Is it Bucket legal or not?

[husaberg]

Hmmm, so if MNZ have a trail bike class in Mini MX does it therefore mean they are competition bikes?

The following machines have been homologated and approved for mini motocross competition:

7-11 (u 12) years Trail
(Note: all machines homologated to this class have a minimum wheel size of 14 inch front & 12 inch rear)
CMG JS 80 (2004 – 2010) CMG JS 90 (2004 – 2010)
Honda CRF 70 (2004 – 2010) Honda XR70 (1997 – 2010)
Honda XR80 (1979 – 2010) Honda CRF 80 (2004 – 2010)
Honda XR100 (1985 – 2010) Honda CRF 100 (2004 – 2010)
Kawasaki KLX 110 (2002 – 2010) Polini XP4R (2010)
Suzuki DRZ 110 (2003 – 2010) Suzuki DS80 (1990 – 2010)
Suzuki JR80 (2001 – 2010) Suzuki DR-Z70
Yamaha PW 90 (2002 – 2010) Yamaha TTR 90 (2000 – 2010)
Yamaha TTR 90E (2004 – 2010) Lifan Club (2005-2010

Without going into the Motors Vs Parts debate which the MNZ can't even fix, or wish to fix.(police it ourselves wasn't it. LOL

Sorry but the competition is pretty clearly (by MNZ standards) defined by the MNZ in the Miniature road race rules.

24-2-4 Engines must be derived from non-competition motorcycles. Motocross, Road Racing,
Enduro and Go Kart motors and transmission parts are not permitted. There shall be no
restriction on the make, type or design of carburettor, ignition, exhaust, piston, cam, valve
springs or cooling system except for class eligibility. All engines must be normally
aspirated except F4 4 stroke engines of less than 100cc capacity, which may be turbo or
supercharged.
F4 2 stroke engines over 104cc are restricted to carburation equivalent to a single 24mm
carburettor, F5 4 stroke engines over 53cc are restricted to carburation equivalent to a
single 20mm carburettor.

The other classes are the "competition bikes in the MNZ Minis". the rules as defined by the MNZ for F4 and F5 (Buckets) in which competition engines exclude, "MX, enduro Road race and go Kart Motors". Not trailbikes.
This class (the trail bike class get it Trail Class) was created to encourage participation by people that have play/Trail bikes that are not competitive, with the competition bikes. they list the eligible bikes (the homologation list) of what they deem aret tail"/ fun bikes only so someone doesn't use a real competition bike)

The minis generally also have a Non Comp class as well which you can ride any bike you like. (Say a FXR150 if you so wished) in which is for new entrants.

If you use your logic to the extent you have. As soon as someone enters a FXR150 in the MX2 class. The FXR150s will then be ineligible for buckets mmmm.....
Then again using your logic Gav as you race in the F5 class "your bike is a competition bike is it not?"

[jasonu]

Hmmm, so if MNZ have a trail bike class in Mini MX does it therefore mean they are competition bikes?

The following machines have been homologated and approved for mini motocross competition:

7-11 (u 12) years Trail
(Note: all machines homologated to this class have a minimum wheel size of 14 inch front & 12 inch rear)
CMG JS 80 (2004 – 2010) CMG JS 90 (2004 – 2010)
Honda CRF 70 (2004 – 2010) Honda XR70 (1997 – 2010)
Honda XR80 (1979 – 2010) Honda CRF 80 (2004 – 2010)
Honda XR100 (1985 – 2010) Honda CRF 100 (2004 – 2010)
Kawasaki KLX 110 (2002 – 2010) Polini XP4R (2010)
Suzuki DRZ 110 (2003 – 2010) Suzuki DS80 (1990 – 2010)
Suzuki JR80 (2001 – 2010) Suzuki DR-Z70
Yamaha PW 90 (2002 – 2010) Yamaha TTR 90 (2000 – 2010)
Yamaha TTR 90E (2004 – 2010) Lifan Club (2005-2010

Nit picker

[TZ350]

The good thing is that in their wisdom MNZ have decleared F4 F5 (Buckets) self regulating.

They trust us to sort it out for ourselves.

Which means, as a class we can make our own common sense decisions about these little things.

[husaberg]

The good thing is that in their wisdom MNZ have decleared F4 F5 (Buckets) self regulating.

