What does KB think i should do to this prick?

[flyingcrocodile46]

From the point of view of somebody that's never been on a race track.
I front up for a training day "because I know very little about track riding,,and I sign the form.
I know there's going to be other know nothings out there,so I have the insurance.
Some other rider makes a mistake an takes me out.
I approach the other rider in the hope he will meet me half way on my insurance excess,,because in the same situation "I would for him".
What ever the result of my talk to the other rider was and no matter how pissed I might be at the end of the day I'd still be aware that I took my chances by riding on a track with others that were just as likely to mess up as I was.


Something about personal responsibility for ones own decisions,,,but meh, fuck that huh.

Fucking spot on.

[TOTO]

Question for you Drew...

Why do training/trackday organisers stipulate no undertaking on corners?

Actually all of the ART days I've attended, there has always been overtaking on the corners. Normal practice and not forbidden at all. The one that it not advised to is the hairpin, on the inside of the rider and the incident did not occur on that corner. It is the responsibility of the overtaking rider to make sure the maneuver is safe, however there is always risk factors that are not under the overtaking rider control sometimes. Hence the waver you sign before getting on track to say you understand and accept that something unfortunate might happen and you are prepared for the consequences.

[TOTO]

From the point of view of somebody that's never been on a race track.
I front up for a training day "because I know very little about track riding,,and I sign the form.
I know there's going to be other know nothings out there,so I have the insurance.
Some other rider makes a mistake an takes me out.
I approach the other rider in the hope he will meet me half way on my insurance excess,,because in the same situation "I would for him".
What ever the result of my talk to the other rider was and no matter how pissed I might be at the end of the day I'd still be aware that I took my chances by riding on a track with others that were just as likely to mess up as I was.


Something about personal responsibility for ones own decisions,,,but meh, fuck that huh.

yes, but if you were there to learn, you will go into the novice group and see how the day is run and what you are supposed to do. if you go out there in the fast group and try to get your knee down by going faster than you should, tough titty.

[Katman]

Sounds like a guilty conscience Toto.

[TOTO]

Sounds like a guilty conscience Toto.

Sadly, I missed that one.

[Bassmatt]

On a positive note, now that I know the unwritten rules of the track, I can throw all the caution out the window and go fucken hard out on my next track day, everyone else can just get the fuck outta my way.

[TOTO]

On a positive note, now that I know the unwritten rules of the track, I can throw all the caution out the window and go fucken hard out on my next track day, everyone else can just get the fuck outta my way.

make sure you are wearing 1tonne leathers. Oh actually are they as safe as Quasi leathers with triple stitching ?

[NinjaNanna]

Actually all of the ART days I've attended, there has always been overtaking on the corners. Normal practice and not forbidden at all. The one that it not advised to is the hairpin, on the inside of the rider and the incident did not occur on that corner. It is the responsibility of the overtaking rider to make sure the maneuver is safe, however there is always risk factors that are not under the overtaking rider control sometimes. Hence the waver you sign before getting on track to say you understand and accept that something unfortunate might happen and you are prepared for the consequences.

Why are you ignoring the difference between overtaking and undertaking - I'm certain you know the difference. Katman's question was in relation to undertaking.

[TOTO]

Why are you ignoring the difference between overtaking and undertaking - I'm certain you know the difference. Katman's question was in relation to undertaking.

If we had to be all PC about it, then lets call it a "passing maneuver". Potato, Potato.

[Subike]

Why are you ignoring the difference between overtaking and undertaking - I'm certain you know the difference. Katman's question was in relation to undertaking.

me thinking,
answer this
In NZ we overtake on the right, undertake on the left, ...road rules.
In USA they over take on the left, and undertake on the right......road rules.
So
On a race track which applies?
the same can be asked as to which side is the "inside" of a corner
turning left, you take the inside line to the left....but that involves undertaking other riders?
turning right you take the inside line to the right....is that over taking other riders?
on the legal road there is no question, the rules are set , or so it seems...
but on the track?

[NinjaNanna]

me thinking,
answer this
In NZ we overtake on the right, undertake on the left, ...road rules.
In USA they over take on the left, and undertake on the right......road rules.
So
On a race track which applies?
the same can be asked as to which side is the "inside" of a corner
turning left, you take the inside line to the left....but that involves undertaking other riders?
turning right you take the inside line to the right....is that over taking other riders?
on the legal road there is no question, the rules are set , or so it seems...
but on the track?

hmmm I see your point, I hadn't actually thought it all the way through. My bad.

SO what is the etiquete at a training/track day - are you meant to go round the outside or is coming up the inside fine?

[FJRider]

me thinking,
answer this
In NZ we overtake on the right, undertake on the left, ...road rules.
In USA they over take on the left, and undertake on the right......road rules.
So
On a race track which applies?
the same can be asked as to which side is the "inside" of a corner
turning left, you take the inside line to the left....but that involves undertaking other riders?
turning right you take the inside line to the right....is that over taking other riders?
on the legal road there is no question, the rules are set , or so it seems...
but on the track?

In the photo's provided by the OP ... it was (as described in the original post) an "undertaking manouvere" on a right hand corner.

My understanding of an overtaking manouvere on a race track ... (to the left or right hand side) it is up to the person overtaking to do it in a safe and responsible manner.

[Kickaha]

My understanding of an overtaking manouvere on a race track ... (to the left or right hand side) it is up to the person overtaking to do it in a safe and responsible manner.

That is correct if you're actually racing, this wasn't a race meeting and the OP said passing on the inside wasn't allowed

[Subike]

Agree FJ
Somewhere in this thread, the statement was made that track rules were no passing on the inside, or words to that effect

The pic shows the bike passing on the inside, yet he was technically overtaking the bike on the right, if normal road rules apply,

was the "offending"" rider thinking he was "correct" to ""overtake"" in this situation,

A reflex thought from road riding?

and did the downed rider, taking a finer line into the corner , not expect a bike to be "overtaking" him , thus turn in to the crn tighter.

So many if, buts and maybes here.

Which, as we have seen, opened the door to a good discussion,
Even if there has been copious amounts of mud slung in several directions

[FJRider]

That is correct if you're actually racing, this wasn't a race meeting and the OP said passing on the inside wasn't allowed

The small point to which I was referring ... was that regardless of if it was either overtaking, or undertaking ... responsibility was on the one attempting to pass to do it safely. Regardless of any "rule" that may have applied.

If the OP was half a metre to his left ... it may well have been safe. (but still against the "rule")