the meaning: the Buddhists got the idea from the Hindus, where the clockwise svastika (from Sanskrit su-asti, well being) signifies the positive expression of life, but the counter-clockwise one represents Kali, destruction and magic. In the Hindu worldview, these are all part of a balance, and they don't have the simplistic "good and evil" views we seem to be stuck with, but either way the Nazi choice of swastika was a willing embrace of evil; a svastika on a Buddhist temple is a positive symbol. So they're not paleo-Nazis.

There is a large amount of irony in your post; admiring Buddhism for not breeding hate, while expressing your general level of bigotry and hate for anyone not like you. Just sayin'. (And I'm not picking on you, but hating, like smoking, will kill you. One of the big challenges of life is to love everyone, even those you really want to hate).

this fulla believes that protein deficiency is the problem.

Yeah, I think nutrition has a role to play, but it's only one factor in a composite set. Massive monocultures are the main cause of nutrition issues (have you seen the almond orchards they refer to in that story - horizon to horizon... madness), complex and poorly understood insecticides, trucking bees around the country wrapped in cling-film, meddling around with lots of imported genetics... and that's just the stuff we do actively. Add in other background toxicity from the way we live plus natural things like varroa and nosema and it is amazing we have any bees at all.

Anyhoo, back to the OP. Population increases plus declining energy = Less food, more misery. Always been that way, always will. Some reading:

• An opinion piece in Nature about oil supplies albeit mainly related to climate change, but relevant as the underlying cause. The debate is pretty much over when Nature is on board.
• An old but a goodie, Richard Manning on embodied energy in food. (Read his book: Against the Grain, I think).
• Various other articles about the relationship between oil and food price and availability. The link to economic growth is also important.
• Pollan talking about food systems at a conference (1 hr video). Also his briefing to the incoming Obama.
• If you haven't seen it, Al Bartlett's "Arithmetic, Population and Energy" is good background.

Solutions aren't impossible, but they involve major changes in how we live, work, eat, grow food, and what we do in many spheres of life, individually, nationally, and globally.

TBH I think we're not gonna, though, cause we're all pussies.