They trust us to sort it out for ourselves.

Which means, as a class we can make our own common sense decisions about these little things.

Interestingly that was the sole part of the reply to the eligibility question that Gav asked the MNZ to clarify that actually made sense.
The rest of the MNZ's reply was written in such a manner that it was unable for anyone to comprehend exactly what the MNZ position was.
They said they were going to clarify the MNZ position on the Website. As of today they still haven't which is a pity really.

Although if you look at the rules changes open for discussion and feed back there are a lot of possible rule changes opening up parts source eligibility requirements with the idea of keeping costs down.

[TZ350]

If you use your logic to the extent you have.

As soon as someone enters a FXR150 in the MX2 class. The FXR150s will then be ineligible for buckets mmmm.....
Then again using your logic Gav as you race in the F5 class "your bike is a competition bike is it not?"

I have been thinking about that because I have been looking at making my own cylinder specifically for a Suzuki GP125 engine being raced in F4.

Now making your own is legal and a bit clever but to sell one to someone else?

As it would be a compition part specifically made for racing, does then make it illegal for others to buy and use in F4?

[gav]

Hehehe, yeah I was just playing with ya, again its interesting how you can interpret the rules.

Engines must be derived from non-competition motorcycles.
Motocross, Road Racing,Enduro and Go Kart motors and transmission parts are not permitted.

And I've always wondered why the rules have this bit, Go Karts, since when is a Go Kart a motorcycle?
Again its that bloody S on the end of MOTORS isnt it?

And I wouldnt dare race my FXR in F5 mate, its way too big ....

[husaberg]

Hehehe, yeah I was just playing with ya, again its interesting how you can interpret the rules.


And I wouldnt dare race my FXR in F5 mate, its way too big ....

Well in my defense the 5 is next to the 4 on the key board. I also have fat fingers i guess and

I actually re read the reply (today) to the Email you sent the MNZ Gav.
Without trying to stir up old arguments. In hindsight Well i now think he was really actually opening the can of worms.
If you read the reply again the main thrust of what he was saying was he is seemingly disagreeing with your interpretation that you offered.

But it is sure open to interpretation. In fact as i replied to you at the time there were a number of different ways his reply could be interpreted. Why he chose not to use any commas i have no idea. Yes punctuation tips from me WTF.

I am, for one going to make some submissions anyway. I still wish i could find a copy of the old ACU Bucket rules the ones that said i think Factory hot up as the original rules and there was something with crankcases too i think.

If anyone could find John Shand i bet he would remember

[richban]

Delete Delete

[F5 Dave]

. .
Now making your own is legal and a bit clever but to sell one to someone else?. .

How is makingf a new barrel legal? Was it based on a non competition part?

[Moooools]

How is makingf a new barrel legal? Was it based on a non competition part?

How about if you melt down the old barrel and use the aluminum? Then it is derived from non competition parts.

[TZ350]

How is making a new barrel legal? Was it based on a non competition part?

I hadn't thought about that, just assumed you could make anything from scratch and it would be legal because it wasn't originally a competition part.

How about if you melt down the old barrel and use the aluminum? Then it is derived from non competition parts.

I like your thinking ...... and may well have to do that.

But it does raise the question of the legal status of home made engine parts, like cylinders and heads.

[Henk]

I was under the impression that home made parts were legal. Not sure why but it is about as "in the spirit of buckets" as it is possible to get.

[jasonu]

I hadn't thought about that, just assumed you could make anything from scratch and it would be legal because it wasn't originally a competition part.
.

But you can make any engine part from scratch, base it on anything you want and it would be legal as it didn't come from a competition motor. Nothing stopping you from machining a direct (say) RS125 copy set of engine cases if you wanted to. I had home cast heads that I cut the exact same dome and squish band that an RS125 has.
Legal? Of course makeing stuff from scratch is fucking legal. That is what Buckets is all about. Who is saying it isn't?

[jasonu]

How is makingf a new barrel legal? Was it based on a non competition part?

Are you on drugs or are you http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1SK3y1a8TYs

[husaberg]

How is makingf a new barrel legal? Was it based on a non competition part?

Your kidding aren't ya.

How is making a barrel meant to be illegal?