Sprawl vs compact development?

[merv]

Paul as for water, the Aussies faced a crisis for about 8 years, now just about everyone I know over there has the big collection tank systems in the back yard collecting rain water from the roof - we could do that here too but the situation just hasn't been desperate enough for us to take the sensible option.

[mashman]

Paul as for water, the Aussies faced a crisis for about 8 years, now just about everyone I know over there has the big collection tank systems in the back yard collecting rain water from the roof - we could do that here too but the situation just hasn't been desperate enough for us to take the sensible option.

They could also put a desalination plant or two on the hills above the populated centres to top off the water source.

[Winston001]

Instead of mortgaging yourself up to the eyeballs to be in a house thats more than you need to live in wouldn't it be encouragement enough to live somewhere just big enough and be free of the mortgage?

Yes there's movement towards this in the USA and other places. Doing more with less. There are some clever designs.


On the subject of home ownership and the relentless lament that nobody can afford to buy a home:

65% of New Zealand home owners have no mortgage. Zero. None.

http://www.rbnz.govt.nz/research/bul...ar72_1kida.pdf

Right now despite the high prices of our housing, real estate sales have jumped up. People are taking mortgages and buying homes. It will be hard for these families for a while but in the long term they will pay off the mortgage and then be able to help their children.

[Brett]

They could also put a desalination plant or two on the hills above the populated centres to top off the water source.

Pretty energy heavy process isn't it?

[flyingcrocodile46]

Paul as for water, the Aussies faced a crisis for about 8 years, now just about everyone I know over there has the big collection tank systems in the back yard collecting rain water from the roof - we could do that here too but the situation just hasn't been desperate enough for us to take the sensible option.

Ok out in the countryside and outlying subdivisions but not so for centres of bigger population centres. You won't get resource consent in Auckland central (and probably some other city centres) due to concerns about cross contamination of comunal water supplies with air polutants contaminating tank water from dirty roofs.

[flyingcrocodile46]

Pretty energy heavy process isn't it?

Not to mention the set up costs

[flyingcrocodile46]

It does work - but the problem is people give up on solving one problem at a time. They EXPECT everything to be solved at once. They EXPECT the impossible - which leaves us with a dozen half-arsed efforts to solve problems.

Take things on step at a time and you will ease the next solution - but provide a solution that band-aids the problems together and you only have a temporary fix.

Solving one problem at a time is fine as long as it is viable to do so in isolation, i.e the return doesn't rely on the resolution of other yet to be solved problems that may subsequently be found to only be resolveable using steps which make no or little use of the answers to the earlier resolved problems. Kinda like building foundations to meet a time line for a building completion, then subsequently finding that it is impractical to use some or all of them for the building design above ground because they are in the wrong place or wrong size.

Or you can take a look at how well the 'one step at a time' philospy works for the IT functions of pretty much any Council and many business's if you want to talk about broken arse band aid solutions. (though they weren't seen as band aids at the time... just solving one problem at a time)

A better result is usually achieved when the full scope of needs and processes are properly understood and pathway solutions and solution pathways are fully tailored to ensure best economy of efforts and the most efficient and fully effective outcome.

[flyingcrocodile46]

This is very confusing. Why would they build cities without industries to employ the occupants?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ely-empty.html

[Winston001]

Aw geeze Croc, ain't it obvious? Build it and they will come!






Well...it worked for Kevin Costner...

[mashman]

Pretty energy heavy process isn't it?

depends on what you use to power them and how ya build 'em I guess... but if the alternative is water shortage ???

Not to mention the set up costs

More than likely... money eh , all the little things it stops us from doing

[ellipsis]

...at some point it will all come together, Trantorian ,habitat related space was somewhat restricted, but Arthur gave us a good picture...from what i remember of the prophetic trilogy, work/industry seemed to be off planet and social mores had become...somewhat lax...more like what it is here, now...shalom...

[flyingcrocodile46]

Is this what Kiwis want? I don't think so. We ain't sardines

[mashman]

Wireless technology: check
Body of water: check

Offices on the water: check... Just add sensible monorail/tram/public transport system. No reason why these things can't be apartment blocks either and as most of our cities are on the shore and we're surrounded by water... No one said we had to use "land".

T'would free up the city housing/shops etc... As Hellzie says, the infrastructure is already there. The office is the intruder in cities imho.

[Ocean1]

Wireless technology: check
Body of water: check

Offices on the water: check... Just add sensible monorail/tram/public transport system. No reason why these things can't be apartment blocks either and as most of our cities are on the shore and we're surrounded by water... No one said we had to use "land".

T'would free up the city housing/shops etc... As Hellzie says, the infrastructure is already there. The office is the intruder in cities imho.

Very good. We could export all of the poor people who can’t afford to live in Ponsonby there.

Leme see, it's within an order of magnitude of the mass of a cruise ship. They cost 'prox US$6000 per gross ton to build, call it an even half a billion US dollars, aaaand as a habitat they service several tens of the clients that structure would. Ah, and a cruise ship isn't even slightly self-sufficient, they import absolutely everything, even the Margaritas.

Cost of residency on a cruise ship, you ask?

http://ezinearticles.com/?Smart-Buye...hips&id=721770

[Usarka]

Funny you say that. If you walk up close to country folk they back away say the body language experts while city folk stay close. I was staying at the Crowne Plaza in Auckland a week ago, jump in the lift with my wife and its quite full. It stops at a floor and a whole lot of people are waiting, some stare and think hmm too full, but an Asian family just happily jump on board and squeezed into the spaces.

Lol I've been in some trains overseas when I'm thinking there's no way in hell anymore people could squeeze on, nek minnit 30 more people. From both sides, as a passenger already in the train, and as someone who wants to get somewhere without havign to wait 4 hours until rush hour is over.